That sounds very Mark Neeldesque.

Tell the players exactly how crap they are, give them no inspiration at all to even bother after that, then destroy any ability to attract any mediocre player and get stuck with Sellar, Gillies, etc.

Would it make any difference? The majority of senior players play on their terms anyway.

Bailey - was the players coach, the players were his boys, built strong relationships with them....failed

Neeld- the task master, gave them some home truths, cut the crap, called it as he saw it....failed

Roos - the leader of men, team builder, advocate for players taking ownership....currently it's a fail

Again, how many players that struggled with us went on to become better players at other clubs?

Stef Martin.

Let's be honest, we got the selections wrong. The majority of senior players aren't up to it, it's as simple as that.

Perfect example - Salem. Did we radically develop him in two pre seasons or did already have 1 - a desire to compete, 2 - elite skills, 3 - footy smarts?

For all of Watts skill and smarts he will never take us forward because he's not a natural competitor. It has to be on his terms. He's never going to tear a game apart. It's these half assed tackles(just stick an arm out) Garland, Howe and Dawes can also go. This has gone on for years. I would seriously doubt that Clarko could have done much better this year with our list.

How do we play like we did against the Cats and serve up what we did against the Bombers and Carlton.

We should just tell them it's not their fault we're losing and offer them all extended contracts.

We should just tell them it's not their fault we're losing and offer them all extended contracts.

No need to be so disingenuous of the point boydie is making.

You can be ruthless without being contemptuous, you can make good decisions without being insulting. In fact that has been a part of our problem of recent years.

You say 'losing isn't their fault' and scoff at the thought but your point about the selections at the draft being wrong - you can't scoff at the statement that that isn't the players fault.

And kudos for rounding up Watts into your diatribe - isn't it funny that the poster child of the 'cut the crap' Neeld years looking a broken player has responded under a coach that respects his players. Taking no notice of the facts changing under your feet will lead to some horrendous decisions.

Are you referring to some of us?

Was referring to people needing to remember some of our performances this year, while there have been some really bad, there have also been some really good.

One down, Crossy. How many more will go? Who will come in, in return.

( Cross ) got that wrong

roos will trade what he can trade, that may mean watts goes, it may mean grimes stays. I doubt we would turn over more than 8 or 9 players, much as many would want to more to go, there is probably not a lot of talent to replace that man with. As far as trading goes its going to be a busy season this year, just hope that we can again pull out a couple sleepers as everyone while be thowing the kitchen sink at the 3 or 4 A graders.

For all of Watts skill and smarts he will never take us forward because he's not a natural competitor.

Watts had that competitiveness when he arrived at the club. I don't know how but we managed to remove it from him somewhere long the way. Watching him that first year at Casey, he was madly competitive, wanted to win, wanted the ball and was really hard on himself when he stuffed up. He was also taking contested marks when outnumbered against AFL-listed players. Whatever went wrong with him, it happened AFTER he was drafted.

( Cross ) got that wrong

Nope. It's the right move. He's just not quick enough. You can't have someone who gets shown up that badly defensively. It compromises your whole structure, and we don't have great defensive structures to start with.

On Roos Views he mentioned they will be 'absolutely' active come trade week. They gonna target players with good character and thats able to gut run.

I would live a Lachie Whitfield or Josh Kelly personally.

On Roos Views he mentioned they will be 'absolutely' active come trade week. They gonna target players with good character and thats able to gut run.

I would live a Lachie Whitfield or Josh Kelly personally.

Yyaaawwwwwnnnnnn. Proof puddin.

On Roos Views he mentioned they will be 'absolutely' active come trade week. They gonna target players with good character and thats able to gut run.

I would live a Lachie Whitfield or Josh Kelly personally.

I'll take Kelly. He looks a genuine gun.

HOW WOULD POSTERS REACT IF CROSS WASN'T GIVEN ANOTHER YEAR BASED ON HIS SENSATIONAL 2015 FORM??

Bump

picket - no doubt you are following and enjoying his retirement thread.

No need to be so disingenuous of the point boydie is making.

You can be ruthless without being contemptuous, you can make good decisions without being insulting. In fact that has been a part of our problem of recent years.

You say 'losing isn't their fault' and scoff at the thought but your point about the selections at the draft being wrong - you can't scoff at the statement that that isn't the players fault.

And kudos for rounding up Watts into your diatribe - isn't it funny that the poster child of the 'cut the crap' Neeld years looking a broken player has responded under a coach that respects his players. Taking no notice of the facts changing under your feet will lead to some horrendous decisions.

What happens when some of the players offered up for trade don't find new homes? Tact will count for nothing.

The players are out of excuses. Some have failed to improve under 3 different coaches. But for some reason it's still the clubs fault or better still the supporters.

Rd 11 - Saints, enough said.

Rd 12 - Geelong at Geelong.

Rd 15 - Essendon, rock bottom.

Some of our senior players can't focus for four quarters, can't dispose of the footy and can't think for themselves. Not good enough.

Jack Watts is an elite kick and has footy smarts in spades. But what good is it if the ball isn't in his hands. I don't think he works hard enough offensively or defensively. When he wants he can be a class act but those moments are too few and far between. We need players that possess the three qualities I have previously mentioned other wise we will continue to go nowhere. Watts being the perfect example why two out of three doesn't cut it. Key defenders possibly being the only exception.

On Roos Views he mentioned they will be 'absolutely' active come trade week. They gonna target players with good character and thats able to gut run.

I would live a Lachie Whitfield or Josh Kelly personally.

We probably have more chance of landing Dangerfield than Josh Kelly.

We probably have more chance of landing Dangerfield than Josh Kelly.

Sold.

What happens when some of the players offered up for trade don't find new homes? Tact will count for nothing.

The players are out of excuses. Some have failed to improve under 3 different coaches. But for some reason it's still the clubs fault or better still the supporters.

Rd 11 - Saints, enough said.

Rd 12 - Geelong at Geelong.

Rd 15 - Essendon, rock bottom.

Some of our senior players can't focus for four quarters, can't dispose of the footy and can't think for themselves. Not good enough.

Jack Watts is an elite kick and has footy smarts in spades. But what good is it if the ball isn't in his hands. I don't think he works hard enough offensively or defensively. When he wants he can be a class act but those moments are too few and far between. We need players that possess the three qualities I have previously mentioned other wise we will continue to go nowhere. Watts being the perfect example why two out of three doesn't cut it. Key defenders possibly being the only exception.

I don't know what your point is?

That the Footy Dept should be tactless and rude to players?

It couldn't be that we have been disappointing at times this season because that's very common knowledge.

And it shouldn't be the tired arguments against Watts because he has listened and he is responding and you still want to treat him the same way you want to treat those who haven't responded.

If you want to send a message, or make it known your displeasure or disgust, I 'get it' but you don't want a coach repeating the antics of a Neeld.

You may want to say you want it - but you don't want it.

U know the way we all go on about how bad our club is and it's never going to end and I'm part of that too, then u look at the news and c a picture of a 3 year old boy being carried across a beach who has died trying to flea a war torn country, it really puts everything into perspective.

It's actually gut wrenching to look at that picture.

We are all very very fortunate.

I don't know what your point is?

That the Footy Dept should be tactless and rude to players?

It couldn't be that we have been disappointing at times this season because that's very common knowledge.

And it shouldn't be the tired arguments against Watts because he has listened and he is responding and you still want to treat him the same way you want to treat those who haven't responded.

If you want to send a message, or make it known your displeasure or disgust, I 'get it' but you don't want a coach repeating the antics of a Neeld.

You may want to say you want it - but you don't want it.

The footy department needs to be hard but fair.

The point I was trying to make was that Bailey/Neeld/Roos all had different philosophies on how to coach, how they interact with their players and how to end someone's career. The results have been varied as we know.

The club is in an awkward position. I say that because I think some of the players it wants to move on are contracted for next year. If offered up during trade week and there are no takers we are then stuck with disgruntled players in the list. We must note though these players have brought it on themselves, everyone's been given an opportunity to prove themselves.

We will agree to disagree on where Watts is at. Yes he has improved under Roos but still nowhere near what he is capable off. His career is in danger of coming and going and many will still be saying what if....

What happens when some of the players offered up for trade don't find new homes? Tact will count for nothing.

The players are out of excuses. Some have failed to improve under 3 different coaches. But for some reason it's still the clubs fault or better still the supporters.

Rd 11 - Saints, enough said.

Rd 12 - Geelong at Geelong.

Rd 15 - Essendon, rock bottom.

Some of our senior players can't focus for four quarters, can't dispose of the footy and can't think for themselves. Not good enough.

Jack Watts is an elite kick and has footy smarts in spades. But what good is it if the ball isn't in his hands. I don't think he works hard enough offensively or defensively. When he wants he can be a class act but those moments are too few and far between. We need players that possess the three qualities I have previously mentioned other wise we will continue to go nowhere. Watts being the perfect example why two out of three doesn't cut it. Key defenders possibly being the only exception.

According to Roos last year, Watts was in the top 3 players for distance racked up on the field so I don't think his running work is in question, personally.

Watts gets enough shite from the media and AFL fans in general without Dees fans refusing to believe their 'lying eyes.'

Who would be everyones realistic dream pick up?

Mine would be Harley Bennell, he is everything we need .. blistering pace, elite skill, ball magnet, goalkicker, X factor

AFL site saying we are into Bennell and Redden. Well at least we are trying.

Who would be everyones realistic dream pick up?

Mine would be Harley Bennell, he is everything we need .. blistering pace, elite skill, ball magnet, goalkicker, X factor

If we can't get Dangerfield as a FA then trading pick 6 for Bennell should be number one priority.

If we can't get him then any of, Redden, Selwood, Mayes, Aish should be on our radar.

Watts had that competitiveness when he arrived at the club. I don't know how but we managed to remove it from him somewhere long the way. Watching him that first year at Casey, he was madly competitive, wanted to win, wanted the ball and was really hard on himself when he stuffed up. He was also taking contested marks when outnumbered against AFL-listed players. Whatever went wrong with him, it happened AFTER he was drafted.

Too right.

The magnitude of destruction caused by key figures post-Watts drafting -- in development, recruitment and other on-field department circles -- was unthinkable. It has practically ruined players.

AFL site saying we are into Bennell and Redden. Well at least we are trying.

Trying and getting aren't the same thing. Fingers crossed, either of those would improve our midfield, perhaps considerably.