Farewell Sam Frost

[Wiseblood 24,637]

6 minutes ago, Red and Blue realist said:

Sounds like his manager has been pumping his tyres up and he's going along with that. Every chance his manger is talking to the Dees and asking for a figure that might be 25% or more above what we are prepared to pay. It could end up like the Weid situation where he ends up signing for a lot less than originally asked, or he could find that his manager locks in a much better deal elsewhere and leaves. I hope the Dees stick to their guns and don't overpay on the back of his season, yes it was the best he's played yet however it still was nowhere near as good as some on here think.

The difference between Frost and Weid are the interest levels of other clubs.  I'd imagine that the Weid wouldn't have had a huge amount of interest, while Frosty has had a terrific season and at 26 is in his prime years.

I am hopeful that the club stick to their guns as well, as I don't believe Frosty is someone who would be in our best 22 if everyone is fit.

[AshleyH30 566]

13 minutes ago, Red and Blue realist said:

Sounds like his manager has been pumping his tyres up and he's going along with that. Every chance his manger is talking to the Dees and asking for a figure that might be 25% or more above what we are prepared to pay. It could end up like the Weid situation where he ends up signing for a lot less than originally asked, or he could find that his manager locks in a much better deal elsewhere and leaves. I hope the Dees stick to their guns and don't overpay on the back of his season, yes it was the best he's played yet however it still was nowhere near as good as some on here think.

I'm seeing a lot of people on here, and on social media acting like he's the god damn messiah. It's actually quite annoying how much people are pumping him up at the moment. That's also with the petition that's going around asking for Melbourne to re-sign him for what ever he wants. I believed he's peaked in his ability. 99 times out of a 100, a player doesn't improve once they reach 26 years old, it's usually the age where they peak.

Edited September 18, 2019 by AshleyH30

[Demon3 2,541]

Frosty went up a lot in my respect levels this year, he never gave up, when clearly a few others had and i really admire that, its clear he has his deficiencies but he kept backing up each week.

The reality is though he isn't a  great ball user and a great decision maker, 2 key areas you need to be pretty good at in the back half. He is a great mark, great rebounder, but does not have a great football brain and that cost us on more than a few times. 

 The problem is we are caught in between paying big (overs) for Lever and also have May on big money and both have shown a propensity to get injured..  do we maintain him for cover, can he play in the back line with lever and May? if they go down, its O-mac and Petty.. god help us.

Tough one and whats he realistically going to get us, is it a second round pick because he has currency? or a player swap, does Frost for Mason Wood work.. its a really intriguing situation and wont be solved for a while i imagine.

[Adam The God 30,256]

22 minutes ago, Superunknown said:

If I was frosty I’d be thinking so what’s the hold up? My contract is predicated on some other deals/inbound? Yeah, nah. See ya dees. He’d look good in a hawks strip

No one looks good in that jumper. It's a shocker.

[Red and Blue realist 2,051]

Just now, Wiseblood said:

The difference between Frost and Weid are the interest levels of other clubs.  I'd imagine that the Weid wouldn't have had a huge amount of interest, while Frosty has had a terrific season and at 26 is in his prime years.

I am hopeful that the club stick to their guns as well, as I don't believe Frosty is someone who would be in our best 22 if everyone is fit.

Weid had just come off a finals series where he was very good, as a 21 year old key position forward. He would have had a huge amount of suitors. Frost has just played his best season, but still has massive limitations, and is best as the 2nd key back and can only be used in certain structures, so it would rule out a lot of clubs. 

[Wiseblood 24,637]

1 minute ago, Red and Blue realist said:

Weid had just come off a finals series where he was very good, as a 21 year old key position forward. He would have had a huge amount of suitors. Frost has just played his best season, but still has massive limitations, and is best as the 2nd key back and can only be used in certain structures, so it would rule out a lot of clubs. 

I might be wrong, but I doubt it.  He had a bit of a shocker this season so those offers might have dried up a little.

[Red and Blue realist 2,051]

2 minutes ago, AshleyH30 said:

I'm seeing a lot of people on here, and on social media acting like he's the god damn messiah. It's actually quite annoying how much people are pumping up at the moment. That's also with the petition that's going around asking for Melbourne to re-sign him for what ever he wants. I believed he's peaked in his ability. 99 times out of a 100, a player doesn't improve once they reach 26 years old, it's usually the age where they peak.

Spot on, if he's your best key back then there are issues. He can be a good complementary piece in the right environment, but I still don't see that he's a definite best 22 when everyone is fit. May, Lever, Jetta and Hibberd, then 1/2/3 of Frost, Hore, Petty or Omac plus a mid running through like Salem, Jones (Lewis this year) etc. 

[Red and Blue realist 2,051]

Just now, Wiseblood said:

I might be wrong, but I doubt it.  He had a bit of a shocker this season so those offers might have dried up a little.

The offers would have come before this year, they would have come on the back of what he did in the finals and what he would have been projected to do. We'll never know of course, but I have no doubt if we put both on the market we'd get a whole lot more for Weid than Frost. 

[pitmaster 3,550]

Having listened to the entire interview what surprised me was that Frosty seemed not to have given his manager Anthony McConville much in the way of riding instructions. Only when prompted by Lyon did he indicate he had told McConville he'd prefer to stay but was waiting on an offer. Frosty seemed to be pretty passive and dare I say it, lukewarm about staying. It sounded more like a vague preference on account of the fact he had his mates at Melbourne. It makes me wonder how much influence managers' have: we could be looking at another Jeremy Howe situation where the manager talks the player out of his club by trying to build up his price.

He nominated North and Hawthorn as clubs that had contacted McConville and added that another, a third club which he did not name, had made contact. 

Edited September 18, 2019 by pitmaster

[Demons1858 1,760]

On 9/14/2019 at 3:22 PM, Laughing Goat said:

I agree....mate

But you need to come up with something better than that.....Frost has an average of 2.7 turnovers per game & the following players have a higher average for the 2019 season......

Hibberd 5, Brayshaw 5, Oliver 4.7, Lever 4.1, Salem, Jones & Viney 4 

Scarey I know but my question still stands......who replaces Frosty with his obvious pace & lock down ability? He provides spark, excitement & quick ball movement, something that all of the above players struggle with.

Stats in the wrong hands are dangerous. To get an accurate view of this turnovers you need to assess the % turnovers/disposals. It's pretty common for mids to have the highest turnovers and other stats for that matter

[whatwhat say what 22,755]

the interview was interesting; it sounds like he doesn't really have anyone that keen to recruit him, and we're 'open to options' in terms of whether or not we keep him

he wouldn't be the first player to have thought he was worth more than he really is, and finds that the reality is a long way removed from what he wishes was the case

he's a good, ordinary player

if we keep him, we keep him

if we don't, we'll get some dribs and drabs for him

[Red and Blue realist 2,051]

3 minutes ago, whatwhatsaywhat said:

the interview was interesting; it sounds like he doesn't really have anyone that keen to recruit him, and we're 'open to options' in terms of whether or not we keep him

he wouldn't be the first player to have thought he was worth more than he really is, and finds that the reality is a long way removed from what he wishes was the case

he's a good, ordinary player

if we keep him, we keep him

if we don't, we'll get some dribs and drabs for him

Seemed like the kind of interviews de-listed players have in the lead up to the draft and in particular the pre-season supplementary selection period last year.Guys like Nathan Freemon, Jimmy Toumpas, Hugh Goddard etc. all did similar on SEN. 

[whatwhat say what 22,755]

1 minute ago, Red and Blue realist said:

Seemed like the kind of interviews de-listed players have in the lead up to the draft and in particular the pre-season supplementary selection period last year.Guys like Nathan Freemon, Jimmy Toumpas, Hugh Goddard etc. all did similar on SEN. 

yes, it definitely had that vibe

[george_on_the_outer 7,591]

52 minutes ago, Superunknown said:

If I was frosty I’d be thinking so what’s the hold up? My contract is predicated on some other deals/inbound? Yeah, nah. See ya dees. He’d look good in a hawks strip

It's called list management, and salary cap. 

How many others are to be delisted?  How much will that save in cap space?

How much money do we have for other players who we might be seeking?. 

How much do we have to pay existing players, as their contracts mature?

If you spend all your tickets before trade period, you can't seriously get involved.  

[Mach5 4,767]

2 hours ago, Superunknown said:

If I was frosty I’d be thinking so what’s the hold up? My contract is predicated on some other deals/inbound? Yeah, nah. See ya dees. He’d look good in a hawks strip

 

He’d look great in any other strip.

[Laughing Goat 308]

2 hours ago, george_on_the_outer said:

It's called list management, and salary cap. 

How many others are to be delisted?  How much will that save in cap space?

How much money do we have for other players who we might be seeking?. 

How much do we have to pay existing players, as their contracts mature?

If you spend all your tickets before trade period, you can't seriously get involved.  

Its about common sense for me.....something the MFC clearly lacks. Before going & spending big money on other players & money we clearly don't have,  lock down a player that we obviously need. Might be too late for us to sign Frosty & TBH I don't blame him for going.....

Shows a total lack of care & common sense considering out lack of outside run & ball carriers.

Tomlinson would be the second slowest player on our list if he came. Wake up.

 

[Wiseblood 24,637]

3 minutes ago, Laughing Goat said:

Its about common sense for me.....something the MFC clearly lacks. Before going & spending big money on other players & money we clearly don't have,  lock down a player that we obviously need. Might be too late for us to sign Frosty & TBH I don't blame him for going.....

Shows a total lack of care & common sense considering out lack of outside run & ball carriers.

Tomlinson would be the second slowest player on our list if he came. Wake up.

 

How did you come to this conclusion?  Our movements in FA so far suggest we have money to spend.

And no, holding off on some contracts as we work through things is absolute common sense.  Every club does it.

[Laughing Goat 308]

2 minutes ago, Wiseblood said:

How did you come to this conclusion?  Our movements in FA so far suggest we have money to spend.

And no, holding off on some contracts as we work through things is absolute common sense.  Every club does it.

Easy to come to this conclusion because in my opinion, Frosty is the exactly the player we need & holding off with his contract is a mistake. He will go to another club, no question!  Wouldn't you?

May & Lever on $800k each & not considered in our best 1 or 2 backman this year.

Dumb.

[DubDee 25,863]

So the guys saying we gave him a low ball offer were full of BS. 

Who would have thought??

[Superunknown 4,217]

3 hours ago, A F said:

No one looks good in that jumper. It's a shocker.

All the players holding those 4 recent cups up looked rrrrrreal good

[Adam The God 30,256]

1 hour ago, Superunknown said:

All the players holding those 4 recent cups up looked rrrrrreal good

Naaaah.

[binman 42,956]

49 minutes ago, DubDee said:

So the guys saying we gave him a low ball offer were full of BS. 

Who would have thought??

The low ball comment no doubt came from his manager, mcconville.

Standard manager trick to pout some bultish rumor out via a sympathetic news gossip and seed a couple of footy forums. Same trick Jone's manager used. 

Works a treat when gullible football forum posters repeat it like it is fact

Might have misread the room on this one methinks.

Edited September 19, 2019 by binman

[praha 11,240]

3 hours ago, pitmaster said:

Having listened to the entire interview what surprised me was that Frosty seemed not to have given his manager Anthony McConville much in the way of riding instructions. Only when prompted by Lyon did he indicate he had told McConville he'd prefer to stay but was waiting on an offer. Frosty seemed to be pretty passive and dare I say it, lukewarm about staying. It sounded more like a vague preference on account of the fact he had his mates at Melbourne. It makes me wonder how much influence managers' have: we could be looking at another Jeremy Howe situation where the manager talks the player out of his club by trying to build up his price.

He nominated North and Hawthorn as clubs that had contacted McConville and added that another, a third club which he did not name, had made contact. 

Evidently, in Howe's case, the manager rightly upped the price to Howe's true value, which regrettably Melbourne disagreed with. Clubs will do their due diligence, Frost might get more at Hawthorn but they're also desperate to fill their cap with experience with the likes of Puopolo and Isaac set to go off the books this year. So would they rather go after experience on a 400k salary or bring in inexperienced potential, 3-4 players? Clarkson is a masterful coach but I also trust him to be a results driven man, he's topping up his retirement coffers at this stage, hitting KPIs and setting achieveable expectations. He can't lose. They'll bounce between top 4 and 10th-12th for the remainder of his coaching career and it won't put a dent in his credentials.

[loges 6,767]

On 9/17/2019 at 7:40 PM, Cards13 said:

Most opposition players think our club is a joke, they’re correct. The West Coast players after our loss to them at Optus where saying we were chit during the song. 

I think it's actually you that thinks the club is a joke.

[jnrmac 20,065]

5 hours ago, Wiseblood said:

I might be wrong, but I doubt it.  He had a bit of a shocker this season so those offers might have dried up a little.

True but he would still have a huge load of suitors. Has shown he can do it on the big stage. And players like that fully developed cost $1m pa