PREGAME: SF vs Carlton

[Red But Mostly Blue 4,547]

Just now, Roost it far said:

Absolutely no way we go with Schache, that’s the coaches unnecessarily [censored] themselves over Carlton’s talls, which is exactly what we don’t do. I like the Salem forward idea and agree that Trac must play forward. 

Salem up forward is a very good idea. Gets him involved in that last kick, and if it goes south we can defend it, rather than things going south at HB. With a bit of luck, and confidence, he'll rediscover that left foot! 

[Demonland 71,111]

29 minutes ago, dazzledavey36 said:

My guess at teams.

Ins: Jordon, Spargo, Tomlinson, Schache

Outs: Brayshaw, Chandler, Hibberd, JVR

No way Goody makes that many changes. I imagine only the two certain outs will be replaced. Perhaps the sub too.

[dazzledavey36 54,084]

6 minutes ago, Mel Bourne said:

Just can’t see Schache rising to this occasion. Grundy has a much better chance to impact. 

We lose in the forward line if Grundy is picked.

I wouldn't be surprised if he is actually the sub.

I know it's not a high bar but at least Schache has better forward craft.

[Demonland 71,111]

 

[dazzledavey36 54,084]

Just now, Demonland said:

No way Goody makes that many changes. I imagine only the two certain outs will be replaced. Perhaps the sub too.

They'll make the two forced changes but if there is anything to go by Mitch Cleary's news then yeah, Tomlinson replaces Hibberd by the sounds of it.

He also broke the news last week about Hibberd being a possible inclusion and that turned out right.

[chookrat 4,247]

4 minutes ago, dazzledavey36 said:

We lose in the forward line if Grundy is picked.

I wouldn't be surprised if he is actually the sub.

I know it's not a high bar but at least Schache has better forward craft.

I can't see Grundy playing as the sub. Usually the sub is to provide cover for injuries to key positions or inject some run into the side and Grundy does neither.  I think we either have Gawn and Grundy playing together for the full game or Grundy doesn't play. I also don't like Gawn playing predominantly forward as he is the most damaging player in the comp in the middle of the ground and doesn't offer anywhere near as much as a dedicated forward.

If Turner doesn't start then I'd say he will probably be the sub or otherwise we would probably use the sub to provide fresh legs between the arcs, e.g. JJ.

[titan_uranus 24,963]

We know we have to replace Brayshaw and it seems like Jordon gets that spot, given there aren't any other mids from outside last week's 23 who are training today. That disappoints me as I'd have liked to see Woewodin get that spot.

We know we have to replace JVR. If we had a full list it wouldn't be Grundy but we don't. With no Petty, no Melksham, and Brown not fit enough, the options other than Grundy are hardly confidence-inspiring. The question has to be whether Schache offers more than Grundy overall - as a forward, probably, but not by all that much, and Grundy then offers a lot more in terms of the ruck, giving Gawn a rest if he needs it, and allowing us to play Gawn more forward if we think that's something that might help. Neither option is ideal, but we don't have a choice.

I personally am fully supportive of Tomlinson replacing Hibberd. Carlton are a tall side and with May needing to focus entirely on Curnow all night, we're leaving too much of the defensive aerial game to Lever. He needs some height support.

Given the two forced changes and IMO the near-forced requirement to get a taller defender in, I don't think we can or should drop Chandler for Spargo. 

So I wouldn't be surprised if it's Jordon, Grundy and Tomlinson in for Brayshaw, JVR and Hibberd, with Hibberd perhaps the sub.

[layzie 33,722]

Only outs at this stage are Brayshaw and JVR so I'd say Jordon and someone else like Turner.

 

 

 

[Jaded No More 68,835]

8 minutes ago, layzie said:

Only outs at this stage are Brayshaw and JVR so I'd say Jordon and someone else like Turner.

 

 

 

No Turner at the captain's run today. He won't play.

Already confirmed by @Dannyz and some journos that Tomlinson is playing.

So that means at least 3 changes, plus the sub if they don't want to go with Laurie again which I believe they won't.

My guess

Out: Gus, JVR, Hibbo, Laurie (sub)

In: JJ, Schache, Tomlinson, Spargo

I would then say Spargo is into the 22 and Chandler is the sub

I have no faith in Schache and was hoping that we would test out Turner, but Schache gives us the 2nd ruck option that JVR provides, and he has more forward craft than Grundy.

Jesus wept at our forwardline. 

[layzie 33,722]

2 minutes ago, Jaded No More said:

No Turner at the captain's run today. He won't play.

Already confirmed by @Dannyz and some journos that Tomlinson is playing.

So that means at least 3 changes, plus the sub if they don't want to go with Laurie again which I believe they won't.

My guess

Out: Gus, JVR, Hibbo, Laurie (sub)

In: JJ, Schache, Tomlinson, Spargo

I would then say Spargo is into the 22 and Chandler is the sub

I have no faith in Schache and was hoping that we would test out Turner, but Schache gives us the 2nd ruck option that JVR provides, and he has more forward craft than Grundy.

Jesus wept at our forwardline. 

Apologies, I've missed the last few hours of news but I really needed to say something because of fomo. 

 

[SthSea22 609]

52 minutes ago, Mel Bourne said:

If defenders aren’t tall, don’t give them an even match?

Then we play Grundy

[Wodjathefirst 2,632]

Seriously I’m getting tension bloody headaches thinking about tomorrow night’s game. Just beat them. Don’t care how, don’t care by how much, just win!

[Roost it far 8,104]

Schache……Jesus wept

[Red But Mostly Blue 4,547]

So it's looking like INs - JJ, Tommo, Grundy/Schache and a possible sub swap as I don't think Laurie will get more minutes. 

[buck_nekkid 5,839]

If we have to win it for Gus, then we are stuffed.  Wrong emotional tone.

If we get in front and apply pressure, I suspect Carlton will fold.  The season will still be a success for them.  For us, anything other than a win is a fail.

Speed on the bal fron the start, high pressure going both ways.  Then it is our to lose

[leucopogon 1,519]

2 minutes ago, Roost it far said:

Schache……Jesus wept

I agree, this idea gives me cold sweats.

[DubDee 25,433]

I'm hearing the name Schache waaaay to much for a finals thread

he hasnt played a game for 3 weeks and in that game he was poor

As much as I don't think Grundy fits our structure if its a call between him and Schache, thats an easy call.  One is an AFL player, the other is not

[Red But Mostly Blue 4,547]

If it ends up being Schache and not Grundy, which is a finely balanced argument, I know Schache cops a lot of heat on here, and rightly so, haven't seen him do much.

The reality is that he is in for JVR - who did not do much last week, a quiet game by his standards and no goals. Did well in the ruck, which I think Schache can fairly well match, and I don't think we can go astray with another tall in the forward, in the hope that the ball falls on him. If he gives us 1-2 goals, it's 1-2 more than last week, and will be a big win.

I don't love it, but it's fair to say we don't have much other option. Grundy is not a forward, he has told as so, and putting Max forward negates the impact of the best ruck in the comp. We'd be doing them a solid. Let's just get Trac, Fritter and the smalls trapping the ball in the 50 and kicking truly when they get a chance. 

[Ouch! 2,258]

4 minutes ago, leucopogon said:

I agree, this idea gives me cold sweats.

The emergencies train thru the Captains run too don't they?

Even if Thommo is in, creative me says Hibbo isn't an automatic out,... I mean... could we have Hibbo and Thommo in defence, bring Rivers into the midfield and play Petracca up forward. Bringing in Jordon or Spargo for Gus.   Then whichever doesn't come in on the emergency list with Grundy, Laurie, and Schache.
Perhaps unlikely... 

[binman 42,467]

1 minute ago, Red But Mostly Blue said:

If it ends up being Schache and not Grundy, which is a finely balanced argument, I know Schache cops a lot of heat on here, and rightly so, haven't seen him do much.

The reality is that he is in for JVR - who did not do much last week, a quiet game by his standards and no goals. Did well in the ruck, which I think Schache can fairly well match, and I don't think we can go astray with another tall in the forward, in the hope that the ball falls on him. If he gives us 1-2 goals, it's 1-2 more than last week, and will be a big win.

I don't love it, but it's fair to say we don't have much other option. Grundy is not a forward, he has told as so, and putting Max forward negates the impact of the best ruck in the comp. We'd be doing them a solid. Let's just get Trac, Fritter and the smalls trapping the ball in the 50 and kicking truly when they get a chance. 

Jvr did terribly in the ruck.

15 ruck contests for one hit out.

Tmac nor much better.  Nine ruck contests for one hit out.

Two hitouts from 24 ruck contests from our two back up rucks. Not great.

[Adam The God 30,021]

Jesus sure is weeping a lot on this thread. It's quite incredible. 

[Red But Mostly Blue 4,547]

Just now, binman said:

Jvr did terribly in the ruck.

15 ruck contests for one hit out.

Tmac nor much better.  Nine ruck contests for one hit out.

Two hitouts from 24 ruck contests from our two back up rucks. Not great.

Wow there you go, I didn't appreciate it was that low. 

That only further solidifies my opinion that while I am no Schache fan, he is unlikely to perform worse in the ruck, or goal wise compared to the guy he's replacing from a game we should have won, notwithstanding that minimal output. 

He may even surprise, you never know. Boggles the mind, still mid 20s, 2m? Taken at #2 in the draft. I'll take a goal or two! With our defence, they will make the difference. 

[beelzebub 23,311]

2 hours ago, dl4e said:

Gawn in forward line and grundy to ruck.

Please....Maxxy along the 50..act as General going forwards. 

Not going to happen...

Still confounds me we're fav...

[Roost it far 8,104]

11 minutes ago, binman said:

Jvr did terribly in the ruck.

15 ruck contests for one hit out.

Tmac nor much better.  Nine ruck contests for one hit out.

Two hitouts from 24 ruck contests from our two back up rucks. Not great.

How many hit outs did Shaun Grigg get?

Edited September 14, 2023 by Roost it far

[Bring-Back-Powell 14,673]

Imagine what Grundy would be thinking on Friday night when he's up in the stands watching Schache taking his first centre ruck contest of the night.

I understand the potential selection because one can play forward and the other can't, but it's still hard to get your head around.