10 minutes ago, binman said:

Three peanuts:

The highest award.

Counterintuitively sometimes gets it right, but just as likely to contradict themselves a few days later - and sometimes even in the same sentence.

But consistently gets it wrong and often doubles down on the wrongness.

Often appears to have an obvious agenda or axe to grind. Almost always cannot get past their preconceptions, suffers terribly from confirmation bias and looks for every opportunity to find evidence that supports that bias.

Confuses spouting stats with analysis.

Highly likely to be an overweight ex footballer who like to wear open necked pastel shirts that at first glance might suggest they are super built.

Hello, Mr. Maclure. 

8 minutes ago, drdrake said:

We are being critical of comments like this but this is exactly what the club did, same as the first article. All the journos were doing was stating the bleeding obvious, we had to become ruthless and stop accepting losing, we had to improve our forward line, we had to get the reward for ruck domination and had to improve our disposal and decision making.  

Guess what we did improve on all these areas and we get the ultimate result.  

 

Bollocks. 

McClure says this about our culture:

“Can Jesus Christ deliver at the Dees? No one can deliver at the Dees.

“The problem is the culture’s all wrong. Which is the biggest-name player that’s ever been dropped at Melbourne? I can’t think of one. Because it’s soft, a soft culture they’ve got.

“What’s got to happen is if the actual coaching staff and the people on the board don’t stand up and start to build a culture of this football club – it’s been 50, 60 years since they’ve won a Grand Final … and they’re still the same. Have they improved? Or have they got worse?”

Total rubbish.

Sure the players went up level this season in terms of their selflessness and buy in. But the improvement didn't come out of nowhere. Just one more example of false, self serving narrative

It takes years to build culture and we have been steadily building since Roos came on board and since Goody took over in 2017.

Instead of making jokes about his use of phrases like learnings, if peanuts like McClure bothered to listen to goody, they would have heard him say that the way we ended the 2020 season winning two elimination games was a really important step forward. A point he reiterated in his post GF interviews. 

What's that expression? Those that can do, those that can't find work as commentors in the media.

I think Guru Bob has a much better grasp than Guru Gary

5 hours ago, DeesignerAU said:

What articles have you read or vision have you seen from so-called experts that makes your blood boil?

There was an article by Garry Buckenara about the status of Melbourne's list not more than 12 months ago which makes me fume.

You can read the article here - https://www.myheartbeatstrue.com/beat-the-paywall/from-the-archive-recruiting-guru-gary-buckenara-analyses-melbourne-demons-list-after-the-2020-afl-season/

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Don't forget to check https://www.myheartbeatstrue.com/ for all the latest demon news

🤣🤣🤣what a banana he is

Cam Mooney was pilloried after last year saying we were ready to win the premiership. He was only out by 1 year in his prediction. Kudos to him

The old hawthorn brigade of Dunstall and Dermie were the worst offenders in my opinion. They didn't try to hid their contempt for us. Ross Lyon has gone down a lot in my estimation as well as he too has an obvious gripe with us for some reason

5 hours ago, WalkingCivilWar said:

The mere mention of his name makes me sick. 

Why is buckenara described as a list "Guru".

He's achieved what exactly?

6 hours ago, DeesignerAU said:

What articles have you read or vision have you seen from so-called experts that makes your blood boil?

There was an article by Garry Buckenara about the status of Melbourne's list not more than 12 months ago which makes me fume.

You can read the article here - https://www.myheartbeatstrue.com/beat-the-paywall/from-the-archive-recruiting-guru-gary-buckenara-analyses-melbourne-demons-list-after-the-2020-afl-season/

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Don't forget to check https://www.myheartbeatstrue.com/ for all the latest demon news

Oliver's 2020 season: AA squad and top 10 brownlow finish

Buckenara: "Oliver is replacable."

 

Petracca's 2020 season: AA midfielder and top 2 brownlow finish

Buckenara: Lists Petracca as a b-grader 

 

I get the vibe that this guy has never watched Melbourne very closely.

Edited September 29, 20213 yr by Hopeful Demon

One more thing about the McClure comments.

He says: 

'Which is the biggest-name player that’s ever been dropped at Melbourne? I can’t think of one. Because it’s soft, a soft culture they’ve got'

He can't think of one hey?

Well, what about Goody's decision to TRADE Jack Watts - a number one draft pick, a huge fan favourite and by all accounts loved by his team mates. That was a seriously big call. A culture call. 

(disclaimer: i was completely against that decision.  Our biggest weakness was kicking and he was our best kick. But i also made clear that i respected Goody and trusted him to make the right call. And acknowledged that i of course didn't know anything about his training standards or of field stuff, other tan rumours of course. Well, Goody has once again been proved correct. And i have been proved incorrect. As many argued on demonland at the time, it was the right call)

5 minutes ago, binman said:

One more thing about the McClure comments.

He says: 

'Which is the biggest-name player that’s ever been dropped at Melbourne? I can’t think of one. Because it’s soft, a soft culture they’ve got'

He can't think of one hey?

Well, what about Goody's decision to TRADE Jack Watts - a number one draft pick, a huge fan favourite and by all accounts loved by his team mates. That was a seriously big call. A culture call. 

(disclaimer: i was completely against that decision.  Our biggest weakness was kicking and he was our best kick. But i also made clear that i respected Goody and trusted him to make the right call. And acknowledged that i of course didn't know anything about his training standards or of field stuff, other tan rumours of course. Well, Goody has once again been proved correct. And i have been proved incorrect. As many argued on demonland at the time, it was the right call)

And guess who we got for Watts...Fritsch

6 minutes ago, binman said:

 

Bollocks. 

McClure says this about our culture:

“Can Jesus Christ deliver at the Dees? No one can deliver at the Dees.

“The problem is the culture’s all wrong. Which is the biggest-name player that’s ever been dropped at Melbourne? I can’t think of one. Because it’s soft, a soft culture they’ve got.

“What’s got to happen is if the actual coaching staff and the people on the board don’t stand up and start to build a culture of this football club – it’s been 50, 60 years since they’ve won a Grand Final … and they’re still the same. Have they improved? Or have they got worse?”

Total rubbish.

Sure the players went up level this season in terms of their selflessness and buy in. But the improvement didn't come out of nowhere. Just one more example of false, self serving narrative

It takes years to build culture and we have been steadily building since Roos came on board and since Goody took over in 2017.

Instead of making jokes about his use of phrases like learnings, if peanuts like McClure bothered to listen to goody, they would have heard him say that the way we ended the 2020 season winning two elimination games was a really important step forward. A point he reiterated in his post GF interviews. 

Don't forget at the end of 2020 season Gary Pert did his own Footy department review that was announced to media and Members, from memory a letter from Pert went out after we lost to Fremantle and Sydney.  That review saw most of our assistant coaches gone and he added in Yze and Williams.  We also moved Richardson into the Football Mangers that was split between him and Josh that lead to him leaving.  The noise coming out of our club was we had a lot to fix, journo's just jumped on it.  Gary Pert makes mention of this review in the below link

https://www.sen.com.au/news/2021/09/08/how-a-post-season-review-helped-turn-melbourne-into-a-juggernaut/

It was a build, no one outside the club cares about the process they report on what they see, what they saw in 2019 and 20 was a club that had talent and failed to deliver, stock standard MFC soft culture, take the easy option of losing rather than dig in and in the past they would be right.

 

 

Didn’t he have one of the Wagner brothers and Petracca more or less on parity?

3 hours ago, Demonised said:

Mark Maclure will probably find something to carp on about. He's never had a good word for the Dees.

Yes he has Demonised he picked us to win the Granny on AFL 360.

1 minute ago, drdrake said:

Don't forget at the end of 2020 season Gary Pert did his own Footy department review that was announced to media and Members, from memory a letter from Pert went out after we lost to Fremantle and Sydney.  That review saw most of our assistant coaches gone and he added in Yze and Williams.  We also moved Richardson into the Football Mangers that was split between him and Josh that lead to him leaving.  The noise coming out of our club was we had a lot to fix, journo's just jumped on it.  Gary Pert makes mention of this review in the below link

https://www.sen.com.au/news/2021/09/08/how-a-post-season-review-helped-turn-melbourne-into-a-juggernaut/

It was a build, no one outside the club cares about the process they report on what they see, what they saw in 2019 and 20 was a club that had talent and failed to deliver, stock standard MFC soft culture, take the easy option of losing rather than dig in and in the past they would be right.

 

 

Lets agree to disagree.

A club with a soft culture would have taken the easy road.

Rather then having the CEO do the review, they would have got an external, high profile consultant to do the review.

They would have sacked the coach.

And instead of looking to improve their governance, they would have ignored problems with their board. Unlike the dees, who, after going 4 zip had the courage to, one, realise they needed to make changes at board level and two make those changes. 

And they would have completely destabilized the club and put it back 10 years.

Just like McClure's joke of a club. 

1 minute ago, binman said:

Lets agree to disagree.

A club with a soft culture would have taken the easy road.

Rather then having the CEO do the review, they would have got an external, high profile consultant to do the review.

They would have sacked the coach.

And instead of looking to improve their governance, they would have ignored problems with their board. Unlike the dees, who, after going 4 zip had the courage to, one, realise they needed to make changes at board level and two make those changes. 

And they would have completely destabilized the club and put it back 10 years.

Just like McClure's joke of a club. 

If your a Journo with knowing the history of the club, the culture the club did have, you report and over state the issues as you see it.  We did need to set higher standards, we needed to realise potential rather than boast about it.  The club fixed it and we got the result, I doubt there would be many supporters that actually believed at the end of 2020 we would win the flag in 2021, the belief grow took a hit mid year and then gained massive momentum late.

On culture, our club has made some good calls to turn ours around, one club that should have made a call after the last couple of years of turmoil and didn't is Adelaide.  They have a young developing list, Walker should have been walked.

51 minutes ago, BDA said:

The old hawthorn brigade of Dunstall and Dermie were the worst offenders in my opinion. They didn't try to hid their contempt for us. Ross Lyon has gone down a lot in my estimation as well as he too has an obvious gripe with us for some reason

To be fair to Dunstall, he was very firm this year in calling us a good club. I remember when we were looking like we were ready to [censored] the bed against North, he said that 'like all good clubs do, Melbourne steadied and found a way to grind out the win'.  This year was the first time I had seen him show active respect to us.

That being said, Dermie as per usual was carrying on like a galloot with his pot shot at Fritta born of nothing. Ross Lyon seemed to be getting his talking points from 2011 as well in how we could be beaten. Those two will never change though I'm afraid.

Edited September 29, 20213 yr by Colin B. Flaubert

1 hour ago, rpfc said:

Speaking of peanuts and being wrong.

Where in the world is Olisik and Dr. D?

Gone back to their actual clubs? Over to Saintsational to troll St Kilda fans?

@olisik @Dr.D where you spanners at?

26 minutes ago, DeeZone said:

Yes he has Demonised he picked us to win the Granny on AFL 360.

I stand corrected!

To be fair, there are of course quite a number of people working in the footy media that provide some really excellent analysis and thought provoking insights - most are trained journos but not all.

Some of my favorites include Greg Baum, Caroline Wilson, Daisy, Montagna, Bartel, Peiek, Nicholson, Delidio, Arnell, Middlemass, Lawson, Atkinson and Gleeson, who wrote this excellent article recently that highlights our bravery as club, inlcuidn how we went about our internal review:

https://www.smh.com.au/sport/afl/four-points-demons-awesome-display-the-moment-that-turned-the-tide-a-reward-for-bravery-20210926-p58uvi.html

Edited September 29, 20213 yr by binman

1 hour ago, binman said:

One more thing about the McClure comments.

He says: 

'Which is the biggest-name player that’s ever been dropped at Melbourne? I can’t think of one. Because it’s soft, a soft culture they’ve got'

He can't think of one hey?

Well, what about Goody's decision to TRADE Jack Watts - a number one draft pick, a huge fan favourite and by all accounts loved by his team mates. That was a seriously big call. A culture call. 

(disclaimer: i was completely against that decision.  Our biggest weakness was kicking and he was our best kick. But i also made clear that i respected Goody and trusted him to make the right call. And acknowledged that i of course didn't know anything about his training standards or of field stuff, other tan rumours of course. Well, Goody has once again been proved correct. And i have been proved incorrect. As many argued on demonland at the time, it was the right call)

Ditto Hogan.

And with respect to dropping players, what about Ben Brown, Weideman, Melksham, Hibberd, Jetta and Jones? Note: I don't know when McClure made those comments, so some of those decisions may have been after the comments were made. The point is, when Goodwin and the Match Committee decided someone else should play in the side, they didn't shy away from making tough decisions on high priced recruits and fan favourites.

Media person 

Adam White

Medium

Radio, breakfast show on  RSN 

Comment

Every Monday during the season, White has had the benefit of listening to the excellent analysis of Bartel and  Ramanaskus, who have consistently highlighted the dees strengths and likelihood of winning the flag. Despite this, and the mounting evidence, has consistently questioned our bona fides.

Unable to shake his confirmation bias, he tipped the lions to beat us. Much to the disbelief of Bartel and  Ramanaskus he tipped the Cats to win the prelim. And then, after bartel had made the case the dees would win the GF, cherry picked a brief comment Bartel made about the pressure of playing in a GF to say 'mmm, that has crystalized my thoughts that the dogs will handle the pressure better given their experience in 2016 and i think they' win'. 

Score

 

2 minutes ago, binman said:

Media person 

Adam White

Medium

Radio, breakfast show on  RSN 

Comment

Every Monday during the season, White has had the benefit of listening to the excellent analysis of Bartel and  Ramanaskus, who have consistently highlighted the dees strengths and likelihood of winning the flag. Despite this, and the mounting evidence, has consistently questioned our bona fides.

Unable to shake his confirmation bias, he tipped the lions to beat us. Much to the disbelief of Bartel and  Ramanaskus he tipped the Cats to win the prelim. And then, after bartel had made the case the dees would win the GF, cherry picked a brief comment Bartel made about the pressure of playing in a GF to say 'mmm, that has crystalized my thoughts that the dogs will handle the pressure better given their experience in 2016 and i think they' win'. 

Score

 

I really hope this is the lead-up to double peanut and triple peanut postings 

As an aside, has Greg Denham retired yet? He was venomous about us back in the day (not without reason though).

It’d be interesting to hear his thoughts about us.

2 minutes ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

I really hope this is the lead-up to double peanut and triple peanut postings 

You always have to start at the beginning. 

This will be a very therapeutic process for me. 

This thread will sustain me for some time.

Quote

 McClure  says: 

'Which is the biggest-name player that’s ever been dropped at Melbourne? I can’t think of one. Because it’s soft, a soft culture they’ve got'

I don't know how long ago he said this, but if you don't have any big-name players, it's hard to drop them.