On 9/9/2018 at 1:07 PM, 000 said:

I don't agree, I thought we had a well rounded 4 quarter game. Just missed too many goals.

I hope we can snap alot better and get some composure when in front.

Depends what your metrics are for "playing well"

For mine, scoring effectively is certainly one. It certainly has a pretty big impact on the result of the game in most cases! 

Do we back our system or try to stop theirs - or a measure of both?

I think the biggest risk is being cut up with legspeed from Impy and Smith, and not making contests.  I beleive we match or better them in the midfield, and with Billy Ray Haircut out with a hammy, they are going to have to rejig to cover our forwards.  Sicily should go to Milkshake, and Creepy Crawly Frawley to TMac.  Leaving the Weed to worry about. I think we can cover Gunston and Roughy, and their other forwards are not 'talls' but play a bit that way.  Big Boy Macavoy will need a bus pass to keep up with Max.

I think we match up pretty well, and since the team did not play this weekend, the form line comes from previous games in the VFL.  Has Smith done enough from his return to play a full game, under finals conditions?

I think we play smashem-up derby footy in the first half, open the game up and control the contests from there.  Expect them to come out hard in response to last week's (lack of) effort.

1 hour ago, Deespicable said:

Thanks DeanOx,

To me this is the only issue of the week and well worthy of its own topic but the moderators have decided my comments need to be buried amid page 8 of our usual diatribe.

Wow post about changes put in changes thread

26 minutes ago, Smokey said:

Depends what your metrics are for "playing well"

For mine, scoring effectively is certainly one. It certainly has a pretty big impact on the result of the game in most cases! 

I was thinking more about how we would drop our bundle for a quarter (last year and early in this season). The other team would get 5 or more goals without us answering.

Seems we have matured and can control the momentum of games now.

Chances to score which are not taken can kill our momentum. Happy that it didn't friday night and we kept scoring goals at important times. The ducker/stager (Selwood) really helped that out, with his head tackle at the interchange. 

You are right, missing the easy goals makes ugly football and shows we are not playing well.

I can only imagine when it all clicks for us, "you beauty". What an "up" we still have left.

Edited September 10, 20186 yr by 000

3 hours ago, Fat Tony said:

Spargo is a good young player but lacks the body strength required at this stage. IMO we would be better off with JKH coming in. A case could also be made for Hunt, Joel Smith or even Vince being the inclusion if he is fit.

We also need to think about how we tag Issac Smith this week. Tyson on the wing is not a good match up and he could be omitted due to the opposition.

He laid an awesome tackle on some big dude in our forward line that stopped him dead. Spargo definitely punches above his weight.

Hawthorn's effort and intensity were pretty good. They just weren't good enough.

1 hour ago, Diamond_Jim said:

Big call and well argued.... would you consider Fritsch to replace Hannan thus freeing up a spot for Smith

 

1 hour ago, Deespicable said:

Ad DeanOx says, Hannan and Fritsch are the same sort of player, but Mitch is quicker, Bayley a better mark and more relaxed and developing into a mid - albeit one that has been sent to defence.

I haven't included Mitch in my questions for a reason - it won't happen. The other three may and the fourth option is not even picking Joel. That is why it is such a good debate and I'm sure the selectors get it. 

 

I'm not sure why Hannan is a definite stater in the convo. Fritsch is a better mark and cleaner with the ball, and I feel less prone to go missing.  But he isn't as likely to bob up for a goal.

I think you could make a case for either, as they will be competing for the same spot if Smith comes in. Spargo will be too, but I personally feel he adds something different.

In that case it will come down to who the coaches think is better placed to succeed this week.

 

 

Also the more I reflect on the Hawks line up, the more I think we need some extra height down back. But Smith only gives us 3 cms on Fritsch...

In: Kent

Out: Spargo 

4 minutes ago, Grand New Flag said:

In: Kent

Out: Spargo 

I don't think Kenty will be ready, he is not over his injury.

7 minutes ago, Grand New Flag said:

In: Kent

Out: Spargo 

Statistically not much between these two this year, but if you consider Kent's career averages, Spargo probably shades him.

I don't think that Kent adds sufficient upside over Spargo that is worth risking recurring injury, lack of form/fitness due to injury, or team synergy.

Also Spargos smarts are more valuable that Kents strength/attack, particularly against Hawthorn,  and given we have Trac, Viney and VDB in the team. 

On 9/9/2018 at 11:51 AM, A F said:

Spargo corrals and tackles well in our forward 50 too. Those that want Jeffy to come in haven't watched Jeff properly. In big games he wilts. In Goodwin teams he's not appropriate because he's too soft at the contest. 

And some saying JKH should come in, are you serious? The bloke can't handle the heat in the regular season. He would crap himself in a final. And he certainly doesn't bring any more pace than Charlie.

What you say about Spargo is correct. But surely a small forward is supposed to kick goals is that not his major task? Seems to fail the major task consistently.

Just now, deanox said:

Statistically not much between these two this year, but if you consider Kent's career averages, Spargo probably shades him.

I don't think that Kent adds sufficient upside over Spargo that is worth risking recurring injury, lack of form/fitness due to injury, or team synergy.

Also Spargos smarts are more valuable that Kents strength/attack, particularly against Hawthorn,  and given we have Trac, Viney and VDB in the team. 

Kent can kick a goal from 50 metres Spargo would not make the goal square. Have said that unless there is an injury I cannot see any change.

3 minutes ago, old dee said:

What you say about Spargo is correct. But surely a small forward is supposed to kick goals is that not his major task? Seems to fail the major task consistently.

But when he has been playing as a small forward in 16 games he's notched up 13 wins.  I dare say the coaches are a fan.

Here's a curious thing I noticed comparing the round 4 game to the Elimination Final, and then followed up with a look at more games over the season.

We've gone all Benjamin Button out there - the current team taking the field is a good slice (a few months average) younger than the one that started the season and that is a consistent pattern over the year.

A lot of it at the moment would be Vince and Garlett out of the team. But still... shouldn't we reasonably expect to age by about 6 months, not get younger by 3?

 

1 hour ago, Clintosaurus said:

Hawthorn's effort and intensity were pretty good. They just weren't good enough.

for the first half. Richmond smashed them after half time.

An ominous sign for the p&p's, my demon under "Mt Warning"

I know @Clint Bizkit and I are the only ones who think this, but if anyone should be dropped it should be VDB IMO.

In saying that, I wouldn't be making any changes barring injury. I don't think we need to "release" Fritsch, we've been playing him across half-back for weeks now and he's playing that role well. It's tough for Smith, who had that spot, but I wouldn't be changing Fritsch's role up now. 

On 9/8/2018 at 7:37 PM, Chook said:

If Vince is fit, we should bring him in because he is experienced and composed, which is exactly what we need against Hawthorn.
If Vince isn't fit, we should just leave it.

I'm very worried about Isaac Smith though, and could Hannan possibly go to him in a shutdown role? Similar body shapes, and could hurt Smith going the other way.

Isn't that what everyone said about us vs Geelong? That their experience was going to be a problem for us?

I love Bernie but I don't think he makes us better and there's no one who deserves to be dropped to make room for him.

23 hours ago, DemonLad5 said:

No one should be dropped, but look at Hawthorns forward line..

Roughead, Nash, Ceglar, Gunston and potentially Schoenmakers. That’s 4, or possibly 5 talls

Would be very stiff, but don’t be surprised to see

IN: J.Smith

OUT: Tyson

Hawthorn would be mad to keep Ceglar in the side. 

They also know that speed kills us so I expect a runner to replace Ceglar.

4 minutes ago, titan_uranus said:

I know @Clint Bizkit and I are the only ones who think this, but if anyone should be dropped it should be VDB IMO.

I wouldn't drop him, I just thought he was poor with his decision making with the ball.

If there was to be a change, the only ones I'd consider would be:

• JKH in for Spargo
• Joel Smith in for Spargo (Fritsch forward or on a wing)
• JKH for Tyson and Joel Smith for Spargo (Fritsch on a wing)

 

I'm perplexed at people thinking Spargo should be dropped. I know his numbers are huge but he just keeps buzzing in and out being helpful. As others have pointed out, he seems to always be doing the little team things like getting in the way of opponents, shepherding, and you can tell he is both alert to what's around him and has good habits with the on-field talk to avoid stuff-ups. I'm confident he'll be a very handy player and also sure that right now he's making a good contribution.

He's like the useful sidekick character in every hero movie ever made.

Plus, there is this. I mean, really. He's the human personification of the cure for MFCSS.

 

34 minutes ago, titan_uranus said:

I know @Clint Bizkit and I are the only ones who think this, but if anyone should be dropped it should be VDB IMO.

 

Melbourne supporters.

So unused to finals...

52 minutes ago, Clint Bizkit said:

I wouldn't drop him, I just thought he was poor with his decision making with the ball.

If there was to be a change, the only ones I'd consider would be:

• JKH in for Spargo
• Joel Smith in for Spargo (Fritsch forward or on a wing)
• JKH for Tyson and Joel Smith for Spargo (Fritsch on a wing)

No way Tyson will be replaced.
Spargo plays his role. The FD knows his deficiencies (not quick, lacks kicking penetration) but he gets to contests and hits targets. 

Spargo should stay. While, even though VDB was ordinary with ball, his tackling pressure will be enough to keep him in the side (and I like PD's assignment of running him through Smith).

I've said it a few times but if we can kick straighter and bring the same pressure that we did last week, we'll win. My fear and feeling is we won't be able to. Our poor kicking has plagued us all year.

Out: Spargo

in: Jeffy 

5 hours ago, Grand New Flag said:

In: Kent

Out: Spargo 

That is bull [censored]

On 9/8/2018 at 11:08 AM, SFebes said:

 

One part of my mind is saying:

Out: Spargo

In: Hunt or Garlett

 

What you need to do. Is go and get that part of your brain cut out. Hunt is no where near it and provides us with nothing that improves us.

Garlett stamped his own papers against the Swans. No Heart picks and chooses contests..

Edited September 10, 20186 yr by MudDogs Gawn Win.. someday