Are we fit enough?

[At the break of Gawn 4,409]

After a consecutive week of goaless last qtrs, I wonder if our playing group is not doing enough off the field or whether we’ve got our training loads out of kilter. 

We’re a 4 goal worse side at the moment in last qtrs since round 10. I know Binman and co talk about the importance of loading for peaking in August and September but unless we see a shift soon, the whole team will be on holidays in September.

[buck_nekkid 5,818]

This [censored] has little idea.

13 players <100 games, 11 under 22, no Trac or Angus.  And yet, we did ok.  It was poise and practice, rather than fitness, that cost us at the end.

[At the break of Gawn 4,409]

15 minutes ago, buck_nekkid said:

This [censored] has little idea.

13 players <100 games, 11 under 22, no Trac or Angus.  And yet, we did ok.  It was poise and practice, rather than fitness, that cost us at the end.

So we’ve gone from 1st to 18th for last qtrs the last 6 weeks and you’re just blaming it on young players? You know North still had more young players and less games experience than us right? 

[chookrat 4,201]

55 minutes ago, At the break of Gawn said:

After a consecutive week of goaless last qtrs, I wonder if our playing group is not doing enough off the field or whether we’ve got our training loads out of kilter. 

We’re a 4 goal worse side at the moment in last qtrs since round 10. I know Binman and co talk about the importance of loading for peaking in August and September but unless we see a shift soon, the whole team will be on holidays in September.

I thought we matched Brisbane from a workrate perspective across all 4 quarters and fitness wasn't the difference. Both sides looked pretty gassed in what was a relentless 4th quarter and while the held momentum we had our chances and didn't convert. Similarly they missed in what was a brutal finals like game.

Re impact during the loading phase it won't so much affect the ability to run out games as overall the players are stronger aerobically but players lose some explosiveness due to the cumulative muscle fatigue caused by the increased training load. At the end of the loading phase the players would have around a week of tapering, or reduced training load, which is short enough to keep the aerobic fitness gains they have made while freshening up and regaining their explosiveness.  This is the same approach taken by endurance athletes where they load up 2 - 3 months before an event and finish with a 7 - 10 day taper for the event.

Looking at how we played vs Brisbane our pressure was relentless and we would stick tackles which in previous weeks we would look slow or lack the explosiveness to bring the player to ground.

My take is that we are absolutely in the hunt this year but don't have much wriggle room to lose games like we did vs Brisbane. While it's only 1 week I'm optimistic that the Melbourne contested  pressure brand of footy is returning.

Edited June 30 by chookrat

[binman 41,940]

1 hour ago, At the break of Gawn said:

So we’ve gone from 1st to 18th for last qtrs the last 6 weeks and you’re just blaming it on young players? You know North still had more young players and less games experience than us right? 

The last six weeks is the key here.

We have struggled for that exact block of time in and around the bye since 2021. 

My explanation as to why is well documented.

To that I'd add nearly half the team are kids.

Two of the starting 22 against lions are in their first season of AFL season, meaning the kolt and Windsor as draftees, have not even completed a full AFL preseason.

And we lost salo and bowey ahead of the game, one a senior seasoned AFL player, the other young but has 50 plus games and 3 AFL preseasons under his belt.

AND we were coming off a six day break, and had to travel.

Is it any wonder we flagged a bit in rhe last quarter?

Edited June 30 by binman

[Jibroni 4,909]

Fitness aside not taking off Petty and giving Brown an opportunity to provide some run was unforgivable and proves again Goodwin has tactical flaws.

 

Edited June 30 by Jibroni

[Jack Vineys Anger Manager 289]

Its really hard to judge from the cheap seats.

The conditioning/ fitness department have a huge say in the wins and losses these days. We always have struggled pre and post bye. It's a wait and see for me. It's not who you play, but how long between games.

Those stats look horrible, but we have been struggling as a team in that time.
From rounds 1 to 10 we were probably in the top 3 for last quarters.

 

 

 

[buck_nekkid 5,818]

58 minutes ago, At the break of Gawn said:

So we’ve gone from 1st to 18th for last qtrs the last 6 weeks and you’re just blaming it on young players? You know North still had more young players and less games experience than us right? 

“.  It was poise and practice, rather than fitness, that cost us at the end.”

[Redleg 40,034]

We kicked 4 points in the last against the Lions.

All were gettable goals.

If one or two go through we win and we aren't discussing fitness.

[Queanbeyan Demon 6,704]

Ask not "are we fit enough", but are we pretty enough?

Edited June 30 by Queanbeyan Demon

[58er 5,922]

3 hours ago, Jibroni said:

Fitness aside not taking off Petty and giving Brown an opportunity to provide some run was unforgivable and proves again Goodwin has tactical flaws.

 

He has trouble using a Sub again. We are playing 22 players and it is not fair on Pup or the team.

Then he says we played too safe AGAIN and does that two weeks in a row with his Sub.

Said it two weeks ago Goody has got to be creative and positive. If not we won’t have a chance of making Finals. 

Thst said it was a very good  performance and probably our best game since Cats or start of the year.

[binman 41,940]

3 hours ago, Queanbeyan Demon said:

Ask not "are we fit enough", but are we pretty enough?

Thanks kasey

[John Demonic 5,489]

3 hours ago, Queanbeyan Demon said:

Ask not "are we fit enough", but are we pretty enough?

Not with tracc on the sidelines

[Watson11 2,210]

If we aren’t fit enough, then Brisbane are just lazy.

We ran further than them, further at high speed, more sprint efforts, more repeat sprints etc etc.  we are plenty fit enough.  Maybe not experienced enough to get the most out of our fitness. 

 

 

[Queanbeyan Demon 6,704]

There's a few of our blokes that need to get Frita's hair dresser's number.

[Queanbeyan Demon 6,704]

3 minutes ago, Watson11 said:

If we aren’t fit enough, then Brisbane are just lazy.

We ran further than them, further at high speed, more sprint efforts, more repeat sprints etc etc.  we are plenty fit enough.  Maybe not experienced enough to get the most out of our fitness. 

 

 

When did introducing facts into an absurd discussion become a thing on 'Land?

Edited June 30 by Queanbeyan Demon

[Clintosaurus 7,543]

4 minutes ago, Queanbeyan Demon said:

When did introducing facts into an absurd discussion become a thing on 'Land?

Must be new? Surprising there hasn't been 20 Eeyores in here calling it fake news.

[Queanbeyan Demon 6,704]

16 minutes ago, Queanbeyan Demon said:

When did introducing facts into an absurd discussion become a thing on 'Land?

 

11 minutes ago, Clintosaurus said:

Must be new? Surprising there hasn't been 20 Eeyores in here calling it fake news.

Maybe the 'Land mods are a little like the umps @Clintosaurus. Ya know - rule of the week type approach. This week must be the 'let the facts creep in' week.

[Graeme Yeats' Mullet 6,704]

Clearly not fit enough, makes a bit of sense with a few interrupted pre seasons and a few youngsters with only 1 or 2 preseasons in the bank

Hopefully an 8.5 day break and an easy kill against WCE can give us some momentum heading into the last 7 games

[WalkingCivilWar 39,256]

5 hours ago, At the break of Gawn said:

So we’ve gone from 1st to 18th for last qtrs the last 6 weeks and you’re just blaming it on young players? You know North still had more young players and less games experience than us right? 

It’s amusing how you only consider one of several suggested reasons then accuse the poster of “blaming” someone. And by amusing I really mean annoying. 

[Moonshadow 17,471]

5 hours ago, Redleg said:

We kicked 4 points in the last against the Lions.

All were gettable goals.

If one or two go through we win and we aren't discussing fitness.

Poor fitness affects skills late in the game.

The quicker a player can get their breath back for a set shot the calmer they are to take the kick.

A snap on the run with tired legs is likely to be less accurate (Fritter, Langdon in the last) 

Could they have better executed the kick with greater fitness? It's a sliding doors moment, but they certainly looked spent

Has our fitness declined or dropped off since our flag year? Certainly we've had some very slow starts to games and now we're stopping in the last quarter.

 

Edited June 30 by Moonshadow

[Adam The God 29,324]

1 hour ago, Moonshadow said:

Poor fitness affects skills late in the game.

The quicker a player can get their breath back for a set shot the calmer they are to take the kick.

A snap on the run with tired legs is likely to be less accurate (Fritter, Langdon in the last) 

Could they have better executed the kick with greater fitness? It's more than just posturing what could have happened in a sliding doors moment

Has our fitness declined or dropped off since our flag year? Certainly we've had some very slow starts to games and now we're stopping in the last quarter.

 

I think it's fair to say there are question marks on Selwyn at this point in time, but we can't really know as outsiders. List profile has changed considerably though, Moonie.

In our premiership year, aside from Kozzy as a small forward, Rivers as a half back and Jackson as a second ruck and third tall forward, plus Sparrow as half forward/defensive mid and Bowey as a half back (ie all role players), all of our 22 had at least 3 pre seasons and 3 years under their belts minimum, so a chance to play about 50 games.

They were - Spargo, Fritta, Petty 2017 class/4 pre season; Oliver 2015 class/6 pre seasons; Trac, Gus, Lever, ANB, Langdon, Harmes 2014 class/7 pre seasons; and Salem, BB 2013 class/8 pre seasons. Plus, even older bodies in Max, TMac, May, Viney and Hibbo.

Only 5 players of the best 22 in 2021 had less experience than that 50 game mark.

In the current side, we have JVR and Turner as key talls expected to repeat sprint, bang crash, provide a consistent contest, and in JVR's case provide second ruck chop outs. So young players expected to play key tall, similar in a way I suppose to having two LJs in the one forward line, therefore bound to be some inconsistencies.

And although the rest are role players, having 7 other best 23 players under that 50 game threshold (McVee, AMW, Kolt, Windsor, Woey, Chandler, Brown) impacts on their aerobic capacity and is very likely influencing our ability to run games out after a gruelling first half of the fixture. That's a lot of vulnerable parts in your system. It probably tips the scales at this stage of the season. 

Edited June 30 by Binmans PA

[monoccular 17,305]

7 hours ago, Redleg said:

We kicked 4 points in the last against the Lions.

All were gettable goals.

If one or two go through we win and we aren't discussing fitness.

Fatigue affects mental acuity and thus  accuracy.  Yes even set shots. But is the fatigue due to training schedule, or age / experience mix?

4 hours ago, Queanbeyan Demon said:

There's a few of our blokes that need to get Frita's hair dresser's number.

Or maybe forget about the coiffure and concentrate on the footy. 

3 hours ago, Graeme Yeats&#x27; Mullet said:

Clearly not fit enough, makes a bit of sense with a few interrupted pre seasons and a few youngsters with only 1 or 2 preseasons in the bank

Hopefully an 8.5 day break and an easy kill against WCE can give us some momentum heading into the last 7 games

I suppose you said that just a few rounds back when we capitulated early and were slaughtered, together with realistic top 4 or even 8 hopes. 
 

Please, never utter that again; there are no easy kills these days. 5% off mentally and it’s game over. 

[Gawndy the Great 9,009]

Simple answer is no.

[JJR 681]

9 hours ago, chookrat said:

I thought we matched Brisbane from a workrate perspective across all 4 quarters and fitness wasn't the difference. Both sides looked pretty gassed in what was a relentless 4th quarter and while the held momentum we had our chances and didn't convert. Similarly they missed in what was a brutal finals like game.

Re impact during the loading phase it won't so much affect the ability to run out games as overall the players are stronger aerobically but players lose some explosiveness due to the cumulative muscle fatigue caused by the increased training load. At the end of the loading phase the players would have around a week of tapering, or reduced training load, which is short enough to keep the aerobic fitness gains they have made while freshening up and regaining their explosiveness.  This is the same approach taken by endurance athletes where they load up 2 - 3 months before an event and finish with a 7 - 10 day taper for the event.

Looking at how we played vs Brisbane our pressure was relentless and we would stick tackles which in previous weeks we would look slow or lack the explosiveness to bring the player to ground.

My take is that we are absolutely in the hunt this year but don't have much wriggle room to lose games like we did vs Brisbane. While it's only 1 week I'm optimistic that the Melbourne contested  pressure brand of footy is returning.

I dont get why some people can't see this, we're slowly getting our DNA back, it doesn't mean we're going to win the flag but at least finish really strong this season.