See, you're doing the exact same thing, but the other way.

You're assuming that the skinnier the player, the less courageous/aggressive they are. Similarly, you're assuming that muscular kids are more courageous. Neither of those are true.

you obviosly didnt read what i just wrote...go back

http://site4.demonland.com/forums/index.php?/topic/34425-the-tradedraft-rumour-mill/?p=838069

Cool rumours.

Any news on the mill ?

Me?

None I'm afraid. Once you're out of the loop you're out!

Cool rumours.

Yes rumour has it we pick skinny kids.

you obviosly didnt read what i just wrote...go back

http://site4.demonland.com/forums/index.php?/topic/34425-the-tradedraft-rumour-mill/?p=838069

You said it's a 'reality' that lighter-bodied players are less likely to be able to effect the contest.

The corollary of that is that stronger-bodied players are more likely to be able to effect the contest.

I disagree. There are plenty of big bodied players who don't give us anything (remember Paul Johnson? Built as well as you could ask for, a pansy in any contested situation). There are also plenty of lighter-bodied players in the AFL who defy their size to get after contested ball (Wingard, Fyfe, Heppell, Hill x 2).

It's about identifying the players in the draft who have that innate passion for a contest. If those players have lighter bodies, so be it.

What most of the champion players over the ages have had in common is the fierce desire to win at all costs. Fat, skinny , chiselled, fast, slow etc seems to matter less.Therefore, attitude and mindset seem a more important attribute.

When recruiting 'best available' , the term best is subjective. As a recruiter I would be looking at who stands up when their team is being over run and delivers under pressure.I'm sure the recruiters do look at this.

Yeah but there is not necessarily a direct correlation between that and size. Look at Tom McDonald, skinny tall, but has desire for the contest and work load and has proven to play early. Same goes for Fyfe who impacted plenty of games early despite how skinny he was.

No doubt more of the midfielders with bigger builds can influence early but if you can't run a 14+ or more beep test you wont get through preseason and get on the park and play early. Nathan Jones had a huge body when he was 18 and was super fit but it took him a long time to adapt to AFL.

Look at last years draft. Bulldogs took Stringer who's a huge, strong inside mid in the making but doesn't have near the tank to be much more than a forward. Wines who's still a monster for 18 but not as big was able to be managed through the season to contribute early. Jack Viney who's a little shorter but solid had a few injury issues that stopped him playing a whole season influenced some games but not most really.

Give me the best footballer, of which winning the ball and using the ball are probably still the most important attributes and I'll be happy. I don't care if he weighs 75kg or 85kg.

I think I just said that?

Initially, I thought that size was important, but I've come to the conclusion that we didn't draft footballers with a combative spirit (leaving the last year or so out of it)

The x factor.

If we can't trade pick 2 for Dylan Shiel or a 10 year, 200 game midfielder I hope that we explore swapping it for Collingwood's Picks 10 and 11.

We don't need an Aish or Kelly, and 10 and 11 would give us the chance to land Crouch and Freeman/Sheed - ready-to-go inside midfielders.

I heard a Recruiter say the other day that there is a clear 'top 4' or so and then the draft opens up a lot. The Pies might see pick 2 as an opportunity to add the best midfielder in the draft to their list along with Taylor Adams, while we turn pick 2 into 2 inside mids which we desperately need.

If we can't trade pick 2 for Dylan Shiel or a 10 year, 200 game midfielder I hope that we explore swapping it for Collingwood's Picks 10 and 11.

We don't need an Aish or Kelly, and 10 and 11 would give us the chance to land Crouch and Freeman/Sheed - ready-to-go inside midfielders.

I heard a Recruiter say the other day that there is a clear 'top 4' or so and then the draft opens up a lot. The Pies might see pick 2 as an opportunity to add the best midfielder in the draft to their list along with Taylor Adams, while we turn pick 2 into 2 inside mids which we desperately need.

I like the idea.However, I think if the club trade's pick 2 it will be for an established player as they will want someone who can make an immediate impact.

If we can't trade pick 2 for Dylan Shiel or a 10 year, 200 game midfielder I hope that we explore swapping it for Collingwood's Picks 10 and 11.

We don't need an Aish or Kelly, and 10 and 11 would give us the chance to land Crouch and Freeman/Sheed - ready-to-go inside midfielders.

I heard a Recruiter say the other day that there is a clear 'top 4' or so and then the draft opens up a lot. The Pies might see pick 2 as an opportunity to add the best midfielder in the draft to their list along with Taylor Adams, while we turn pick 2 into 2 inside mids which we desperately need.

Yer thats not a bad idea if we are having trouble landing a big fish.

We could then draft a mid with pick 10 and maybe try and get a establish mid like Myers with pick 11.

It could be better then putting all our eggs in the one basket.

Okay... so I was jogging along the track by Warrandyte river yesterday afternoon and this bloke needed a hand getting his kayak out of the river. Gave him a hand and we got chatting, turns out he's a relative of Tom Rockliff's manager. Not sure if I should reveal this but Rockliff is apparently 'signed, sealed and delivered' to the Dees.

Okay... so I was jogging along the track by Warrandyte river yesterday afternoon and this bloke needed a hand getting his kayak out of the river. Gave him a hand and we got chatting, turns out he's a relative of Tom Rockliff's manager. Not sure if I should reveal this but Rockliff is apparently 'signed, sealed and delivered' to the Dees.

Haha did enjoy reading

Are Carlton not interested in anyone?

Are Carlton not interested in anyone?

Apparently offering up the pick 28 from the Tigers (from Hampson trade) for Savage.

Also some interest in Chapman and Cross.

Okay... so I was jogging along the track by Warrandyte river yesterday afternoon and this bloke needed a hand getting his kayak out of the river. Gave him a hand and we got chatting, turns out he's a relative of Tom Rockliff's manager. Not sure if I should reveal this but Rockliff is apparently 'signed, sealed and delivered' to the Dees.

Thanks for putting the thread back on track.

Let's hope you weren't sold down the river.

Okay... so I was jogging along the track by Warrandyte river yesterday afternoon and this bloke needed a hand getting his kayak out of the river. Gave him a hand and we got chatting, turns out he's a relative of Tom Rockliff's manager. Not sure if I should reveal this but Rockliff is apparently 'signed, sealed and delivered' to the Dees.

Great to hear... but if that really is the case, why wouldn't they have anounced this already?

Apparently offering up the pick 28 from the Tigers (from Hampson trade) for Savage.

Also some interest in Chapman and Cross.

At least you're offer rumours haha

Great to hear... but if that really is the case, why wouldn't they have anounced this already?

Because the manager has been bedridden with an extreme case of gout for the last couple of days.

At least you're offer rumours haha

Those ones were serious, the other not so much!

Okay... so I was jogging along the track by Warrandyte river yesterday afternoon and this bloke needed a hand getting his kayak out of the river. Gave him a hand and we got chatting, turns out he's a relative of Tom Rockliff's manager. Not sure if I should reveal this but Rockliff is apparently 'signed, sealed and delivered' to the Dees.

Whether this is true or not, hopefully for everyone's sake it is I'm not sure I'm all for the Rockliff. It's another 4 year 800-900k a year job, we've got 2 of them already neither of which so far have been beneficial, and Brisbane have turned a PSD pick 1 into a Pick 2 in the National draft 4 years later.

You can bring in other teams hard work but it'll never win you a flag on that alone, pick 2 should net you a Cotchin, and I feel like this is the safer lower risk smaller reward option but he's an enormous improvement so I won't complain too much.

Michie is the Gumbleton of the west.

Stricken with injury, can't make it on the park.

Tread carefully.

Btw, how's Mitch Clark travelling? Is he out of rehab?

This is not the case, Michie played 16 games in WAFL this season and won Peel Thunder BNF, was very impressive in the games I saw him play and Freo's top quality midfield was more of the issue than Injury for 2013

You said it's a 'reality' that lighter-bodied players are less likely to be able to effect the contest.

The corollary of that is that stronger-bodied players are more likely to be able to effect the contest.

I disagree. There are plenty of big bodied players who don't give us anything (remember Paul Johnson? Built as well as you could ask for, a pansy in any contested situation). There are also plenty of lighter-bodied players in the AFL who defy their size to get after contested ball (Wingard, Fyfe, Heppell, Hill x 2).

It's about identifying the players in the draft who have that innate passion for a contest. If those players have lighter bodies, so be it.

PJ did his shoulder against Sydney putting his body on the line....he wasn't a pansy....he was just an ordinary flanker in a ruckmans body who couldn't take an overhead mark to save himself.

Okay... so I was jogging along the track by Warrandyte river yesterday afternoon and this bloke needed a hand getting his kayak out of the river. Gave him a hand and we got chatting, turns out he's a relative of Tom Rockliff's manager. Not sure if I should reveal this but Rockliff is apparently 'signed, sealed and delivered' to the Dees.

Oh yeah...I saw you there, that was right after you delivered a set of twins via caesarean using a pocket knife, whilst also putting 3 Essendon players under a citizens arrest because you saw them dealing drugs. You were also eating a sandwich.

Because the manager has been bedridden with an extreme case of gout for the last couple of days.

haha.. thats gold.

If we can't trade pick 2 for Dylan Shiel or a 10 year, 200 game midfielder I hope that we explore swapping it for Collingwood's Picks 10 and 11.

We don't need an Aish or Kelly, and 10 and 11 would give us the chance to land Crouch and Freeman/Sheed - ready-to-go inside midfielders.

I heard a Recruiter say the other day that there is a clear 'top 4' or so and then the draft opens up a lot. The Pies might see pick 2 as an opportunity to add the best midfielder in the draft to their list along with Taylor Adams, while we turn pick 2 into 2 inside mids which we desperately need.

2009: Pick 2 - Trengove, Pick 3 dusty Pick 10 - Melksham, 11 Gysberts, 12 Lucas

2008: Pick 3 or 4 - Hill or Hartlett. Pick 9 - Ziebell, 11 - Sidebottom

2007: Pick 2 - Cotchin, pick 3 - Masten. Pick 10 Dangerfield then Vespremi, Rioli, Ebert, Grimes

2006 (pic 2-4 talls) 5- Boak, 9 Armitage, 15 Dan O'Keefe, 18 L. Jetta -- the year of amazing talls

Seems like a risky strategy. Would've paid off big time in 2008 and 2007 if you got the right names but the other 2 years might have been a bust (some pretty good talls in 2006 could've got N. Brown and Frawley over Lachie Hansen or Gumbleton).

I'd say take the best player at pick 2 and hope one of the others you like slips to the second round is safer.

Oh yeah...I saw you there, that was right after you delivered a set of twins via caesarean using a pocket knife, whilst also putting 3 Essendon players under a citizens arrest because you saw them dealing drugs. You were also eating a sandwich.

I climbed Everest too and was home for a hot dinner. Good day.