Watts Is Better Than Hurley

[old55 23,848]

He's playing very well in his current role and improved his aerial contesting this week. He was recruited as a KPF and we really need support for Clark there but he can't deliver in that role. I've settled that he'll never make it there and his talents would be wasted trying. I think he can carve out a great career in the backline and I don't see it as a stepping stone to other roles. He might go into the midfield or forward to pinch hit and cause some chaos, but I think his most effective role is in the backline.

It will be interesting to see what happens when he gets the defensive forward a la Jake King which will happen from this week. He has height to make this a very difficult match-up. Alternatively he could play on a legitimated tall a la Ben Reid and still be a very effective "quarterback". That would require a re-jig of the backline roles because we've got Frawley, McDonald and Rivers there at present taking the talls.

[Hannibal 5,814]

Ben, thanks for the spelling lesson. eye coodnt kare howe menny wirds eye spelled rong.

The problem with you, and it's a big reason why I'm glad you don't have anything to do with the coaching/development of this club, is that you are too busy focusing on this kid's weaknesses, rather than playing to his strengths. Neeld has shown that the move to the backline is highlighting Jack's strengths, and as a result, he is playing the best footy he has in the red and blue.

While we disagree, you haven't convinced me to think differently. I've given you examples of why I believe the backline isn't the easiest place on the field to play, all you've given is because it's easier to react than initiate. You have not provided any evidence in your opinion, as a result, it earns no respect from me.

I advocated Watts being in the back-line once it was clear he couldn't impact games at this stage of his career as a forward. A small amount of research will indicate this.

Being a key forward is the most difficult gig in footy. There's an art to timing a lead. There's an art to creating space when most clubs are playing a 7th back, implementing zones, and defending space. It's easier to defend space than create it. It takes talent to take a contested mark when you're being double teamed by defenders that are merely trying to spoil. It takes talent to regularly impact games by hitting the scoreboard. It doesn't take nearly as much talent to be part of a defensive unit hellbent on negating. It takes talent to play ahead of the ball because you're trying to create opportunities and not as much talent when you're playing behind the ball and minding a man. The forward's goal is to win the ball, while winning the ball is often not the primary aim of the defender. They're primary aim is to stop their opponent winning the ball, or dispossessing them once they have. A forward relies on winning contested possessions to impact games. A defender may have done their job without winning contested possessions. A forward may get limited opportunites, so when they do they have to make them count. A defender doesn't have to worry about opportunities. His mantra is shut-down, dispossess, negate, niggle, hold, "the boundary line is your friend", etc. Have you ever seen a star goal kicker shunted off to defence for the rest of their career ?

But look, I don't expect to convince you. I'm not that clever.

Btw, I'm in no way saying that being an elite defender is easy. And I'm not saying that they're not valuable. And I'm not saying that some players aren't suited to a particular area of the ground. And I'm not saying that some defenders aren't more valuable than some forwards. And I'm not suggesting that some defenders aren't elite at reading the play. And I recognise that the best teams set play up off half back. And I recognise that strong defensive teams win finals. But I am saying that when you're playing in defence it's far easier to play your role than it is to make a regular impact on the scoreboard as a forward, whether that be through your own goals, or goal assists.

Why do you think Watts is finding it far easier to play in defence and was struggling so much as a forward ? Nah, forget it.

[The Chazz 4,077]

I advocated Watts being in the back-line once it was clear he couldn't impact games at this stage of his career as a forward. A small amount of research will indicate this.

Being a key forward is the most difficult gig in footy. There's an art to timing a lead. There's an art to creating space when most clubs are playing a 7th back, implementing zones, and defending space. It's easier to defend space than create it. It takes talent to take a contested mark when you're being double teamed by defenders that are merely trying to spoil. It takes talent to regularly impact games by hitting the scoreboard. It doesn't take nearly as much talent to be part of a defensive unit hellbent on negating. It takes talent to play ahead of the ball because you're trying to create opportunities and not as much talent when you're playing behind the ball and minding a man. The forward's goal is to win the ball, while winning the ball is often not the primary aim of the defender. They're primary aim is to stop their opponent winning the ball, or dispossessing them once they have. A forward relies on winning contested possessions to impact games. A defender may have done their job without winning contested possessions. A forward may get limited opportunites, so when they do they have to make them count. A defender doesn't have to worry about opportunities. His mantra is shut-down, dispossess, negate, niggle, hold, "the boundary line is your friend", etc. Have you ever seen a star goal kicker shunted off to defence for the rest of their career ?

But look, I don't expect to convince you. I'm not that clever.

Btw, I'm in no way saying that being an elite defender is easy. And I'm not saying that they're not valuable. And I'm not saying that some players aren't suited to a particular area of the ground. And I'm not saying that some defenders aren't more valuable than some forwards. And I'm not suggesting that some defenders aren't elite at reading the play. And I recognise that the best teams set play up off half back. And I recognise that strong defensive teams win finals. But I am saying that when you're playing in defence it's far easier to play your role than it is to make a regular impact on the scoreboard as a forward, whether that be through your own goals, or goal assists.

Why do you think Watts is finding it far easier to play in defence and was struggling so much as a forward ? Nah, forget it.

I appreciate your points regarding your view, I don't appreciate you getting personal BH. What gives you the right? PM me with your answer, because I'm sure a majority of posters on here are sick to death of it. And no, we will not find another site, we have as much right to contribute to this site as you do. Seriously, PM me so we can discuss matters privately rather than boring everyone else on the public threads.

If any player on the Melbourne list finds their position easy, we're in trouble. Also, as you are obviously basing part of your opinion on what Harry Taylor said in an interview, have a listen to what Buddy said after his 13 goals, something along the lines of the midfield making his job easy.

[Guest José Mourinho]

What the hell's a point guard??

Don't follow basket ball - I'd really like to know.

I'm not sure any of the PG descriptions so far in this thread are sufficient, or show a deep understanding of the position in a basketball.

The PG generally brings the ball up court and from outside the 3pt arc, looking towards the hoop and all the other players ahead of him (generally all of them), he initiates and dictates the offense.

He assesses options, directs teammates and attempts to find the best way to score.

His role is to cut through the defense and score himself, or pass to a teammate in the best position to score, ideally in a way that makes it as easy for them to score as is possible.

He often sees the whole "field" ahead of him, and needs to be able to read cues and see play develop before others.

If you were to translate that to footy, it'd be the role he is now playing.

[sylvinator 96]

All the Watts critics can go eat a turd!

http://www.afl.com.au/news/newsarticle/tabid/208/newsid/137779/default.aspx

Jack's coming on just as expected. still only 21 years old and almost 50 games.

Just wait till he's 24 years old, 196cm, 100kg, with his pace and agility and skill. Will be unstoppable!

[jumbo returns 6,741]

I'm not sure any of the PG descriptions so far in this thread are sufficient, or show a deep understanding of the position in a basketball.

The PG generally brings the ball up court and from outside the 3pt arc, looking towards the hoop and all the other players ahead of him (generally all of them), he initiates and dictates the offense.

He assesses options, directs teammates and attempts to find the best way to score.

His role is to cut through the defense and score himself, or pass to a teammate in the best position to score, ideally in a way that makes it as easy for them to score as is possible.

He often sees the whole "field" ahead of him, and needs to be able to read cues and see play develop before others.

If you were to translate that to footy, it'd be the role he is now playing.

Okay, I see. Thanks for that.

Having assessed his options, he looked mighty frustrated against the Swans where the movement was almost zilch.

[Guest Jackie]

For some unknown reason I'm starting to compare Jack Watts with Luke Hodge. Same same but different.

[Pates 9,688]

I don't see this move as permanent, he'll end up being a versatile player that can play where we need him. This is just another component of his education. Also who else thinks playing on the established forwards in the comp will help him learn about creating space and leading in our forward line?

[binman 44,714]

Barry P doesn't get a lot of love but he got this one 100% right

[beelzebub 23,390]

Barry P doesn't get a lot of love but he got this one 100% right

lets be fair all round.. all pundits said it was either the Nic or the Jack...thats a flip of the coin at worst ??

[Range Rover 1,935]

Barry P doesn't get a lot of love but he got this one 100% right

Recruiters should be judged for the most part on the names they call out from picks 10 - 40.

[LeBron James 41]

I do follow basketball (somewhat) and although I have heard the term used I couldn't explain what differentiates one position from another. They all basically run up and down the court doing the same thing. Wasn't Jordan a point guard?

All play very different roles. Some players are mix between positions though.

Jordan was a shooting guard.

[Hannibal 5,814]

I appreciate your points regarding your view, I don't appreciate you getting personal BH. What gives you the right? PM me with your answer, because I'm sure a majority of posters on here are sick to death of it. And no, we will not find another site, we have as much right to contribute to this site as you do. Seriously, PM me so we can discuss matters privately rather than boring everyone else on the public threads.

If any player on the Melbourne list finds their position easy, we're in trouble. Also, as you are obviously basing part of your opinion on what Harry Taylor said in an interview, have a listen to what Buddy said after his 13 goals, something along the lines of the midfield making his job easy.

Having re-read my post I'm still not sure why you're in meltdown. I was restrained.

You say in the post I replied to "the problem with you", as well as "your opinion earns no respect from me", yet you accuse me of getting "personal" ? You also say in another post, "See Benny boy, you do have it in you to provide an interesting reply without carrying on like a two-bob watch". Congratulations, I reckon you've got the biggest glass jaw I've encountered in 10 years on here; and your hypocrisy knows no bounds.

My views were well formed before Harry Taylor's comments and they had no bearing on my views, or posts. They were merely topical, because I happened to hear them the morning of the discussion. To be honest, I doubt I've ever come across anyone that thought playing in the back-line was more difficult than being a forward. And I reckon I've posted about most things over the past decade. You're breaking new territory. Well done.

[leehow 303]

I'm not sure any of the PG descriptions so far in this thread are sufficient, or show a deep understanding of the position in a basketball.

The PG generally brings the ball up court and from outside the 3pt arc, looking towards the hoop and all the other players ahead of him (generally all of them), he initiates and dictates the offense.

He assesses options, directs teammates and attempts to find the best way to score.

His role is to cut through the defense and score himself, or pass to a teammate in the best position to score, ideally in a way that makes it as easy for them to score as is possible.

He often sees the whole "field" ahead of him, and needs to be able to read cues and see play develop before others.

If you were to translate that to footy, it'd be the role he is now playing.

the point guard will generally have a pass first mentality, always looking to set a team mate up first, and then scoring himself if he doesnt have another option. good point guards will be like an on-court coach, knowing when to attack, when to slow the play down, what play to run, etc.

jack at times can look slow and indecisive, but i think this is because he is a couple of steps ahead of most players, and he has to wait for a teammate to run to where he expects them to be naturally. once players realise that if they work hard jack will find them, you will find play opens up and we start to look like a much better team.

i really like him behind the ball, because i think it better suits his strengths. he is smart enough to know when to stay with his man, when to go third man up and help a teammate, and with a bit more confidence, i think we will see him start to take the game on a bit more. when he does, i think we are all going to see a very, very good player.

[Guest José Mourinho]

All play very different roles. Some players are mix between positions though.

Jordan was a shooting guard.

In name, but even he acknowledged he actually played most of his career like a SF.

Spent a lot of time in the post.

[jumbo returns 6,741]

All play very different roles. Some players are mix between positions though.

Jordan was a shooting guard.

That's it! I'm confused.

[Grandson of a gun 276]

So who is the quarterback? Which is the better wide receiver? Will either be as good as Jordan? Who's the next Billy Slater?..................

Bottom line. I'm glad MFC have Jack. And slowly the competition and the "expert" commentators are waking up to this realisation too!

[LeBron James 41]

In name, but even he acknowledged he actually played most of his career like a SF.

Spent a lot of time in the post.

Definitely in his latter playing days he developed a strong post game. It's needed when you lose a bit of athleticism. Bit off topic though haha.

[The Chazz 4,077]

Does our team need a Quarterback, or a Point Guard? We play Aussie Rules football, there are no such positions on the ground. It's either back pocket, full back, half back flank, chentre half back, etc, etc.

Our game is unique, let's keep it that way.

[H_T 3,049]

For some unknown reason I'm starting to compare Jack Watts with Luke Hodge. Same same but different.

Is your take a late bloomer ?

Jack Watts reaction after the siren in amongst the celebrating was more of composure I thought in the glimpses I observed of him. More "reality bus 1-9" reaction I thought.

He was criticised along with others by Matthew Lloyd and co this time last year after the Essendon win.

[Striker475 696]

Does our team need a Quarterback, or a Point Guard? We play Aussie Rules football, there are no such positions on the ground. It's either back pocket, full back, half back flank, chentre half back, etc, etc.

Our game is unique, let's keep it that way.

It's more a role rather than an outright position. Similar to the 'defensive forward' or the 'rebounding defender'.

[The Chazz 4,077]

It's more a role rather than an outright position. Similar to the 'defensive forward' or the 'rebounding defender'.

I understand that S475, but do you hear NFL people referring to their Quarterbacks as "rebounding defenders"? No. So why should we refer to our rebounding defenders as "quarterbacks"?

[daisycutter 29,917]

I understand that S475, but do you hear NFL people referring to their Quarterbacks as "rebounding defenders"? No. So why should we refer to our rebounding defenders as "quarterbacks"?

Zacchary Billy, as bad as Hose and his point guard tish

[Brayshaw Self 847]

I understand that S475, but do you hear NFL people referring to their Quarterbacks as "rebounding defenders"? No. So why should we refer to our rebounding defenders as "quarterbacks"?

billy, stop acting like a fascist dictator. Who cares how other people refer to the rebounding defender's role? The quarterback is a good analogy and it shouldn't matter if it originates from an evil American code or Aussie rules. People can say whatever they want. Stop wasting cyberspace.

[The Chazz 4,077]

billy, stop acting like a fascist dictator. Who cares how other people refer to the rebounding defender's role? The quarterback is a good analogy and it shouldn't matter if it originates from an evil American code or Aussie rules. People can say whatever they want. Stop wasting cyberspace.

Sorry you feel that way DG, obviously Daisycutter and Old Dee don't believe I wasted cyberspace. But brace yourself, because if I don't agree with something written, I will continue to "waste cyberspace" on this forum.