CAN SYLVIA STEP UP?

[Jaded No More 58,226]

Since he has been at MFC, I dont think there has been that "Kick it to Colin" arrangement so I dont think that plagues him.

Aside from his OP and the inabiilty to put in a full pre season, Colin has the lack the coaching and player development pre and during his MFC time.

I would hope that with Bailey's teaching style of coaching that Colin learns and benefit.

Which player has Colin been favoured over to get a place in the side? Colin has fought for a place in the side as hard as Brock has. He earned his place on merit. Statements to the contrary are a fallacy.

Bottom line both Brock and Colin are in their fifth years of AFL footy. If Brock is fit and Colin gets a pre season under his belt then they both need to deliver and produce.

You missed my point.

I think that Sylvia is still stuck in that 'kick it to Col' mentality.

When he's fit he always fires up in the VFL, which consequently earns him a senior spot, but often he does not perform at AFL level when given the opportunity, but he's not dropped as a consequence.

For example... In round 10 against Adelaide (an actual victory!), Sylvia only got 5 disposals. He played on the next week and only got 12 disposals. He played on for the rest of the season and never exceeded 18 disposals (and that was against Carlton!). Obviously given our injury list last year, we weren't rushing to drop players, but Sylvia hasn't performed at a level where he comfortably fits into a starting 18. He's been on the cusp from the day he was drafted.

Just for the sake of comparison, CJ was dropped after Round 5 (15 disposals, 6 tackles in a losing side) and did not return until round 14. He had 8 disposals in Round 16 and was dropped immediately. I know that Sylvia is more talented than CJ, but can you see what I mean when I say that Sylvia hasn't had the hardest ride in terms of getting senior games?

His VFL form has earnt him a recall, but his AFL form has been shakey to say the least.

I think he is a supremely talented player, but he lacks urgency and he seems to be cruising along just waiting for things to happen, instead of making them happen. At least that's what it looks like from where I sit.

I hope he makes it through this pre-season uninjured, and I hope he really comes on next season. If he doesn't, it might be time for him to start looking elsewhere.

[Freddy Fuschia 666]

judging someone on whether or not they win a b and f

is a little rich

the question was do you think he is capable of playing 22 rounds of good footy.. which TJ never did

Whether it's rich or not, it is an indicator of how someone's career is travelling. TJ was a disappointment but whatever you might say about him, he did have one or two good, solid years. In 2002, he was not that far off a Brownlow and had to get votes while Adem Yze was also having a stellar year and in 2005 he did win the B & F in a consistent and solid season. The opening post of this thread adks whether Colin is going to disappoint us in the same way as TJ has and I would say he's well on the way to achieving that distinction. He needs to pull his finger out, stop partying and knuckle down to have a good career.

[maximum bob 462]

The nub of the question is does Sylvia have the footy smarts to match his physical skills?

Jury still definitely out. 2008 is a make or break year.

If he's an average player, he'll be traded to the Dogs for an early pick.

Over to you Col.

[Jerry Lundergard 382]

I've been expressing my doubts about Col for a couple of seasons now, and thought he should have been used as trade bait at the end of this season.

As much as i would like to see Sylvia live up to the potential that a No.3 pick comes with, i have resigned myself to the fact he will never reach our expectations.

[demonfanjezza 1]

Jury still definitely out. 2008 is a make or break year.

I'm one of that jury. I hope he performs well and proves his potential. 2008 defintely a make or break year

[Tex 68]

Get off his back.

He has struggled with the most debilitating injury AFL footballers can get.

He has chronic OP.

He has not been able to do a full preseason since we recruited him.

His engine is no where near where it should be for his age, as he simply hasn't been able to do the miles on the track.

At the start of the 2006 season he was absolutely flying in the preseason practice matches (playing midfield) and looked set to take the competition apart, but was again brought back down a few pegs with his body breaking down.

I cannot question his application and attack on the ball.

We must all hope and pray his body gets over this OP, but demanding immediate results is unfair as we have already been told he is still on a reduced fitness program this preseason.

Col may very well require another 2-3 years of careful management of his OP, as the last thing anyone would want is another major flare up.

From my understanding of recovering from OP, is it is a fine line and requires a happy medium of training intensity and rest, which can often be very difficult with so many impatient and demanding supporters, who all think they are experts.

Give Col a chance to get his body right and i guarantee you all he will show us all he is capable of being an All-Australian.

[praha 10,287]

To even say Colin's attitude is the same as TJ's is laughable imo. TJ never looked like he wanted to be there, even when he was playing well. He is a natural talent. Colin is a different player and has a more prestigious look about him. He will step up under a new coach and new environment, which is what I think the Melbournefc will be this year.

[torpedo 33]

Interesting comparison given the problems with both players are 100% alcohol related. My mail is that such issues meant that TJ was always gonna go, pick 16, 17 or otherwise.

Whilst Cols injuries have caused problems I dont think thats the half of it. He seems to be heading down a similar path to TJ, as an unproven top 3 pick it seems fair that the MFC is willing to persist but I agree that this year should be make or break.

Personally I prefer him in the mould of Brad Johnson-esque leading small forward. At 22 breaking into the midfield after all this time seems an unusual transition, whether he was intended to be a mid or not I think his time has passed to make his mark in such a role, he will either use his natural ability to excel in the forward half or his time is up. Lets hope its the former.

[occo 2]

Mark my words, col will never make it to afl standard and not because of injury.

[torpedo 33]

Hanging onto a gifted 6'6 CHF pisshead I can understand, that sort of potential is rare, but small > medium build kids whose success revolves around fitness is a whole different kettle of fish... plenty of more willing players available.

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

You missed my point.

I think that Sylvia is still stuck in that 'kick it to Col' mentality.

When he's fit he always fires up in the VFL, which consequently earns him a senior spot, but often he does not perform at AFL level when given the opportunity, but he's not dropped as a consequence.

For example... In round 10 against Adelaide (an actual victory!), Sylvia only got 5 disposals. He played on the next week and only got 12 disposals. He played on for the rest of the season and never exceeded 18 disposals (and that was against Carlton!). Obviously given our injury list last year, we weren't rushing to drop players, but Sylvia hasn't performed at a level where he comfortably fits into a starting 18. He's been on the cusp from the day he was drafted.

Just for the sake of comparison, CJ was dropped after Round 5 (15 disposals, 6 tackles in a losing side) and did not return until round 14. He had 8 disposals in Round 16 and was dropped immediately. I know that Sylvia is more talented than CJ, but can you see what I mean when I say that Sylvia hasn't had the hardest ride in terms of getting senior games?

His VFL form has earnt him a recall, but his AFL form has been shakey to say the least.

I think he is a supremely talented player, but he lacks urgency and he seems to be cruising along just waiting for things to happen, instead of making them happen. At least that's what it looks like from where I sit.

I hope he makes it through this pre-season uninjured, and I hope he really comes on next season. If he doesn't, it might be time for him to start looking elsewhere.

When you drop a player you need to have another player to bring up? Given we had Neitz and Robbo injured and others not available, who would you have brought up to replace him. Who were they?

Its simplistic and self serving to measure the position purely on possessions given that possessions are so cheap and easy these days.

Bluntly CJ is crap and has been crap in his games so far. He has been totally out of his depth at the AFL standard and he is fully fit too. For some supremely talented he has been supremely crap. He is lucky to be still with the opportunity to play AFL.

Sylvia's got his limitations both physically and with his learning. FCS he has shown far more than some supremely talented NQR players who have shown zip.

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

Hanging onto a gifted 6'6 CHF pisshead I can understand, that sort of potential is rare, but small > medium build kids whose success revolves around fitness is a whole different kettle of fish... plenty of more willing players available.

I cant understand why? Because he is tall.

In today's game demanding greater mobility the rules for a 6'6 player are the same as a player who is 6'0.

I think some of the versions about Colin's socialising circulating aoround rely little on the facts.

[Demon_Tingles 211]

I have the opinion that this year will be the big col's year. A new coach and a new attitude around the club may be just what he needs. Dean Bailey should give him a rocket and suggest to him that he is not irreplacable and that to be an afl star like he can be, he needs to perform on a consistent basis. I think barring injury big colin sylvia will have a tremendous year.

Love watchin the big fella play i have a feeling that this year he will finally show us what he is capable of.

Melbourne FC 150 Years

Bring back that premiership cup.

[mo64 5,209]

Get off his back.

He has struggled with the most debilitating injury AFL footballers can get.

He has chronic OP.

He has not been able to do a full preseason since we recruited him.

His engine is no where near where it should be for his age, as he simply hasn't been able to do the miles on the track.

At the start of the 2006 season he was absolutely flying in the preseason practice matches (playing midfield) and looked set to take the competition apart, but was again brought back down a few pegs with his body breaking down.

I cannot question his application and attack on the ball.

We must all hope and pray his body gets over this OP, but demanding immediate results is unfair as we have already been told he is still on a reduced fitness program this preseason.

Col may very well require another 2-3 years of careful management of his OP, as the last thing anyone would want is another major flare up.

From my understanding of recovering from OP, is it is a fine line and requires a happy medium of training intensity and rest, which can often be very difficult with so many impatient and demanding supporters, who all think they are experts.

Give Col a chance to get his body right and i guarantee you all he will show us all he is capable of being an All-Australian.

Haydo, I pose this question to you. Does Col give himself every opportunity to get his body right?

[red&blue&true 0]

I would still rather have Col sitting on the list, then Ray (pick 4) Bradley (pick 6) Tenace (pick 7) R. Clarke (pick 8) Trotter (pick 9) or R. Dunn (pick 10)

Sylvia will be OK i think, seeing N. Jones, and a few others go past him last year may just have woken him up a bit.

[Deestroy All 14,262]

I would still rather have Col sitting on the list, then Ray (pick 4) Bradley (pick 6) Tenace (pick 7) R. Clarke (pick 8) Trotter (pick 9) or R. Dunn (pick 10)

Sylvia will be OK i think, seeing N. Jones, and a few others go past him last year may just have woken him up a bit.

That ^ is a good point.

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

Haydo, I pose this question to you. Does Col give himself every opportunity to get his body right?

Realistically, unless you are involved in the Footy dept how could you make an informed judgement?

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

I would still rather have Col sitting on the list, then Ray (pick 4) Bradley (pick 6) Tenace (pick 7) R. Clarke (pick 8) Trotter (pick 9) or R. Dunn (pick 10)

Its a good point.

Lets look at the 2003 draft.

For all the supposed talent it has been a lack lustre draft to date. None of the top 10 are champions and the close to an AA this year was pick 33 Adcock from the Lions.

Priority 1 Adam Cooney West Adelaide Football Club Western Bulldogs

Priority 2 Andrew Walker Bendigo U18 Carlton

Priority 3 Colin Sylvia Bendigo U18 Melbourne

1 4 Farren Ray Peel Thunder Football Club Western Bulldogs

1 5 Brock McLean Calder Cannons Melbourne

1 6 Kepler Bradley West Perth Football Club Essendon

1 7 Kane Tenace Murray Bushrangers Geelong

1 8 Raphael Clarke St. Mary's Football Club St. Kilda

1 9 David Trotter Calder Cannons Kangaroos

1 10 Ryley Dunn Murray Bushrangers Fremantle

1 11 Beau Waters West Adelaide Football Club West Coast Eagles

1 12 Ryan Murphy Gippsland U18 Fremantle

1 13 Brent Stanton Northern U18 Essendon

1 14 Fergus Watts Sandringham U18s Adelaide Crows

1 15 Troy Chaplin North Ballarat U18s Port Adelaide

1 16 Josh Willoughby Glenelg Football Club Sydney Swans

1 17 Billy Morrison Tasmania U18s Collingwood

1 18 Llane Spaanderman East Perth Football Club Brisbane Lions

2 19 David Mundy Murray Bushrangers Fremantle

2 20 Sam Butler Central District Bulldogs West Coast Eagles

2 21 Alex Gilmour Tasmania U18s Richmond

2 22 Cameron Thurley Tasmanian Devils Football Club Geelong

2 23 Matthew Moody South Fremantle Football Club Brisbane Lions

2 24 Chad Jones Claremont Football Club Kangaroos

2 25 Harry Miller Port Adelaide (SANFL) Hawthorn

2 26 Daniel McConnell Eastern U18 West Coast Eagles

2 27 Adam Campbell North Ballarat U18s Fremantle

2 28 Jay Nash Central District Bulldogs Essendon

2 29 Tim Schmidt West Adelaide Football Club Sydney Swans

2 30 Brad Symes Central District Bulldogs Port Adelaide

2 31 Joshua Krueger Glenelg Football Club Adelaide Crows

2 (f/s) 32 Brayden Shaw Northern U18s Colingwood

2 33 Jed Adcock North Ballarat U18s Brisbane Lions

[torpedo 33]

QUOTE(Rhino Richards @ Dec 16 2007, 04:03 AM)

Hanging onto a gifted 6'6 CHF pisshead I can understand, that sort of potential is rare, but small > medium build kids whose success revolves around fitness is a whole different kettle of fish... plenty of more willing players available.

I cant understand why? Because he is tall.

In today's game demanding greater mobility the rules for a 6'6 player are the same as a player who is 6'0.

I think some of the versions about Colin's socialising circulating aoround rely little on the facts.

As I said quality KPP are rare, small > medium build kids less so. I agree that the committment expected of all players is the same but if a team had a potential J.Brown or N.Riewoldt in the wings then they'd probably be a little more tolerant of any indiscretions as these types of players dont come around too often, currently Sylvia hasnt shown anything that dozens of others havent already.

Either way I hope he has an injury free 2008 and turns it on because I think he could be a very valuable contributor down forward.

[mo64 5,209]

Realistically, unless you are involved in the Footy dept how could you make an informed judgement?

OK Rhino, answer this one. Why wasn't Sylvia taken on the recent trip to China with the other young players?

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

OK Rhino, answer this one. Why wasn't Sylvia taken on the recent trip to China with the other young players?

Do tell!!

As I said quality KPP are rare, small > medium build kids less so. I agree that the committment expected of all players is the same but if a team had a potential J.Brown or N.Riewoldt in the wings then they'd probably be a little more tolerant of any indiscretions as these types of players dont come around too often, currently Sylvia hasnt shown anything that dozens of others havent already.

Either way I hope he has an injury free 2008 and turns it on because I think he could be a very valuable contributor down forward.

I dont think Sylvia is either a pisshead or deserving of any special tolerance.

I agree with your hopes for him in 2008.

[Dappa Dan 2,188]

For all the supposed talent it has been a lack lustre draft to date. None of the top 10 are champions and the close to an AA this year was pick 33 Adcock from the Lions.

Jeez that's shockin' isn't it....

[kramer 0]

i thought sylvia was terrific through the midfield against richmond ( yer i know) the day N. Brown broke his leg. i remember thinking at the time it could be the " arrival" of him as a player, but unfortunately he hasnt really kicked on. Maybe the change of coach will help, it will be interesting to see how he goes this year , he must know he will be under the pump to preform. Be nice if he could turn himself into another Luke Hodge.

[DEMONMICK 0]

Colin Sylvia is a class act. He hasn't a head problem; simply O.P. When he overcomes this and plays in the midfield he will be one of Melbourne's greats.

His attack at the ball, ability to read the play and skills are great.

[Allus Monk 568]

Its a good point.

Lets look at the 2003 draft.

For all the supposed talent it has been a lack lustre draft to date. None of the top 10 are champions and the close to an AA this year was pick 33 Adcock from the Lions.

2 28 Jay Nash Central District Bulldogs Essendon

Another interesting thing - this was the bloke we were supposedly looking at with pick 20, which we actually swapped for Ben Holland. Reckon we're slightly ahead at this point.