Pretty much the only reason I tune in in the first place is to watch Oliver. Not much else excites me. 
Trac has joined him, though. 

Forgotten my [censored]...only by anyone not really paying attention or serious about their footy

How is Cripps considered a superstar when he can’t kick? He is a great inside bull but his kicking especially for goal is embarrassing 

8 hours ago, Watts the matter said:

He did a great job, but if Cripps kicks straight he is the game winner. Oliver also had the advantage of a much better Ruckman.

They had to throw Cripps up forward because they needed to get him I to the game.

If Cripps had kicked those goals that's not on Oliver, thats on our defenders.

He did his job on the day.

1 hour ago, DubDee said:

How is Cripps considered a superstar when he can’t kick?

I despise carlton as much as anyone, but Cripps is an absolute jet. He's clearly among the top handful of midfielders in the league, no point pretending otherwise.

On topic, I think Oliver is a bit of a victim of his own consistency. He's been dominating since day dot, but so far hasn't really taken the next step to becoming a more damaging, goalkicking mid that many of us think he can become. That said, I'm more than happy for him to fly under the radar.

Oliver is a great midfielder, but he's not a superstar yet. There are two key parts of his game he needs to improve to become a superstar.

First, he needs to stand up and have an impact when the team needs it. Superstars drag their team along with them. Think Michael Voss bulldozing someone and kicking a goal when scores are tied. Think Dusty shoving aside multiple people and snapping his third goal of a quarter when scores are tied. The superstars have the ability to stand up when it's required. Oliver as yet doesn't do this. He consistently wins ball across games, but he doesn't have bursts of impact or stand up in big moments.

Second, he needs to hit the scoreboard. The difference between the superstars (Dusty, Fyfe, Dangerfield) and the next level down (T. Mitchell, Kelly, Oliver) is the superstars all hit the scoreboard. They do it consistently and sometimes in a big way. Dusty, Fyfe and Danger all rest forward and kick bags. the best players in the league are mid-forwards. Oliver showed glimpses of this in 2018, but as yet hasn't developed the forward part of his game.

I believe he can become a superstar. He has shown he has the ability and physical attributes, he just needs to develop them. At this stage, he came in a ball winning gun, and he's still a ball winning gun. He hasn't really developed much at all, but he is young and has plenty of time.

2 hours ago, dazzledavey36 said:

They had to throw Cripps up forward because they needed to get him I to the game.

If Cripps had kicked those goals that's not on Oliver, thats on our defenders.

He did his job on the day.

I don't necessarily disagree, but that's something Oliver needs to add to his game to get to the next level.

I am not sure if Cripps went forward or was just pushing forward from the midfield, he was always around the clearances in the last quarter. I actually think the one he missed in the last quarter, he got away from Oliver and Rivers was trying to cover, impossible for any of us to know, but a few minutes later when he marked and goaled Oliver was on him in the forward 50 and Cripps got rid of him very easily. Cripps had a shocker with his disposal on the weekend but did have a big last quarter.

My point was more that I can't remember too many occasions where Oliver lifts late in the game the way that Cripps, Fyfe, Martin and others do. 

I am a huge Oliver fan, he is a seriously goof footballer.

His work around the contest is phenomenal and his handball is razor sharp. Where I think he falls behind is perceived effort, Tom Mitchell for instance is another accumulator, but he is frantic in his approach.

Clayton get's things done with very little fuss, he's not bowling people over to win the ball, he just gets it and moves on. I doubt he will ever be regarded in the same manner as the absolute elite, because most observers are not clued in enough to watch what he does and he certainly doesn't showboat around to make people take notice. Martin, Fyfe and Dangerfield are all very similar in their desire to take everyone on alone and when it comes off, people notice - it also fails often.

1 hour ago, Lord Travis said:

Oliver is a great midfielder, but he's not a superstar yet. There are two key parts of his game he needs to improve to become a superstar.

First, he needs to stand up and have an impact when the team needs it. Superstars drag their team along with them. Think Michael Voss bulldozing someone and kicking a goal when scores are tied. Think Dusty shoving aside multiple people and snapping his third goal of a quarter when scores are tied. The superstars have the ability to stand up when it's required. Oliver as yet doesn't do this. He consistently wins ball across games, but he doesn't have bursts of impact or stand up in big moments.

Second, he needs to hit the scoreboard. The difference between the superstars (Dusty, Fyfe, Dangerfield) and the next level down (T. Mitchell, Kelly, Oliver) is the superstars all hit the scoreboard. They do it consistently and sometimes in a big way. Dusty, Fyfe and Danger all rest forward and kick bags. the best players in the league are mid-forwards. Oliver showed glimpses of this in 2018, but as yet hasn't developed the forward part of his game.

I believe he can become a superstar. He has shown he has the ability and physical attributes, he just needs to develop them. At this stage, he came in a ball winning gun, and he's still a ball winning gun. He hasn't really developed much at all, but he is young and has plenty of time.

This is pretty much how I see him as well,  'LT'.

He needs to have more effort across the whole ground,  impacting up forward,  or down back cutting off the opposition,  which includes stopping Cripps from drifting forward and marking inside F50.

Oliver cam close to losing the game for us,  because he switched off when in our D50.   And allowed Cripps to mark easily.

18 hours ago, picket fence said:

The Age rated him second best on the Ground, The Hun No Votes.

I absorbed his game last week and Second only to Trac was easily a 2 vote game Max also telling but his domintaion also dropped of after half time

From My perspective is an umpire I would have called it 

3 Votes Trac

2 votes Oliver

1 Vote Weitering!

I agree a criminally UNDERRATED PLAYER 

What were the coaches Votes??

If your thinking Cripps you would be right according to my mate over the back paddock...

I hope Trac takes Oliver under his wing (I know they're good mates) this year or next and shows him how to train more intensely (over the summer break) and drift forward to kick a goal or two. 

I get that he and Trac are totally different players but Oliver could become fitter/be a goal kicker too. He's still super young and whenever I see him in a club video he's always joking around or taking the pi**. All well and good of course, but this year or next would love to see him take the next step. From memory I though it had happened against GC in 2018 when he kicked 2 or 3? 

Just needs to hit the scoreboard more because Viney rarely does. So even 1 between them a game would be nice

9 hours ago, Deestroy All said:

Pretty much the only reason I tune in in the first place is to watch Oliver. Not much else excites me. 
Trac has joined him, though. 

Kysaiah says hi!

3 hours ago, Accepting Mediocrity said:

I despise carlton as much as anyone, but Cripps is an absolute jet. He's clearly among the top handful of midfielders in the league, no point pretending otherwise.

On topic, I think Oliver is a bit of a victim of his own consistency. He's been dominating since day dot, but so far hasn't really taken the next step to becoming a more damaging, goalkicking mid that many of us think he can become. That said, I'm more than happy for him to fly under the radar.

Unfortunately, he only gets under the radar from pundits and other team supporters. The opposition coaches are well aware of his influence. But as he is so good, most of their tactics are not effective - long may that continue.

3 hours ago, Accepting Mediocrity said:

I despise carlton as much as anyone, but Cripps is an absolute jet. He's clearly among the top handful of midfielders in the league, no point pretending otherwise.

On topic, I think Oliver is a bit of a victim of his own consistency. He's been dominating since day dot, but so far hasn't really taken the next step to becoming a more damaging, goalkicking mid that many of us think he can become. That said, I'm more than happy for him to fly under the radar.

Good comment, but Cripps isn’t much of a goal kicker at all but still the best current player to compare Clarry to.

Oliver can become an elite player but that doesn’t mean he has to become a consistent kick for goal. Most elite teams only really need to have one of their mids who do that, and we have Petracca to take us to the next level in this regard.

We would be better off comparing Oliver to Sam Mitchell, who was never a real goal kicker, but still an absolute star of the competition in his prime.

17 minutes ago, nacnud said:

Good comment, but Cripps isn’t much of a goal kicker at all but still the best current player to compare Clarry to.

Oliver can become an elite player but that doesn’t mean he has to become a consistent kick for goal. Most elite teams only really need to have one of their mids who do that, and we have Petracca to take us to the next level in this regard.

We would be better off comparing Oliver to Sam Mitchell, who was never a real goal kicker, but still an absolute star of the competition in his prime.

Why are we making excuses for him,  instead of encouraging him to become a more rounded Mid with wider skills, than just,  see-ball get-ball.

That's allowing him to sit back from here, and just maintain what he is now.

18 minutes ago, nacnud said:

Good comment, but Cripps isn’t much of a goal kicker at all but still the best current player to compare Clarry to.

Oliver can become an elite player but that doesn’t mean he has to become a consistent kick for goal. Most elite teams only really need to have one of their mids who do that, and we have Petracca to take us to the next level in this regard.

We would be better off comparing Oliver to Sam Mitchell, who was never a real goal kicker, but still an absolute star of the competition in his prime.

Not sure about that - Mitchell was an elite kick on both sides (later the developed his left) and had extreme footy smarts. 

Oliver I see more as a better version of Daniel Cross (both good tacklers, would prefer to handball than kick, inside mids and don't hit the scoreboard). 

I'd like to see Oliver become that Jobe Watson type player (could see backlash for that comment) but Jobe in his prime was super impactful once he hit that next level. 

In saying all of this he's 22 - which is pretty crazy for how good he is. In 3-4 years he'll be in his peak and he could rise to being a totally different player.  

8 minutes ago, MyFavouriteMartian said:

Why are we making excuses for him,  instead of encouraging him to become a more rounded Mid with wider skills, than just,  see-ball get-ball.

That's allowing him to sit back from here, and just maintain what he is now.

Gee whiz mate, all I’m saying is that simply kicking more goals is not the only way Oliver can be elite.

I’d like to see him kick more goals, but what I’d love to see is him kicking the ball more instead of handballing, and we’re already starting to see that.

I also think it’s pretty stupid to think the supporters somehow has more an influence on a player than the coaching staff. 

Some people really need to calm down about Oliver. We keep forgetting that the bloke is only 22, and yet people are still complaining.

 

19 minutes ago, nacnud said:

Gee whiz mate, all I’m saying is that simply kicking more goals is not the only way Oliver can be elite.

I’d like to see him kick more goals, but what I’d love to see is him kicking the ball more instead of handballing, and we’re already starting to see that.

I also think it’s pretty stupid to think the supporters somehow has more an influence on a player than the coaching staff. 

Some people really need to calm down about Oliver. We keep forgetting that the bloke is only 22, and yet people are still complaining.

 

Oli is what 22Yrs you say. Tim Watson started playing AFL at 16Yrs of age.

Oli has plateaued for the past 2 seasons.

 

I'd like to see him backup our defenders more, by running harder defensively,  and getting involved there,  spoiling opposition, and then helping to bring the ball back up.   In 2018,  he was busy in-between 30Mtrs to back edge of square;  I 'd like to see him work more between F50 & our beyond our half-backline, helping our defenders.   Much more than him kicking goals.  

This is where we need our midfielders hardest work. 

 

We as a team have to run harder longer.  As has been talked of relentlessly over the past 4 seasons. 

 

 

 

 

Edited June 18, 20204 yr by MyFavouriteMartian

4 hours ago, TheKozzieExperience said:

Kysaiah says hi!

everyone tunes in for ANB. Just nobody admits it.

19 hours ago, Watts the matter said:

He did a great job, but if Cripps kicks straight he is the game winner. Oliver also had the advantage of a much better Ruckman.I didn’t think Clarry was on Cripps when he went forward? Could be wrong 

Just now, Billy said:

19 hours ago, Watts the matter said:

He did a great job, but if Cripps kicks straight he is the game winner. Oliver also had the advantage of a much better Ruckman.I didn’t think Clarry was on Cripps when he went forward? Could be wrong 

Was Clarry on Cripps when he went forward?

16 minutes ago, Billy said:

Was Clarry on Cripps when he went forward?

He was for the goal in the last quarter, Cripps easily outbodied Oliver and marked. On the other occasion in the last quarter Rivers was opposed to him but unsure how that matchup came about.

In the third quarter Cripps was resting forward and Smith gave away a panic free kick. Nothing to do with Oliver.

23 hours ago, Demon Disciple said:

Until he starts kicking more goals and chasing more, he should not be even close to being considered a superstar.

A good player absolutely, and our best mid along side Trac, but superstar, no.

This is exactly what Clayton needs to lift towards. 
He is a gun Midfielder but he will be so much better if he can tackle more and kick 1-2 goals a game

24 minutes ago, Sir Why You Little said:

This is exactly what Clayton needs to lift towards. 
He is a gun Midfielder but he will be so much better if he can tackle more and kick 1-2 goals a game

Would probably lead our tackle count at the moment.

He doesn't run back hard enough at times but tackling is not an issue, he lays them and they stick.

The superstars don't usually chase or tackle...at least he has half of this covered.

He could do with hitting the scoreboard a bit more but I agree with the article. He is a bit of the forgotten man...

7 minutes ago, rjay said:

Would probably lead our tackle count at the moment.

He doesn't run back hard enough at times but tackling is not an issue, he lays them and they stick.

The superstars don't usually chase or tackle...at least he has half of this covered.

He could do with hitting the scoreboard a bit more but I agree with the article. He is a bit of the forgotten man...

Clarry is tough, don’t get me wrong. Yes he does lay some hard tackles in the middle of the ground, but he needs to do more work around the ground to go to the next level

He will get there...