Prismall

[dee-luded 2,959]

Prismall gone down injured, hurt his knee, could be 12 months.

[Red and Blue Flame 179]

get him- PSD, injured- decreases value. doesn't have a spot in geelongs side- will now have missed two geelong premierships

[jacey 333]

get him- PSD, injured- decreases value

hmm...Righto.

Feel for the kid as he is out of contract and had worked so hard to get into the Geelong team.

However MFC stay away.

[Demon Disciple 12,071]

get him- PSD, injured- decreases value. doesn't have a spot in geelongs side- will now have missed two geelong premierships

Agree with you there BB. His injury would have deterred clubs looking to trade for him quite a bit. As we won't be pressing finals next year (although stranger things have happened), we can afford to pick him and wait a year. But that's only if there isn't anyone else we could get in the PSD.

[Red and Blue Flame 179]

beautiful- someone who agrees. we arent going to finish higher than13th next yr. prismall will be 6 yr + player at least. touch wood he'll recover fine, luckily he didnt snap medial as well.

[Rogue 585]

As soon as I heard the injury I wondered about the implications for his future, and a possible trade.

His trade value would certainly be decreased, and with him likely to miss the entire 2009 (not 2010*) season that's a blow for Geelong, which are certainly in their flag contention window atm.

*edit: hey, it was nearly 1AM

[Gorgoroth 12,925]

I'd happily offer Geelong a 60+ pick for him, these days 99% of footballers make a full recovery from knee's.

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

I'd happily offer Geelong a 60+ pick for him, these days 99% of footballers make a full recovery from knee's.

Agree. If MFC wants Prisnall then we offer a fifth round pick while waving PSD#1 at them if they dont. Whether you would use PSD#1 is dependent upon what is available in the PSD this year.

Players do recover from ACL injuries but the injury is a definite negative on his market value.

[Gorgoroth 12,925]

And when he recovers full by 2010 we will have a better side for him to slot into and he would be virtually a free pick up.

[Courtney_Fish 183]

.............If MFC wants Prisnall then we offer a fifth round pick while waving PSD#1 at them if they dont. ............

That's the way. Spot on. Maybe offer them a 6th. Then repeat the whole process for Warnock with the 5th.

[deanox 9,902]

As soon as I heard the injury I wondered about the implications for his future, and a possible trade.

His trade value would certainly be decreased, and with him likely to miss the entire 2010 season that's a blow for Geelong, which are certainly in their flag contention window atm.

you mean miss the 2009 season i think?

you wouldn't want to go offering too much for him, but he has to know his chances at geelong are now limited. out for probably 9 months, he will probably be able to come back towards the end of next season, but would have to regain fitness at vfl level and fight his way into an afl side, so next year is not a reality. his spot will probably be overtaken by others at geelong also, and he will have to fight back in.

i would still be keen to trade for him, as long as we offer very little. i would not want to be offering a 2nd rounder for an injured player. do geelong want adem yze or jeff white? :D :D

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

That's the way. Spot on. Maybe offer them a 6th. Then repeat the whole process for Warnock with the 5th.

You need to offer the club something as opposed to nothing that forces you to ultimately use the PSD#1 on that player as opposed to another.

If he had no ACL problem, I'd go a 4th round. With ACL, I'd offer a fifth round. I cant see how Geelong can bargain much on this player.

Warnock is a different matter. From a Freo perspective he is a required player more so than Prisnall is to Geelong. He is fit and ready to play AFL. I think we need to deal fairly with Freo. Offering them pick 67 (5th round) is akin to offering them nothing.

If MFC have identified another needed player that they would use the PSD #1, I would offer Freo pick #51. Its a better incentive than having pick #67 in order to get Freo to agree to the deal.

I dont agree with screwing a Club in the short term because it comes back on you in the long term.

[45HG 1,539]

His trade value would certainly be decreased, and with him likely to miss the entire 2010 season that's a blow for Geelong, which are certainly in their flag contention window atm.

Two year injury Roguey?

[mo64 5,853]

You need to offer the club something as opposed to nothing that forces you to ultimately use the PSD#1 on that player as opposed to another.

If he had no ACL problem, I'd go a 4th round. With ACL, I'd offer a fifth round. I cant see how Geelong can bargain much on this player.

Warnock is a different matter. From a Freo perspective he is a required player more so than Prisnall is to Geelong. He is fit and ready to play AFL. I think we need to deal fairly with Freo. Offering them pick 67 (5th round) is akin to offering them nothing.

If MFC have identified another needed player that they would use the PSD #1, I would offer Freo pick #51. Its a better incentive than having pick #67 in order to get Freo to agree to the deal.

I dont agree with screwing a Club in the short term because it comes back on you in the long term.

Neither Warnock or Prismall have been screwed by their current clubs, so it wouldn't show much character in the person if they in turn screwed their clubs by nominating for the PSD. Offering a token 4th or 5th round pick could be construed by the player as a demeaning offer, and a lack of respect of the player's talent.

I think that Geelong will keep Prismall, and use Lonergan as an example of fighting your way back from adversity. Also, there's no suggesting that he actually wants to leave.

[H_T 3,043]

His trade value would certainly be decreased, and with him likely to miss the entire 2010 season that's a blow for Geelong, which are certainly in their flag contention window atm.

2009 season. You need some sleep.

you wouldn't want to go offering too much for him, but he has to know his chances at geelong are now limited.

Why are they now limited? Salary Cap? Do you know for sure Geelong will trade Prismall? I have seen or read nothing to suggest they will.

I think that Geelong will keep Prismall, and use Lonergan as an example of fighting your way back from adversity. Also, there's no suggesting that he actually wants to leave.

Agree. He has been given alot of opportunity this season, especially the latter half.

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

Neither Warnock or Prismall have been screwed by their current clubs, so it wouldn't show much character in the person if they in turn screwed their clubs by nominating for the PSD. Offering a token 4th or 5th round pick could be construed by the player as a demeaning offer, and a lack of respect of the player's talent.

Warnock is not happy with the level of game time and opportunity at Freo. He wants to come home. Prisnall has echoed similar sentiments. Players will go where they see opportunity. Its not a matter of getting screwed either way

If Warnock wants to come to MFC and he is out of contract then Warnock could go to MFC for nothing. Its happened before (eg Stephen Powell to St Kilda). Its not a preferred outcome.

Players and their managers are more focussed on "demeaning" contractual offers that refelct a "lack of respect of the players talent" than club trading negotiations.

The proposed low ball offer reflects the relativities of the trade rules and bargaining positions of both parties. I am sure players are not that wet behind the ears to misconstrue the mechanics of trading against their precious egos. This matter can be easily explained by the Club with the player over a cup of coffee to clear any lack of understanding.

[mo64 5,853]

Prisnall has echoed similar sentiments.

The talk of Prismall wanting out of Geelong is purely forum speculation. The same crap was thrown up last year.

And talk that Warnock wants to come to the MFC is again speculation. There is more than one club after him, and if say Carlton, is prepared to give up their 2nd round pick for him, whilst we're trying to get him to nominate for the PSD, his conscience and ego may sway him to Carlton. Also, player manager's don't like to get offside with the clubs.

Never underestimate a sportspersons precious ego!!!!

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

The talk of Prismall wanting out of Geelong is purely forum speculation. The same crap was thrown up last year.

And talk that Warnock wants to come to the MFC is again speculation. There is more than one club after him, and if say Carlton, is prepared to give up their 2nd round pick for him, whilst we're trying to get him to nominate for the PSD, his conscience and ego may sway him to Carlton. Also, player manager's don't like to get offside with the clubs.

Never underestimate a sportspersons precious ego!!!!

Most of the forum speculation gets whipped up by player managers seeking to send a message. Warnock (or his manager) has stated that he is looking to come home east and wants more opportunity as an AFL ruckman.

You can add Richmond to the mix as well as Carlton. Players will go where there best contractual arrangement and football opportunity will reside. I think MFC are astute to realise they are unlikely to play for Warnock just using their PSD#1.

However if Warnock is going to leave Freo he will seek to negotiate with the Club that offers him the best terms. If he wants to go to MFC and MFC and Warnock agree terms, then MFC can bargain with Freo very hard on this matter and other Clubs wont have look in on this. The deal would be lopsided in MFC's favour.

If Warnock wants to go to another Club other than MFC and has agreed terms with that Club, then that Club will have to negotiate a market linked trade with Freo to avoid Freo not agreeing and then letting Warnock go to the PSD and to the first PSD ranked Club that can meet his terms. And it may not be the Club that Warnock wants.

It wont be conscience or ego that sways him at all.

[mo64 5,853]

Most of the forum speculation gets whipped up by player managers seeking to send a message.

Sure, player manager's might leak something to the media, but football forums, give me a break.

I always thought that Yze_Magic was actually Cam Bruce's player manager.

As for Warnock, if 2 clubs have agreed to his contractual demands, what the club has to offer as trade could be the deal breaker, and that comes down to the player's conscience or the ethics of the player manager.

[deanox 9,902]

Why are they now limited? Salary Cap? Do you know for sure Geelong will trade Prismall? I have seen or read nothing to suggest they will.

he is out for next season. he is not currently in their best 22, and his selection each week depends on the availability of others. what i was referring to was the fact that he was already slightly on the outer and for him to press his claim to be part of the best team in the comp, he needed to be at full fitness and playing well every week, otherwise he is always the first dropped. a year out of the game means others will get the opportunities that have the last two years been presented to him. if someone else steps up he is then ranked further down the list.

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

Sure, player manager's might leak something to the media, but football forums, give me a break.

I regularly do. Player managers regularly leak around the media and the relevant clubs which feeds into Forums.

As for Warnock, if 2 clubs have agreed to his contractual demands, what the club has to offer as trade could be the deal breaker, and that comes down to the player's conscience or the ethics of the player manager.

Right so we agree on contractual demands. Good.

The next issue is what the other player wants re football career. Its not enough to just meet the players contract demands. If a player does not want to play for you then forget it. No trade. And if the Club is not holding the requisite PSD then its in the players interest to nominate his preferred Club so that Club can begin meaningful negotiations with the intended Club and by passing other offers.

If you hold PSD#1 in the negotiations, it allows the intended Club to twist the deal

I have yet to see a trade get to or hinge on a conscience vote. You are grasping at straws claim ethics of player manager.

And it makes no logical sense for a player to push an intended Club to trade higher than it has to get the deal. There is no conscience or ethics to it. When a player moves Clubs he either wants to join a successful club or one that will be. Pushing an intended Club to deal higher than would punishes the intended Club from use that higher pick for a more talented player to create a more successful team.

[torpedo 33]

I dont think this will work in our favour at all.

The preferred situation from MFC's position would have been Prismall gets left out of the Cats team for the GF and / or Prelim & GF and the kid really questions his future at Geelong.

The current situation is he had been in the Cats team for 10 of the last 12 matches then went down with an ACL. His No 1 priority will now be recovering as best as possible and as quickly as possible in the most supportive environment available, both medically and personally - Geelong is the best place for that, MFC probably the last.

And there is no way Freo will deal on Warnock for a 5th or 6th rounder, look at the picks Wood & Meesen got, it will be at least a 3rd rounder and as high as a 1st rounder, they'll rather risk letting him walk into the PSD than consider a token pick. I'd be happy acquiring him for a 3rd or 2nd round pick and consider our 17th or 19th, particularly if we can trade someone out for another decent pick ourselves.

[H_T 3,043]

he is out for next season. he is not currently in their best 22, and his selection each week depends on the availability of others. what i was referring to was the fact that he was already slightly on the outer and for him to press his claim to be part of the best team in the comp, he needed to be at full fitness and playing well every week, otherwise he is always the first dropped. a year out of the game means others will get the opportunities that have the last two years been presented to him. if someone else steps up he is then ranked further down the list.

Yes. Prior to his injury yesterday I believe he was under consideration for their best 22. His selection earlier in the season probably did depend upon other players availability. Whilst he won't get an opportunity whilst in rehabilitation. Returning from injury when fit will see him gain the same opportunities he has been offered. Much like Tom Lonergan.

[dee-luded 2,959]

beautiful- someone who agrees. we arent going to finish higher than13th next yr. prismall will be 6 yr + player at least. touch wood he'll recover fine, luckily he didnt snap medial as well.

I'd trade Wheatley for him.

[Bring-Back-Powell 14,787]

Prismall will stay at Geelong. Don't underestimate how tight-knit this club is. They showed faith in Lonergan and look at him now. Also Blake stayed at Geelong even after the humilation of being dropped for the GF.

I would only trade a token 5th round draft pick for him. I'd rather target a disgruntled 23 year old who is fit and ready to play round 1 for us next year.