I'm not convinced on this likely bounce-back based on better pre-seasons and natural improvement in younger players. 

The problem I have is that, yes, Oliver may improve very significantly on 2024. Yes, Petracca may come back as good or better than ever. Yes, we'll have another chance to adjust the game plan so that it's neither predictable nor completely unsuited to our team. Yes, we have exciting players under 22. 

But if I'm being completely honest about our best team in 2025, taking into account retirements and even being optimistic with injuries, is it just... well... good enough?

 

43 minutes ago, deanox said:

It probably shouldn't be possible to go as bad for us next year as it has this year. Although if there are ongoing issues with Clarry and Petracca then it is possible.

So assuming if tends to normal, instead of terrible, we should bounce back up somewhat. Like all clubs we'll need luck to bounce back all the way. And we can create some of that luck in the off season.

I think a lot of the posters here are missing this point - we do not exist in a vacuum but in the context of the entire league.

Yes, we have been bitterly unlucky this season with injuries and stupidity (sometimes both): Smith, Angus, Clarrie, Trac, Max, May, Lever, Spargo, Salem, Bowey etc all injured or out for one reason or another.

Some players have gone backwards due to injury, age or being exposed due to the overall (team) fall off in performance.

BUT...look at Richmond and their injury list, these things happen and cannot be controlled.

ALSO....look at Hawthorn, a young side with no fear that is learning to play together and running on top of the ground.

With the right management and some luck, we have as good a chance as anyone to improve our list and performances next season.

We've blooded a LOT of kids this year, more than most, which will provide benefit next season. No real surprises we looked flat on Friday.

We are in a much better position than the pre Goodwin days, I do have hope for 2025.

 

1 hour ago, Little Richard said:

I'm bullish on 2025. If a few things go our way (Clarry's form, a couple of savvy trades, Trac back to full health), I can definitely see us contending for the top 6. Top 4 if next season is as close as this year.

the window isnt closed  but the pack has caught up.

2022-2023 was there for the taking

2024 is a free for all - expecting 2025 to be similar 

1 hour ago, Little Richard said:

I'm bullish on 2025. If a few things go our way (Clarry's form, a couple of savvy trades, Trac back to full health), I can definitely see us contending for the top 6. Top 4 if next season is as close as this year.

the window isnt closed  but the pack has caught up.

2022-2023 was there for the taking

2024 is a free for all - expecting 2025 to be similar, so a few tweaks and no reason why we can't be there. Especially as we've lost a few close ones this year.

All clubs face injuries, the issue is the injuries' are to guys the wrong side of 30 and our prime movers. If 2025 is our last chance then the reset must include the coach! #Goodwinout

Edited August 5, 2024Aug 5 by Fuchsias Forever

Bumped. I agree that we have gone backwards and others have now gone past us.  Some things are outside our control (Brayshaw, JS29) but some were (JJ, Grundy). I think it’s time to reset the list. I don’t think Goody had the bravery to do it.  He seems very stuck in strategy and in team selection.  
 

Certainly there needs to be some tough discussions at year end.  I can see Melksham and McDonald seeking another year but they are in decline and they would restrict development of others.  It would be a brave move to lose experience in the sheds however it’s time to reset. Here’s my take on offseason list management 

Retire: Brayshaw (medical) B.Brown, Melksham, McDonald, Hunter

Delist: Schache, JS29, Tomlinson, Sestan, Farris-White

upgrade : Moniz-Wakefield  

** thats 9 list spots available **

rookies: Hore, Kentfield, KBrown, Verrall 

Stuck with existing poor list management …Contracted until end 25: Spargo. Billings. Contracted until end 26: Laurie, McAdam.  None were deserving of such deals.  (Tim Lamb 🤯)
—————————————————

Aim to bring in

1. Free agent priority : Isaac Cumming - skilled half back 

2. Find a mature plan B ruckman 

3. Trade in tall key defender (cover loss of Tmcd and Tomlinson) 

** Trade out 2025 1st round with Freo to get 2024 pick 10-12 in this years draft 

National Draft. Let JT weave his magic. (4 picks likely) 

1st round Two of the following- Xavier Lindsay🌟/Harvey Langford🌟/Sam Lalor🌟/Murphy Reid/Tom Gross/Christian Moraes//Toby Travaglia/Taj Hotton/Bo Allan 

2nd round: (circa pick 40 - Swans pick) some potential names who might be available: Kade Gerryn ,  Hamish Davis , Lachie Jacques, Zak Johnson, Kade Herbert. 

Youngsters who could be bargains at a 3rd/4th round pick 50 ish :  Patrick Retschko, Cody Anderson , Oliver Depaoli-Kubank, Zane Cochrane, Bailey McKenzie,  Jaxon Artemis, Keighton Matofai-Forbes.

———————————————-

Add as a Rookie: father son Noah Yze

Add Cat B rookie: Ricky Mentha

Im not at all optimistic about 2025 and believe we may finish bottom 4 .Max May and Viney have all been wonderful servants of the club but time is rapidly catching up with them .Salem Lever and Petty have been on a downhill trajectory and we may have seen the best of them .Langdon Kossie and Fritsch are good players but not A graders .We hope that Clarry and Trac can recover form their serious setbacks but that is far from being a given and they may understandably struggle .There is not a lot of exposed talent in the youth department and nothing at Casey .Bedford ,Harmes and Jordon would make no difference as they are now struggling at their new homes .I expect 2025 to be a long season for us.

 

 

 

 

Remember the title of the trade board at the end of 2022? "How to get back on track"

Turns out the devil was in the detail, you really need to nail the off-season to keep the window open. 

4 minutes ago, layzie said:

Remember the title of the trade board at the end of 2022? "How to get back on track"

Turns out the devil was in the detail, you really need to nail the off-season to keep the window open. 

To me themost important thing for next year starts in Preseason, Oliver Petracca, Gawn, Viney,May, and Lever have to have excellent preseasons if we are to be a chance again. Injuries are so critical to your chances at any stage of the season especially when it's thus even.

A pessimist is an optimist in possession of all the facts.

If Clarry and Trac return to their best, our window is absolutely very much still open. Those two are good enough to build a premiership team around, and I am very bullish about a lot of the younger players who are already on our list. 

We absolutely need to nail this off season, not just from a trading and draft perspective, but from a fitness perspective too. 

And of course you need a lot of luck. Injuries will and do kill all teams.

Edited August 5, 2024Aug 5 by Jaded No More

Hawks were struggling early and some were questioning their trajectory as being slow.  Not now.
 

And so were the Dogs. Beveridge had apparently lost the players and was on the skids. Not now.

And the Power. Hinkley was almost on the chopping block.  Port fans were screaming for blood.  Not now.  
 

It can turn around.  It’s a simple game.  It’s not as complex as some make it to be.  

1 hour ago, Winners at last said:

A pessimist is an optimist in possession of all the facts.

Gee, that’s a bit glass half empty

3 hours ago, DubDee said:

Gee, that’s a bit glass half empty

Actually it is a glass half full

3 hours ago, Jaded No More said:

If Clarry and Trac return to their best, our window is absolutely very much still open. Those two are good enough to build a premiership team around, and I am very bullish about a lot of the younger players who are already on our list. 

We absolutely need to nail this off season, not just from a trading and draft perspective, but from a fitness perspective too. 

And of course you need a lot of luck. Injuries will and do kill all teams.

I agree - Clarry and Trac are hitting their prime.   I have a feeling we will land a forward in this years trade period and I think our midfield depth is ok with McVee and Rivers developing nicely.  I like the thought of acquiring another half back in the Hibberd mould as I think we have missed that tough lockdown mid sized defender greatly this year. 

Edited August 5, 2024Aug 5 by Demons11

The last time we missed finals was 2020. Early finish to the season, early restart to pre season. We all know what happened in 2021. Same scenario this year. Same outcome next year.👌

Reasons to be optimistic for 2025: easier draw.

Most people are assuming Petracca will be back and Oliver magically sorts out whatever it is he has going on (I've heard lots of rumours but am genuinely unsure) and gets back to his best.  

If those two assumptions are false and the club chickens out of coaching changes, then it could be a harder season than this one was without the strong wins at the start.  

6 hours ago, spirit of norm smith said:

Hawks were struggling early and some were questioning their trajectory as being slow.  Not now.
 

And so were the Dogs. Beveridge had apparently lost the players and was on the skids. Not now.

And the Power. Hinkley was almost on the chopping block.  Port fans were screaming for blood.  Not now.  
 

It can turn around.  It’s a simple game.  It’s not as complex as some make it to be.  

What do both the Dogs and Power have in common? They have traded for their team needs very well.

We haven't in the past 5 years.

Port- Jordan Sweet (Ruckman), Ivan Soldo (Ruckman), Rategolea (Defender/Forward), Zerk-Thatcher (Defender), Rioli (Forward), Jason Horne-Francis (Midfielder), F.Evans (DFA) (Midfielder), J.Finlayson (Forward/Ruckman), Alilr Alilr (Defender)

Dogs- Treloar (Midfielder), Lobb (Ruck/Defender) very lucky that one! Coffield (Defender), Jones(Defender), Bramble (Defender), Harmes (Midfielder)

Melbourne- Brown (Forward) 🏆Langdon (Midfielder)🏆Grundy (Ruckman) Gone 1 season, Billings (Forward/Midfielder), McAdam (Forward), Fullarton (Forward/Ruckman), Josh Shaq attack (He can do it all), Lachie Hunter (Midfielder).

Kiss poor recruitment/trading right there, looking back on it we have not been a destination club. Trading is clearly not our 1 wood.

Probably a couple more in there I have missed but you get where I'm coming from.

The need for a power forward is just so obvious along with genuine help for Maxy.

He can't do this by himself anymore he's 33 not 26 FFS.

In saying all this can we achieve all these needs in 1 draft period?

We have to give something to get something, plus the need for a midfielder to replace Gus.

We just have so many holes popping up everywhere.

Poor trading has got us to this point, with the extra cap room from Gus' retirement and the retirement of BBB, now it's time to fix the problems Lamby and Co.

Edited August 5, 2024Aug 5 by YesitwasaWin4theAges

FF:  Pickett  JVR  Tracc
HF: Chandler ?????  ANB
C; Langdon ????? Windsor
HB: McVee  ???? Lever
FB: ????  May ???
Foll: Gawn   Rivers  ????
Int: Viney Tholstrup  Bowey  ????

 

Probables: Oliver, Fritsch, Salem, Petty

Possibles: Jefferson, Disco, Sparrow, Spargo, Woewodin, Melk? T Mc?

Need to sort the talls out and recruit ready to go tall depth, 1 at each end.

Need a back pocket to free McVee up the field.

Need a high quality on baller so Viney and Petrraca can both play forward more.

Get most of that sorted  and the team will be back in contention if they put in a huge amount of work and stay healthy in summer.

 

12 hours ago, layzie said:

Remember the title of the trade board at the end of 2022? "How to get back on track"

Turns out the devil was in the detail, you really need to nail the off-season to keep the window open. 

This Year? Dan...

"Houston, We have a Problem" Trade Board 🚀 

@Demonland

Edited August 5, 2024Aug 5 by John Demonic

I've got a good idea... Let's recruit a guy by the name of J. Hogan playing for GWS.  Does anyone know much about him - or his history?

Edited August 5, 2024Aug 5 by David-Demon

5 hours ago, John Demonic said:

This Year? Dan...

"Houston, We have a Problem" Trade Board 🚀 

@Demonland

Hell yeah. Rack that one Andy.

3 hours ago, David-Demon said:

I've got a good idea... Let's recruit a guy by the name of J. Hogan playing for GWS.  Does anyone know much about him - or his history?

Goodwin will never have him back. I don’t think Hogan would actually want to come back. So it ain’t happening. But agree, the bloke is absolutely nailing it. 

Updated

Retire: Brayshaw (medical) B.Brown, Melksham, McDonald, Hunter

Delist: Schache, JS29, Tomlinson, Sestan, Farris-White

upgrade : Moniz-Wakefield  

** thats 9 list spots available **

rookies: Hore, Kentfield, KBrown, Verrall 

Stuck with existing poor list management …Contracted until end 25: Spargo. Billings. Contracted until end 26: Laurie, McAdam.  None were deserving of such deals.  (Tim Lamb 🤯)
—————————————————

Aim to bring in

1. Free agent priority : Isaac Cumming - skilled half back 

2. Find a mature plan B ruckman 

3. Trade in tall key defender (cover loss of Tmcd and Tomlinson) 

** Trade out 2025 1st round with Freo to get 2024 pick 10-12 in this years draft 

National Draft. Let JT weave his magic. (4 picks likely) 

1st round Two of the following- Xavier Lindsay🌟/Harvey Langford🌟/Sam Lalor🌟/Murphy Reid/Tom Gross/Christian Moraes//Toby Travaglia/Taj Hotton/Bo Allan 

2nd round: (circa pick 40 - Swans pick) some potential names who might be available: Kade Gerryn ,  Hamish Davis , Lachie Jacques, Zak Johnson, Kade Herbert. 

Youngsters who could be bargains at a 3rd/4th round pick 50 ish :  Patrick Retschko, Cody Anderson , Oliver Depaoli-Kubank, Zane Cochrane, Bailey McKenzie,  Jaxon Artemis, Keighton Matofai-Forbes.

———————————————-

Add as a Rookie: father son Noah Yze

Add Cat B rookie: Ricky Mentha