Pre Season Winners and Losers

[Forest Demon 4,681]

As the title suggests (excluding the obvious like Gawn)...

Winners - Bugg, Kennedy, Watts, Harmes

Losers - Stretch, ANB

[PaulRB 6,363]

Oliver's been a big winner.

 

[Forest Demon 4,681]

Just now, PaulRB said:

Oliver's been a big winner.

 

No doubt. Round 1 definite now.

[Little Goffy 14,546]

Aside from the obvious and the already mentioned -

Dom Tyson, not that his spot was in doubt, but that he looks to be rebuilding his form and that could be an important factor for us.

Jeff Garlett got a lot of the ball against St Kilda today and looked good. More complete than before.

And y'know what, Jack Trengove. He's landed on the moon (with the boot and buggy to prove it) and is almost back. Re-entry to the atmosphere is the only remaining stage of the journey. I'm boiling with nerves and excitement for him and at this point the fact that he's joined full training is a huge achievement.

Simon Goodwin. For the first time in a very long time our midfield was spacing itself and cooperating just that much better. Either close enough to crunch in or that little bit of distance away to allow a handball out of trouble. Not some stupid distance in between where you can't shepherd or scrap for it, and also can't get free.

As a side note, the autocorrect on my phone now capitalised GAWN for me without instruction.

We're gonna need a beard-related emoticon.

[Forest Demon 4,681]

not writing young guys off, but these guys are unlikely to feature round 1 after being a good chance heading into the nab challenge...

OMac, Wagner, Hunt

[Demon Disciple 12,127]

1 hour ago, Little Goffy said:

As a side note, the autocorrect on my phone now capitalised GAWN for me without instruction.

May as well close the thread, i'm calling it. You're not gonna get a better winner than that right there.

[stuie 7,374]

Winners - Goodwin, Oliver, Bugg, Watts, Harmes

Waiting on photo finish - Kennedy, M.Jones

Losers - ANB, Stretch, Hunt, Garland, Brayshaw (obivously purely because of the injury), Roos?

[The Backyard Charizard 1,202]

38 minutes ago, Forest Demon said:

not writing young guys off, but these guys are unlikely to feature round 1 after being a good chance heading into the nab challenge...

OMac, Wagner, Hunt

Agree Forest....

Replace with Dunn, Harry O and VDB

We have some depth now which is nice!

Wait until CP5, Trenners and Gus also get involved 

Rise up young demons.... rise up!

[Coup Cooper 610]

Apart from the obvious..

Kennedy has definitely showed he is going to be more than handy..  Same as Bugg.. Wagner looks to be already better than Michie.. Frost showed he CAN play CHF.. Harmes is an exciting talent

Losers

Petracca.. The basketball incident ruined his chance to do what Oliver has just done. Brayshaw missed out on valuable match practice.. Hogan looks to of developed a stutter worse than Doug Hawkins in his set shots.. Hopefully just a bad game.. Pedersen will probly miss 1-2 after that "bump" I thought it was fair.. Hunt didn't really impress me..

Thats about it!

Bring on GWS! May somebody plz shirt front that weasel Scully!!

ps.. Looking fwd to Trengove, Brayshaw & Petracca all coming into this team!!! #wow

 

[Whispering_Jack 30,140]

I'm not sure how people define "losers" from the pre season but I note that a few are suggesting Jayden Hunt. 

Perhaps they had better think again. 

For someone who has come off his initial two seasons at the club wracked by injury, I thought he did well to get game time in two NAB Challenge matches and then to come into a very poor standard Casey Scorpions team and be one of the very few shining lights on the day.

On Saturday, he displayed great composure in a defence under fire. He marked, stood out with his pace and good kicking and stood his ground a couple of times with the high ball coming in - altogether his best performance at this level to date and not without a chance to get AFL time if he keeps up the rate of improvement he's shown since last year.

[stuie 7,374]

18 minutes ago, Whispering_Jack said:

I'm not sure how people define "losers" from the pre season but I note that a few are suggesting Jayden Hunt. 

Perhaps they had better think again. 

For someone who has come off his initial two seasons at the club wracked by injury, I thought he did well to get game time in two NAB Challenge matches and then to come into a very poor standard Casey Scorpions team and be one of the very few shining lights on the day.

On Saturday, he displayed great composure in a defence under fire. He marked, stood out with his pace and good kicking and stood his ground a couple of times with the high ball coming in - altogether his best performance at this level to date and not without a chance to get AFL time if he keeps up the rate of improvement he's shown since last year.

3rd year on the list, yet to play a game and did zero in the NAB cup before being dropped to Casey where they got smashed by 10 goals.

Not sure I'd classify that as a "winner"....

 

[Mazer Rackham 14,971]

12 hours ago, Little Goffy said:

As a side note, the autocorrect on my phone now capitalised GAWN for me without instruction.

We're all adjusting to this new era of AFL standard football. Even our technology.

[stevethemanjordan 6,952]

Pre-Season Positives and Negatives* :

POSITIVES: 

- Winning in general. We're the only team in the AFL that needs to get that 'feeling' back after a game. Even if it is NAB challenge. And it's clear, that was one of our goals   despite the throwaway 'it's only nab challenge' line. I might add that the bulldogs game was an exception simply because we weren't playing against an AFL side. But for the Port Adelaide and St Kilda games who both fielded really strong sides, the wins were very good. Not only is it beneficial for our group to experience winning, but it's clear it will have a really positive effect heading into what will be a very tough round one game. The group will definitely feel united and upbeat though and for that, it's clearly a positive. 

- More attacking and confident gameplay. Not news to anyone but clearly we're much more proactive with ball in hand and hopefully it will be the end of our 'slingshot' attacks which was our main source of goals last year. 

- Midfield depth and quality. Clearly it's improved and we now have a several players who can go through the middle and have an impact. Only a positive.

- Certain players looking to take the next step, (as they should and need to). Including Max Gawn, Jack Viney, AVB and Christian Salem. Really important that others follow suit so that we can continue our journey back up the ladder. 

- Clayton Oliver. Obviously very early days but I'd say we're all confident we nailed that pick. Has some really special attributes and will provide further excitement for the club heading into the season. Another who will become part of 'the core' in time.

- Injury list. Overall, I'd say we're in the best shape I've seen in some time. (Last year was also pretty good). With Petracca and Trengove almost ready to play, it will really add to our depth and talent levels.

 

NEGATIVES:  (No it won't go for two-pages and yes it will feature Garland so look away now Wiseblood and co..)

- I think it would be fair to say we still lack polish and class in all areas of the ground. Yesterday's game whilst overall a positive outcome, showed our weakness is still foot-skills coming out of defence. I can't remember how many goals St Kilda kicked in the first half from our turnovers but it was definitely most of them. Again, if posters would like to point out that it's Nab challenge that it 'doesn't matter' you miss the point. St Kilda are a reasonable side who are probably a little ahead of us at this stage but during the season, if we continue to turn the ball over in our defensive 50, we will keep ourselves out of games. It's as simple as that. We're more proactive   with the ball and attacking yes, but I'm yet to see any signs of improvement from regular turnovers resulting in shots on goals for the opposition. It will literally determine outcomes of games this year.

- Dunn and Garland. I know ya'll love to hear it. Two members of the dark days who continue to play greatly inconsistent football. It's a negative because neither have inspired confidence in me as a supporter in any NAB challenge game thus far. Both have played at really high levels once in their career but since then, like so many of our past players they've fallen apart. Garland in particular. Part of the reason I don't believe we'll rise as quickly as many supporters do this year is because of these two. They're senior players. Both have been in and out of the leadership group, (which says a lot to me for players of their age and experience). They need to be playing high level football, and they're not. It's a negative. 

- Ruck Coverage and depth and Key Position depth. It's a problem and god help us if any of Gawn, Hogan or T Mac go down with serious injuries. We simply cannot cover for them and as I've said before, I wish we brought someone in as insurance. A worry for me is that Oscar McDonald seems way off the pace and in my view his Nab games have been pretty average. He lacks intensity and hardness which as of late, has been a prerequisite in our draftees and he has made some really basic errors. Whether it be missed marks under zero pressure or mis-kicks. No I'm not writing him off, but I definitely didn't like a lot of what I saw. He's nowhere near ready for senior footy and it's a worry because he is our only depth as a KPD at the minute. 

Overall: 

- I think one thing that's important for all die-hard Melbourne supporters is that we're not the only team that has 'improved' over the off-season. And sometimes I think that is forgotten. We have been in the doldrums. No other club has performed has horridly as we and we're only now beginning to match it with the lesser clubs within the AFL. That is the reality of the situation. Sure we can take a scalp here and there but I definitely don't see us making the 8 unless we have a non-existent injury list all year and we start the season with a bang. We lack depth in some really key areas and we're only now starting to play relevant football. I think we have a really exciting and solid group talent. A 'core' who can come through together. But we are where GWS were a couple of years ago. Their core have now played between 50-100 AFL  games and they have a much better supported group of senior players. Round 1 will be extremely tough. But it's winnable. And so is our Round 2 match.

We need to win the first two to really believe that we're a relevant footy team again. 

Looking forward to it. 

Go Dees.

* Edited because I've forgotten to mention Watts as a positive. The best I've seen him play was on the weekend and all three games during       NAB challenge he has performed strongly. Hoping he carries it into the season. Would have to give him confidence.

Edited March 14, 2016 by stevethemanjordan

[jnrmac 20,065]

11 minutes ago, stevethemanjordan said:

- Dunn and Garland. I know ya'll love to hear it. Two members of the dark days who continue to play greatly inconsistent football. It's a negative because neither have inspired confidence in me as a supporter in any NAB challenge game thus far. Both have played at really high levels once in their career but since then, like so many of our past players they've fallen apart. Garland in particular. Part of the reason I don't believe we'll rise as quickly as many supporters do this year is because of these two. They're senior players. Both have been in and out of the leadership group, (which says a lot to me for players of their age and experience). They need to be playing high level football, and they're not. It's a negative. 

Dunn is interesting because 2 yrs ago was unbeatable one on one. Seems to have dropped off a bit but still is able to deliver the ball into a teammates hand from deep in defence and is usually reliable in the last line when under seige.

Garland is the one who worries me the most. Just is not playing the kind/quality of football that you would expect frm such a seasoned campaigner. Not good at positioning himself, struggles with when to stay with an opponent and when to leave, Also does little damage to opposition teams when he gets the ball. I have said enough in the past about Garland so I won't bang on but will say IF he has a really good year our team will have a great year. To me he's the weak link and I hope he proves me wrong.

Edited March 14, 2016 by jnrmac

[Slartibartfast 17,279]

15 minutes ago, jnrmac said:

Garland is the one who worries me the most.

He doesn't worry me.  He'll do his job, is rarely beaten one on one and is smart.  He can play tall and small.

Many here don't rate him and I understand why.  He's not a glamour footballer.  He's just someone that can be relied upon to do his job. 

I thought he was good yesterday - in a Garland sort of way.

[PaulRB 6,363]

I think some of the issues Steve and other raise above about skills and KP depth will be addressed as our out players return and we trim back to our best 22.

I like the way our flanks and even pockets can play as mids. Vince and Salem rotating, Kent and Kennedy rotating, etc... 

With Brayshaw, Vandenburg to return who can also play forward or back, some of our delivery, decision making and application issues should ease up further. I'd be in no rush to bring Lumumba back, feel he's too slap dash with the ball.

I like M Jones, Harmes and Watts on wings.

On Tall Key Position we are exposed, but with Dawes and Spencer on the mend, should be ok for depth there in a month or two. Also, I'm hoping that once Petracca is in forward line, Frost and Pedo could be freed up to go back if necessary.

[Redleg 40,925]

Posted 5 Nov 2015 (edited) · Report post

Jack is the most overly criticised player in the AFL, all because of his draft position.

If he was pick 50 no one would comment.

There is a bloke running around for the Giants getting $1.2m a year, playing pretty ordinary football and escaping criticism for his pick 1 position and high salary.

I think we will see an improved JW now, especially if he is allowed to settle in one position.

BTW, I think he is the leading goal assist at the MFC and probably the best kick for goal.

And yes there is a spot in our 22 for him.

This is one of my pro Jack Watts posts and another said," I think he can be our big improver in 2016."  Pretty comfortable at the moment with Jack's start to 2016. 

[jnrmac 20,065]

3 hours ago, Baghdad Bob said:

He doesn't worry me.  He'll do his job, is rarely beaten one on one and is smart.  He can play tall and small.

Many here don't rate him and I understand why.  He's not a glamour footballer.  He's just someone that can be relied upon to do his job. 

I thought he was good yesterday - in a Garland sort of way.

Thats nice for you. I see 3 goals he gave away or was responsible for in the 1st qtr yesterday and shake my head. I simply wonder when he is going to stop doing the dumb things.

[stevethemanjordan 6,952]

4 hours ago, Baghdad Bob said:

He doesn't worry me.  He'll do his job, is rarely beaten one on one and is smart.  He can play tall and small.

Many here don't rate him and I understand why.  He's not a glamour footballer.  He's just someone that can be relied upon to do his job. 

I thought he was good yesterday - in a Garland sort of way.

Before half time yesterday he was more valuable to the opposition than he was to us. 

You and Wiseblood seem to always say that, when really it's not the truth. 

 

[Barney Rubble 1,576]

The club is the winner.

All the journos that have been putting us down for years especially kingy  the velvet sledge hammer and dunstall. You are all LOSERS !!!!

 Edit "Now off to take my anger management medication"

Edited March 14, 2016 by Barney Rubble

[Wiseblood 24,637]

12 minutes ago, stevethemanjordan said:

Before half time yesterday he was more valuable to the opposition than he was to us. 

You and Wiseblood seem to always say that, when really it's not the truth. 

 

How isn't it the truth?

His kicking is what let's him down.  I distinctly recall some excellent work from him yesterday as well in amongst a few brain farts with his kicking.  He is excellent one on one, is rarely beaten and does his job with minimal fuss.

Off topic a bit, but I don't think there are any losers on our list from this pre-season.  Guys like ANB and Stretch know they have hard work ahead of them for a spot in the 22 and that will make them work even harder.  That's great for the club going forward.

[Redleg 40,925]

14 minutes ago, Wiseblood said:

 

Off topic a bit, but I don't think there are any losers on our list from this pre-season.  Guys like ANB and Stretch know they have hard work ahead of them for a spot in the 22 and that will make them work even harder.  That's great for the club going forward.

Agree. Great to have some quality depth and that players know they have to earn their spot. 

[Rolling Stone 157]

11 hours ago, stuie said:

3rd year on the list, yet to play a game and did zero in the NAB cup before being dropped to Casey where they got smashed by 10 goals.

Not sure I'd classify that as a "winner"....

 

The post didn't describe the kid as a "winner". He's just not a loser as some painted him because he got senior game time in practice matches and is showing improved form. I think the club has been the "winner".

This time last year I was feeling quite ill after we lost a NAB Challenge game to an Essendon full of top up players. That's losing.

[bing181 9,238]

Winner: Apart from those mentioned above, Matt Jones. He may not be a first choice player, or even do enough to get his contract renewed, but has shown a lot more that what he's been credited for thus far. Shame he got a knock yesterday, would have been another opportunity to see where he's (really) at.

[RalphiusMaximus 6,053]

9 hours ago, Whispering_Jack said:

I'm not sure how people define "losers" from the pre season but I note that a few are suggesting Jayden Hunt. 

Perhaps they had better think again. 

For someone who has come off his initial two seasons at the club wracked by injury, I thought he did well to get game time in two NAB Challenge matches and then to come into a very poor standard Casey Scorpions team and be one of the very few shining lights on the day.

On Saturday, he displayed great composure in a defence under fire. He marked, stood out with his pace and good kicking and stood his ground a couple of times with the high ball coming in - altogether his best performance at this level to date and not without a chance to get AFL time if he keeps up the rate of improvement he's shown since last year.

I agree with this.  Once I got a look at the replay of the Doggies match and saw how much work he did that didn't result in a stat I was actually pretty impressed.  He's not a walk-up start yet, but I think he did ok.  I prefer a back who does his job defensively and gets less ball than one who forgets to defend to go looking for disposals.  Give him some time in the seniors and I think he'll get his head around the balance and start showing the outside pace to go with his solid defesive work. 

2 hours ago, jnrmac said:

Thats nice for you. I see 3 goals he gave away or was responsible for in the 1st qtr yesterday and shake my head. I simply wonder when he is going to stop doing the dumb things.

Are you counting the one where Grimes kicked a shocker across the face of goal to his ankles and he was pinged for HTB? There is no way that is Garlands fault.