SOLUTIONS NEEDED. 2 JUNE 2024. Memo to Goody

[Deespicable 2,574]

A very good thread by Spirit of Norm Smith, but I actually disagreed with almost every one of the 10 or so suggestions.

The exceptions were the following two which are pretty well spot on in my view.

Step 3/  STOP LAZY PLAY   STOP SLOW & WIDE & BORING FOOTY   Scared footballers take easy 15 metres sideways kicks , even when running through the midfield 

MOVE THE BALL QUICKLY WITH INTENSITY  BE BRAVE NOT SCARED!! 

The issue is that we don't really have a lovely long accurate kicking or pacey defender who can hurt teams so that we can break lines or invoke a quick switch on a regular basis. Some sides have a thumping kick such as Houston or Dale or Duggan or Hinge or Impey, some have pace such as Clark or Blakey. The best line breaker from back we have got is Rivers but he doesn't really use his long kick very often and Bowey (a longer kick than many realise) rarely goes down the middle, preferring to play safe. Salem is a very accurate short kick that can diffuse the situations. McVee is safe, shortish and reliable. Maysie has a booming left boot but as we don't switch it that much, he doesn't get to use it to the max and he's not going to run it 25m before kicking it. And being a left footer he's more accurate kicking it up the left side and on the left wing we generally have either Billings or Hunter (lately) who don't have line-breaking pace, so it's usually when we go right to Ed or Windsor (before he got tired) that we take the game on.

The only other time that we really take the game on is when Trac has the ball - he's our only long-kicking, line breaking option and the main reason we aren't in the bottom handful.

In 2021 and 2022 he had an in-form and confident Clayton who had discovered just how dangerous he can be when he takes the game on. But sadly Clayton of 2024 has gone back into his quick handball give, kick safely or long bomb out of trouble player. If you watched his goal against Freo, you could see he really didn't feel comfortable with the ball and wanted to give it off but there was no-one else around and he was forced to maximise his talent.

Of the others, Nibbler and Viney try to break lines but they are not thumping kicks, Sparrow has yet to show he's got AFL level peripherals and Kossie looks too short or to his mate McAdam.

So game plan wise we are stuck relying totally on Trac creating dangerous forward plays or Ed or Windsor breaking lines through pace. 

The other major factor is that we don't have a reliable tall lead up marking player such as a Daniher, Curnow, McKay etc. Goody was hopeful that Petty could play that role but he has been effectual in one of 10 games this year - against Geelong. that's not good enough. JVR does it as fairly well and has great tackle pressure but he needs another sidekick aside from Fritter -  a reliable mid-size flyer like a Fogarty or even a Jamie Elliott. What we'd give for a young Sam Darcy or even Riccardi. And because we are so small (we are the smallest side in the league with Richmond and Collingwood the only others in our height division), we lose confidence.

Step 4/ STOP TURNING BACKS AND FORWARDS INTO MIDS (RECRUIT MIDS) 

The engine room is so critical.   It all starts in the middle.   Real quality mids are the stars.   Even with a generation champion Ruckman, our mids are losing big time.  No more Riv or Kozzy experiments. We need them doing what they do best. Kozzy kicking goals   Riv being courageous and defending for his life 

Recruit mids.  We have enough backs and forwards- talls mediums smalls.  Why are trying to turn small forwards into mids. Stop It

I don't totally agree with your point that Rivers has played as a midfielder. Yes he's gone there for a few minutes but generally has played down back. But Kossie has spent a lot of time in the middle, especially in the Alice and yes we are definitely robbing Peter to pay Paul and it's not as if he's been a match winner in the middle.

The biggest problem in the middle is that Clayton has lost his amazing mojo and barely wins a clearance and if he does it's a lame handball sideways or backwards. He also seems unable to stick tackles like he used to. He still runs his butt off, so I disagree with those who say he ain't fit, but he clearly lacks confidence and it affects the whole team. Invariably he lines up next to a Cripps or Butters and you know that he'll be beaten because his body-language tells you before the play. The mongrel in him is gone and unless he rediscovers it, our midfield will remain second rate.

My suggestions:

I say these with the proviso that the season is gone and some of these are too left-field for Goody, but maybe another loss to the Pies before the break may force Goody to rethink. And I actually reckon that we are a chance against Collingwood because as I mentioned before, they are a small side and we won't be exploited by size so much. And if we happen to use a hard tag on Daicos and allow that player to forget about the zone, who knows what could happen as I'm sure after our loss last week we will be fired up.

But back to the rejigs:

Firstly we have to go back to T-Mac playing forward. Yes I know he's too slow, but he gets what's required and it allows Petty to go back and play the Lever intercept role and get his marking confidence going again. Then, and this isn't radical to those of you over 40, we can actually switch T-Mac and him around after half time and see if Petty can take his confident A-game there. 

Secondly we have to get more out of Bowey in a role up forward or in the middle. He's got a thumping kick and he's got great courage. There's no reason why he shouldn't be one of our midfielders applying tackling pressure and he's also got the smarts and leap to be dangerous alongside Kozzie as a small forward. That means Goody has to drop his love affair with Chandler, but unfortunately Kade just hasn't been a reliable small forward - he either moves to the left wing or he moves to the sub role where we saw he can impact with his skill.

Thirdly we have to continue to go big, even though our bigs are by and large not good enough. Totally relying on Gawny is not fair on him and the rest of the team. Yes we will lose some pace, but we have to play three bigs because it allows Fritter to get a medium tall defender. Among the calls that has to play includes Fullarton and Jefferson, who I suspect aren't good enough, but at least we can start their development, not leave them to rot in the VFL like Schache or Mitch Brown etc. Turner was worth a try, but one good game (against Richmond) doesn't 't mean he plays there all season.

Fourthly we need to find out if our better-performing VFL players are any good. Moniz-Wakefield has pace and deserves a couple of games to see if he can cope with the level (i'm dubious about his disposal skills, but he deserves a chance) and by sending Bowey forward it frees up a small spot down back. Sestan is also ready for a couple of games and with McAdam failing, can play the same role with better tackling ability. Tholstrup just has to play again and again - we have to progress his development. All these young guys may fail, but at least we can mark them off, rather than letting them rot in the twos.

Finally the tricky one is Clayton. How do you get a guy who has been one of our greats to perform with the confidence of a great. I don't have an answer and so far neither does Goody. Will the axe send him spiralling further or has his game already spiralled. 

That's why I have great sympathy for Goody. He's shown great loyalty to his core 22, but that's because they have performed week-in, week-out. But on Sunday, the return of the loyalty from the players went missing.
 

[beelzebub 22,724]

3 hours ago, picket fence said:

Poor comment?? Very fair unless you think Goody will win another 5 !!

There's  context...relevance...and balance..

Both of you have a point 👉 

[Dee*ceiving 1,260]

We shouldnt think we are a 15 goal worse side than Freo though, that's just not true. 

We got opened up in the first half, for the 4th or 5th time this year by a hungry, fast side I form, whilst we were missing our FF and CHB and have a number of players down on form and or fitness. 

This is the first time in a long time there was no fight back.  The dam wall was broken and there was no fight in the tank.  

Two meaningful free agents, 3 more kids out of the draft, some style tweaks, Viney & Oliver back to there best and some improvement from the kids we have and we can climb out. 

But it shouldn't be this year.  One last ditch effort to beat the pies, & if we don't we should be experimenting and getting blokes cherry ripe for 2025

[Deelectable 382]

Don't get me wrong.  Yesterday was horrendous with plenty to be concerned about but are we overreacting?  Myself included! In 2017 Richmond lost to Adelaide by 76 points and proceeded to lose their next three.  In round 16 they lost to the Saints by 67 points and were 14 goals to 1 down at halftime! Media were all over them like a rash. Richmond finished 3rd and the rest is history. Might be clutching at straws. No doubt need a response and a win this week. Not going to be easy.

[Bombay Airconditioning 6,024]

It’s almost like unless we have a full list to chose from we’ve always got an excuse. If only we had a gun key fwd we’d be unstoppable, Carlton have two (McKay hit and miss but having arguably his best season to date) and there 5th. Pies won the flag last year with Miohcheck as their big man. Our gameplan is not working, we can’t score, we’ve gone from bombing it long to a congested fwd line to kicking it with more purpose to a congested fwd but so wide a lot of our marks our deep in the pockets. Our smalls have a habit of not being in the right spot. 

[beelzebub 22,724]

13 minutes ago, Deespicable said:

A very good thread by Spirit of Norm Smith, but I actually disagreed with almost every one of the 10 or so suggestions.

The exceptions were the following two which are pretty well spot on in my view.

 

Step 3/  STOP LAZY PLAY   STOP SLOW & WIDE & BORING FOOTY   Scared footballers take easy 15 metres sideways kicks , even when running through the midfield 

MOVE THE BALL QUICKLY WITH INTENSITY  BE BRAVE NOT SCARED!! 

The issue is that we don't really have a lovely long accurate kicking or pacey defender who can hurt teams so that we can break lines or invoke a quick switch on a regular basis. Some sides have a thumping kick such as Houston or Dale or Duggan or Hinge or Impey, some have pace such as Clark or Blakey. The best line breaker from back we have got is Rivers but he doesn't really use his long kick very often and Bowey (a longer kick than many realise) rarely goes down the middle, preferring to play safe. Salem is a very accurate short kick that can diffuse the situations. McVee is safe, shortish and reliable. Maysie has a booming left boot but as we don't switch it that much, he doesn't get to use it to the max and he's not going to run it 25m before kicking it. And being a left footer he's more accurate kicking it up the left side and on the left wing we generally have either Billings or Hunter (lately) who don't have line-breaking pace, so it's usually when we go right to Ed or Windsor (before he got tired) that we take the game on.

The only other time that we really take the game on is when Trac has the ball - he's our only long-kicking, line breaking option and the main reason we aren't in the bottom handful.

In 2021 and 2022 he had an in-form and confident Clayton who had discovered just how dangerous he can be when he takes the game on. But sadly Clayton of 2024 has gone back into his quick handball give, kick safely or long bomb out of trouble player. If you watched his goal against Freo, you could see he really didn't feel comfortable with the ball and wanted to give it off but there was no-one else around and he was forced to maximise his talent.

Of the others, Nibbler and Viney try to break lines but they are not thumping kicks, Sparrow has yet to show he's got AFL level peripherals and Kossie looks too short or to his mate McAdam.

So game plan wise we are stuck relying totally on Trac creating dangerous forward plays or Ed or Windsor breaking lines through pace. 

The other major factor is that we don't have a reliable tall lead up marking player such as a Daniher, Curnow, McKay etc. Goody was hopeful that Petty could play that role but he has been effectual in one of 10 games this year - against Geelong. that's not good enough. JVR does it as fairly well and has great tackle pressure but he needs another sidekick aside from Fritter -  a reliable mid-size flyer like a Fogarty or even a Jamie Elliott. What we'd give for a young Sam Darcy or even Riccardi. And because we are so small (we are the smallest side in the league with Richmond and Collingwood the only others in our height division), we lose confidence.

Step 4/ STOP TURNING BACKS AND FORWARDS INTO MIDS (RECRUIT MIDS) 

The engine room is so critical.   It all starts in the middle.   Real quality mids are the stars.   Even with a generation champion Ruckman, our mids are losing big time.  No more Riv or Kozzy experiments. We need them doing what they do best. Kozzy kicking goals   Riv being courageous and defending for his life 

Recruit mids.  We have enough backs and forwards- talls mediums smalls.  Why are trying to turn small forwards into mids. Stop It

I don't totally agree with your point that Rivers has played as a midfielder. Yes he's gone there for a few minutes but generally has played down back. But Kossie has spent a lot of time in the middle, especially in the Alice and yes we are definitely robbing Peter to pay Paul and it's not as if he's been a match winner in the middle.

The biggest problem in the middle is that Clayton has lost his amazing mojo and barely wins a clearance and if he does it's a lame handball sideways or backwards. He also seems unable to stick tackles like he used to. He still runs his butt off, so I disagree with those who say he ain't fit, but he clearly lacks confidence and it affects the whole team. Invariably he lines up next to a Cripps or Butters and you know that he'll be beaten because his body-language tells you before the play. The mongrel in him is gone and unless he rediscovers it, our midfield will remain second rate.

My suggestions:

I say these with the proviso that the season is gone and some of these are too left-field for Goody, but maybe another loss to the Pies before the break may force Goody to rethink. And I actually reckon that we are a chance against Collingwood because as I mentioned before, they are a small side and we won't be exploited by size so much. And if we happen to use a hard tag on Daicos and allow that player to forget about the zone, who knows what could happen as I'm sure after our loss last week we will be fired up.

But back to the rejigs:

Firstly we have to go back to T-Mac playing forward. Yes I know he's too slow, but he gets what's required and it allows Petty to go back and play the Lever intercept role and get his marking confidence going again. Then, and this isn't radical to those of you over 40, we can actually switch T-Mac and him around after half time and see if Petty can take his confident A-game there. 

Secondly we have to get more out of Bowey in a role up forward or in the middle. He's got a thumping kick and he's got great courage. There's no reason why he shouldn't be one of our midfielders applying tackling pressure and he's also got the smarts and leap to be dangerous alongside Kozzie as a small forward. That means Goody has to drop his love affair with Chandler, but unfortunately Kade just hasn't been a reliable small forward - he either moves to the left wing or he moves to the sub role where we saw he can impact with his skill.

Thirdly we have to continue to go big, even though our bigs are by and large not good enough. Totally relying on Gawny is not fair on him and the rest of the team. Yes we will lose some pace, but we have to play three bigs because it allows Fritter to get a medium tall defender. Among the calls that has to play includes Fullarton and Jefferson, who I suspect aren't good enough, but at least we can start their development, not leave them to rot in the VFL like Schache or Mitch Brown etc. Turner was worth a try, but one good game (against Richmond) doesn't 't mean he plays there all season.

Fourthly we need to find out if our better-performing VFL players are any good. Moniz-Wakefield has pace and deserves a couple of games to see if he can cope with the level (i'm dubious about his disposal skills, but he deserves a chance) and by sending Bowey forward it frees up a small spot down back. Sestan is also ready for a couple of games and with McAdam failing, can play the same role with better tackling ability. Tholstrup just has to play again and again - we have to progress his development. All these young guys may fail, but at least we can mark them off, rather than letting them rot in the twos.

Finally the tricky one is Clayton. How do you get a guy who has been one of our greats to perform with the confidence of a great. I don't have an answer and so far neither does Goody. Will the axe send him spiralling further or has his game already spiralled. 

That's why I have great sympathy for Goody. He's shown great loyalty to his core 22, but that's because they have performed week-in, week-out. But on Sunday, the return of the loyalty from the players went missing.
 

Probably one of the most interesting and considered posts....ever ...here. ... kudos.

Strangely  I feel sympathy for Goody.  ( now that's tempered obviously with my general  disdain...but as most have never understood my position I neither care or worry )..  yet he's  in the poo.  Much of his own making but he's been helped along by circumstances and neg-serendipity. I understand he has his beliefs, his ideas ( he can be quite maverick...I actually liked that..esp earlier years ).. but in the poo none the less.

Imho he now knows ...the list isn't right.. the game plan not only isn't right but won't work with current list or leanings.

Whatever he's been trying to get them do....they aren't.  

But that's not even #1  on his worry list.  What's happened to the group ? That's the question. 

Me thinks he knows...

Again.... a very good post. Best for yonks 

 

[ANG13 1,655]

6 hours ago, spirit of norm smith said:

Must be delisted ( but probably won’t): Hunter

I highly doubt if Hunter is at the club next year. 

[ANG13 1,655]

3 hours ago, Billy said:

2. James Jordon/Lachie Hunter, this one still burns deep. Getting rid of a hard working 23yo popular teammate replacing with a slow 29yo with nothing to offer & a history of poor culture.

Yep this one still burns me to Billy. 

[ElDiablo14 3,713]

9 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

Probably one of the most interesting and considered posts....ever ...here. ... kudos.

Strangely  I feel sympathy for Goody.  ( now that's tempered obviously with my general  disdain...but as most have never understood my position I neither care or worry )..  yet he's  in the poo.  Much of his own making but he's been helped along by circumstances and neg-serendipity. I understand he has his beliefs, his ideas ( he can be quite maverick...I actually liked that..esp earlier years ).. but in the poo none the less.

Imho he now knows ...the list isn't right.. the game plan not only isn't right but won't work with current list or leanings.

Whatever he's been trying to get them do....they aren't.  

But that's not even #1  on his worry list.  What's happened to the group ? That's the question. 

Me thinks he knows...

Again.... a very good post. Best for yonks 

 

Just one thing to add McAdam can't play in our fwd line if TMac goes back there. We would lose most of the very slim fwd pressure we have.

[picket fence 15,783]

1 hour ago, Dee Zephyr said:

WCW gets canned for defending the players most of the time and now that she’s not saying anything something must be wrong? 
 
A lot on here vent by wanting everyone sacked, constant bagging of recruits that haven’t even played a game, hell some even want binman traded. 
Maybe WCW is venting by just staying away for a few days. 

Yer well dont make out that u have inside info and intell then Shut up!

[picket fence 15,783]

24 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

Probably one of the most interesting and considered posts....ever ...here. ... kudos.

Strangely  I feel sympathy for Goody.  ( now that's tempered obviously with my general  disdain...but as most have never understood my position I neither care or worry )..  yet he's  in the poo.  Much of his own making but he's been helped along by circumstances and neg-serendipity. I understand he has his beliefs, his ideas ( he can be quite maverick...I actually liked that..esp earlier years ).. but in the poo none the less.

Imho he now knows ...the list isn't right.. the game plan not only isn't right but won't work with current list or leanings.

Whatever he's been trying to get them do....they aren't.  

But that's not even #1  on his worry list.  What's happened to the group ? That's the question. 

Me thinks he knows...

Again.... a very good post. Best for yonks 

 

U are kidding?? Sympathy? SERIOUSLY??

Edited June 3 by picket fence

[beelzebub 22,724]

11 minutes ago, ElDiablo14 said:

Just one thing to add McAdam can't play in our fwd line if TMac goes back there. We would lose most of the very slim fwd pressure we have.

Very disappointed with McAdam.  Not particularly blaming him but he's anything but the Xfactor player Crows had ...I mean wtf ?? 

Atm   nqr...maybe never 

JVR.. Fritta.. TMAC ...Hmmmm 

Reality is... it won't be them.as such... it'll  be the plan/delivery 

It's not that [censored] hard..     footy teams have this worked out for ever... but not us.. at an elite level.  Now THAT..  I'd shove down Goodwins throat til he choked.  [censored]

[beelzebub 22,724]

3 minutes ago, picket fence said:

U are kidding?? Sympathy? SERIOUSLY??

Again read.. you don't get me ... That's  fine...carry on....please  ;)

[picket fence 15,783]

57 minutes ago, Deespicable said:

A very good thread by Spirit of Norm Smith, but I actually disagreed with almost every one of the 10 or so suggestions.

The exceptions were the following two which are pretty well spot on in my view.

 

Step 3/  STOP LAZY PLAY   STOP SLOW & WIDE & BORING FOOTY   Scared footballers take easy 15 metres sideways kicks , even when running through the midfield 

MOVE THE BALL QUICKLY WITH INTENSITY  BE BRAVE NOT SCARED!! 

The issue is that we don't really have a lovely long accurate kicking or pacey defender who can hurt teams so that we can break lines or invoke a quick switch on a regular basis. Some sides have a thumping kick such as Houston or Dale or Duggan or Hinge or Impey, some have pace such as Clark or Blakey. The best line breaker from back we have got is Rivers but he doesn't really use his long kick very often and Bowey (a longer kick than many realise) rarely goes down the middle, preferring to play safe. Salem is a very accurate short kick that can diffuse the situations. McVee is safe, shortish and reliable. Maysie has a booming left boot but as we don't switch it that much, he doesn't get to use it to the max and he's not going to run it 25m before kicking it. And being a left footer he's more accurate kicking it up the left side and on the left wing we generally have either Billings or Hunter (lately) who don't have line-breaking pace, so it's usually when we go right to Ed or Windsor (before he got tired) that we take the game on.

The only other time that we really take the game on is when Trac has the ball - he's our only long-kicking, line breaking option and the main reason we aren't in the bottom handful.

In 2021 and 2022 he had an in-form and confident Clayton who had discovered just how dangerous he can be when he takes the game on. But sadly Clayton of 2024 has gone back into his quick handball give, kick safely or long bomb out of trouble player. If you watched his goal against Freo, you could see he really didn't feel comfortable with the ball and wanted to give it off but there was no-one else around and he was forced to maximise his talent.

Of the others, Nibbler and Viney try to break lines but they are not thumping kicks, Sparrow has yet to show he's got AFL level peripherals and Kossie looks too short or to his mate McAdam.

So game plan wise we are stuck relying totally on Trac creating dangerous forward plays or Ed or Windsor breaking lines through pace. 

The other major factor is that we don't have a reliable tall lead up marking player such as a Daniher, Curnow, McKay etc. Goody was hopeful that Petty could play that role but he has been effectual in one of 10 games this year - against Geelong. that's not good enough. JVR does it as fairly well and has great tackle pressure but he needs another sidekick aside from Fritter -  a reliable mid-size flyer like a Fogarty or even a Jamie Elliott. What we'd give for a young Sam Darcy or even Riccardi. And because we are so small (we are the smallest side in the league with Richmond and Collingwood the only others in our height division), we lose confidence.

Step 4/ STOP TURNING BACKS AND FORWARDS INTO MIDS (RECRUIT MIDS) 

The engine room is so critical.   It all starts in the middle.   Real quality mids are the stars.   Even with a generation champion Ruckman, our mids are losing big time.  No more Riv or Kozzy experiments. We need them doing what they do best. Kozzy kicking goals   Riv being courageous and defending for his life 

Recruit mids.  We have enough backs and forwards- talls mediums smalls.  Why are trying to turn small forwards into mids. Stop It

I don't totally agree with your point that Rivers has played as a midfielder. Yes he's gone there for a few minutes but generally has played down back. But Kossie has spent a lot of time in the middle, especially in the Alice and yes we are definitely robbing Peter to pay Paul and it's not as if he's been a match winner in the middle.

The biggest problem in the middle is that Clayton has lost his amazing mojo and barely wins a clearance and if he does it's a lame handball sideways or backwards. He also seems unable to stick tackles like he used to. He still runs his butt off, so I disagree with those who say he ain't fit, but he clearly lacks confidence and it affects the whole team. Invariably he lines up next to a Cripps or Butters and you know that he'll be beaten because his body-language tells you before the play. The mongrel in him is gone and unless he rediscovers it, our midfield will remain second rate.

My suggestions:

I say these with the proviso that the season is gone and some of these are too left-field for Goody, but maybe another loss to the Pies before the break may force Goody to rethink. And I actually reckon that we are a chance against Collingwood because as I mentioned before, they are a small side and we won't be exploited by size so much. And if we happen to use a hard tag on Daicos and allow that player to forget about the zone, who knows what could happen as I'm sure after our loss last week we will be fired up.

But back to the rejigs:

Firstly we have to go back to T-Mac playing forward. Yes I know he's too slow, but he gets what's required and it allows Petty to go back and play the Lever intercept role and get his marking confidence going again. Then, and this isn't radical to those of you over 40, we can actually switch T-Mac and him around after half time and see if Petty can take his confident A-game there. 

Secondly we have to get more out of Bowey in a role up forward or in the middle. He's got a thumping kick and he's got great courage. There's no reason why he shouldn't be one of our midfielders applying tackling pressure and he's also got the smarts and leap to be dangerous alongside Kozzie as a small forward. That means Goody has to drop his love affair with Chandler, but unfortunately Kade just hasn't been a reliable small forward - he either moves to the left wing or he moves to the sub role where we saw he can impact with his skill.

Thirdly we have to continue to go big, even though our bigs are by and large not good enough. Totally relying on Gawny is not fair on him and the rest of the team. Yes we will lose some pace, but we have to play three bigs because it allows Fritter to get a medium tall defender. Among the calls that has to play includes Fullarton and Jefferson, who I suspect aren't good enough, but at least we can start their development, not leave them to rot in the VFL like Schache or Mitch Brown etc. Turner was worth a try, but one good game (against Richmond) doesn't 't mean he plays there all season.

Fourthly we need to find out if our better-performing VFL players are any good. Moniz-Wakefield has pace and deserves a couple of games to see if he can cope with the level (i'm dubious about his disposal skills, but he deserves a chance) and by sending Bowey forward it frees up a small spot down back. Sestan is also ready for a couple of games and with McAdam failing, can play the same role with better tackling ability. Tholstrup just has to play again and again - we have to progress his development. All these young guys may fail, but at least we can mark them off, rather than letting them rot in the twos.

Finally the tricky one is Clayton. How do you get a guy who has been one of our greats to perform with the confidence of a great. I don't have an answer and so far neither does Goody. Will the axe send him spiralling further or has his game already spiralled. 

That's why I have great sympathy for Goody. He's shown great loyalty to his core 22, but that's because they have performed week-in, week-out. But on Sunday, the return of the loyalty from the players went missing.
 

Christ AXE Clarry?? Nup if anything play him deep forward with a licence to go ANYWHERE!

[John Demonic 4,977]

1 hour ago, Deelectable said:

Don't get me wrong.  Yesterday was horrendous with plenty to be concerned about but are we overreacting?  Myself included! In 2017 Richmond lost to Adelaide by 76 points and proceeded to lose their next three.  In round 16 they lost to the Saints by 67 points and were 14 goals to 1 down at halftime! Media were all over them like a rash. Richmond finished 3rd and the rest is history. Might be clutching at straws. No doubt need a response and a win this week. Not going to be easy.

56-114 was the expected score. Turns out yesterday was a very poor performance rather than a diabolical sack the coach season over loss. 

Edited June 3 by John Demonic

[Older demon 2,323]

I believe one poster warned after the Richmond game that all wasn't well with the game plan. In retrospect the warning signs have been there. 

Remember the ANZAC game where every second possession was a turnover and luck for us Richmond were just as bad. Fortunately we corrected it in the second half. It was stated that a repeat against a good team would be a disaster, Ewell yesterday was that disaster. 

I can understand the confusion but think this team had to learn how to play tempo football. That we had to stop kicking it long to a pack in the left forward pocket but the transition has been bad at times. Some of our disposals are poor and at least the long kick down the line can create a contest. It has been there all season. Against the sins in round 1 when we ran out of steam, against Brisbane where we butchered the ball. The first quarter against Carlton, West Coast and then on Sunday when we turned up for the first 8 minutes.

Collingwood have shown that despite a long injury list as long as the entire playing list stick to their role and trust the system they are always in games. Yes there are personnel down but if available which system will they play? I am convinced some lack the foot skills to play keepings off and others have forgotten our DNA to contest.

it is retrievable and we have seen that our best is good enough but who is going to show us the way

[leucopogon 1,494]

51 minutes ago, Older demon said:

 

it is retrievable and we have seen that our best is good enough but who is going to show us the way

But what would you consider our best this season? Port Adelaide? Geelong? Both games we probably should have lost if not for inaccuracy by the oppo. St K and Richmond wins were rubbish. Hawthorn didn't even turn up to play, didn't watch the Bulldogs game so can't comment. 

I would argue that we haven't even gotten anywhere near to seeing what our best looks like let alone know whether its good enough. If we have seen our best, then god help us, we are so far off the pace its just sad. 

The list is completely unbalanced now with the decline of Clarry and Viney and the loss of Gus and all of our depth. Borderline list management incompetence that we haven't drafted any genuine mids since Sparrow (and he's not even a mid). Even last year we went for a winger and a flanker with our two 1st rounders. Talk about shooting ourselves in the foot.

Edited June 3 by leucopogon

[Billy 2,175]

6 hours ago, Demonsone said:

To think that Goodwin had schache as a sub over Grundy in a final is laughable, billing’s & Hunter can’t kick yet we let Jordan go 

The mind boggles with some his decisions

[Demonsone 1,740]

The 3 qtr blitz seems like a decade ago and the Freo game was like the Neeld era … 

[Redleg 38,554]

4 hours ago, picket fence said:

Christ AXE Clarry?? Nup if anything play him deep forward with a licence to go ANYWHERE!

Agree. There is more chance of me playing, than Clarry getting axed. 

[titan_uranus 23,225]

14 hours ago, picket fence said:

NORM SMITH Coached the DEES TO 6 PREMIERSHIPS and got every ounce of talent out of all players. You cannot even contemplate a comparison to Simon Goodwin, who FLUKED a premiership and has wasted the last 3 years of what has been recognised as a Crack list!!

I’m going to keep calling this out when I see it because it’s [censored]. 

17-1-4 in the H&A season, we beat every other side except one, we finished on top and we dominated three finals.

The revisionism on here from posters like you is embarrassing and pathetic. 

Focus on the problems we’re facing now but if you want to demean our 2021 flag, honestly, [censored] off. 

[Dee*ceiving 1,260]

6 hours ago, titan_uranus said:

I’m going to keep calling this out when I see it because it’s [censored]. 

17-1-4 in the H&A season, we beat every other side except one, we finished on top and we dominated three finals.

The revisionism on here from posters like you is embarrassing and pathetic. 

Focus on the problems we’re facing now but if you want to demean our 2021 flag, honestly, [censored] off. 

100% 

[picket fence 15,783]

7 hours ago, titan_uranus said:

I’m going to keep calling this out when I see it because it’s [censored]. 

17-1-4 in the H&A season, we beat every other side except one, we finished on top and we dominated three finals.

The revisionism on here from posters like you is embarrassing and pathetic. 

Focus on the problems we’re facing now but if you want to demean our 2021 flag, honestly, [censored] off. 

So two straight finals exits and u want to sugar coat that everythings Dandy, who gives a fat rats clacker what happens in the Home and Away it is what you do in finals that defines you! and so the warnings of previous games are now just coming to fruition, so are you saying you can't "Fluke" a Flag?? Footscray did it in 2016! AND given our diabolical last two STRAIGHT SETS EXITS It may well be that we indeed FLUKED a premiership just saying! Your plan for moving forward is???, I have one suggestion, play the kids and see who can be part of 2025, Hunter, Mc Adams, Shache, Fullarton and probably BBB, T.Mac and possibly Billings should not be part of 2025. So what I am saying is play for 2025. 2024 is COOKED! You dont lose to West Coast and Freo, unless there is something mightily wrong in the club!!

Edited June 3 by picket fence

[whatwhat say what 20,401]

the thing is, @picket fence, that's not what people are calling you up on - you are denigrating the 2021 premiership by looking at 2024

i don't think we're a chance to win the premiership in 2024 personally, but that has nothing to do with 2021

saying we fluked a premiership? stupid comment

[ElDiablo14 3,713]

49 minutes ago, picket fence said:

So two straight finals exits and u want to sugar coat that everythings Dandy, who gives a fat rats clacker what happens in the Home and Away it is what you do in finals that defines you! and so the warnings of previous games are now just coming to fruition, so are you saying you can't "Fluke" a Flag?? Footscray did it in 2016! AND given our diabolical last two STRAIGHT SETS EXITS It may well be that we indeed FLUKED a premiership just saying! Your plan for moving forward is???, I have one suggestion, play the kids and see who can be part of 2025, Hunter, Mc Adams, Shache, Fullarton and probably BBB, T.Mac and possibly Billings should not be part of 2025. So what I am saying is play for 2025. 2024 is COOKED! You dont lose to West Coast and Freo, unless there is something mightily wrong in the club!!

Maybe not a fluke, but definitely we had a perfect run. No major injuries and all our top talent playing at their peak of their powers.

Perhaps Goodwin is a coach that can only do it when all things fall in place. 🤷🏻‍♂️