PREGAME: Rd 19 vs Fremantle

[Engorged Onion 10,215]

Here’s hoping Freo are going through a heavy block at the moment… but these things change due to anxieties around how many loses are too many..

[Chook 15,012]

This one is going to be tough. Fremantle have the wood over us in a big way, and without a recognised ruckman against Jackson and Darcy it's going to be brutal. 

On the positive side, the whole side is starting to rack up some confidence and belief again, and would be absolutely primed to atone for one of the worst performances put in by this side under Goodwin a few weeks back.

Van Rooyen will have to play majority ruck unfortunately - he's simply our best option in that spot, as much as I'd love to play him as a forward.

No chance Gawn gets up for this you wouldn't think.

Win this one and our finals chances truly are alive. Lose (as expected) and we're still in the hunt but it's going to be tough.

Edited July 14 by Chook

[DubDee 25,764]

Gawn is out for 2-3 weeks as of last week

zero chance for Freo

lets hope he is an outside chance for the week after

[whatwhat say what 22,731]

1 minute ago, DubDee said:

Gawn is out for 2-3 weeks as of last week

zero chance for Freo

lets hope he is an outside chance for the week after

he's been out for 6-8 weeks and returned in 3 before

the man is a machine

Edited July 14 by whatwhat say what

[DubDee 25,764]

Hitouts we lost 43 to 27

Clearances we WON 44 to 32

Do people really think tap work matters that much?

Darcy and LJ could kill us around the ground and that’s what we should focus on. Can Fullarton or Verral help with that?

 

[loges 6,767]

1 hour ago, Roost it far said:

Really hope Gawn gets up. Either that or Fullerton plays a blinder today and gets his chance........Unlikely either of these things happen so I guess we go in with no change. The run of Freo worries me but they're flakey........We're playing finals football from now on but so are 10 other teams.

Not all other teams, some will get found out, like last night.

[Jibroni 5,002]

More rain in WA would be nice and we seem suited to these conditions.

Assuming Darcy comes back for Freo it does make it an interesting selection dilemma assuming Max is N/A.

[layzie 33,792]

I would like to get Woey in but could be tough.

I wouldn't be thrilled with no change but happiness at selection isn't currently possible. 

So after that I say no change.

[loges 6,767]

The thing for me with Petty was no so much his ruckwork just in general play some of his efforts seemed really feeble. Re JVR he may get outreached in the ruck but I have never seen him moved off his line in a ruck contest, this kid is strong.

[Adam The God 30,209]

10 minutes ago, Jibroni said:

More rain in WA would be nice and we seem suited to these conditions.

Assuming Darcy comes back for Freo it does make it an interesting selection dilemma assuming Max is N/A.

We heat Freo in the rain this time last year in Perth, so I think it'd help our bigger mids versus their smaller mids.

Edited July 14 by Binmans PA

[deejammin' 2,370]

I think today’s VFL game will be very important. I’m yet to see Fullerton be convincing at VFL level, hopefully he puts his best foot forward. Verral has played some excellent games as a ruck forward but he goes missing. Today is huge if Gawny doesn’t get up. Selection may we’ll depend on it, I’d be surprised if Goody and Gawny aren’t there today watching the rucks like a hawk.

Edited July 14 by deejammin'

[binman 42,842]

2 hours ago, picket fence said:

Not at all, probably a very nice fellow, but what I dont like seeing is selection based on ZERO form! People fail to see that he first got selected on a ZERO possesion game at Casey earlier this season. Its no wonder he has failed to fire a shot.Ok I get it I'll say no more re Petty.

Picket, to be honest you are coming off as not having a great grasp on what might drive selection in modern footy.

I think it is reasonable to assume goody selection is largely driven by picking a team he thinks gives us the best possible chance of winning that game (I say largely because a factor sometimes might be an eye to getting a player ready for finals - so, an eye to winning future games).

If goody is picking petts at this point in the season, in a critical 8 point game, it is reasonable to assume he did so because he believed it would help us win. 

Petty is clearly playing a role, and doing what is asked of him.

He is a work horse who gets to contests and provides a down the line marking option.

In case you haven't noticed goody has ALWAYS had a player playing such a role in his teams. BBB and Tmac are two such examples.

It is a critical part of his structure and method - not least because it gives maxy a chop out from being smashed in such aeriel pack contests all game.

And have a listen to goody's answer to another inane question about our forward line.

Asked about the forward line mix working in the last 2-3 weeks, implying something radical had changed, he, politely, pointed out that the only change to that mix has been melk and that petts, jvr and disco have played together for most of the season.

Cohesion is critical in sport he pointed out. And that takes time he also pointed out. It takes continuity.

That's exactly what they have been doing - continuity in selection and building cohesion.

And we are seeing the fruits of that approach.

Dropping petty does not contribute to continuity or cohesion.

And brining in another kid like Jefferson does nothing to help us win, or for cohesion - or the kid's development for that matter.

And seriously, do you really think Fullarton would have helped us win last night? Bloke is barely passing muster as a ruck at VFL level

Despite the frankly ridiculous hand wringing on here about selection, we won the raw clearance count - which by the by is not a particularly useful stat these days as it's not a measure of impact.

What is a measure of impact is scores from stoppages, which critically we won by 14 points.

In fact it was arguably the deciding factor in our win given they scored 3 more points from turnover.

That doesn't happen without petty.

Goody deserves credit and praise not brickbats.

Which is why, when responding to a question about who we might play in the ruck against freo goody visibly bristled, before noting the option he ran with this week clearly JUST WORKED, implying the obvious- why would we change something that literally just proved successful?

Edited July 14 by binman

[Jaded No More 68,879]

34 minutes ago, DubDee said:

Hitouts we lost 43 to 27

Clearances we WON 44 to 32

Do people really think tap work matters that much?

Darcy and LJ could kill us around the ground and that’s what we should focus on. Can Fullarton or Verral help with that?

 

The ruck position is completely overrated. 
Unless your ruckman is Max Gawn. 

[layzie 33,792]

56 minutes ago, DubDee said:

Hitouts we lost 43 to 27

Clearances we WON 44 to 32

Do people really think tap work matters that much?

Darcy and LJ could kill us around the ground and that’s what we should focus on. Can Fullarton or Verral help with that?

 

No but having someone who competes does. JVR was so important last night.

[Roost it far 8,226]

1 hour ago, loges said:

Not all other teams, some will get found out, like last night.

That's how Essendon play finals football these days, 7250 + (but who's counting).  :)

[At Least I Saw a Flag 5,227]

Playing the young blokes has paid dividends ... (How's that for a cliche?)

Turner, Windsor, Tolstrup, AMW ... 

Rather than NQRs recruited from other clubs who haven't really passed muster. (Another cliche.)

I think Howes is also a likely type ... Woey, maybe ... Laurie ... hmm, not convinced.

[beelzebub 23,323]

What's the weather forecast for Sunday arvo ?? 🤔

[ManDee 7,134]

14 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

What's the weather forecast for Sunday arvo ?? 🤔

Never believe weather forecasters! "Should stop raining in Mansfield sometime this afternoon". 

Hasn't rained all day!

 

Edit. They got cold right.

Edited July 14 by ManDee

[Watson11 2,240]

1 hour ago, binman said:

Picket, to be honest you are coming off as not having a great grasp on what might drive selection in modern footy.

I think it is reasonable to assume goody selection is largely driven by picking a team he thinks gives us the best possible chance of winning that game (I say largely because a factor sometimes might be an eye to getting a player ready for finals - so, an eye to winning future games).

If goody is picking petts at this point in the season, in a critical 8 point game, it is reasonable to assume he did so because he believed it would help us win. 

Petty is clearly playing a role, and doing what is asked of him.

He is a work horse who gets to contests and provides a down the line marking option.

In case you haven't noticed goody has ALWAYS had a player playing such a role in his teams. BBB and Tmac are two such examples.

It is a critical part of his structure and method - not least because it gives maxy a chop out from being smashed in such aeriel pack contests all game.

And have a listen to goody's answer to another inane question about our forward line.

Asked about the forward line mix working in the last 2-3 weeks, implying something radical had changed, he, politely, pointed out that the only change to that mix has been melk and that petts, jvr and disco have played together for most of the season.

Cohesion is critical in sport he pointed out. And that takes time he also pointed out. It takes continuity.

That's exactly what they have been doing - continuity in selection and building cohesion.

And we are seeing the fruits of that approach.

Dropping petty does not contribute to continuity or cohesion.

And brining in another kid like Jefferson does nothing to help us win, or for cohesion - or the kid's development for that matter.

And seriously, do you really think Fullarton would have helped us win last night? Bloke is barely passing muster as a ruck at VFL level

Despite the frankly ridiculous hand wringing on here about selection, we won the raw clearance count - which by the by is not a particularly useful stat these days as it's not a measure of impact.

What is a measure of impact is scores from stoppages, which critically we won by 14 points.

In fact it was arguably the deciding factor in our win given they scored 3 more points from turnover.

That doesn't happen without petty.

Goody deserves credit and praise not brickbats.

Which is why, when responding to a question about who we might play in the ruck against freo goody visibly bristled, before noting the option he ran with this week clearly JUST WORKED, implying the obvious- why would we change something that literally just proved successful?

I would stay with JVR and Petty as well.  I am praying it’s wet next Sunday and we have no change. Freo will have a huge hit out to advantage benefit and it will be easier for us to nullify if it’s wet and slippery.  Last time they beat Max in hitouts to advantage (+6), smashed us in clearance (+25), resulting in +14% in time in forward half and +42 points in score from stoppage. 

But more important on who rucks is whether Goody sticks with the stoppage structures from last night regardless of the weather.  We went in with a plan to bring extras to the stoppages to nullify Drapers advantage, something Goody has been reluctant to do even when it’s wet.  The benefits were pretty obvious (winning more clearances and a more open forward line).  We actually have a very quick forward line that is dangerous when it’s not crowded, but completely ineffective when there is no space.

[titan_uranus 24,985]

1 hour ago, binman said:

Picket, to be honest you are coming off as not having a great grasp on what might drive selection in modern footy.

I think it is reasonable to assume goody selection is largely driven by picking a team he thinks gives us the best possible chance of winning that game (I say largely because a factor sometimes might be an eye to getting a player ready for finals - so, an eye to winning future games).

If goody is picking petts at this point in the season, in a critical 8 point game, it is reasonable to assume he did so because he believed it would help us win. 

Petty is clearly playing a role, and doing what is asked of him.

He is a work horse who gets to contests and provides a down the line marking option.

In case you haven't noticed goody has ALWAYS had a player playing such a role in his teams. BBB and Tmac are two such examples.

It is a critical part of his structure and method - not least because it gives maxy a chop out from being smashed in such aeriel pack contests all game.

And have a listen to goody's answer to another inane question about our forward line.

Asked about the forward line mix working in the last 2-3 weeks, implying something radical had changed, he, politely, pointed out that the only change to that mix has been melk and that petts, jvr and disco have played together for most of the season.

Cohesion is critical in sport he pointed out. And that takes time he also pointed out. It takes continuity.

That's exactly what they have been doing - continuity in selection and building cohesion.

And we are seeing the fruits of that approach.

Dropping petty does not contribute to continuity or cohesion.

And brining in another kid like Jefferson does nothing to help us win, or for cohesion - or the kid's development for that matter.

And seriously, do you really think Fullarton would have helped us win last night? Bloke is barely passing muster as a ruck at VFL level

Despite the frankly ridiculous hand wringing on here about selection, we won the raw clearance count - which by the by is not a particularly useful stat these days as it's not a measure of impact.

What is a measure of impact is scores from stoppages, which critically we won by 14 points.

In fact it was arguably the deciding factor in our win given they scored 3 more points from turnover.

That doesn't happen without petty.

Goody deserves credit and praise not brickbats.

Which is why, when responding to a question about who we might play in the ruck against freo goody visibly bristled, before noting the option he ran with this week clearly JUST WORKED, implying the obvious- why would we change something that literally just proved successful?

Agree with this but query the last paragraph.

The fact that it worked this week vs Draper doesn't mean it's going to work next week vs Darcy/Jackson.

The threat they pose at stoppage with their clearance work, and around the ground (both are much better than Draper), means the task next week is a step up at least. Plus it rained last night, which I'm going to assume won't be the case next week.

Plus JVR's just played a game in the ruck and has to get on a plane to Perth. 

There are plenty of reasons why, despite it working this week, we may need to reconsider it for next week.

[beelzebub 23,323]

56 minutes ago, ManDee said:

Never believe weather forecasters! "Should stop raining in Mansfield sometime this afternoon". 

Hasn't rained all day!

 

Edit. They got cold right.

Ahh but has it snowed ?? 🤔🤣🤣

[binman 42,842]

1 hour ago, titan_uranus said:

Agree with this but query the last paragraph.

The fact that it worked this week vs Draper doesn't mean it's going to work next week vs Darcy/Jackson.

The threat they pose at stoppage with their clearance work, and around the ground (both are much better than Draper), means the task next week is a step up at least. Plus it rained last night, which I'm going to assume won't be the case next week.

Plus JVR's just played a game in the ruck and has to get on a plane to Perth. 

There are plenty of reasons why, despite it working this week, we may need to reconsider it for next week.

Agree, and goody said as much ie next week is a different challenge. 

I'm not arguing we should stick with jvr, roo and turner - though I suspect we will - just suggesting goody implied that we have good reason to.

That said,  before this game i said i totally got the logic of going with jvr, petts and disco.

And i see the logic in doing so again. Yes they have two excellent rucks, but if they run with roo against Darcy roo can exploit Darcy's lack of pace and run off him hard.

And whilst petts can't cover Jackson's leap, petts had the strength to match him at around the ground stoppages. Disco too.

Having just watched the Casey game I really can't see Fullarton offering anything more in the ruck than petty, and certainly less in around the ground marking and up forward.

Ditto Verrell.

[Nascent 9,210]

Woewy allegedly injured and didn't return to the field for most of the second half. Lauire best on. This is probably the simple change. What we do re ruck is up for debate.

[whatwhat say what 22,731]

based on today's vfl game, the only change i'd be considering if gawn doesn't come up is ben brown in for harry petty

if woey 2.0 is injured then it'll probably be howes as next man up

[Magnus 45]

Hi all, I have interpreted this as a positive sign for the game. My family and I are currently over in Perth and had a great lunch at a restaurant by the beach here today. To our surprise, Fyfe and a few others were at the table near us - looked like they were settling in for a traditional Perth Sunday sesh…