48 minutes ago, TassieDevil said:

1958 - 1990 were lean years.

Mid 90s - late 2000s were also lean Pies years. In fact in late 1990s they were almost financially destitute.

48 minutes ago, roy11 said:

Clarry an interesting one, racked up 30+ disposals in the last 2 games without really imposing himself on the game.

Hoping they both have blinders tonight

Clarry has had possessions, sadly a lot of his disposals were long bombs that didn't do much, in fact often they were found by oppo players. He just needs to fine tune his play a bit. Not a big deal, it's certainly fixable.

What model do we want, the Geelong model where they retain their provide stars and build the young players around them for sustained success or Hawks model or trading them out for some currency to quicken a rebuild. (not that they got along for their players in the end)

I like the Geelong model. The question is their ability to stay competitive as a rule compared to other sides through great trading and player development. Yes they offer a point of difference compared to us due to their location (As yes there seems to be some fishy deals to get high profile players there). But internally they run an orgnaiustion that has been consistently competitive.

The other point is their and the pies ability for older stars to remain at th top of their game till the end.

21 minutes ago, darkhorse72 said:

What model do we want, the Geelong model where they retain their provide stars and build the young players around them for sustained success or Hawks model or trading them out for some currency to quicken a rebuild. (not that they got along for their players in the end)

I like the Geelong model. The question is their ability to stay competitive as a rule compared to other sides through great trading and player development. Yes they offer a point of difference compared to us due to their location (As yes there seems to be some fishy deals to get high profile players there). But internally they run an orgnaiustion that has been consistently competitive.

The other point is their and the pies ability for older stars to remain at th top of their game till the end.

One of the reasons Geelong keep attracting players is also because of what you say. They get to play into their 30's and the club keeps injecting quality youth meaning it virtually plays finals every year which gives you the best chance to win a flag. I'm hoping Melbourne have adopted this model.

23 minutes ago, Katrina Dee Fan said:

Clarry has had possessions, sadly a lot of his disposals were long bombs that didn't do much, in fact often they were found by oppo players. He just needs to fine tune his play a bit. Not a big deal, it's certainly fixable.

I know Stats don't tell the entire picture but his kicking efficiency so far this season is 59%, his career average is 56.2%. Will watch him with particular focus tonight.

14 minutes ago, darkhorse72 said:

What model do we want, the Geelong model where they retain their provide stars and build the young players around them for sustained success or Hawks model or trading them out for some currency to quicken a rebuild. (not that they got along for their players in the end)

I like the Geelong model. The question is their ability to stay competitive as a rule compared to other sides through great trading and player development. Yes they offer a point of difference compared to us due to their location (As yes there seems to be some fishy deals to get high profile players there). But internally they run an orgnaiustion that has been consistently competitive.

The other point is their and the pies ability for older stars to remain at th top of their game till the end.

I find it interesting the way some posters are writing about our list and choosing to frame it in this way.

We're not where Hawthorn were. We're already 3 years into a re-set and list reshuffle that is now seeing our game style shift with it. If anything, our approach has been closer to Geelong's, where we acknowledged the shifting trend of the game at the end of 2023 and drafted for speed and ball use.

We've since spent 4 first round picks on midfielders in two years. Prior to that, 2 first round picks on tall forwards (JVR and Jefferson). Within that time we've picked up a key tall defender at the Petty pick with Jed Adams, who is starting to come along nicely, and Judd McVee has turned into a legit AFL level player, one of my favourites.

Add to that we already had relative youngsters (two first round picks) in Kozzy and Bowey, and we had Rivers in the same age bracket as Kozzy.

This is our team drafted over the last 5 years:

McVee Adams AMW

Bowey ??? Windsor

??? Langford Lindsay

Kolt Turner ???

??? JVR Jefferson

??? Kozzy Rivers

That's a significant injection of AFL level talent in 5 years. Question marks for me over AMW, Kolt and Jefferson, but I really like AMW and think he'll make it, but acknowledge it could be too early to say. And really like the energy and power Kolt brings too.

Add experienced premiership players in Lever, Petty, Langdon, Salem, May, Max, Trac, Oliver, Viney and Fritsch, and our age profile is really pretty good.

If we can get our game going this year, a free agent or two in the 25-27 range would be handy, but unless they're a Butters or Callaghan type gun, I think we're better hitting the draft for these type of players.

If Trac, Clarry and Kozzy stay, we might have to trade out of 2026 and 2027 to get into 2025. I'm sure the club is thinking this way. Providing we believe the 2025 draft is strong enough, just keep adding to our under 25 talent pool. Number one on my wishlist would be a speedy small forward ala Kozzy / Papley / Watson.

Edited April 4Apr 4 by Adam The God

6 minutes ago, Adam The God said:

I find it interesting the way some posters are writing about our list and choosing to frame it in this way.

We're not where Hawthorn were. We're already 3 years into a re-set and list reshuffle that is now seeing our game style shift with it. If anything, our approach has been closer to Geelong's, where we acknowledged the shifting trend of the game at the end of 2023 and drafted for speed and ball use.

We've since spent 4 first round picks on midfielders in two years. Prior to that, 2 first round picks on tall forwards (JVR and Jefferson). Within that time we've picked up a key tall defender at the Petty pick with Jed Adams, who is starting to come along nicely, and Judd McVee has turned into a legit AFL level player, one of my favourites.

Add to that we already had relative youngsters (two first round picks) in Kozzy and Bowey, and we had Rivers in the same age bracket as Kozzy.

This is our team drafted over the last 5 years:

McVee Adams AMW

Bowey ??? Windsor

??? Langford Lindsay

Kolt Turner ???

??? JVR Jefferson

??? Kozzy Rivers

That's a significant injection of AFL level talent in 5 years. Question marks for me over AMW, Kolt and Jefferson, but I really like AMW and think he'll make it, but acknowledge it could be too early to say. And really like the energy and power Kolt brings too.

Add experienced premiership players in Lever, Petty, Langdon, Salem, May, Max, Trac, Oliver, Viney and Fritsch, and our age profile is really pretty good.

If we can get our game going this year, a free agent or two in the 25-27 range would be handy, but unless they're a Butters or Callaghan type gun, I think we're better hitting the draft for these type of players.

If Trac and Clarry stay, we might have to trade out of 2026 and 2027 to get into 2025. I'm sure the club is thinking this way. Providing we believe the 2025 draft is strong enough, just keep adding to our under 25 talent pool. Number one on my wishlist would be a speedy small forward ala Kozzy / Papley / Watson.

I agree, as are thread is about trading quality players out now, hence my post.

I believe we have and continued injected high quality talent in the last few ears through the draft as you stated. My point that people are looking to trade out experienced established high quality players for draft pics. I don't agree with this approach, we tried it once and it nearly killed the club (Among other factors) as it kills culture.

As for the current state of play for the team, the coaching team need to fix it. If they cannot then naturally the club will find someone who they believe can.

2 minutes ago, darkhorse72 said:

I agree, as are thread is about trading quality players out now, hence my post.

I believe we have and continued injected high quality talent in the last few ears through the draft as you stated. My point that people are looking to trade out experienced established high quality players for draft pics. I don't agree with this approach, we tried it once and it nearly killed the club (Among other factors) as it kills culture.

As for the current state of play for the team, the coaching team need to fix it. If they cannot then naturally the club will find someone who they believe can.

I think there's a balance though. We still have enough high quality senior players, 10 that I named, that if 1 or 2 or even 3 went, I don't think we'd be cutting the list too deep. Whereas, we certainly cut too deep in the Junior McDonald days, North cut too deep too and I believe Hawthorn may have cut a little deep.

Richmond cut super deep, because they obviously saw a strong draft cohort in 2024, Tassie on the horizon and an ability to maximise return on some of their middle aged to older players (Bolton, Rioli etc). Richmond still have the midfield bulls in Hopper and Taranto to carry their midfield while their younger guys grow though.

The thing I think you have to be careful with is cutting too deep in the midfield. Most young mids need that protection of a lot of experienced bodies around them. I wouldn't advocate trading both Clarry and Trac, because I think Langford and co need more protection than just Viney. But I think we could trade one and not upset our mix.

Edited April 4Apr 4 by Adam The God

16 hours ago, Demonsone said:

Need tough calls & trade value & our trading has been poor, consider who the pies got in Houston,Perryman,Membry, Schultz, Mcstay, vs Sharp, billings, Campbell (free agent), Jai Culley (SSP), Jack Henderson (SSP), Aidan Johnson (No.68) schache, Hunter Grundy

Schultz cost a first round pick and pick 34.

Perryman was a free agent but was graded first round compensation so the contract must be substantial.

Dan Houston cost (deep breath) John Noble, Joe Richards, pick 34 and their first pick 2025, and no doubt a fat wad of cash.

Dan Mcstay has been solid when available but has played 14 then 5 games in his first two seasons with the Pies and still has a high-priced contract to 2027.

Tim Membery is another solid citizen and I think would have been handy for us to grab.

But all up, Collingwood have taken themselves out of multiple first rounds of the draft and even gone thin in the second round, while pushing their salary cap to its limit in ways that clearly require backended contracts which will limit their bargaining power for years.

They've gone all-in for right now. There's no law against it but they aren't looking like contenders now, despite Tom Mitchell being their only injured played who has ever played 15 games in a season, and you wouldn't want to be the successor to McRae inheriting the dust.

The thing about Sharp, Billings, Campbell, Culley, Johnson, Schache and Hunter is that they cost very, very little to acquire in trade or salary cap. In fact, the whole lot of them combined might not match just Dan Houston. Grundy, well he's already got a 1000 post thread.

Anyway, our recruiting outside the four top draft picks in two years has been unambitious and it shows, Collingwood have gone all in geting the shiniest toys available. It's comparing apples and dugong.

14 minutes ago, Little Goffy said:

But all up, Collingwood have taken themselves out of multiple first rounds of the draft and even gone thin in the second round, while pushing their salary cap to its limit in ways that clearly require backended contracts which will limit their bargaining power for years.

Given they have 2 F/S picks and a NGA in the next draft, will curious to see how they approach their list/additions/departures this year.

2 hours ago, seventyfour said:

Collingwood gave up their future to get Schultz and Houston. Schultz has been very average, not worth the first round pick they gave up.

McStay has spent more time in rehab than playing (22 of possible 73 games since he got to Collingwood).

Way to early to make a call on Perryman and Membrey.

They were average last year and their 3-1 record this year has been far from impressive.

Schultz won the Joffa trophy or whatever the medal is called for BOG in the Collingwood vs Carlton annual fixture.

2 minutes ago, chookrat said:

Schultz won the Joffa trophy or whatever the medal is called for BOG in the Collingwood vs Carlton annual fixture.

The less said about that scumbag the better.

2 hours ago, seventyfour said:

They were average last year and their 3-1 record this year has been far from impressive.

Collingwood are going fine. They win most of their MCG games. They'll win half of their interstate and Marvel games.

Before you know it they'll be 16-7 and in the top 4 at the end of the year.

8 hours ago, TassieDevil said:

1958 - 1990 were lean years.

Competed in 8 GFs (and a replay) losing a number by small margins - hardly lean.

Does anyone else think that Clayton isn’t as fit as he could be? Modern on ballers cover the ground and are lean.

3 minutes ago, Vineytime said:

Does anyone else think that Clayton isn’t as fit as he could be? Modern on ballers cover the ground and are lean.

30 possesions most contested not enough for ya. Yeah lets skinny him down like Twiggy!

Petracca's anger and frustration after the loss to Geelong was significant.

The vision of this has been replayed a few times now.

In some ways, it is good, because it shows he hates losing and wants the Demons to win. But it could also be a sign that he is fed up and wants to leave....

Let's hope it's the former rather than the latter.

On 03/04/2025 at 06:22, TheWiz said:

Getting rid of Viney is like getting rid of Junior all over again. Plenty left and heart and soul.

Checking in on your thoughts about our heart and soul after another horrible performance? Thank god we have our heart and soul for another 3 years, absolutely blessed and a great list management decision.

19 minutes ago, Supreme_Demon said:

Petracca's anger and frustration after the loss to Geelong was significant.

The vision of this has been replayed a few times now.

In some ways, it is good, because it shows he hates losing and wants the Demons to win. But it could also be a sign that he is fed up and wants to leave....

Let's hope it's the former rather than the latter.

Fitter than he was last year by a mile but not impacting games in the same manner he once did. Ive been an Oliver hater so to speak but I dont think the coach is doing him any favours (much like the rest of the list)

27 minutes ago, Supreme_Demon said:

Petracca's anger and frustration after the loss to Geelong was significant.

The vision of this has been replayed a few times now.

In some ways, it is good, because it shows he hates losing and wants the Demons to win. But it could also be a sign that he is fed up and wants to leave....

Let's hope it's the former rather than the latter.

Petracca is in his prime, and is currently being wasted. He hasn’t lost a step. He is obviously frustrated, as many (most) of us are. It’s frustratingly obvious that our list would derive great benefit from replacing Goodwin.

3 minutes ago, KingDingAling said:

Petracca is in his prime, and is currently being wasted. He hasn’t lost a step. He is obviously frustrated, as many (most) of us are. It’s frustratingly obvious that our list would derive great benefit from replacing Goodwin.

One player doesn’t make a team. Trac was made to look good by his team mates.What ever fractures were made last year, it’s clear they weren’t resolved in Bright.

They are not playing for each other. That is the only way all this makes sense. Sure we are changing game plan and all that, but the level of poorness on display would be on par with an U18 Coates league team that is playing together for the first time.

With the quality of our players, it shouldn’t be this bad - I think a fair comparison would be Carlton. Our performance is unexcusable. I think it’s only a matter of time until the players start talking and media start reporting it. I wouldn’t be surprised if we start hearing it this week.

Goody is trying to hold the team together as well as be a coach with a new game plan. It’s too much for him. gawns drop in performance is probably for the same reason. Players are playing for themselves , the more I think about this, the more obvious it is.

Maybe being at rock bottom together can galvanise the group as the only way up and out of this form rutt is together- that could be really powerful.

But equally, fractures could turn deep into resentment and hate and this could spiral to something we all fear.

Couldn’t care less tbh

They can stay or go - they’re giving nothing

I'd love to keep these two, and Kozzy, but at least one needs to go. Why? We need picks to regenerate the list.

I'm terrified about the future of our backline, there's no KPD repalcements in sight and they take time to develop. We need to draft someone this year.

17 hours ago, chookrat said:

Schultz won the Joffa trophy or whatever the medal is called for BOG in the Collingwood vs Carlton annual fixture.

Winning the “Joffa” award. You say it’s a medal, wouldn’t a fiddle be the appropriate trophy?

Reckon the bombers would give our first pick back for trac?