47 minutes ago, monoccular said:

Just a question about linguistics - or perhaps semantics 

Can an opinion actually be wrong, or can it only be unfounded or unsupported or unpopular?  
It is after all personal and founded on one’s own perceptions on an issue?

something can be an opinion and wrong. no semantics needed.

just spend 5 minutes on social media

Edited September 23, 20231 yr by daisycutter

54 minutes ago, monoccular said:

Just a question about linguistics - or perhaps semantics 

Can an opinion actually be wrong, or can it only be unfounded or unsupported or unpopular?  
It is after all personal and founded on one’s own perceptions on an issue?

Spot on Monoccular.

It's like how scientists never say a theory is proved, only supported with evidence.

Eg. The theory of gravity is supported for the most part but there might be one patch of land on the world where you drop an apple and it doesn't hit the ground. Unless you check every square inch of the Earth it will always only be a supported theory.

1 hour ago, monoccular said:

Just a question about linguistics - or perhaps semantics 

Can an opinion actually be wrong, or can it only be unfounded or unsupported or unpopular?  
It is after all personal and founded on one’s own perceptions on an issue?

Mono too much binging on Big Bang Theory is not good for the eyes

5 minutes ago, layzie said:

Spot on Monoccular.

It's like how scientists never say a theory is proved, only supported with evidence.

Eg. The theory of gravity is supported for the most part but there might be one patch of land on the world where you drop an apple and it doesn't hit the ground. Unless you check every square inch of the Earth it will always only be a supported theory.

Not you too LZ!!  Gadzooks

Both are done unfortunately injuries have impacted them…. 

23 hours ago, monoccular said:

Just a question about linguistics - or perhaps semantics 

Can an opinion actually be wrong, or can it only be unfounded or unsupported or unpopular?  
It is after all personal and founded on one’s own perceptions on an issue?

100% an opinion can be wrong. 
 

I work with a peanut who thinks the earth is flat. 

Edited September 24, 20231 yr by MoeSyzlak

22 hours ago, Demon Dynasty said:

Mono too much binging on Big Bang Theory is not good for the eyes

Penny isn’t too bad on the eyes!

Having players who are past it (but still contracted) is just a legacy of pro sports (soccer is a good example for those who follow the round ball game)

And all the AFL clubs will be affected sooner or later same as all the clubs get burnt with draftee busts

So it won't be just our club

Lengthier contracts are now a staple in the AFL as they are in sports all around the world

Across the board, players reaching the end despite being contracted is going to happen more than we realise (to all the clubs)

But what should also be a staple in terms of list management is front ending lengthy contracts.  Do that and the payout is kept to a minimum if retirement is imminent

So in the quest to win big, 2 or 3 list spots may need to be sacrificed ... over time, it will even itself out (when factoring in the aforementioned occurances to all 18 clubs)

Edited September 24, 20231 yr by Macca

1 hour ago, MoeSyzlak said:

Penny isn’t too bad on the eyes!

Haha yes good point

On 9/23/2023 at 9:53 AM, biggestred said:

Tmac spent a lot of the year injured dont forget. I think with a massive preseason and staying injury free he can definitely challenge for a spot in the team. 

I hope you're right. I might be being slightly unfair but playing him in our 2 finals this year contributed to us losing both. It's easy to say in hindslight but in my opinion it would have been better if he hadn't recovered enough fitness to be selected (even with Melksham & Petty injured I would have brought in Shache ahead of him, at least Schache has a degree of agility).

I really can't see any upside for TMac. He's taking up a list spot currently but he is contracted for next year so is entitled to remain on the list if we can't negotiate him off it. 

51 minutes ago, Sydney_Demon said:

I hope you're right. I might be being slightly unfair but playing him in our 2 finals this year contributed to us losing both. It's easy to say in hindslight but in my opinion it would have been better if he hadn't recovered enough fitness to be selected (even with Melksham & Petty injured I would have brought in Shache ahead of him, at least Schache has a degree of agility).

I really can't see any upside for TMac. He's taking up a list spot currently but he is contracted for next year so is entitled to remain on the list if we can't negotiate him off it. 

For that reason, I’m still perplexed why TMac wasn’t subbed against Carlton for Schache. Goodwin’s brief explanation in the press conference after the game was bollocks. It’s a fair question that deserves an answer.

After the week before with Gus, maybe they were worried a player would get injured and they’d be a man down altogether? 

Edited September 24, 20231 yr by Great Northern Summer

In their day they were both champions. Bbb in last year's finals had close to no real influence and unfortunately it was Tmac following suit in this year's. Clearly their bodies are letting them down and from the last two years efforts it's hard to see either of them recapturing their previous great form. Maybe Bbb gets to play fwd again but I can't see Tmac doing it unless we can't recruit well or have another shocking run of injuries.

Edited September 24, 20231 yr by leave it to deever

I would be disappointed if at least one of them didn't retire. Tmac has given the club very good service over his career and BBB's first year contributed to the premiership.

7 hours ago, Great Northern Summer said:

For that reason, I’m still perplexed why TMac wasn’t subbed against Carlton for Schache. Goodwin’s brief explanation in the press conference after the game was bollocks. It’s a fair question that deserves an answer.

After the week before with Gus, maybe they were worried a player would get injured and they’d be a man down altogether? 

There is absolutely no excuse for not subbing a fresh Schache for Tom Mac, who was totally useless, at the very least, well into the last quarter.

Weitering was groggy and Schache could have run him around, or found space to do something, which could have won us the game. At the very least he could have gone back into defence in the last few minutes and maybe spoiled the Acres mark. A tap, a handball, a kick off the ground, a mark a score, anything would have been more than Tom’s zero contribution in the last quarter.

 

 

 

5 minutes ago, Redleg said:

There is absolutely no excuse for not subbing a fresh Schache for Tom Mac, who was totally useless, at the very least, well into the last quarter.

Weitering was groggy and Schache could have run him around, or found space to do something, which could have won us the game. At the very least he could have gone back into defence in the last few minutes and maybe spoiled the Acres mark. A tap, a handball, a kick off the ground, a mark a score, anything would have been more than Tom’s zero contribution in the last quarter.

 

 

 

Which is Why Goodwin failed dismally to the detriment of us potentially winning! Poor coaching in every level!🤮

In some good news generally players in their final years play above expectation, so fingers crossed we can actually get something out of one of these two next year.

19 minutes ago, leave it to deever said:

In their day they were both champions. Bbb in last year's finals had close to no real influence and unfortunately it was Tmac following suit in this year's. Clearly their bodies are letting them down and from the last two years efforts it's hard to see either of them recapturing their previous great form. Maybe Bbb gets to play fwd again but I can't see Tmac doing it unless we can't recruit well or have another shocking run of injuries.

Agree that there is a chance that BBB gets his knee right and can contribute but Tom is not getting more agile.

1 minute ago, Cheap Seats said:

In some good news generally players in their final years play above expectation, so fingers crossed we can actually get something out of one of these two next year.

Or they coast through the emotions knowing it's their last year knowing that they'll be pulling the socks up at VFL level.

 

7 hours ago, Great Northern Summer said:

For that reason, I’m still perplexed why TMac wasn’t subbed against Carlton for Schache. Goodwin’s brief explanation in the press conference after the game was bollocks. It’s a fair question that deserves an answer.

After the week before with Gus, maybe they were worried a player would get injured and they’d be a man down altogether? 

No plausible reason.

That and seemingly zero red time strategy when we were 9 points up with under a 2 minutes to go.

The Schache incident is completely on Goodwin.

The red time blunder is on all leaders both on and off the field.

Both aspects played a significant part in us not making a Prelim imho.

If the club doesn't look to get to the whys and address them then we're treading water at best in 24.

Finals do this.  They lay bare any major weaknesses in a club both in the FD and on the ground.

Ignore them at your peril.

Edited September 24, 20231 yr by Demon Dynasty

Unfortunately T Mac has the manouverabilty of a Port of Melbourne Barge. Surely he retires?

if we need them next year we are screwed.

6 minutes ago, dazzledavey36 said:

Or they coast through the emotions knowing it's their last year knowing that they'll be pulling the socks up at VFL level.

 

Yeh depends on how you want to look at it.

Im going with glass half full, you seem to be more of a pessimist?

24 minutes ago, Redleg said:

There is absolutely no excuse for not subbing a fresh Schache for Tom Mac, who was totally useless, at the very least, well into the last quarter.

Weitering was groggy and Schache could have run him around, or found space to do something, which could have won us the game. At the very least he could have gone back into defence in the last few minutes and maybe spoiled the Acres mark. A tap, a handball, a kick off the ground, a mark a score, anything would have been more than Tom’s zero contribution in the last quarter.

 

 

 

Yes Red but but i'd argue even earlier, from half time, which i called for in the game day thread.

I think everyone at the ground (if they were being honest) new Macca was cooked by half time, bar Simon (and maybe the entire FD but find that hard to fathom).

Relief ruck role with Max forward for a stint in the third.  Possible assist from Max for the extra (potentially match winning) goal.

Last quarter....Max back into the middle for significant minutes and behind the ball late to ice the game.

Schache forward for a large part of the last, mostly for ruck duties again (wasn't bringing much else at Casey just prior).

At the very least, would've freed up Tracc or tapped a ball or two to our advantage for a possible scoring opportunity to again potentially increase the buffer early in the last before parking the bus.

Edited September 24, 20231 yr by Demon Dynasty

On 9/23/2023 at 1:12 PM, Dwight Schrute said:

I think Tmacs best chance to get back into the team and extend his career is to train as a key defender and compete directly with Tommlinson for the CHB position. 

a fully fit Petty and Van Rooyen plus whoever else we bring in are going to keep him out as a forward

T Macs field kicking is horrendous and why he was moved away from down back in the 1st place.  

10 minutes ago, Cheap Seats said:

In some good news generally players in their final years play above expectation, so fingers crossed we can actually get something out of one of these two next year.

That’s because the player is usually playing for their next contract, and it’s often a big one. There is motivation.

In BBrown and TMacs case, neither will be getting another contract at their age with their injury history.

Browns knee is stuffed. He’s been managing it for years, but it’s at the point where it doesn’t seem it can be managed effectively anymore.  TMac has played 1 full season in the last 6 years, and even that was off limited preseason due to injury. His foot’s stuffed. We’d be negligent to offer either a new contract. We need to find other tall forward options in a hurry.