2 minutes ago, Pates said:

Well Fritch would be the one to go as he’s the one that we got with his pick. Fritch has been good, and has done an admirable job of filling the Lever hole, I would argue Watts would probably have gone down a similar path with first half of year in forward line and then floating in defence to cover Lever’s absence. 

Fritsch is a better player, even after one year. 

I am hoping he goes up another level in 2 weeks

30 minutes ago, xarronn said:

My comment is not about Watts. It's about bundling the period since the guys I mentioned joined us with the issues of the previous 7 years. I was drawing attention to that dividing line rather than being critical of you.

By the way, do you feel like a bigger man after that gratuitous smart arxe "champ" comment?

I can see what you’re saying. Many people have played a part in the journey. 

16 minutes ago, Wiseblood said:

That's not what I said, Pates.  Don't put words in my mouth.

My point is simply that, by making finals, we have shown that he wasn't required for us to do so.  I'm not potting the bloke and I've made my feelings clear on it.  But to say we're better with him in the side is not correct.

I guess my point is we’re a better side this year for a lot of reasons. Oliver’s game has gone to a new level, Gawn has had an (touch wood) injury free run, Brayshaw has had an injury free run and shown his true potential, Hogan has had a better year with injuries/health and personal life, Harmes becoming an excellent player. 

Improvement was always going to happen with all those dominos falling into position. We don’t know how with all those things happening it would’ve affected Watts’s game, most of us came to accept he was a cherry on top player that could show his best when the team was at its best (essentially a front runner). We will never know whether with all those things coming together that Watts might’ve taken a step up in class as well. 

And remember we are (currently) only a better side by one win (and yes a bucket load of %), there are dozens of factors to consider but I feel it’s an oversimplification to say we are better without him. 

I think it’s just sad that people (not saying you) feel the need to slag off a guy who a) got traded against his will b) stayed loyal at times when he had every reason to ditch us and c) was IMO treated quite poorly at times by the club and it’s fans. 

Edited August 20, 20187 yr by Pates

35 minutes ago, xarronn said:

My comment is not about Watts. It's about bundling the period since the guys I mentioned joined us with the issues of the previous 7 years. I was drawing attention to that dividing line rather than being critical of you.

By the way, do you feel like a bigger man after that gratuitous smart arxe "champ" comment?

Touched a nerve have we? I like how you’ve instantly assumed I’m a man with next to no knowledge. 

It was a terrible period and Watts was simply not good enough. If he was we probably would have been better, and he would still be here. Why is this so hard to understand?

Are you people all going to send Lynden Dunn a bouquet of roses if they play finals again next year? How about a box of mixed reds on Stefan Martin’s doorstep when Brissy make the finals next year? Actually all you Watts do-gooders should all get together and belt out a beautiful rendition of Danny Boy for Shane Woewodin or anyone else that has been traded ‘against their will’.

19 minutes ago, Pates said:

I guess my point is we’re a better side this year for a lot of reasons. Oliver’s game has gone to a new level, Gawn has had an (touch wood) injury free run, Brayshaw has had an injury free run and shown his true potential, Hogan has had a better year with injuries/health and personal life, Harmes becoming an excellent player. 

Improvement was always going to happen with all those dominos falling into position. We don’t know how with all those things happening it would’ve affected Watts’s game, most of us came to accept he was a cherry on top player that could show his best when the team was at its best (essentially a front runner). We will never know whether with all those things coming together that Watts might’ve taken a step up in class as well. 

And remember we are (currently) only a better side by one win (and yes a bucket load of %), there are dozens of factors to consider but I feel it’s an oversimplification to say we are better without him. 

I think it’s just sad that people (not saying you) feel the need to slag off a guy who a) got traded against his will b) stayed loyal at times when he had every reason to ditch us and c) was IMO treated quite poorly at times by the club and it’s fans. 

His destiny was in his own hands and given ample amount of opportunities but he just didn't grab it.

I was a Watts fan, but reality is he coasted all the way to his 150 games..

He would not get a game in our side right now.

I bagged the club for letting him go for pick 28.  Club looks like they knew what they were doing with Fridge.

I am rapt Port missed, but wanted Jack to play finals footy.

 

No sentiment in professional footy; which was why Goodwin made this ruthless call.

 

9 minutes ago, dazzledavey36 said:

His destiny was in his own hands and given ample amount of opportunities but he just didn't grab it.

I was a Watts fan, but reality is he coasted all the way to his 150 games..

He would not get a game in our side right now.

I was also a Watts fan. I did NOT want to trade him. If nothing else purely for the fact that we needed as much elite kicking as we could get. We made a tough decision and I do feel bad for him because he clearly bled red and blue but we had to make this decision. 

 

1 hour ago, Wiseblood said:

Wrong.  It might be a hard pill to swallow for some, but we're a better team without him.  Making finals this year is proof of that.  

While I stick by my earlier comments that he would be hurting to see us play finals, and I do feel sorry for him that he can't experience that with us, but I don't think he was harshly treated, and nor do I think we would be better with him.  

Wrong.

6 hours ago, sue said:

Come on, it wasn't his choice.

 

41 minutes ago, Pates said:

I guess my point is we’re a better side this year for a lot of reasons. Oliver’s game has gone to a new level, Gawn has had an (touch wood) injury free run, Brayshaw has had an injury free run and shown his true potential, Hogan has had a better year with injuries/health and personal life, Harmes becoming an excellent player. 

Improvement was always going to happen with all those dominos falling into position. We don’t know how with all those things happening it would’ve affected Watts’s game, most of us came to accept he was a cherry on top player that could show his best when the team was at its best (essentially a front runner). We will never know whether with all those things coming together that Watts might’ve taken a step up in class as well. 

And remember we are (currently) only a better side by one win (and yes a bucket load of %), there are dozens of factors to consider but I feel it’s an oversimplification to say we are better without him. 

I think it’s just sad that people (not saying you) feel the need to slag off a guy who a) got traded against his will b) stayed loyal at times when he had every reason to ditch us and c) was IMO treated quite poorly at times by the club and it’s fans. 

I’m not sure if this is entirely true. He agreed to the trade he was under contract. He could have dug his heels in if he really wanted to. To say that he was moved on at gunpoint is not right. 

8 minutes ago, pinkshark said:

Wrong.

You’re just wrong. 

13 minutes ago, Sadler said:

 

I’m not sure if this is entirely true. He agreed to the trade he was under contract. He could have dug his heels in if he really wanted to. To say that he was moved on at gunpoint is not right. 

He didn’t want to go, his manager made a public plea on his behalf saying he wanted to stay. That is very rare in these situations, I suspect he was given the hard word by the footy department saying if don’t go we won’t play you. Or something to that effect. 

When a player is put up for trade it’s very rare for the player to dig their heels in as you say. The only one I can remember on our side is Hawthorn were really keen on Ryan Ferguson and tried to trade Brad Sewell to us. Sewell apparently gave it the ok but Fergburger refused to go and the trade fell through. 

Watts wasn’t wanted, so there was very little option on his part. 

19 minutes ago, Pates said:

He didn’t want to go, his manager made a public plea on his behalf saying he wanted to stay. That is very rare in these situations, I suspect he was given the hard word by the footy department saying if don’t go we won’t play you. Or something to that effect. 

When a player is put up for trade it’s very rare for the player to dig their heels in as you say. The only one I can remember on our side is Hawthorn were really keen on Ryan Ferguson and tried to trade Brad Sewell to us. Sewell apparently gave it the ok but Fergburger refused to go and the trade fell through. 

Watts wasn’t wanted, so there was very little option on his part. 

Yeah Ryan Ferguson is the only one that comes to mind for me. Not unheard of but very rare. And knowing Jack he’d probably rather take his medicine than do anything to hurt the club. 

I would have preferred the club found another way to trade into Fritsch. Perhaps moved on Tyson or someone else. Watts would have been handy this year, especially with Lever going down. If we had Watts we could probably consider trading Hogan as well.

 

2 hours ago, johndemonic said:

It's still not out of the realms of possibility that Jack Watts could kick a matchwinner in an elimination final against us at the G, i wouldn't be going too early ?

I can see it now, Watts has to go back with the flight and jump to take the mark, Fritz standing under the high ball... I look up at the ball, I look down at Watts, I look across to Fritz... phew, I relax. Uncontested mark. 

57 minutes ago, KingDingAling said:

I would have preferred the club found another way to trade into Fritsch. Perhaps moved on Tyson or someone else. Watts would have been handy this year, especially with Lever going down. If we had Watts we could probably consider trading Hogan as well.

 

As much as I like Watt's his efforts no longer fitted the expectations of the club.  I would take a half fit Hogan over Watt's every game.

Ahhhhhh the old Watts debate I was wondering when this would surface again... 

For the Watts fan boys (& girls) how many seasons he had with us were you happy with the consistent output from jack? 

Sure he had great games, however he could almost never back them up. 

He would have moments of brilliance followed by moments where he would be scared to go near the ball. 

He was taking the [censored] in how poor shape he was rocking up to preseason in. 

Where as fritta is the complete opposite, an absolute work horse, doesn't balk at a contest and is just a natural footballer. 

I know who I'd prefer to have wearing the jumper ESPECIALLY when the heat is on. 

Jack seemed like a top bloke, just Colin Sylvia MK 2... minus the [censored]

Edited August 20, 20187 yr by Whispering_Jack
No you don’t

The Watts trade needed to happen,  for reasons that are more symbolic than operational.

Move on.

Edited August 20, 20187 yr by Guest

Ok the swimwear sensation in 2019, move on. Football was never his life, just did enough and we kept him too long 

No longer a part of the Demon fabric.

9 hours ago, KingDingAling said:

I would have preferred the club found another way to trade into Fritsch. Perhaps moved on Tyson or someone else. Watts would have been handy this year, especially with Lever going down. If we had Watts we could probably consider trading Hogan as well.

 

Get real.

11 hours ago, Sir Why You Little said:

Fritsch is a better player, even after one year. 

I am hoping he goes up another level in 2 weeks

Watts is way better then fritsch! But jack lacks what makes a good player into a great player, hunger  competitiveness watts has to me reinforced ever few games, port was the worse team he could have gone to they are soft. People hate macca but he is the right sort of coach for watts, he is hard on the players, thats why he got sacked from the bulldogs, kids of today are soft, most can't take harsh  criticism and a kick up the bum.

So taking all that in, yes fritsch is a better player then watts, because unlike watts he wants to be the best he can be.

17 hours ago, pinkshark said:

I was a big fan.  Thought Goodwin wasn't a fan from the get go. He was harshly treated by the footy club.  A more experienced coach wouldn't have sent him packing.  We would be better with him.

But at least the worst possible scenario I could ever have imagined (him knocking us out of a finals spot/game off his own boot), won't happen this year.  

 

(yawn) which bit of 4 good games in 150 do you not get? A player that was on the list for 9 long years? Not treated harshly at all. Was told exactly what he had to do and failed to do it.

Has the distinction of being dropped by every single senior coach he has had. He even dropped himself.

1 top 5 finish in the B&F. Says it all. Worse at the Bluey presentation when he got up to speak he unbelievably said words to the effect "its taken me a while to get up here (to speak at the B&F). Normally I'm down there drinking the free [censored]. I guess I now know what it takes." He then came back from the summer break and was dropped for all pre season games because his skin folds weren't right and his training regime was not as it should have been.

Goodwin rightly said 'I am going on holdays and this bloke had better not be here when I get back'.

You don't create success with people like Jack Watts at your club. You create success with people like Harmes, Viney, Max and others that bust a gut. Coasters like Watts are cancerous in a club because young players come in and see that senior players aren't working hard why should they.

Good on the club for taking the hard decision. And I would also bet that the players would now say we are better without him.

Edited August 21, 20187 yr by jnrmac

48 minutes ago, don't make me angry said:

Watts is way better then fritsch! But jack lacks what makes a good player into a great player, hunger  competitiveness watts has to me reinforced ever few games, port was the worse team he could have gone to they are soft. People hate macca but he is the right sort of coach for watts, he is hard on the players, thats why he got sacked from the bulldogs, kids of today are soft, most can't take harsh  criticism and a kick up the bum.

So taking all that in, yes fritsch is a better player then watts, because unlike watts he wants to be the best he can be.

At AFL Level Fritsch is a far better player, regardless of natural ability. 

Watts may be unique in that by one move he has improved two football teams.

I was a Watts fan, I think we are a better side with Fritsch. Check the metres gained comparison. From Footywire.

Player Statistics Comparison   Bayley Fritsch Name Jack Watts Melbourne Demons Team Port Adelaide Power Midfield, Forward Position Forward 20 Career Games 171 Casey Demons Origin Sandringham Dragons December 6, 1996 Date of Birth March 26, 1991 21yr 8mth Age 27yr 4mth 188cm Height 196cm 81kg Weight 88kg 2017 National Draft Last Drafted In 2008 National Draft Round 2, Pick #31 Last Draft Position Round 1, Pick #1 Melbourne Demons Last Drafted By Melbourne Demons 2018 Stats for Season 2018 20 Games 18 10.6 Kicks Per Game 6.7 6.1 Handballs Per Game 7.2 16.7 Disposals Per Game 13.9 5.5 Marks Per Game 4.6 0.8 Goals Per Game 1.0 0.6 Behinds Per Game 0.4 2.5 Tackles Per Game 2.8 0 Hitouts Per Game 0.1 3.0 Inside 50s Per Game 1.7 0.5 Goal Assists Per Game 0.4 1.2 Frees For Per Game 0.5 0.6 Frees Against Per Game 0.7 6.3 Contested Possessions Per Game 4.4 10.7 Uncontested Possessions Per Game 9.3 12.8 Effective Disposals Per Game 11.0 76.6% Disposal Efficiency % Per Game 79.1% 1.9 Clangers Per Game 1.3 0.9 Contested Marks Per Game 0.5 0.8 Marks Inside 50 Per Game 0.9 0.9 Clearances Per Game 0.3 1.5 Rebound 50s Per Game 0.2 1.7 One Percenters Per Game 1.1 0.3 Bounces Per Game 0 78.3 Time On Ground % Per Game 78.2 0.1 Centre Clearances Per Game 0.2 0.8 Stoppage Clearances Per Game 0.1 5.2 Score Involvements Per Game 4.8 309.9 Metres Gained Per Game 138.0 2.9 Turnovers Per Game 2.1 3.8 Intercepts Per Game 1.3 0.6 Tackles Inside 50 Per Game 1.2 $462,000 AFL Fantasy Price $388,000 75.5 AFL Fantasy Score Per Game 64.2 $347,000 Supercoach Price $299,700 76.0 Supercoach Score Per Game 66.4

Edited August 21, 20187 yr by ManDee

9 minutes ago, ManDee said:

I was a Watts fan, I think we are a better side with Fritsch. Check the metres gained comparison. From Footywire.

Player Statistics Comparison   Bayley Fritsch Name Jack Watts Melbourne Demons Team Port Adelaide Power Midfield, Forward Position Forward 20 Career Games 171 Casey Demons Origin Sandringham Dragons December 6, 1996 Date of Birth March 26, 1991 21yr 8mth Age 27yr 4mth 188cm Height 196cm 81kg Weight 88kg 2017 National Draft Last Drafted In 2008 National Draft Round 2, Pick #31 Last Draft Position Round 1, Pick #1 Melbourne Demons Last Drafted By Melbourne Demons 2018 Stats for Season 2018 20 Games 18 10.6 Kicks Per Game 6.7 6.1 Handballs Per Game 7.2 16.7 Disposals Per Game 13.9 5.5 Marks Per Game 4.6 0.8 Goals Per Game 1.0 0.6 Behinds Per Game 0.4 2.5 Tackles Per Game 2.8 0 Hitouts Per Game 0.1 3.0 Inside 50s Per Game 1.7 0.5 Goal Assists Per Game 0.4 1.2 Frees For Per Game 0.5 0.6 Frees Against Per Game 0.7 6.3 Contested Possessions Per Game 4.4 10.7 Uncontested Possessions Per Game 9.3 12.8 Effective Disposals Per Game 11.0 76.6% Disposal Efficiency % Per Game 79.1% 1.9 Clangers Per Game 1.3 0.9 Contested Marks Per Game 0.5 0.8 Marks Inside 50 Per Game 0.9 0.9 Clearances Per Game 0.3 1.5 Rebound 50s Per Game 0.2 1.7 One Percenters Per Game 1.1 0.3 Bounces Per Game 0 78.3 Time On Ground % Per Game 78.2 0.1 Centre Clearances Per Game 0.2 0.8 Stoppage Clearances Per Game 0.1 5.2 Score Involvements Per Game 4.8 309.9 Metres Gained Per Game 138.0 2.9 Turnovers Per Game 2.1 3.8 Intercepts Per Game 1.3 0.6 Tackles Inside 50 Per Game 1.2 $462,000 AFL Fantasy Price $388,000 75.5 AFL Fantasy Score Per Game 64.2 $347,000 Supercoach Price $299,700 76.0 Supercoach Score Per Game 66.4

Not to forget Watts has been in the game longer and has 10 years more experience too.