Training - Friday 27th February, 2015

[Samael 560]

Agreed, he does everything with the minimum of fuss, same as Michie who they had playing in defence today

been saying it for some time. Michie will probably be playing in defence, HBF this season.

[WERRIDEE 5,362]

Struggled today. Used a bit in centre clearances and a bit of half back. Jones, Tyson and Viney dominated the clearances, and Newton did little of half back.

2 different views on Newton, I don't know which one to believe. I just hope he can step up because I still think our midfield depth is paper thin, Vince having virtually no pre season will hurt us.

[mo64 5,597]

It is only mo64's opinion, I made a point of asking Ben Mathews, and he said it was a good quality session, I also asked could I quote him directly, and he said yes

Like I said TDI, I look at training from the perspective of where we'll improve, remembering that we're coming from a low starting base. In perfect conditions, it was very rare for the ball to move from one end of the ground to the other without a mistake. My views aren't jaundiced by having emotional attachments to individual players.

And I'm cynical about what an assistant coach would say to a supporter. Do you honestly think that he'd say the "it was pathetic, and you can quote me on that"?

[hardtack 10,433]

2 different views on Newton, I don't know which one to believe. I just hope he can step up because I still think our midfield depth is paper thin, Vince having virtually no pre season will hurt us.

I'm inclined to go for the glass half full view, simply using the weight of numbers law... ashdemons22 also said: "Newton looks solid and found it allot pencil him in for round 1".

[mo64 5,597]

2 different views on Newton, I don't know which one to believe. I just hope he can step up because I still think our midfield depth is paper thin, Vince having virtually no pre season will hurt us.

I really pumped him up after the match sim 2 weeks ago, so maybe I had high expectations for him. He made a couple of obvious mistakes in front of me that stuck in my head.

Edited February 27, 2015 by mo64

[DeeSpencer 24,904]

As far as the match sim went it had its moments of positive play and others not so much.

To be honest I was probably as disappointed in the coaches as much as the players. The focus again seems to be on possession retention, with Goodwin calling for calm and slow steady play at half back. Seems a strong desire to get the ball to running players by foot trying to pick through zones instead of attacking run from the backline and long kicks to half forwards presenting which is what I'd love to see.

The best patches of play did involve a more attacking kick towards the corridor and then some flowing handball and run. Frost actually straightened the team up a bit with an attacking play. One went from the Northern end in to the middle for a series of handballs (I think Salem, Viney, Kent) who then pumped it in forward.

The slower play around half back was ok at times. It certainly wasn't terrible. But when you switch it around half back against any good defensive team (and both sides defended pretty well) at some stage you're going to need to do 1 of 3 things to get out - 1. kick to a contest. 2. thread the needle on a difficult kick or 3. run and link up and break through a zone. There were too many times where I would've liked to see us try the kick to the ruck/CHF option OR try the handball and run through the middle early on in the rebound.

Individual wise (bearing in mind the teams were pretty balanced and so you had to look both ends)

Backs:

Dunn made it hard for Gawn by out bodying him. Grimes was more solid. Salem defended well, took a great mark backing in to a pack and used the ball really well. Garland had one moment where he dangled a kick out for young White who probably could've held it with strong hands but was picked off. Hunt had a big long run (during the earlier match simulation stuff). Tommy McDonald continues to be a liability with ball in hand. Shank central. He has a very slow steady and release on his kicks. White kicks really well and looks up for the contest, just is a bit awkward defending and around the packs. Frost provided a bit of burst and was otherwise ok. Jetta was very comfortable for the time he played. Sat Hogan on his backside I believe at the far end. A number of others - Michie, Newton, Lumumba, McKenzie filled in on the flanks.

Mids:

Tyson is still probably our best on the spread, just gets to the right spots to get the ball. Viney found plenty as well. Jones was Jones. Lumumba breaks the game open with his run but we'll have to cop some turnovers or poor kicks. Matty Jones found lots of space, he's good at getting a handball and getting to the edge of a pack, unfortunately he just isn't smooth by foot when running full pace. Lively is a good word for Stretch. Newton pulls off the occasional lovely left foot kick, but I'm concerned about how he's going to find the ball. Michie has moments of clever play but then can be walking around a pack instead of busting for that handball receive. Toumpy found a bit of it and used it well. He's up for the contest but I'm not sure he's figured out just how he'll win them yet.

Spencer did manage to handball the ball along the ground at one stage in his excitement to dish off a handball to a running player. He missed a lot of footy last year and training, so I'll give him time. But it's hard to watch at times. I think he'll only ever be of use if he plays angry and plays like a big strong bugger. That's not ideal for a scratch match, but he if rucks in games like he did v Pedersen at centre bounces he wont contribute much. Anyway, too much time for our 3rd string ruck already.

Fwds:

Hogan very solid. Dawes 2 grabbing but did take a few. Gawn got at least one goal when in more space but Dunn does give him trouble one on one. Garlett was buzzing around. JKH as usual finds a way to get to space, he's got a good work ethic. Kent was involved in lots and was very physical. Didn't see much of Fitzy besides on nice grab.

Anyway, good players played well, ordinary players not so much. Defensive set ups were pretty sound. Physical effort seemed willing. Ball use was safe around half back. Forwards stayed at home pretty well. Mainly it's time to play against an actual opponent and to get our better players in the same team.

[ashdemons22 235]

I'm inclined to go for the glass half full view, simply using the weight of numbers law... ashdemons22 also said: "Newton looks solid and found it allot pencil him in for round 1".

Allot is probably wrong wording, I would say he had at least 6-8 touches in the simulation from where I could see and used it well every time. Was good in traffic and spread well. My observation.

[Ted Lasso 18,909]

Allot is probably wrong wording, I would say he had at least 6-8 touches in the simulation from where I could see and used it well every time. Was good in traffic and spread well. My observation.

That's about my thoughts too, he is a pretty solid player, i reckon he'll be best 22 and play his role pretty well

[The Devil Inside 2,147]

Like I said TDI, I look at training from the perspective of where we'll improve, remembering that we're coming from a low starting base. In perfect conditions, it was very rare for the ball to move from one end of the ground to the other without a mistake. My views aren't jaundiced by having emotional attachments to individual players.

And I'm cynical about what an assistant coach would say to a supporter. Do you honestly think that he'd say the "it was pathetic, and you can quote me on that"?

Yes, Ben Mathews told me a session before Xmas was very ordinary, that's why I ask his opinion, and the coaches know I post here so they will answer and allow me to post their reply

I haven't got emotional attachments, I will point out where players are pulled up for doing something wrong no matter who the player is, eg Tyson, I just found your opinion of Newton today bizarre to say the least, but you are entitled to it

Edited February 27, 2015 by The Devil Inside

[mo64 5,597]

To be honest I was probably as disappointed in the coaches as much as the players. The focus again seems to be on possession retention, with Goodwin calling for calm and slow steady play at half back. Seems a strong desire to get the ball to running players by foot trying to pick through zones instead of attacking run from the backline and long kicks to half forwards presenting which is what I'd love to see.

Not sure if it was a coach's instruction that led to Garland copping a spray from Jones. There was a switch in play and Garland took a mark at CHB, 15 metres in the clear. He could have easily taken off and pumped the ball to a leading forward. Instead he went back and chipped a 25m pass to White on a flank, who was under pressure, but probably should have taken the mark.

[mo64 5,597]

Yes, Ben Mathews told me a session before Xmas was very ordinary, that's why I ask his opinion, and the coaches know I post here so they will answer and allow me to post their reply

I haven't got emotional attachments, I will point out where players are pulled up for doing something wrong no matter who the player is, eg Tyson, I just found your opinion of Newton today bizarre to say the least, but you are entitled to it

As I found your comments about Spencer.

[Ted Lasso 18,909]

Not sure if it was a coach's instruction that led to Garland copping a spray from Jones. There was a switch in play and Garland took a mark at CHB, 15 metres in the clear. He could have easily taken off and pumped the ball to a leading forward. Instead he went back and chipped a 25m pass to White on a flank, who was under pressure, but probably should have taken the mark.

I don't think the spray was about the decision as much as the indecision, the spray seemed to be around the fact that he didn't commit and just go, he hesitated and because of that the switch didn't come off and resulted in a turnover.

[dazzledavey36 53,255]

Take a bow Mo64 and Geoguio Martin fantastic training reports. Loving your guys honesty and constructive criticism on the reports. Special mention too BB for kicking it off.

t

[DeeSpencer 24,904]

The main one that stood out to me Bobby was "as the tempo of training increases so do the mistakes".

This is only training tempo. A games tempo is even greater which concens me greatly. I have a bad feeling our skills under pressure will go to water and we will be similar to last yr.

Then there was MO64 report. Not much to like in that.

Maybe it's just me but for the first time in a long time I am being very wary of how we will perform and can't get excited until I see it on game day.

You have to remember they are playing against each other, so including a lot of younger and fringe players and they also know each others strengths and weaknesses.

From the forwards I'm confident Hogan and Garlett will add skills. Kent and JKH impressed today. I know what Dawes will deliver. Either Gawn or Pedersen should offer something. Not much from Watts today but obviously if he can get the damn footy he uses it well.

Jones, Tyson, Viney stood out today. Crossy is Crossy. Lumumba makes the team better even though his foot skills will up and down. Toumpy should be improved and Matt Jones showed that whilst he'll miss a target here and there he's got the ability to get the ball moving. Bernie Vince would be a nice addition but so be it. Newton can kick a footy.

In the backline Salem uses it really well. I'd still like Howe back there too for more run and skill. Garland and Dunn are steady, they'll have moments but mostly they don't burn it and they defend well. Garland's turnover (whilst unnecessarily opening a window) would've been marked by a stronger more experienced player. Jetta is very solid if unspectacular with the ball. Grimes is Grimes, but he didn't muck up today and his run and defensive work was solid. Frost isn't highly skilled but not terrible. Tom McDonald is dreadful by foot, but hopefully can defend well.

Overall Hawthorn (that skill masters) got out pressured and soundly beaten by Collingwood, with both teams missing plenty last night because Collingwood won the physicality, pressure and defensive set up battle and used the ball well enough to good enough forwards who got some score on the board.

[The Devil Inside 2,147]

As I found your comments about Spencer.

Yes but it is an opinion, I thought he did ok today, Jamar is the first ruck and we seem to be concentrating on getting Gawn as a forward, so as a backup ruckman today Spencer did ok, every player makes mistakes

I don't think the spray was about the decision as much as the indecision, the spray seemed to be around the fact that he didn't commit and just go, he hesitated and because of that the switch didn't come off and resulted in a turnover.

Agreed, they need to commit and go and forward if that option is there, said a similar thing in another topic the other day

[DeeSpencer 24,904]

Forgot to mention Vandenberg. He seems to present well enough. Like his size and how he moves. If he's got the work ethic he'll be even fitter next year. In the early match sim with smaller teams he got right up the ground from half forward and helped out the backs and also had to chase Lumumba around a bit, which is not an enviable task.

I would be keen to see him in the guts but I don't think he's been wasted or disrespected by playing half forward at all. It's his way in to the side and he seemed to have a session of near misses from making an impact. He'd have a kick sail over his head or be open for split second and ignored. Cracks in and looks like a footballer (both in size and by having a classic footballers mug). My dream of him being the next Barlow might be a bit unrealistic, but I'm still hoping he gets a shot in the NAB challenge.

Also didn't mention Aidan Riley. The pig was involved a fair bit. Ran the lines much better (and faster) than last year and used it well enough. Goes wear others fear to tread as well. Don't rule him out of round 1 contention. I think injury free he's got a bit more speed that most fans probably thought after seeing him last year.

[ManDee 7,124]

Take a bow Mo64 and Geoguio Martin fantastic training reports. Loving your guys honesty and constructive criticism on the reports. Special mention too BB for kicking it off.

t

And TDI. Variety is the spice of life, I enjoy reading all the reports and accept them for what they are, opinions. It would be a boring world if we all agreed on everything. Kudos to all reports.

[The Devil Inside 2,147]

And TDI. Variety is the spice of life, I enjoy reading all the reports and accept them for what they are, opinions. It would be a boring world if we all agreed on everything. Kudos to all reports.

Totally agree, the training threads are getting good now, we have varying reports and opinions, which you can either agree or disagree with, I will only reiterate for the glass half empty posters and readers that Ben Mathews told me it was a good quality session, I ask him once a week to make sure I am not seeing it through rose coloured glasses

In the match sim I thought Tyson actually stood out today as did Viney in the midfield along with Nathan Jones and Col Garland

[ManDee 7,124]

Totally agree, the training threads are getting good now, we have varying reports and opinions, which you can either agree or disagree with, I will only reiterate for the glass half empty posters and readers that Ben Mathews told me it was a good quality session, I ask him once a week to make sure I am not seeing it through rose coloured glasses

In the match sim I thought Tyson actually stood out today as did Viney in the midfield along with Nathan Jones and Col Garland

I have been to matches and have come away thinking X was the best player on the ground, only to hear on the way home X was playing on Y and Y had 45 disposals and kicked 4 goals. All a matter of perspective I suppose.

[jabberwocky 2,301]

glass half empty posters

sigh

Thanks all for the reports.

Edited February 27, 2015 by jabberwocky

[The Devil Inside 2,147]

sigh

Thanks all for the reports.

Only because I think sometimes I am not critical enough and some posters are too critical, hence why I ask both the players and the coaches, that way on Demonland we get input from everybody, which can only be a good thing

[Ted Lasso 18,909]

Totally agree, the training threads are getting good now, we have varying reports and opinions, which you can either agree or disagree with, I will only reiterate for the glass half empty posters and readers that Ben Mathews told me it was a good quality session, I ask him once a week to make sure I am not seeing it through rose coloured glasses

In the match sim I thought Tyson actually stood out today as did Viney in the midfield along with Nathan Jones and Col Garland

Agree on all but Col, i wasn't so impressed by Col today, still just doesn't seem 100% right to me.

[sue 9,058]

An earlier post #21 said Dawes smashed Jetta on the chops which would be reportable.

I'm surprised that none of the other reports on the session mentioned or denied this???

[Ted Lasso 18,909]

An earlier post #21 said Dawes smashed Jetta on the chops which would be reportable.

I'm surprised that none of the other reports on the session mentioned or denied this???

I saw Dawes give Allison a spray basically because Allison told him to get on the mark and he was shitty he'd just been beaten in a one on one by Grimes.

didn't see the Wack but may have been up the other end, seemed a very grumpy few boys out there today, Roosy even didn't seem impressed with a few questioning his umpiring decisions at times.

[The Devil Inside 2,147]

Agree on all but Col, i wasn't so impressed by Col today, still just doesn't seem 100% right to me.

He went over on his ankle again at one point during the match sim, think that shook him up a bit, was ok, I asked him, thought he was just back with the timing of spoils etc