Tanking scandal documents

[Bring-Back-Powell 14,865]

I’m looking forward to the 80 page special about West Coast going from finishing 3rd (2007) to second last (2008) and being rewarded a priority pick which just happened to be a bloke called Luke Shuey.

Or an investigation into Collingwood’s round 19 performance against North at the formerly known Telstra Dome. 40 points up in the third quarter, 5 wins on the board, another win and they lose their priority pick.

They end up getting rolled, lose their remaining 3 games and score Dale Thomas and Scott Pendlebury. Happy days for them and not a peep from the media.

[beelzebub 23,380]

1 hour ago, Whispering_Jack said:

The arguments and the counter arguments lie buried in contemporary news items and can be read if one wants to delve into the archives on this site. Some is fact, a great deal is fiction based on supposition including quoting a dead man in a different way to the manner in which he told it. The purpose of the article is clear and needs to be treated with the contempt it deserves - not even as tomorrow’s fish and chip wrapping.

That era is over now and I’m looking ahead to tonight’s game.

There are those who still have sharp knives for us.

There is still corruption at many levels of this sport.

There is still a power collusion among some. We don't fit in.

[Guest]

I'm not going to get defensive about this.

We tanked. It was a disgrace and we shouldn't have done it. It was a massive waste as our filthy lucre mostly left or never came on. The aftermath also wrecked the culture of the joint for a good seven years (2008-2015).

The interviews itself themselves are a look back on a different historical era but what they have to do with now, I'm not entirely sure. I'd say only one staff member remains from that time. The AFL is a different beast as well.

Skim reading the Bailey interview, his allegations are pretty damning. However, in a legal sense, a lot of it is one person's word against another's. Unless there are memos, meeting minutes or Nixon style tapes, it would be hard to get anything up in a legal sense (if that is what Slobbo is angling at here). 

It doesn't make what we did right but it is where we legally stand.

I'm not as conspiritorial as others but if this a ploy to get us off our game or even  season that actually works, then we are an inherently pathetic club. As I said earlier, this happened 10 years ago and the investigation 9 years ago. If our players get rattled over something that had sweet FA to do with them, we are a soulless husk of a club.

Get out there and smash Essendon. That's the best way to respond. I'm not going to give this any more oxygen in the meantime.

Edited April 4, 2019 by Hillary Bray

[Clintosaurus 7,852]

It did keep Bill Shorten and his Budget Reply speech off the front page.

Half the comp has tanked. Teams in most elite level competitions tank. The common element is the draft.

[Sir Why You Little 37,054]

The sadness in all this is that it contributed to the early death of Dean Bailey 

i hope those responsible feel proud of that

[Skuit 10,031]

1 hour ago, Whispering_Jack said:

The arguments and the counter arguments lie buried in contemporary news items and can be read if one wants to delve into the archives on this site. Some is fact, a great deal is fiction based on supposition including quoting a dead man in a different way to the manner in which he told it. The purpose of the article is clear and needs to be treated with the contempt it deserves - not even as tomorrow’s fish and chip wrapping.

That era is over now and I’m looking ahead to tonight’s game.

WJ - I don't have access to the documents/reports and don't know what is going on. Can you elaborate further on your response?

[beelzebub 23,380]

Gee...let's look at this.

Melbourne ...almost a flavour of a months some little while ago.and now as putrid as mouldy apple .... Essendon ... continually 'imaged' as a victim...a club trying to get back to footy...all nicely nicely. Even the illusion that Hird is kinda back. ( Nauseating )

But Essendon isn't off to its Rosey start. It's playing Melbourne....and lo and behold...this BS comes out from that blubbering tool and his Essendon mad boss !!

Go on tell me that's all completely accidental !! ?

 

[The Chazz 4,077]

54 minutes ago, Clint Bizkit said:

Clearly there was pressure from Schwab and co. to try to maximise the draft picks, however I have not seen any concrete evidence that it was actually enforced and that we intentionally lost games.

People point to players being played out of position, going  off for surgery or playing the kids, but that happens every year.

I want some hard concrete evidence that Melbourne intentionally lost games of football.

There clearly isn't any, not that was documented in some capacity.

Without having evidence myself, I feel our biggest issue was that we were so open about it in some so-called inner sanctum happenings.  If they (Schwab and CC) were openly talking about it in team meetings or at supporter functions, then it always had the potential of being leaked.

Schwab and CC aren't total idiots (close, but not fully).  There is no way known that they would leave any paper trail that would be used as evidence.  The problem was that the more people they told of their plans, the greater chance there was of something getting out.  If it were to be one man's word against another, then we would've been fine.  The problem was that there was more than one man.

I just wish we had've drafted better in those days and pinched a flag.  Our club is quite hated by people, and realistically, we have nothing to use in our defence.  A couple of tainted flags would've been bloody lovely to use as a comeback.

 

[Fork 'em 6,984]

So the clown who ticked off Slobbos 10yr old article for todays front page is also a Essendon supporter.
Surprise, surprise.
Of course they ignored their drugcheat clubs cover-up.
Slobbo even thinks his needle wielding mate Hird should coach them again.
FMD, what a joke.

 

Edited April 4, 2019 by Fork 'em

[3183 Dee 2,853]

I saw this conversation last night, but just walked into a cafe to see this splashed all over the front page.  What a beat up - I hope we are galvanised by this.

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

1 minute ago, The Chazz said:

There clearly isn't any, not that was documented in some capacity.

Without having evidence myself, I feel our biggest issue was that we were so open about it in some so-called inner sanctum happenings.  If they (Schwab and CC) were openly talking about it in team meetings or at supporter functions, then it always had the potential of being leaked.

Schwab and CC aren't total idiots (close, but not fully).  There is no way known that they would leave any paper trail that would be used as evidence.  The problem was that the more people they told of their plans, the greater chance there was of something getting out.  If it were to be one man's word against another, then we would've been fine.  The problem was that there was more than one man.

I just wish we had've drafted better in those days and pinched a flag.  Our club is quite hated by people, and realistically, we have nothing to use in our defence.  A couple of tainted flags would've been bloody lovely to use as a comeback.

 

That's why we were fined for conspiring to tank.

There is no evidence (that I know of) that we did things to intentionally lose (tank).

[beelzebub 23,380]

13 minutes ago, The Chazz said:

There clearly isn't any, not that was documented in some capacity.

Without having evidence myself, I feel our biggest issue was that we were so open about it in some so-called inner sanctum happenings.  If they (Schwab and CC) were openly talking about it in team meetings or at supporter functions, then it always had the potential of being leaked.

Schwab and CC aren't total idiots (close, but not fully).  There is no way known that they would leave any paper trail that would be used as evidence.  The problem was that the more people they told of their plans, the greater chance there was of something getting out.  If it were to be one man's word against another, then we would've been fine.  The problem was that there was more than one man.

I just wish we had've drafted better in those days and pinched a flag.  Our club is quite hated by people, and realistically, we have nothing to use in our defence.  A couple of tainted flags would've been bloody lovely to use as a comeback.

 

Sorry Chazz... I'm going to have to agree with you

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,816]

40 minutes ago, Clintosaurus said:

It did keep Bill Shorten and his Budget Reply speech off the front page.

Half the comp has tanked. Teams in most elite level competitions tank. The common element is the draft.

 

13 minutes ago, Fork 'em said:

So the clown who ticked off Slobbos 10yr old article for todays front page is also a Essendon supporter.
Surprise, surprise.
Of course they ignored their drugcheat clubs cover-up.
Slobbo even thinks his needle wielding mate Hird should coach them again.
FMD, what a joke.

 

There are a number of posts in this thread suggesting that the article was published today because Mark Robinson is an Essendon supporter. I very much doubt that Robbo had any say as to when it was published. I think the first comment I've copied above is far more likely - that the editor of the Herald Sun needed a story to avoid having to put Bill Shorten's budget reply on page 1. 

As to the story itself. Ho-hum. By name it's the same club, but a decade on it is essentially a completely different organisation with a different Board, admin and almost a completely different playing list. And don't forget, many of the players on the list today would have been too young to even be aware of the "tanking issue" when it happened. To them, it's ancient history.

 

[The Chazz 4,077]

12 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

Sorry Chazz... I'm going to have to agree with you

Great way to ruin my day.  Thanks.

[beelzebub 23,380]

10 minutes ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

 

There are a number of posts in this thread suggesting that the article was published today because Mark Robinson is an Essendon supporter. I very much doubt that Robbo had any say as to when it was published. I think the first comment I've copied above is far more likely - that the editor of the Herald Sun needed a story to avoid having to put Bill Shorten's budget reply on page 1. 

As to the story itself. Ho-hum. By name it's the same club, but a decade on it is essentially a completely different organisation with a different Board, admin and almost a completely different playing list. And don't forget, many of the players on the list today would have been too young to even be aware of the "tanking issue" when it happened. To them, it's ancient history.

 

@La Dee-vina ComediaComedia you do know the HUN is an Essendon mouthpiece ?

Bloke in charge...a rabid Bomber. Probably why Rubbishon keeps his job

[Macca 17,020]

We tanked ('97, '03, '08,  09' and possibly even in 2014) but no Demon supporter should give a f/f

There is nothing to feel guilty about ... whilst we have a draft tanking will always exist as a matter of course.

But again,  since the mid 90's tanking has happened nearly every year and often on multiple occasions in any given year

It is best to work backwards to find the 'culprits' ... e.g Collingwood received picks 2 & 5 in 2005 but lost their last 8 games after being 5/9 after round 14.

No Pendlebury,  no flag? So the risk paid off. Pie fans don't feel guilty either .. again,  they could not care less   They got their flag and that is all that matters.

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,816]

14 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

@La Dee-vina ComediaComedia you do know the HUN is an Essendon mouthpiece ?

Bloke in charge...a rabid Bomber. Probably why Rubbishon keeps his job

And I assume you know the HUN is owned by someone who has a pathological dislike of Bill Shorten and is known for instructing his editors to use the paper for political purposes. I think the owner's political interests trump the editor's football interest!

Coincidentally, The Age today has a fascinating story about the Murdochs with a reference to their willingness to use their media assets in this way.  

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,816]

8 minutes ago, Macca said:

We tanked ('97, '03, '08,  09' and possibly even in 2014) but no Demon supporter should give a f/f

There is nothing to feel guilty about ... whilst we have a draft tanking will always exist as a matter of course.

But again,  since the mid 90's tanking has happened nearly every year and often on multiple occasions in any given year

It is best to work backwards to find the 'culprits' ... e.g Collingwood received picks 2 & 5 in 2005 but lost their last 8 games after being 5/9 after round 14.

No Pendlebury,  no flag? So the risk paid off. Pie fans don't feel guilty either .. again,  they could not care less   They got their flag and that is all that matters.

This is the key point. The AFL (as it was then) is fundamentally to blame. It established the system which encouraged tanking and then turned a blind eye to the practice. If I recall, it was only when the Victorian gambling regulator said it was going to investigate that the AFL reacted.

A quick Google search found this - see page 7

[spirit of norm smith 16,481]

Old news. Nothing new here. 

Players played out of position.  No tagging.  Players put in for surgery early.  

Bailey is not here to defend or clarify.  Poor form from Herald Scum news.  

[rjay 25,002]

52 minutes ago, 3183 Dee said:

I saw this conversation last night, but just walked into a cafe to see this splashed all over the front page.  What a beat up - I hope we are galvanised by this.

It has nothing to do with the current administration, FD or players.

I wouldn't think it would rate a mention at the club and nor should it.

I hope they say nothing, don't get drawn into it in anyway, play well and win.

The only people to be galvanised are us poor long suffering supporters.

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

4 minutes ago, spirit of norm smith said:

Old news. Nothing new here. 

Players played out of position.  No tagging.  Players put in for surgery early.  

Bailey is not here to defend or clarify.  Poor form from Herald Scum news.  

Tom McDonald was played out of position last year.

[At the break of Gawn 4,460]

1 hour ago, Sir Why You Little said:

The sadness in all this is that it contributed to the early death of Dean Bailey 

i hope those responsible feel proud of that

How can you possibly come to this conclusion? He died of lung cancer, not of a stress-related heart attack. 

[dieter 3,325]

31 minutes ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

And I assume you know the HUN is owned by someone who has a pathological dislike of Bill Shorten and is known for instructing his editors to use the paper for political purposes. I think the owner's political interests trump the editor's football interest!

Coincidentally, The Age today has a fascinating story about the Murdochs with a reference to their willingness to use their media assets in this way.  

A dreadful imputation against the mighty Herald Sun, the Working man's paper, the paper for the masses, printed in Boganville, by Bogans who serve the bloke who wants them to remain there forever. Just give em footy, Davie Warner and the races, and the odd titillating cleavage revealing photo. Simple.

 

[Diamond_Jim 12,600]

There's the facts, the story and the spin.

The fact is that Bailey clearly believed he had been actually or impliedly threatened with the sack by Schwab and Connolly if the team won more than five games. (read the interview...it's all in there.)

The story... write what you will.

Now the Spin... Confront your mistakes and learn from them. Give the subtle message that other teams should do the same including those who have been involved in far more damaging scandals involving the future health of young men who entrust themselves to the camaraderie of a football club etc etc.

It happened a long time ago and there is nothing for the present club to be ashamed of IF they learnt from the mistake.

The win at all costs mantra of a sporting club breeds a toxic atmosphere sometimes just as it does in business. The challenge is to find the balance and leave the club a better place after you leave. I think Peter Jackson did that. Can this administration and group of players do the same.

 

[beelzebub 23,380]

38 minutes ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

And I assume you know the HUN is owned by someone who has a pathological dislike of Bill Shorten and is known for instructing his editors to use the paper for political purposes. I think the owner's political interests trump the editor's football interest!

Coincidentally, The Age today has a fascinating story about the Murdochs with a reference to their willingness to use their media assets in this way.  

Fair point