1 hour ago, Redleg said:

Interesting that Hogan has kicked only 8 goals so far this year with a few Joe the Goose ones included and also didn’t have a single kick against the Lions. Clearly not setting the world on fire.

Lost interest in footy?

9 hours ago, Moonshadow said:

Hogan was a key forward, contested marking beast in his first 2 years. Just what we needed. Soon became a running high half forward who would kick a couple of goals per game. Could hardly take a contested mark in the end. Loves to party, wanted home to his 'mates' in WA, pictures tell a thousand words. 

We need a stable key forward, whether that be Tmac, Weid or someone like Cameron. 

Its as almost like he was trying to play that floating forward in the same form as Luke Bruest.

I remember that huge contested mark he took against Rance in his first year and i was licking my lips knowing that was going to be a regular trademark from him. Unfortunately thats pretty much the only time we saw that kind of display.

9 hours ago, DV8 said:

Who would we chase for a running player ?    Coniglio or Whitfield..  

I reckon I would go Coniglio 1st...  as we need leadership,  and he has leadership already in his repertoire.

Pretty sure they will retain Coniglio DV.  They were never going to lose all three of their star trio, Kelly, Coniglio & Cameron.

Cameron is still up but even if he decides to take a mad offer elsewhere i doubt it would be us after this year's debacle and Sunday's bog ordinary performance.

49 minutes ago, Moonshadow said:

Lost interest in footy?

Bit of a selfish footballer who drank his own bath water too often Moon.  He also never flew the flag for his mates on the odd occasion it was needed and the solid pack/one on one marking pretty much disappeared after the first season.

He was very handy around the ground, especially intercept and contested marking through mid field, which is sadly lacking this season.  But after playing as a high HF for a year or so (no doubt under instruction) completely forgot what he was recruited for in the first place and how to play as one (when it was asked / needed).

2 hours ago, Rusty Nails said:

Bit of a selfish footballer who drank his own bath water too often Moon.  He also never flew the flag for his mates on the odd occasion it was needed and the solid pack/one on one marking pretty much disappeared after the first season.

He was very handy around the ground, especially intercept and contested marking through mid field, which is sadly lacking this season.  But after playing as a high HF for a year or so (no doubt under instruction) completely forgot what he was recruited for in the first place and how to play as one (when it was asked / needed).

Still to play out, but I think we will eventually come out better from that trade. May will be a good footballer for us, just needs to get fit and on the park which will happen soon

Not sure about Finlayson. He was good on the weekend, but we let him of the leash way to easily. Does he play well against a better team or better opponent? I doubt he would've done much against May or Lever.

Jeremy Cameron? Yes please, but I wish we could poach a few FAs rather than give up players or picks in return. Reckon we'd have cap space for him.

Edited May 30, 20195 yr by Moonshadow

57 minutes ago, Moonshadow said:

Still to play out, but I think we will eventually come out better from that trade. May will be a good footballer for us, just needs to get fit and on the park which will happen soon

Not sure about Finlayson. He was good on the weekend, but we let him of the leash way to easily. Does he play well against a better team or better opponent? I doubt he would've done much against May or Lever.

Jeremy Cameron? Yes please, but I wish we could poach a few FAs rather than give up players or picks in return. Reckon we'd have cap space for him.

I haven't seen enough of Finlayson to form an opinion other than on Sunday Moon.  Certainly appears to have his kicking boots on in front of goals though.

Cameron in would obviously be a great coup and would more than make up for Hogan in our forward stakes.

Çan anyone imagine GWS trading Cameron. I think he would be in the KAAC Bracket !!!!

9 hours ago, Rusty Nails said:

Pretty sure they will retain Coniglio DV.  They were never going to lose all three of their star trio, Kelly, Coniglio & Cameron.

Cameron is still up but even if he decides to take a mad offer elsewhere i doubt it would be us after this year's debacle and Sunday's bog ordinary performance.

I expect us to hoist a very wet sail  'RN',  with $$$$'s written all over it.    Coniglio...

Perhaps we could offer up the money we  saved...  by not hitching up the  $ulky.

Edited May 30, 20195 yr by DV8

21 hours ago, Moonshadow said:

Still to play out, but I think we will eventually come out better from that trade. May will be a good footballer for us, just needs to get fit and on the park which will happen soon

Not sure about Finlayson. He was good on the weekend, but we let him of the leash way to easily. Does he play well against a better team or better opponent? I doubt he would've done much against May or Lever.

Jeremy Cameron? Yes please, but I wish we could poach a few FAs rather than give up players or picks in return. Reckon we'd have cap space for him.

Do  You know why we can't score this year, we traded all our forwards for defenders, hogan has 8 to 10 years  in the game, may already 28 next year before we see any benefits. The list is so unbalanced at the moment we have defenders coming out of our ears, besides Sam we have no other promising young  key forwards on the list, we need to trade in a ready made forward to replace hogan, instead we replaced hogan with a 28 year old fat  Defender, may has always been  a lazy fat unprofessional footballer, no one knew how unprofessional he was because the Suns where so bad, it made him look good.

Finlayson this year.

   games   wins  kicks  marks  handballs  disposals   goals   behinds

10

7-0-3

106

55

26

132

22

9

 

Tom Mac

10

3-0-7

72

38

45

117

8

9

Edited May 31, 20195 yr by Redleg

Finlayson is their 3rd key forward and Tom is basically our only one.

We let our main key man go and didn't replace him at all and left the whole job to Tom and a still developing Weid.

That is great list management.

15 minutes ago, Redleg said:

Finlayson is their 3rd key forward and Tom is basically our only one.

We let our main key man go and didn't replace him at all and left the whole job to Tom and a still developing Weid.

That is great list management.

"Our main key man" became a running high half forward, a linkage player who has taken less and less contested marks over the last 3 years. Now averaging less than 1 per game this year and less than 1 goal per game this year

But I agree we need a stable, key forward who can successfully take the no 1 key back. I'd still like to see Preuss play forward, whilst not a kpf and having limited ability, he would be a hand full for any backline to deal with. He'd probably take the no 1 back, leaving Tmac with no 2 and eventually Weid no 3

Perhaps they have a kpf in mind for next year.

Regardless, our delivery forward has been so terrible this year, I reckon even Jeremy Cameron would struggle

2 hours ago, Moonshadow said:

"Our main key man" became a running high half forward, a linkage player who has taken less and less contested marks over the last 3 years. Now averaging less than 1 per game this year and less than 1 goal per game this year

But I agree we need a stable, key forward who can successfully take the no 1 key back. I'd still like to see Preuss play forward, whilst not a kpf and having limited ability, he would be a hand full for any backline to deal with. He'd probably take the no 1 back, leaving Tmac with no 2 and eventually Weid no 3

Perhaps they have a kpf in mind for next year.

Regardless, our delivery forward has been so terrible this year, I reckon even Jeremy Cameron would struggle

You point out all of Hogan's  flaws but you forget to mention he kick 54 goals last year we haven't replaced that, hogan has always averaged 2 goals a game at the dees even in our really bad years. You say even Jeremy would struggle, i think he would still kick goals, because the supply in our forward line is as high as ever, we just don't have anyone who is good enough to take advantage of that Jeremy would Provide a better contest in our forward half.

On 5/29/2019 at 10:06 AM, Bitter but optimistic said:

We need someone who can teach our current forwards how to kick.

Ill do it for the right price Uncle with Guaranteed results.? In fact Uncle I was deadly accurate from anywhere 60 -70 m Torps were my go ! And none of this Bultish kicking bananas from angles either. Just pick out a target behind the goals and run in straight lines!!

Practice a meticulous routine, lower the ball drop in synchronisation with hand to foot, kick through the ball with a 12 o clock finish. Its not that hard. Clearly too hard for club to invest in a Goal kicking coach. Sheesh whats Peter Mc Kenna doing??

1 hour ago, picket fence said:

Ill do it for the right price Uncle with Guaranteed results.? In fact Uncle I was deadly accurate from anywhere 60 -70 m Torps were my go ! And none of this Bultish kicking bananas from angles either. Just pick out a target behind the goals and run in straight lines!!

Practice a meticulous routine, lower the ball drop in synchronisation with hand to foot, kick through the ball with a 12 o clock finish. Its not that hard. Clearly too hard for club to invest in a Goal kicking coach. Sheesh whats Peter Mc Kenna doing??

You’re an inspiration picket - as always!

2 hours ago, picket fence said:

Ill do it for the right price Uncle with Guaranteed results.? In fact Uncle I was deadly accurate from anywhere 60 -70 m Torps were my go ! And none of this Bultish kicking bananas from angles either. Just pick out a target behind the goals and run in straight lines!!

Practice a meticulous routine, lower the ball drop in synchronisation with hand to foot, kick through the ball with a 12 o clock finish. Its not that hard. Clearly too hard for club to invest in a Goal kicking coach. Sheesh whats Peter Mc Kenna doing??

I saw him in a TAB once. Might still be there. Mind you I rarely go there myself.

Not a fan of him.

He's not the type of forward we need IMHO

3 hours ago, don't make me angry said:

You point out all of Hogan's  flaws but you forget to mention he kick 54 goals last year we haven't replaced that, hogan has always averaged 2 goals a game at the dees even in our really bad years. You say even Jeremy would struggle, i think he would still kick goals, because the supply in our forward line is as high as ever, we just don't have anyone who is good enough to take advantage of that Jeremy would Provide a better contest in our forward half.

No he didn't. If you're going to ramble in disagreement with another poster's reasonable point of view, at least get your facts right.

Edited May 31, 20195 yr by Moonshadow

3 hours ago, don't make me angry said:

You point out all of Hogan's  flaws but you forget to mention he kick 54 goals last year we haven't replaced that, hogan has always averaged 2 goals a game at the dees even in our really bad years. You say even Jeremy would struggle, i think he would still kick goals, because the supply in our forward line is as high as ever, we just don't have anyone who is good enough to take advantage of that Jeremy would Provide a better contest in our forward half.

How many times?

Hogan has NEVER KICKED OVER 50 GOALS IN A SEASON!

2018 Hogan kicked 47

This year Hogan is averaging .9 goals per game

 

Edit:- Beat me to it Moonie. I am sick to death of Hogan the superstar! Jayden Hunt averages more goals this year and has kicked more goals this year than Hogan and he is no superstar.

Edited May 31, 20195 yr by ManDee

A big problem I believe that Jessie faced taking big pack marks in our forward line was our habbit of blindly bombing the ball in, with blatant disregard to kick it to the advantage of our own players.  That and combined with the high forward press that we played meaning our forward line was usually super congested and Jessie often double or tripple manned in marking contrsts.

That all said, by definition, a pack mark also infers a highly contested situation fought over by a big group of players and I do feel that Jessie did drop off and never completely delivered on his potential for us in this regard.

9 hours ago, ManDee said:

How many times?

Hogan has NEVER KICKED OVER 50 GOALS IN A SEASON!

2018 Hogan kicked 47

This year Hogan is averaging .9 goals per game

 

Edit:- Beat me to it Moonie. I am sick to death of Hogan the superstar! Jayden Hunt averages more goals this year and has kicked more goals this year than Hogan and he is no superstar.

Hunt's been thrown in the deep end this year up forward. Was tried there before and it failed, but he's having a red hot crack at it. I've always thought it was his natural position, and if he gets his goal kicking going he could well be a superstar.

Give him space i50 and he'll lead up, give him the ball in space around 60 out and he doesn't need to look up and find a target, he knows where it is. I think there's massive upside.

Back on track though. I'd have Finlayson, but we'd need to pay for him. Coniglio comes free (trade value), as have all of the Hawks premiership winners. The free agency bus is the one we need to be getting on. People keep saying 'but he's not what we need'. Take the bloody freebie and find a way to make it work.

On a related note, how badly did big Cam Pedersen time his career with us?  We were absolute rubish when he first joined us, but then spent years on the fringe when we picked up our game.

It's a pitty we don't have Pedo this year as I feel he could have played a role to bridge the gap while Weid matures a bit more.  I feel that Pedo was more mobile than Preuss,  but had a bigger presence than Tim Smith. 

This whole discussion begs two questions to me:

1.Is Weid going to become the player we had hoped when we picked him at pick 9; and

2. Are we actually going to play Preuss? The past several weeks seemed to be the ideal time to play him and at the moment he looks like becoming the next Pedo, the fridge player who gets half a dozen games a year and work almost be questioning why he made the move from North.

If either of the above two can play that second key forward role for us sufficiently well, then I see Cameron or Finlayson as being fairly redundant to our needs and we would be better spending the money and trade capital elsewhere, unless he just fell into our lap. 

Edited May 31, 20195 yr by Rodney (Balls) Grinter

Hogan has been a loss however if he still played for us he’d probably be with everyone else on the injury list anyway. I’m with you @don't make me angry, I like to church up a players stats to help support my position. 

Edited May 31, 20195 yr by Ethan Tremblay

The point of my thread is that good list management would have  seen a need and addressed it.

I used Finlayson as the example, because some of us on DL saw the need and knew he was available pretty cheaply and he could play both ends, was an accurate kick, good mark and had pace.

Who did the FD identity and go after? Result was it was all left to Tom who was injured and the developing Weid. We can see the results now, that we are the worst  side in the AFL at keeping possession when we enter our inside 50. 

Finlayson as a 3rd tall forward has kicked 3 times the goals of Tom and would have helped him and us if we got him. He was available and most on here knocked him.

I have said for a while our list management has been poor, as we have ignored pace and disposal in our relentless search for contested possession. 

I don’t blame Taylor I blame those giving him the shopping list.

7 hours ago, FireInTheBelly said:

Coniglio comes free (trade value), as have all of the Hawks premiership winners. The free agency bus is the one we need to be getting on. People keep saying 'but he's not what we need'. Take the bloody freebie and find a way to make it work.

This ?