On 18/07/2019 at 00:12, Dr. Gonzo said:

The only thing that stopped us getting the double chance last year was our 2x games vs Geelong. We lost both on (or close to) the siren. It sucks but if those games go our way, were top 4.

I think that cuts both ways.  If Kennedy and Darling (who went off early in the 1st) had played the rnd 22 game and GWS not shut up shop for rnd 23 (they couldn't make top 4 if they had beaten us so barely turned up) we could easily have lost one or both games and just scraped into the 8.    

So many ifs and maybes: we just need to accept the season as it was:  a roller coaster until round 21 then we had some luck, put our skates on and had a purple patch for a few weeks. 

It was a great ride but I would like to see more than 2 weeks of good luck and 2 weeks of flying high to be convinced we are a really good club capable of making finals on a regular basis.  We have a good side, just not convinced about us being a good club.  Both are needed.

Edited July 18, 20195 yr by Lucifer's Hero

Get Watts back Beg him to come back and that all is forgiven.  Make him the kicking to position coach, Make him help Petracca adjust his kicking for goal coach. He would give confidence to the Weid him being there. However it is all impossible.

HALF  JOKING    However l wonder. 

  On 18/07/2019 at 00:28, Bring-Back-Powell said:

David King also brought up those stats last night on AFL 360.

Hard to argue with them, and hard to see us being anything more than a 7th-10th side next year if we do have a bounce back year.

The right moves over the break and we will bounce back up and contend.

For a lot of the negatives (constructive criticisms) I've posted about this season I still think we have the foundations of a very good team.

Some good trading, drafting, moves and attitude adjustments in the FD/playing group along with a bit of luck and we're as good a chance as any.

Remember the Cats were finished after we cleaned them up in the final last season and look how they've bounced back.

Here is a different take on this.  Yes, we have had a terrible year.  Yes, on our path, we haven’t beaten too many top teams.

#1 On our way up, we had an easier draw and less games against top sides.  This year, we are worse and play more of them. Natural progression would have seen us play more top sides, and beat them.  This did not happen.

#2 Lots of reasons we dropped the bundle this year.  It is a complete write off.  If we can look to next year, then it is what we make of this car crash that matters.  A few things like:

• Getting a back 6 that plays cohesively together.  With May and Lever AA quality, surrounded by a group working and understanding each other (not all flying for the same mark, etc.)
• Getting a midfield that has some experience, and can shift from ‘panic’ mode with the ball to actually using it productively.  Building confidence in each other and doing more than just winning the contest, but winning the quality clearance.
• Having a forward line that works.  TMac back in form (he had been moving like gollum this year) and more development into Weid.  A small forward and some clean half forwards.
• Gaining confidence in each other and improving basic skills.  Most of the team are kids, and we have played something like 38 players this year.
• Getting development into Preuss so he can be the second ruck, He is definitely a work in progress, and not there yet.
• The addition of some outside run.

We are simply young, damaged, without confidence and struggling to apply a complex system under pressure.  If they use what is left of this year and the pre-season, it will not be wasted.  Then we can best a few more of those top teams (and hopefully get the easier draw and a nice draft pick as additional bonuses.)

  On 17/07/2019 at 12:10, beelzebub said:

Did you miss H/A ?? 

But why leave out finals, surely they are more definitive than H/A games?

  On 17/07/2019 at 11:58, praha said:

That is our record against top 8 sides during H&A over the last two seasons. Only one other team hasn't won against a top 8 side this year. I'm sure you can guess which team it is.

What do we put this down to? Inexperience? Coaching? Luck (or lack thereof) of the draw? Culture? This is over two years. Not just this year.

The more we see, the more reality starts to hit home.

What does this club stand for?

I've not pondered that question since round 2, 2013.

Here we are, six years on.

I've been banging on about it for two years also, we've beaten nobody....

Edited July 18, 20195 yr by SFebes

We will find this all out next year, Simon knows he has next year to turn the ship around. He has most probably asked for a few new changes within the club, understandable those are in motion and will begin to take shape even as we speak and in the off season.

If things do not change and continue on the same course as this year, then its going hard for him to continue.

I will be expressing my desire for the club to seek a new Coach if this whole season is repeated again.

I ain't got time for this [censored] again!

  On 17/07/2019 at 12:07, Pennant St Dee said:

Hawks, GWS, Geelong, Eagles = 4 top 8 sides last season but knock yourself out to suit your argument 

Not to mention the Crows were in the 8 when we pantsed them in the NT last season 

FMD the sky is falling 

 

Gee, a cloud just hit me.

1. Our list is just not fit enough, look at our final quarters. 

2. I honestly believe the club has not recovered from last September in Perth. 

At some stage it has to be faced, otherwise Goodwin is completely wasting his time. 

His Press Conferences are now just a repeat of the week before...

Nothing is improving or changing except endeavour, but without skills that will always drop off. 

  On 18/07/2019 at 00:31, Lucifer's Hero said:

I think that cuts both ways.  If Kennedy and Darling (who went off early in the 1st) had played the rnd 22 game and GWS not shut up shop for rnd 23 (they couldn't make top 4 if they had beaten us so barely turned up) we could easily have lost one or both games and just scraped into the 8.    

So many ifs and maybes: we just need to accept the season as it was:  a roller coaster until round 21 then we had some luck, put our skates on and had a purple patch for a few weeks. 

It was a great ride but I would like to see more than 2 weeks of good luck and 2 weeks of flying high to be convinced we are a really good club capable of making finals on a regular basis.  We have a good side, just not convinced about us being a good club.  Both are needed.

I think that's a somewhat inaccurate assessment of our performance Vs GWS.  They would have been trying pretty hard to win I recon:

1.  What team wants to go into an elimination final against a team they just lost to {I think that was one of the scenarios};

2.  Whilst top 4 might have been unlikely/out of the equation, GWS were still playing at least for the guarantee of a home final.

  On 18/07/2019 at 02:46, Sir Why You Little said:

1. Our list is just not fit enough, look at our final quarters. 

2. I honestly believe the club has not recovered from last September in Perth. 

At some stage it has to be faced, otherwise Goodwin is completely wasting his time. 

His Press Conferences are now just a repeat of the week before...

Nothing is improving or changing except endeavour, but without skills that will always drop off. 

I think some supporters haven't moved on but I'd be very surprised if the players and the coaches haven't. For them, it's ancient history. Equally, every finals win before the PF would also be forgotten. They know they are only as good as the ladder says they are.

  On 18/07/2019 at 03:11, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

I think some supporters haven't moved on but I'd be very surprised if the players and the coaches haven't. For them, it's ancient history. Equally, every finals win before the PF would also be forgotten. They know they are only as good as the ladder says they are.

I disagree

Otherwise we wouldn’t still be playing the same way...

Meth Coke will run rampant this weekend, i will bet my left one...

  On 18/07/2019 at 03:14, Sir Why You Little said:

I disagree

Otherwise we wouldn’t still be playing the same way...

Meth Coke will run rampant this weekend, i will bet my left one...

I can't see the link between the PF and us playing the way we are now.  Perhaps I'm missing something, but is there something specific about the way we play that you can point to which can correct my view? 

  On 18/07/2019 at 03:02, Rodney (Balls) Grinter said:

I think that's a somewhat inaccurate assessment of our performance Vs GWS.  They would have been trying pretty hard to win I recon:

1.  What team wants to go into an elimination final against a team they just lost to {I think that was one of the scenarios};

2.  Whilst top 4 might have been unlikely/out of the equation, GWS were still playing at least for the guarantee of a home final.

Fair points. 

Looking at the key stats in rnd 23 their performance was way below par which prompted my 'barely turned up' comment. 

Had they beaten us and finished 5th they may have well faced Geelong in the first semi.  Better odds that they would play Sydney in their home state which is what happened.

Nonetheless, my point was more about all the ifs and maybes that can go either way that would have enabled us to make the top 4 or position in the 8.

  On 18/07/2019 at 03:23, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

I can't see the link between the PF and us playing the way we are now.  Perhaps I'm missing something, but is there something specific about the way we play that you can point to which can correct my view? 

I can’t help you if you cannot see a connection between lat years PF and the 2019 Season....

  On 18/07/2019 at 03:27, Sir Why You Little said:

I can’t help you if you cannot see a connection between lat years PF and the 2019 Season....

I was hoping you could. I now have to decide whether you can't help me or won't help me. 

My point is, that you have an opinion that it's about the PF and the lack of any review.  I just happen not to share that opinion. You think there's an obvious correlation; I think it's far more nuanced than that. 

  On 18/07/2019 at 03:34, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

I was hoping you could. I now have to decide whether you can't help me or won't help me. 

My point is, that you have an opinion that it's about the PF and the lack of any review.  I just happen not to share that opinion. You think there's an obvious correlation; I think it's far more nuanced than that. 

Since Half Time PF Day last year this club has been a mere shadow of what it was. 90% is above the shoulders. But it won’t be addressed until it is acknowledged. If Goodwin refuses to do it, he is a fool and Bartlett aint far behind him....

Right at the moment i would be happy to have beaten all teams outside the 8 and no side in the eight. Well not happy but our season would not be dead just yet.

  On 18/07/2019 at 03:23, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

I can't see the link between the PF and us playing the way we are now.  Perhaps I'm missing something, but is there something specific about the way we play that you can point to which can correct my view? 

agree. i can't understand why so many posters want to make so much out of just one game in a season of 25.

we had a bad day, and lets not forget that within a week of that game we had 9 players in for surgery, and that wasn't due to the pf.  our deteriorating physical condition must have played a part, even though there was no comment (excuses) on it before the game

  On 18/07/2019 at 03:55, daisycutter said:

agree. i can't understand why so many posters want to make so much out of just one game in a season of 25.

I assume that SWYL is still peddling this one, almost a year after it happened?

I admire his persistence and marvel at his stubborness.

  On 18/07/2019 at 03:55, daisycutter said:

agree. i can't understand why so many posters want to make so much out of just one game in a season of 25.

we had a bad day, and lets not forget that within a week of that game we had 9 players in for surgery, and that wasn't due to the pf.  our deteriorating physical condition must have played a part, even though there was no comment (excuses) on it before the game

The PF was the straw that broke the demon's back Thats the significance of the PF.  That so many players went under the knife is  imho directly a result of many being ridden into the ground by a playing style that simply cant be done for 100 mins.

we were worn out by that game....literally

(that is to say ...by that game we were worn out...fried )

Edited July 18, 20195 yr by beelzebub

  On 17/07/2019 at 12:17, praha said:

The only sides that were top 8 during H&A when we beat them were GWS and WC. 

In what world are you living in that any half decent side is even remotely relevant without beating good teams?

Teams that can't beat top 8 sides aren't relevant.  You're right about that.

The problem is that we DID beat Top 8 sides.  As Pennant points out, and I'm ignoring the H&A aspect here, we knocked off five of them, two of which were done in the pressure cooker of finals.  That's a pretty handy record if you ask me.  It took us a while to do it in 2018, but then we went on and beat four of them in a row.  That's nothing to sneeze at.

This season has been forgettable and we're lucky to beat anyone, but as someone else pointed out, we still knocked off Fremantle while they were inside the Top 8.  I guess it's not exactly the same, but I think this stat is a little irrelevant if you look at ALL the stats and not just limit it to anything prior to finals.

  On 18/07/2019 at 04:07, Wiseblood said:

I assume that SWYL is still peddling this one, almost a year after it happened?

I admire his persistence and marvel at his stubborness.

Keep your head in the sand Wise, it’s your best spot

you who acknowledge that this year “is a bit of a shocker”.....

 

  On 18/07/2019 at 04:08, beelzebub said:

The PF was the straw that broke the demon's back Thats the significance of the PF.  That so many players went under the knife is  imho directly a result of many being ridden into the ground by a playing style that simply cant be done for 100 mins.

we were worn out by that game....literally

Correct, and the same tactics are still in place....

 

Foolish Behaviour 

  On 18/07/2019 at 03:39, Sir Why You Little said:

Since Half Time PF Day last year this club has been a mere shadow of what it was. 90% is above the shoulders. But it won’t be addressed until it is acknowledged. If Goodwin refuses to do it, he is a fool and Bartlett aint far behind him....

We matched them in the second half of the prelim only being -4pts. 8.5.53 - 7.7.49..... the problem isn't the prelim, its surgeries, injuries and coaching.