Our players are killing our club

[Redleg 38,521]

I am not sure why some continually blame the players.

We have players who are not good enough. That is not their fault. Some have no skill. They never will have. They need to be moved on and replaced.

People need to stop expecting a side that is not good enough to win. It just doesn't happen.

The list needs to be improved with hard, quick, talented players, then properly developed and coached properly. It is not impossible and big inroads can be made in one off season.

[jnrmac 19,505]

I am not sure why some continually blame the players.

We have players who are not good enough. That is not their fault. Some have no skill. They never will have. They need to be moved on and replaced.

People need to stop expecting a side that is not good enough to win. It just doesn't happen.

The list needs to be improved with hard, quick, talented players, then properly developed and coached properly. It is not impossible and big inroads can be made in one off season.

Redleg you can see it with your own eyes just like we can. We have many who don't run to space, chase, harass, give second options, help teamates out etc. Poor skills don't help either.

Watch Harry O in the game against the Dorks. He would get the ball, explode for three or 4 paces taking the game on, give the ball off and run hard to create another option often receiving it back and driving it into the fwd 50.

You can't tell me our players do that. Some don't try, some are too scared to try, some try but don't have the skills. Listen to any commentators about Saturdays game. Watch the replay and tell me you are happy with the effort our players showed. They give the ball off and stop - job done.

Thats why we need on field leaders. Our experiment hasn't worked with rodan and byrne but its obvious why they were recruited. We are so lacking in leadership its a joke.

Port have done it, The Dogs look like they have done it. brisbane look like they have done it. Our pea hearts need a flogging.

[Sir Why You Little 35,321]

Jump up and down all you like, how do you know changes have not been made already and don't fool yourself yesterday would not have happended had the changes already been put in place.

oh i am sure PJ has made many changes already.

This list is a complete cot case. I am sure we can all agree on that.

People are still trying to find positives. There is no point. There are none at this moment.

Let this wretched season end.

[dee-luded 2,958]

I've been saying this all year. People were crying out for Mark Neeld to get sacked and maybe they were right to do so, but that doesn't hide the fact that it is our players who are ultimately responsible for anything good or bad we see on the field.

They ARE killing our club, and the worst thing about it is that they don't even know (or care) that they're doing it.

Neeld was onto this losers attitude,,, & was on his way to getting rid of the ones who don't really want to play hard for the red & blue... but people bucked him off the bull, so to keep some players who were threatening to leave!!!

the tail won again.

when, when will the Mfc supporters get tough & back a hard coach to rid the club of its soft centre.

its the supporters who chucked it in. since they removed Neeld, watt has changed? the tails stopped bristling & has a warm glow again?

[Curry & Beer 5,444]

Neeld was onto this losers attitude,,, & was on his way to getting rid of the ones who don't really want to play hard for the red & blue... but people bucked him off the bull, so to keep some players who were threatening to leave!!!

the tail won again.

when, when will the Mfc supporters get tough & back a hard coach to rid the club of its soft centre.

its the supporters who chucked it in. since they removed Neeld, watt has changed? the tails stopped bristling & has a warm glow again?

oh FFS Neeld wasn't on to anything he was one of the worst coaches of all time

[dee-luded 2,958]

Redleg you can see it with your own eyes just like we can. We have many who don't run to space, chase, harass, give second options, help teamates out etc. Poor skills don't help either.

Watch Harry O in the game against the Dorks. He would get the ball, explode for three or 4 paces taking the game on, give the ball off and run hard to create another option often receiving it back and driving it into the fwd 50.

You can't tell me our players do that. Some don't try, some are too scared to try, some try but don't have the skills. Listen to any commentators about Saturdays game. Watch the replay and tell me you are happy with the effort our players showed. They give the ball off and stop - job done.

Thats why we need on field leaders. Our experiment hasn't worked with rodan and byrne but its obvious why they were recruited. We are so lacking in leadership its a joke.

Port have done it, The Dogs look like they have done it. brisbane look like they have done it. Our pea hearts need a flogging.

this club Has not done that since the time of Leoncelli, Farmer & Woewodin.

[Sir Why You Little 35,321]

Neeld was onto this losers attitude,,, & was on his way to getting rid of the ones who don't really want to play hard for the red & blue... but people bucked him off the bull, so to keep some players who were threatening to leave!!!

the tail won again.

when, when will the Mfc supporters get tough & back a hard coach to rid the club of its soft centre.

its the supporters who chucked it in. since they removed Neeld, watt has changed? the tails stopped bristling & has a warm glow again?

Neeld was onto the situation but he went about it in a shocking way.

He actually made it worse.

Installing 2 Baby Captains was the worst decision possible.

[dee-luded 2,958]

oh FFS Neeld wasn't on to anything he was one of the worst coaches of all time

absolutely he was, just because you don't get it... you have to remove the rot before you reconstruct it...

now maybe some will realise why he is in demand from other competing clubs..

... just because he was playing the night carter for 2 years,,, doesn't mean he couldn't clean things up to build strong & new. its just that the supporters weren't able to patiently commit after the previous 4 years of rebuild failure, which had failed because of the continuing & growing soft culture & poor developers at our club...

even if neelds gameplan was strong enough after 3 Yrs or so, the culture would have been strong & healthy for the next coach to grow it.

now its half way done, & still not there yet.

[Sir Why You Little 35,321]

FFS. Discussing anything with you is akin to slamming your head into a brick wall.

Where did I 'excuse' yesterday's performance? I'd say, if anything, your insistence on blaming 186 is ignoring the present and thus more of an 'excuse' than anything.

We're all moving on from 186 except you, WYL. As usual, you're stuck in the past, and you're far less relevant.

I am not ignoring the present at all. Far from it.

I use 186 as a reference point because it is still relevant.

The club has made many changes since that day but the progress of the match day efforts has not changed. The players were lazy and disinterested in 2011 at Geelong & they are still lazy and disinterested yesterday 2 years later.

I liked what the President said yesterday. "We are soft"

Never did Mclardy or Schwab have the balls to EVER say that. The covered everything up.

I hope Bartlett started his new no bullsh!t tenure today first thing.

[dee-luded 2,958]

Neeld was onto the situation but he went about it in a shocking way.

He actually made it worse.

Installing 2 Baby Captains was the worst decision possible.

No, he went about it in the quickest fashion he could...

you have to get rid of the cultural flag bearers first & quickly & thoroughly,,,, or otherwise the young kids will carry that sick torch the same way that they learnt from the original cultural flag bearers.

Neelds job was not finished... he would have finished it this year & the new culture would have started to show itself in 2014... this is why some transitional mature players were imported from successful environments. to hold up the cultural vacuum from collapsing back into the old ways.

[Sir Why You Little 35,321]

No, he went about it in the quickest fashion he could...

you have to get rid of the cultural flag bearers first & quickly & thoroughly,,,, or otherwise the young kids will carry that sick torch the same way that they learnt from the original cultural flag bearers.

Neelds job was not finished... he would have finished it this year & the new culture would have started to show itself in 2014... this is why some transitional mature players were imported from successful environments. to hold up the cultural vacuum from collapsing back into the old ways.

Neeld was never going to finish the job...The AFL would have kicked him out before that thankfully..

It was Garry Lyon who went about his job in the quickest way and hired a coach who thought he could do it but had no previous experience.

The result being our list is now brain dead...very few of this group will be the footballers they hoped to be.

[Biffen 12,560]

Neeld was never going to finish the job...The AFL would have kicked him out before that thankfully..

It was Garry Lyon who went about his job in the quickest way and hired a coach who thought he could do it but had no previous experience.

The result being our list is now brain dead...very few of this group will be the footballers they hoped to be.

So Garry Lyon wrecked the club?

I thought it was CS.

Or Caro.

Or Norm Smiths Curse

Or Jack Watts.

[Theo 263]

I am not sure why some continually blame the players.

We have players who are not good enough. That is not their fault. Some have no skill. They never will have. They need to be moved on and replaced.

People need to stop expecting a side that is not good enough to win. It just doesn't happen.

The list needs to be improved with hard, quick, talented players, then properly developed and coached properly. It is not impossible and big inroads can be made in one off season.

How can Craig Cameron and Barry Prendergast get it so wrong. The recruiters are just about the most important people at a football club and we have failed miserably. I have some faith in Todd and Jason but then againg who nows. If we had followed Quigley or Knightmares phantom drafts we would have ended up with Atley or Lycett, Aaron Black and Nathan Vardy. No Gysberts, Cook ot Tapscott.

[Guest]

No, he went about it in the quickest fashion he could...

you have to get rid of the cultural flag bearers first & quickly & thoroughly,,,, or otherwise the young kids will carry that sick torch the same way that they learnt from the original cultural flag bearers.

Neelds job was not finished... he would have finished it this year & the new culture would have started to show itself in 2014... this is why some transitional mature players were imported from successful environments. to hold up the cultural vacuum from collapsing back into the old ways.

Your theory is an interesting one.

It's main shortcoming is that Neeld had f*** all idea about what he was doing.

Edited August 19, 2013 by Guest

[Sir Why You Little 35,321]

So Garry Lyon wrecked the club?

I thought it was CS.

Or Caro.

Or Norm Smiths Curse

Or Jack Watts.

CS was a big fan of Neeld...so i daresay that partially answers your queries....

[dee-luded 2,958]

Neeld was never going to finish the job...The AFL would have kicked him out before that thankfully..

It was Garry Lyon who went about his job in the quickest way and hired a coach who thought he could do it but had no previous experience.

The result being our list is now brain dead...very few of this group will be the footballers they hoped to be.

WYL, the biggest & most important job re our list is to cut out the rot first... why do you think we haven't been able to develop our kids properly since around the time of Brent Grgic, & our development situation worsened after him... until we are where we are now.

the lazy attitudes & because of this not keeping up with the professional attitudes of stronger clubs... its been growing for a long time, before it became Obvious.

Only the totally committed have got thru like Jonesy... how much better would he be at a Pro club???

Neeld new this & had the balls to try to pull it out by the roots. but timing & his lack of a High profile, caused the panicking supporters to kill off his efforts... If the supporters kept up the memberships & attendances, the AFL would not have taken action. just as they did not in 2009-10.

[Sir Why You Little 35,321]

WYL, the biggest & most important job re our list is to cut out the rot first... why do you think we haven't been able to develop our kids properly since around the time of Brent Grgic, & our development situation worsened after him... until we are where we are now.

the lazy attitudes & because of this not keeping up with the professional attitudes of stronger clubs... its been growing for a long time, before it became Obvious.

Only the totally committed have got thru like Jonesy... how much better would he be at a Pro club???

Neeld new this & had the balls to try to pull it out by the roots. but timing & his lack of a High profile, caused the panicking supporters to kill off his efforts... If the supporters kept up the memberships & attendances, the AFL would not have taken action. just as they did not in 2009-10.

DL you or i could have cut out the dead rot, just like Neeld....Trouble was he had to coach the list as well...in 18 months we went backwards.

He was no good.

He was signed in haste....Ken Hinkley says hi.

[dee-luded 2,958]

Your theory is an interesting one.

It's only shortcoming is that Neeld had f*** all idea about what he was doing.

sorry Colin because you don't understand what he was doing, does not mean that he & the assistants, & Craig, & Todd didn't get it.

I'm sure they did... some, may have got cold feet part way thru with the form due to key injuries, but I guarantee you they all new about how the list management would be carried out.

we should have cut out the rot years before & traded out the softness around 2006ish. but at that time the game was not played so contested. so the Issues were not as obvious, but I was screaming for some head over the ball hard footy even then.

when daniher wanted us to be harder, he went out and got Miller & Pickett??? how pathetic to fix soft issues by buying 2 players to cover over the problems. mates club had been well established.

[dee-luded 2,958]

DL you or i could have cut out the dead rot, just like Neeld....Trouble was he had to coach the list as well...in 18 months we went backwards.

He was no good.

He was signed in haste....Ken Hinkley says hi.

you can't coach a bunch of babes & lemmings without leaders... it was always going to take time... thats why I say the timing to do it was wrong. it should have been done in 2008, or earlier around 2005 - 06... but it went undiagnosed.

sanderson says Hi, he was 2nd on the ladder last year & everyone wanted him at Melbourne... he was http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012_AFL_season#Ladder_progression

Fix the real issues first... then coach after problems fixed...

[Guest]

Fair dinkum dee-luded. Give it up already.

You mean well but this and the BS about Daniher 'destroying' the club is just absolute foolishness. The theory that Neeld was a success is a spin job not even Satyriconhome would attempt these days. Compare his early cocky press conferences and his later tentative 'it is what it is' ones and tell me, based on his demeanor, if HE thought he was succeeding. Has it also dawned on you that his 'cleanout' may have been more inspired by CS's need to marginalize his critics rather than anything noble?

[Soidee 1,496]

PLayers come and go but our club has been here for 150+yrs.This present bunch of players though is doing their best to kill our club.

I am sick of hearing about how hard it is to play for a club like melbourne when we are so bad. Sick of hearing players like Watts say " I wish we had leaders like Joel Selwood". Sick of the media laughing at us like they did on two radio stations I heard today

Jack Viney showed the rest of them today how to run and how to attack a contest. A first year player. There were a few others and Nate Jones gives his all every week but I am so over this pathetic bunch of soft pea hearts.

Port adelaide have done an amazing job of dragging themselves off the canvas when no-one wanted to coach them, no players wanted to get drafted by them.

Same as the Bulldogs. Looked pathetic for a year and a half but now playing with passion and fire.

And us? Well frankly our club will be lucky to be here in 3yrs time. Our players have escaped so much scrutiny its a joke. 'Oh we don't like cameron Schwab, oh we don't like Chris Connolly, oh we don't like Mark Neeld. If only we had some leaders, if only this if only that.

My kids are done. Melbourne suck. I know of at least 3 other families where the kids have abandoned our club. And why wouldn't they? Where is the hope?Where is the spirit? Where is the passion?

I couldn't care less if we dropped 20 players from our list at season end. Just find me some more like Viney who has a go week in week out. Some hard asses who play with passion and hardness.

If we don't we will fold.

Yes 100% our list is below AFL standard. The rot has set in and PJ needs to wipe the slate clean with those (and I include Watts) who have a soft underbelly. We know who you are on this list and we want rid of your types.

[Sir Why You Little 35,321]

Fair dinkum dee-luded. Give it up already.

You mean well but this and the BS about Daniher 'destroying' the club is just absolute foolishness. The theory that Neeld was a success is a spin job not even Satyriconhome would attempt these days. Compare his early cocky press conferences and his later tentative 'it is what it is' ones and tell me, based on his demeanor, if HE thought he was succeeding. Has it also dawned on you that his 'cleanout' may have been more inspired by CS's need to marginalize his critics rather than anything noble?

Correct. Neeld bought CS more time.

God only knows what other plans CS had in mind to keep himself relevant.

The money had run out.

[dee-luded 2,958]

Fair dinkum dee-luded. Give it up already.

You mean well but this and the BS about Daniher 'destroying' the club is just absolute foolishness. The theory that Neeld was a success is a spin job not even Satyriconhome would attempt these days. Compare his early cocky press conferences and his later tentative 'it is what it is' ones and tell me, based on his demeanor, if HE thought he was succeeding. Has it also dawned on you that his 'cleanout' may have been more inspired by CS's need to marginalize his critics rather than anything noble?

the laziness was already there,,, robbo refusing to keep his feet, & chase... yze never fit enough to be a real midfielder, so he was put in the pocket, with runs thru the middle. then he complained he wasn't fit enough to run thru the mids, but he was bored in the pocket when the ball wasn't there.

bruce getting cheap kicks in the back pocket from the kickouts... where do you think morton learnt it.

the culture was crap, but we had talent,, lazy talent that got us wins... the tail was wagging the dog & the dog patted it, except for the dogs work horses... they didn't get patted.

the workhorses ended up at richmond, or finished. or at the swans.

we are still paying for the crap that started mid nineties somewhere, around the time we had all the injuries & players were all sent out riding bikes instead of training. it (the lazy culture) got worse after around 2003ish. & grew & grew...until the wheels fully fell off in 2007.

all the kings Horses, & all the kings Men, haven't been able to figure it out since.

[John Crow Batty 8,373]

You are the one who is absurd Stuie. You just don't get it.

31 goals is what i am talking about.

A PLAYER REVOLT.

True, it was a player revolt brewing from around the time before McLean left. Same old denialists keeping their heads in the sand, papering up the cracks and dishing out disinformaton etc. Those we trusted to make our club great again [censored] up big time. Now we are at trash time of this pathetic saga. Everyone at the club is making time for new world order to begin. Things will improve.

[Earl Hood 5,874]

Yes 100% our list is below AFL standard. The rot has set in and PJ needs to wipe the slate clean with those (and I include Watts) who have a soft underbelly. We know who you are on this list and we want rid of your types.

Strewth! Can you have 38 picks in the draft?