POSTGAME: Rd 22 vs Carlton

[Gawndy the Great 7,691]

30 minutes ago, titan_uranus said:

It 100% wasn’t touched. The angle which looks like his hand touches it is misleading because when you match it up with the side-on angle, the ball is past his hand. 

He didn’t touch it.

It’s eminently arguable we’ve lost a game due to an egregious ARC error. 

It’s also eminently arguable that we lost because we weren’t good enough for long enough. Smashed at stoppages by a side missing three starting mids. 5 goals from 31 inside 50s in the second half. A number of complete passengers.

It’s an easy conclusion to make after one game (and a loss to boot) but I don’t think Grundy forward is going to win us the flag. It just didn’t look right. 

I agree- I just got back and the first thing I did was bring this up on the telly. This was an absolute howler of a call. And the fact that the Arc didn’t overrule is an absolute joke. I was prepared to suck it up but after watching this for myself, it is undeniable. 
 

How the goal umpire calls it touched is pure guess work. It is clearly instruction from the AFL to make a call one way or the other and this bloke picked a side.

The media won’t make a fuss as they’ll talk about their love affair with the Blues. The AFL will be more than happy in having the talking points dominate the airwaves. 

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

I have a theory that the bye before finals is as much a chance to give the MCG a chance to recover.

Why they allowed a Rugby Union game to be played on there during the season is a disgrace, it was so slippery out there (although Carlton didn’t seem to mind).

[Chook 14,613]

I hate to give up on Grundy and I worry about JVR's ability to back up Max in a final, but assuming I'm wrong about both of those I think we ship off Grundy to Port, never to be seen again and we bring in whoever is our best genuine forward, because Grundy gives us very little in the ruck and absolutely nothing forward. JVR to ruck as he's actually quite good at that.

Edited August 12, 2023 by Chook

[Demon Dynasty 15,954]

38 minutes ago, Clint Bizkit said:

His fingers move, only problem is the ball is on his palm side, not the finger side.

 

The ball dropped below his hand before he even got it near the trajectory.

It's not just that he missed, he was late with the attempt by a split second but that was enough to miss it entirely.

But according to all the Blues happy clappers at 7 it was touched, bar Daisie.  That might be her last special comments sesh 😄

[Roger Mellie 3,599]

23 minutes ago, Clint Bizkit said:

I’m so conflicted about Grundy.

I agree he’s a very good ruck and helped a lot on the last when we couldn’t buy a centre clearance.

But he isn’t a forWard and he seemingly makes Gawn worse.

But he also makes JVR better (gets worn out in the ruck) and we still need another tall forward.

The only obvious out is Jordon, so it’s a tough one.

I share your conflict and I don't know what the answer is. One thing I do know is Gawn's 32 and other than Grundy, there's no obvious replacement waiting in the wings.

[david_neitz_is_my_dad 3,946]

All the radio calls thought it should be a goal except AFL Nation

 

 

 

Edited August 12, 2023 by david_neitz_is_my_dad

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

 

[Gawndy the Great 7,691]

14 minutes ago, dazzledavey36 said:

Wasn't there once upon a time you could actually zoom right in?

Does that not exist anymore???

Its grainy at best, the zoom does nothing.

AFL need at least 500 FPS cameras on the goal line  with some type of hot spot tech. Will cost 50-100K for every ground. But that is a drop in the ocean. 
 

Also don’t make goal umpire make a call.  If in doubt go to the ARC and allow them to make the decision. If that was the case tonight, it would have been a goal because there was no evidence that it was touched. 

[DeelightfulPlay 2,268]

On a different note, please can we never put Smith in the backline again.  I understand we need to keep Hibbo fresh, but Smith is too unpredictable up back.  He is much better off using his athleticism to advantage in the forward line.

[Willmoy1947 3,814]

2 minutes ago, Brownie said:

Yeah, I'm angry.

Such a lost opportunity. The lions fall over the line by a goal and we get ripped off.

Sometimes the better team loses the game. That should have been Carlton tonight.

Clear free kicks to us in the last 5 minutes ignored. A ridiculous goal line review.

Sometimes good teams win when they haven't played their best. That should have been us. 

I really detest the AFL. 

Now your close to the truth. TWSNBN not a hope on hell of making finals. Who bobs up to take their place .

Plus Richmond will not either.

Razor's game was balanced No 23 or 25 was in his usual hate mode. I wondered why Max said hello before the game started actually.

You actually think you are watching a different game from the start of the season. Pushing in the back. Constant deliberate throwing. Interference in every marking contest with umpires' s discretion as to whether they pay them or not.

That goal. Watch and listen to the Goal Umpire. He had NO F"N IDEA. He just thought it could not have got through there without someone touching it, so i will call it touched, and see how the review hold up with that.

Other than that not displeased with the game was a ripper. Still a lot to play out here.

[Macca 16,173]

3 minutes ago, kev martin said:

They were the most ungracious supporters on my walk home.

I sat above the Demon Army. There were a few blues wanting to fight them, pointing, abusing (I think), the security step in and the bad people run away. 

Imagine if Tracc's kick goes through, maybe I wouldn't get home.

The constant calls by Le blue, for htb, throws, in the back amazed me, considering how we tackled well and didn't get reward. Also looked like plenty of scragging against our players. 

Forward area marking goes astray with Petty out. 

When we mark we are a better team.

May and Lever have something going.

Need Max firing when playing with Grundy.

Viney in and under everything.

Cannot let the other team get goals from their kick ins. Something to work on, I guess.

Not too unhappy, though would have like to be still winning on the "G".

Again, no sportsmanship from the winners, entitled lot and lacking any humility.

 

Regardless of their supporters, they were the better team on the night

Can we play a lot better?  Of course we can but tonight we didn't bring it, Kev

We lacked system going forward, we played the boundary too often and we lacked decisiveness

Many of our kicks forward were scrubby and a lack of marking ability up forward was a standout feature.  Some would say an alarming feature

Still, if Port win tomorrow we'll be back in 4th spot with a likely QF opponent in Collingwood (minus Nick)

A reminder that we dismantled the Pies in the QB clash

In a lot of ways, we now know where we stand

Is it the loss we needed to have?

The wake-up call? 

[Binmans PA 26,479]

6 minutes ago, Clint Bizkit said:

Spot on about one the sub was made.

Do you think Grundy stays? I’m conflicted.

 

Before tonight I thought we'd beaten Collingwood with Gawndy and it could absolutely work, but when you need someone to take a big grab up forward, he just doesn't provide a consistent threat. 

And for whatever reason, Max can't get his game going when Grundy is in the team. 

I think they'll go without Grundy now, but I'm personally on the fence about it.

As I say, we'll have to make some more bold decisions if we're gonna win our 14th.

[dees189227 11,014]

Well at least the matildas won

[Garbo 1,359]

Goal or not we were outplayed tonight and the blue deserved that win more than we did, they came to play and kept the pressure up for 4qtrs while we chose when to go tonight.

[deanox 8,780]

47 minutes ago, Clint Bizkit said:

His fingers move, only problem is the ball is on his palm side, not the finger side.

 

I don't understand why they don't do synchronised frame by frame from multiple angles. Like they do for "over the top of goal posts" or like how they do with edges in cricket.

It would be clear as day that this wasn't touched if they lined up the two or three camera angles in synch.

[Demon Dynasty 15,954]

1 minute ago, Chook said:

I hate to give up on Grundy and I worry about JVR's ability to back up Max in a final, but assuming I'm wrong about both of those I think we ship off Grundy to Port, never to be seen again and we bring in whoever is our best genuine forward, because Grundy gives us very little in the ruck and absolutely nothing forward. JVR to ruck as he's actually quite good at that.

JVR shouldn't have to be doing so at such an early stage if his career but that's the unfortunate truth.

In limited doses he is as good or better than Grundy and probably only a smidgem behind Max at tap ruck work now.

Max & Reg were beaten on a number of occasions with tap work by their oppo rookie De Koenig tonight.

[Bates Mate 3,963]

35 minutes ago, Demonland said:

 

The Blues fans around me where calling holding the ball 😅. They definately got a few crowd assisted frees or non calls tonight

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

1 minute ago, DeelightfulPlay said:

On a different note, please can we never put Smith in the backline again.  I understand we need to keep Hibbo fresh, but Smith is too unpredictable up back.  He is much better off using his athleticism to advantage in the forward line.

Madness that’s how we started the game.

Great we fixed it but should never have happened in the first place.

[Roost it far 6,240]

Close, tight, tough…..these games end with one winner, just got to make sure it’s us next time.

[Anti-Saint 216]

1 hour ago, bing181 said:

Said it last week. Losing Petty will cost us a flag. We are not going to kick the scores we need against quality opposition without a decent power forward.
 

and the option of kicking it in to a marking option provides so much more - "its a heartbreaker!"

[Earl Hood 5,816]

3 minutes ago, Gawndy the Great said:

I agree- I just got back and the first thing I did was bring this up on the telly. This was an absolute howler of a call. And the fact that the Arc didn’t overrule is an absolute joke. I was prepared to suck it up but after watching this for myself, it is undeniable. 
 

How the goal umpire calls it touched is pure guess work. It is clearly instruction from the AFL to make a call one way or the other and this bloke picked a side.

The media won’t make a fuss as they’ll talk about their love affair with the Blues. The AFL will be more than happy in having the talking points dominate the airwaves. 

Yes I have noticed goal umpires calling touched when they could only be guessing. Unless you see the ball deviate or hear a slap it used to be assumed to be a goal. A few weeks ago one of the umps called touched from a snap 25 m out from goal. The review played back and forth on whether someone’s finger moved. I mean there was no way the ump would be knowing from that distance.
 

Are they tending to guess now because they have the video review? 

[Binmans PA 26,479]

Just now, Macca said:

Regardless of their supporters, they were the better team on the night

Can we play a lot better?  Of course we can but tonight we didn't bring it, Kev

We lacked system going forward, we played the boundary too often and we lacked decisiveness

Many of our kicks forward were scrubby and a lack of marking ability up forward was a standout feature.  Some would say an alarming feature

Still, if Port win tomorrow we'll be back in 4th spot with a likely QF opponent in Collingwood (minus Nick)

A reminder that we dismantled the Pies in the QB clash

In a lot of ways, we now know where we stand

Is it the loss we needed to have?

The wake-up call? 

Agree with this mate.

I think we played the percentages a fraction too often with our ball movement.

A couple of times when we should have gone long on the switch or fast on the slingshot, we played safe. The coaches might be ultimately okay with that, because their response would be, if Trac's goal is given, we win. But this is the difference between us and Collingwood and Port. They take that every time. Particularly, Collingwood. 

I guess over the next month and a half, we'll see which approach stacks up better. And ultimately, we might stick with our approach anyway as we fit our system to our personnel. If we had two F/Ss that could hit kicks from everywhere that were essentially the best players in their draft years, we might be better able to make that shift. Instead we have inside bulls and contested beasts.

Again, we'll see who wins out soon.

[jane02 3,460]

7 minutes ago, Demon Dynasty said:

The ball dropped below his hand before he even got it near the trajectory.

It's not just that he missed, he was late with the attempt by a split second but that was enough to miss it entirely.

But according to all the Blues happy clappers at 7 it was touched, bar Daisie.  That might be her last special comments sesh 😄

Daisy has totally lost me. When Rivers was slammed into the ground she stated that ‘he contributed’. I would like her explanation on how that was so? 
I would suggest she needs to get her eyes checked especially after that call of the ball being touched.

 

 

[dazzledavey36 49,301]

12 minutes ago, Binmans PA said:

The other thing that seemed obvious tonight was the lack of midfield cohesion, which was undoubtedly thrown off by the return of Clarry.

It's no one's fault, we just have to find better cohesion. Multiple players going for the same ground ball and lacking trust in team mates to win it. Happened at the back too.

This was then exacerbated by Carlton's pressure.

Both Sparrow and Pickett had very limited CBA minutes which was disappointing. 

Sparrow had a poor game and was stuck at half forward majority of the game, but at one stage.it would have been good to rotate him.through there where's he's actually been in good form since Oliver was out.

[The heart beats true 16,483]

I’ve settled down. The reality is that we pipped them this time last year and it really didn’t make much difference come September. Being fit and feeling good in September is what matters.

We didn’t play well for sections of that game, and almost stole it. I’m very proud of the boys. When it mattered they came hard. Sometimes it just doesn’t fall your way.