5 minutes ago, Katrina Dee Fan said:

I think a bit factor that is being left out is Goody's rapport with the players, which I think is there.  If you compare that with say the like of Luke Beveridge, there are whimpers that that's a big factor as to why players are leaving the Bulldogs, is that the abrasiveness of Beveridge is wearing a bit thin.  I don't see that the rapport with the players is a problem at Melbourne, They seem to respect and value him.  That's a massive plus.  We're not having a massive exodus of players, in fact we're having players extend their contracts mid way, including the likes of the kids in Windsor and Tholstrup, which I think is telling.  

A couple of years ago a friend and I were taken on a tour of the club room .We were introduced to Goody - as he called himself - in his small office.The door was open.I reckon it’s always open for the players to have a chat with him.

6 minutes ago, Dingo said:

A couple of years ago a friend and I were taken on a tour of the club room .We were introduced to Goody - as he called himself - in his small office.The door was open.I reckon it’s always open for the players to have a chat with him.

The docos the club produced of Kozzie going home, last year to South Australia with Trac, this year to Western Australia with Clarry and McAdam, showed it, I think.  He has so much love and respect for his players, which was so evident to see, and it's reciprocated.  They're special moments, and they're relationship building.  You can't fake that, and they take effort and patience to build that kind of relationship.  You either have it or you don't - he does.  In abundance.  

Edited October 28, 2024Oct 28 by Katrina Dee Fan

2 hours ago, Bring-Back-Powell said:

For those blaming injuries for us missing the finals, take a look at Brisbane Lions:

1) Lose Keidean Coleman to an ACL in opening round. One of the best players in last year's grand final and was a prime candidate to be an all australian small defender.

2) Lose Lincoln McCarthy and Darcy Gardiner on the same night to ACL's. Both were settled into their forward line at the time. The former a clear 30-35 goal kicker a year.

3) Lose their high quality Ruckman for the grand final of all games.

No how's that for dealing with adversity.

The only time I saw us dealing with adversity this year was the Adelaide oval business trip. We raised the white flag in Perth and Alice Springs when things got a bit tough.

 

Brisbane and Fagan did brilliantly (and I've long loved Fagan since his time with us, increased by his underdog credentials from his time applying for senior position after senior position and getting knocked back).

But I'm pretty sure every Melbourne player who ever made the all-Australian shortlist squad of 40 was either injured or just plain had a personal stinker in 2024!

Koleman, McCarthy, Gardiner and McInerney is a problematic hole.

Petracca, Oliver, and Brayshaw is >20% of the salary cap value of the team. That's an abyss.

 

Having said all that, I actually agree we still have a problem with mental brittleness within games and over the season. A problem we've had for... as long as I can recall, actually.

1 hour ago, Little Goffy said:

Brisbane and Fagan did brilliantly (and I've long loved Fagan since his time with us, increased by his underdog credentials from his time applying for senior position after senior position and getting knocked back).

But I'm pretty sure every Melbourne player who ever made the all-Australian shortlist squad of 40 was either injured or just plain had a personal stinker in 2024!

Koleman, McCarthy, Gardiner and McInerney is a problematic hole.

Petracca, Oliver, and Brayshaw is >20% of the salary cap value of the team. That's an abyss.

 

Having said all that, I actually agree we still have a problem with mental brittleness within games and over the season. A problem we've had for... as long as I can recall, actually.

The reality is it’s easier to deal with injuries when you have them for the whole season.

Also in that Brisbane scenario they had a player of A grade to bring back halfway during the season. Will Ashcroft yes just as skilled and tough as Daicos and I know it matters diddly squat but the Lions I have no doubt would have won the 2023Flag with Will in their side on GF day.
Why say that. As I live in Brisbane I saw his half season in 2023 and was brilliant and after he acclimatised back into AFL pace in a month just was a fantastic boost on what he bought the Lions in late 2024. 

He was like a horse trained for the Melb Cup ( Grand Final) as he improved in each Final and his impact grew to his BOG status in the Granny. 

We need a player like him in our midfield and last season  more than ever. Caleb Windsor is very like Will but probably wing or centre suits him better where he just needs a bit of space to create his magic. Time will tell That’s why Caleb should be in the centre all season from Round 1 to direct our play and get our full bang for buck going into our forward line in 2025. We should start a Campaign for “The Duke for Centre in 2025” now. Trust me we will regret it if we don’t get the right mid/s in the draft. ( Actually I want Tauru with our no 5 pick as an X factor KPPlayer. Forward or back) we can get a good mid from 9 IMO as the depth is there. 

It really is so typical of the press and many Dees fans see our team as on the slide. Yes if all that happened in 2024 repeated itself maybe a chance of no Finals again. 

But I am backing in the following improvement like in 2021 from 2020. 

1. Oliver Petracca and Salem to regain their best form and be ready for stellar seasons. ( No guarantee but we are talking about 3 greats in our 2017-24 journey who despite all the going’s on are very proud and champions in their roles. ) 

2. Just about every one of the following has an upside ( no matter how much considerable or just in the 1%ers. 
JVR Petty Turner Kossie Fritta Windsor ( see above) AMW and Howes ( see both above) Kolt Jefferson Adams Laurie Verrall Sparrow ( at long last) Chandler McVee Bowey Maysie Kentfield Pup Brown and both Sharp and Campbell have been needs based recruits who will make is better prepared as a team. 

3. new Assistant Coaches Bassett and Jones if this transpires. And no forward line with Stafford’s “ coaching”. 

4. Surely Goody has room for improvement not only in his horrible use ( make that NON USE) of our Sub. The AFL may save us and rule 5 interchange and no 4 and  a Sub. Immediate Improvement.

5. The off season will have affected the team as well as 14 th place last season being the highest placed team in the AFL ever to win 11 games and remember lose 4 games by a goal or less.

6. Our 2022 to 2024 have been disappointing no doubt so an improvement is possible as no doubt other teams are believing the same. 

7. The media and other knives throwers and muck takers will  try and say nothing has changed at Board and FD and coaching level but we should obliterate that [censored] and show them our window is not closed. 

7. I defy our harshest critics to look at the upside we have and forecast another year/s of underperforming at our top level. It’s there for us to show who we are again and not waste our rebuilding the run while our champs and A and B + are still vital players who will lead the way again with the youth to follow. 

8. Anyone a betting person should get on sensibly our odds for Finals and Flag. Oh maybe a Petracca or Oliver Brownlow or if Caleb is still eligible the Rising Star. 

9. Go Dees with an easier Draw also if the AFL don’t shaft is like they did Adelaide last season. 

 

5 minutes ago, 58er said:

The reality is it’s easier to deal with injuries when you have them for the whole season.

Also in that Brisbane scenario they had a player of A grade to bring back halfway during the season. Will Ashcroft yes just as skilled and tough as Daicos and I know it matters diddly squat but the Lions I have no doubt would have won the 2023Flag with Will in their side on GF day.
Why say that. As I live in Brisbane I saw his half season in 2023 and was brilliant and after he acclimatised back into AFL pace in a month just was a fantastic boost on what he bought the Lions in late 2024. 

He was like a horse trained for the Melb Cup ( Grand Final) as he improved in each Final and his impact grew to his BOG status in the Granny. 

We need a player like him in our midfield and last season  more than ever. Caleb Windsor is very like Will but probably wing or centre suits him better where he just needs a bit of space to create his magic. Time will tell That’s why Caleb should be in the centre all season from Round 1 to direct our play and get our full bang for buck going into our forward line in 2025. We should start a Campaign for “The Duke for Centre in 2025” now. Trust me we will regret it if we don’t get the right mid/s in the draft. ( Actually I want Tauru with our no 5 pick as an X factor KPPlayer. Forward or back) we can get a good mid from 9 IMO as the depth is there. 

It really is so typical of the press and many Dees fans see our team as on the slide. Yes if all that happened in 2024 repeated itself maybe a chance of no Finals again. 

But I am backing in the following improvement like in 2021 from 2020. 

1. Oliver Petracca and Salem to regain their best form and be ready for stellar seasons. ( No guarantee but we are talking about 3 greats in our 2017-24 journey who despite all the going’s on are very proud and champions in their roles. ) 

2. Just about every one of the following has an upside ( no matter how much considerable or just in the 1%ers. 
JVR Petty Turner Kossie Fritta Windsor ( see above) AMW and Howes ( see both above) Kolt Jefferson Adams Laurie Verrall Sparrow ( at long last) Chandler McVee Bowey Maysie Kentfield Pup Brown and both Sharp and Campbell have been needs based recruits who will make is better prepared as a team. 

3. new Assistant Coaches Bassett and Jones if this transpires. And no forward line with Stafford’s “ coaching”. 

4. Surely Goody has room for improvement not only in his horrible use ( make that NON USE) of our Sub. The AFL may save us and rule 5 interchange and no 4 and  a Sub. Immediate Improvement.

5. The off season will have affected the team as well as 14 th place last season being the highest placed team in the AFL ever to win 11 games and remember lose 4 games by a goal or less.

6. Our 2022 to 2024 have been disappointing no doubt so an improvement is possible as no doubt other teams are believing the same. 

7. The media and other knives throwers and muck takers will  try and say nothing has changed at Board and FD and coaching level but we should obliterate that [censored] and show them our window is not closed. 

7. I defy our harshest critics to look at the upside we have and forecast another year/s of underperforming at our top level. It’s there for us to show who we are again and not waste our rebuilding the run while our champs and A and B + are still vital players who will lead the way again with the youth to follow. 

8. Anyone a betting person should get on sensibly our odds for Finals and Flag. Oh maybe a Petracca or Oliver Brownlow or if Caleb is still eligible the Rising Star. 

9. Go Dees with an easier Draw also if the AFL don’t shaft is like they did Adelaide last season. 

 

 

Just now, 58er said:

 

Sorry the info on AMW and Howes is in the AMW summary of 2024 season. 

12 minutes ago, 58er said:

The reality is it’s easier to deal with injuries when you have them for the whole season.

Also in that Brisbane scenario they had a player of A grade to bring back halfway during the season. Will Ashcroft yes just as skilled and tough as Daicos and I know it matters diddly squat but the Lions I have no doubt would have won the 2023Flag with Will in their side on GF day.
Why say that. As I live in Brisbane I saw his half season in 2023 and was brilliant and after he acclimatised back into AFL pace in a month just was a fantastic boost on what he bought the Lions in late 2024. 

He was like a horse trained for the Melb Cup ( Grand Final) as he improved in each Final and his impact grew to his BOG status in the Granny. 

We need a player like him in our midfield and last season  more than ever. Caleb Windsor is very like Will but probably wing or centre suits him better where he just needs a bit of space to create his magic. Time will tell That’s why Caleb should be in the centre all season from Round 1 to direct our play and get our full bang for buck going into our forward line in 2025. We should start a Campaign for “The Duke for Centre in 2025” now. Trust me we will regret it if we don’t get the right mid/s in the draft. ( Actually I want Tauru with our no 5 pick as an X factor KPPlayer. Forward or back) we can get a good mid from 9 IMO as the depth is there. 

It really is so typical of the press and many Dees fans see our team as on the slide. Yes if all that happened in 2024 repeated itself maybe a chance of no Finals again. 

But I am backing in the following improvement like in 2021 from 2020. 

1. Oliver Petracca and Salem to regain their best form and be ready for stellar seasons. ( No guarantee but we are talking about 3 greats in our 2017-24 journey who despite all the going’s on are very proud and champions in their roles. ) 

2. Just about every one of the following has an upside ( no matter how much considerable or just in the 1%ers. 
JVR Petty Turner Kossie Fritta Windsor ( see above) AMW and Howes ( see both above) Kolt Jefferson Adams Laurie Verrall Sparrow ( at long last) Chandler McVee Bowey Maysie Kentfield Pup Brown and both Sharp and Campbell have been needs based recruits who will make is better prepared as a team. 

3. new Assistant Coaches Bassett and Jones if this transpires. And no forward line with Stafford’s “ coaching”. 

4. Surely Goody has room for improvement not only in his horrible use ( make that NON USE) of our Sub. The AFL may save us and rule 5 interchange and no 4 and  a Sub. Immediate Improvement.

5. The off season will have affected the team as well as 14 th place last season being the highest placed team in the AFL ever to win 11 games and remember lose 4 games by a goal or less.

6. Our 2022 to 2024 have been disappointing no doubt so an improvement is possible as no doubt other teams are believing the same. 

7. The media and other knives throwers and muck takers will  try and say nothing has changed at Board and FD and coaching level but we should obliterate that [censored] and show them our window is not closed. 

7. I defy our harshest critics to look at the upside we have and forecast another year/s of underperforming at our top level. It’s there for us to show who we are again and not waste our rebuilding the run while our champs and A and B + are still vital players who will lead the way again with the youth to follow. 

8. Anyone a betting person should get on sensibly our odds for Finals and Flag. Oh maybe a Petracca or Oliver Brownlow or if Caleb is still eligible the Rising Star. 

9. Go Dees with an easier Draw also if the AFL don’t shaft is like they did Adelaide last season. 

 

I reckon we missed Spargo a lot.A canny player.

Dayam, there really isn't an off season anymore 🤣

2 hours ago, Katrina Dee Fan said:

I think a bit factor that is being left out is Goody's rapport with the players, which I think is there.  If you compare that with say the like of Luke Beveridge, there are whimpers that that's a big factor as to why players are leaving the Bulldogs, is that the abrasiveness of Beveridge is wearing a bit thin.  I don't see that the rapport with the players is a problem at Melbourne, They seem to respect and value him.  That's a massive plus.  We're not having a massive exodus of players, in fact we're having players extend their contracts mid way, including the likes of the kids in Windsor and Tholstrup, which I think is telling.  

I'm not a Luke Beveridge fan but the only player of note they have lost was Bayley Smith, and he's been a problem child at the club. The rest were playing VFL footy at some stage.

Goody may have a good rapport with the players but that may cloud his judgement. Some of the player extensions have been questionable. And I won't go into our club culture issues, because I'm sure you'll defend it to the hilt.

5 minutes ago, Dingo said:

I reckon we missed Spargo a lot.A canny player.

Gimme a break. He was playing at Casey in 2023. 

2 hours ago, mo64 said:

Gimme a break. He was playing at Casey in 2023. 

I suppose we agree to disagree.Roll on 2025.

Can I remind everyone that both Bomba Thompson and Dimma survived external reviews at their respective clubs prior to winning flags? They weren't sacked, but changes were made around the existing coach. I expect the same with us. Whether you like him or not, Goodwin is a good head coach and man manager, but maybe not the best tactician. Yze admitted on his departure that he was coaching from the box, and Goody was on the boundary line managing the players.

This was a transition year with, at times we had five new players in the lineup, some in their first season and others having less than ten games under their belt

None of us has any idea what the board has set the coach to do. His job description, tasks, KPI's and performance skill set. He reports to the GM or board monthly, so I don't think they will be sacking him now, given they have followed his progress all season. Already, two assistants have gone, and the dynamic will change. Stop worrying about things that we have no control over. The external reviews will challenge the club, but I cannot see mass sackings. Are there ready-made replacements for the incumbents who cop so much vitriol? NO.

It was stated elsewhere that Brisbane lost three senior players to ACLs and their ruckman for the granny. This is where they are better than us. Their second side played deep into the VFL finals, and they have great depth. Would Lohmann, Morris and Ah Chee have got the opportunity if not for the injuries? It worked out better for them, and they introduced new blood that lifted. The injured players ( McCarthy, Coleman & Gardner) probably aren't in the best 22 any more. Darcy Fort is an experienced ruck who played his role on Grand Final day, limiting the effect Grundy had on the game and covering McInerny's absence perfectly. Sydney got smashed in the midfield by Neale, Ashcroft, Berry, McCluggae, Dunkley & Bailey

The return of Ashcroft mid-season also bolstered Brisbane. Having a Coleman medalist join the midfield mid-season was a pretty handy acquisition. As we saw, the cupboard was bare in our midfield at Casey, and there was no one to replace Trac and later Windsor and Oliver. Brisbane has a much better and deeper list than us and mids who kick goals.

Edited October 28, 2024Oct 28 by Older demon

15 hours ago, Katrina Dee Fan said:

I think a bit factor that is being left out is Goody's rapport with the players, which I think is there.  If you compare that with say the like of Luke Beveridge, there are whimpers that that's a big factor as to why players are leaving the Bulldogs, is that the abrasiveness of Beveridge is wearing a bit thin.  I don't see that the rapport with the players is a problem at Melbourne, They seem to respect and value him.  That's a massive plus.  We're not having a massive exodus of players, in fact we're having players extend their contracts mid way, including the likes of the kids in Windsor and Tholstrup, which I think is telling.  

There is no doubt fractures in the playing group from the goings on this year

 

Some serious fence mending is required

17 hours ago, sydneydee said:

Time for goody to go with 18 months ago. I fear it is too late for this list and he will leave once we have truly hit rock bottom. My kids no longer follow AFL and I’m on the way out. 
 

i didn’t buy a family membership for the first time in decades last year and won’t buy a membership while he is at the club. 

Passing on your lack of resilience to the kids hey? What a great lesson in life that is. 

1 hour ago, jnrmac said:

There is no doubt fractures in the playing group from the goings on this year

 

Some serious fence mending is required

Really?  What do you base that on?  And don't say from the media.  As Clarry at the Best and Fairest himself said, "don't trust the media". 

14 hours ago, mo64 said:

I'm not a Luke Beveridge fan but the only player of note they have lost was Bayley Smith, and he's been a problem child at the club. The rest were playing VFL footy at some stage.

Goody may have a good rapport with the players but that may cloud his judgement. Some of the player extensions have been questionable. And I won't go into our club culture issues, because I'm sure you'll defend it to the hilt.

You don't rate Jack Macrae, who was a Norm Smith medalist?  Or Caleb Daniel?  It's interesting to hear Daniel talk about the soured relationship with Bulldogs post his trade to North.  Not to mention the commentary about some players' remarks in speeches at their best and fairest.  It's not a happy camp there.

3 minutes ago, Katrina Dee Fan said:

You don't rate Jack Macrae, who was a Norm Smith medalist?  Or Caleb Daniel?  It's interesting to hear Daniel talk about the soured relationship with Bulldogs post his trade to North.  Not to mention the commentary about some players' remarks in speeches at their best and fairest.  It's not a happy camp there.

Jack Macrea has never won a Norm Smith medal.

Just now, dazzledavey36 said:

Jack Macrea has never won a Norm Smith medal.

Apologies, I got him mixed up with Johanniesen

Well, nearly 850 posts = enough conternation of doubt that he can get the job done again!

19 minutes ago, Katrina Dee Fan said:

Really?  What do you base that on?  And don't say from the media.  As Clarry at the Best and Fairest himself said, "don't trust the media". 

I'm not sure about serious fractures (i mean the facts don't support that - no way so many players extend contracts in the last few months if there was serious fractures in the playing group), but i don't think there is much doubt there's some fence building needed, particularly in relation to tracc.

But to that I'd say so what.

At any given point in time there is likely to be some conflict in an organisation as big as a footy club, full of alpha male athletes with (nessarary) egos and any number of potential grievances ('why did they pick him not me', 'I'd be better in that position', 'he never puts away his weights').

Every club except the lions will be dealing with some level of internal conflict atm.

Most clubs have unhappy players wanting out for non family or personal related reasons (ironically an exception being the dees).

And every club has delisted players, most of whom who have close relationships with players who are staying. 

Whatever fence building is needed will happen naturally and they will just get on with training. 

No biggie.

14 hours ago, Dingo said:

I reckon we missed Spargo a lot.A canny player.

I dont

19 hours ago, sydneydee said:

Time for goody to go with 18 months ago. I fear it is too late for this list and he will leave once we have truly hit rock bottom. My kids no longer follow AFL and I’m on the way out. 
 

i didn’t buy a family membership for the first time in decades last year and won’t buy a membership while he is at the club. 

 

1 hour ago, Smokey said:

Passing on your lack of resilience to the kids hey? What a great lesson in life that is. 

Probability that sydneydee also complains about millenials being soft snowflakes with main character syndrome is looking high.

12 hours ago, Older demon said:

It was stated elsewhere that Brisbane lost three senior players to ACLs and their ruckman for the granny. This is where they are better than us. Their second side played deep into the VFL finals, and they have great depth. Would Lohmann, Morris and Ah Chee have got the opportunity if not for the injuries? It worked out better for them, and they introduced new blood that lifted. The injured players ( McCarthy, Coleman & Gardner) probably aren't in the best 22 any more. Darcy Fort is an experienced ruck who played his role on Grand Final day, limiting the effect Grundy had on the game and covering McInerny's absence perfectly. Sydney got smashed in the midfield by Neale, Ashcroft, Berry, McCluggae, Dunkley & Bailey

The return of Ashcroft mid-season also bolstered Brisbane. Having a Coleman medalist join the midfield mid-season was a pretty handy acquisition. As we saw, the cupboard was bare in our midfield at Casey, and there was no one to replace Trac and later Windsor and Oliver. Brisbane has a much better and deeper list than us and mids who kick goals.

That was me who stated Brisbane's injuries and I wholeheartedly agree with you that they have a clearly better list than us with an abundance of "non top 10 draft picks" youth that stepped up big time in the likes of Lohmann and Morris.

However, they'll clearly welcome back McCarthy and Coleman next year. 

1 hour ago, Katrina Dee Fan said:

You don't rate Jack Macrae, who was a Norm Smith medalist?  Or Caleb Daniel?  It's interesting to hear Daniel talk about the soured relationship with Bulldogs post his trade to North.  Not to mention the commentary about some players' remarks in speeches at their best and fairest.  It's not a happy camp there.

I don't rate the 2024 versions of Jack Macrae and Caleb Daniel. Just like I didn't rate the 2022 version of Lachie Hunter, and was totally against trading for him.

Being premiership players from a bygone era is irrelevant. Clubs need to move on from past deeds. Sadly we have been slow in that area.

2 hours ago, Katrina Dee Fan said:

Really?  What do you base that on?  And don't say from the media.  As Clarry at the Best and Fairest himself said, "don't trust the media". 

Gawn's multiple comments for a start

But also several players I have spoken to

Was not a happy camp in 2024