23 hours ago, Flowergirl said:

Why do journalists encourage trades? It seems a bit wrong for mine.

Damo is wrong about this, Houston will unbalance further and already unbalanced defense, if you've got Saad and Houston and to a lesser extend Newman all down back together what you've got is 3 attacking half backs who aren't great one on one and don't contribute strongly to the teams defensive structure, i think as good a player as he is, someone like Judd McVee for example is what Carlton need, not Dan Houston 

 

5 minutes ago, Ted Lasso said:

Damo is wrong about this, Houston will unbalance further and already unbalanced defense, if you've got Saad and Houston and to a lesser extend Newman all down back together what you've got is 3 attacking half backs who aren't great one on one and don't contribute strongly to the teams defensive structure, i think as good a player as he is, someone like Judd McVee for example is what Carlton need, not Dan Houston 

 

Judd for a Generational Key Forward and their 1st round pick. I'd say that's win win for both clubs

 

7 minutes ago, Demonland said:

 

Haha. 💩 just got real. He essentially recommitted only a few weeks back prior to exit interviews. 

Would love him at the dees. 
If we can get our hands on Brisbanes first and our F1 it might be enough to get him over the line. 
 

We need our leaders to stand up and sell our club and Tim Lamb to crack out his famous power point presentation 

17 minutes ago, GCDee said:

Would love him at the dees. 
If we can get our hands on Brisbanes first and our F1 it might be enough to get him over the line. 
 

We need our leaders to stand up and sell our club and Tim Lamb to crack out his famous power point presentation 

So what’s the play on Lions first? Do we have the picks to get a 17/18 (~1000) off their hands? They’ll likely need 2000 points or more to match any bids for Ashcroft.

They are in need of some picks and we will likely need to pay overs 1200-1400 range. So it’s ANB pick plus Grundy compensation that will net us the lower end of the band. 

You only do it if port agree in principle. 

i'd love to get him

but it seems a fait accompli he's heading to the baggers

He has iterated thatbhe has zero interest coming to us!

On 13/09/2024 at 15:50, Young Angus said:

We should still go after him somehow…but not for pick 5 no way no how

If he doesn’t want to come don’t waste our time. 

3 minutes ago, 58er said:

If he doesn’t want to come don’t waste our time. 

Quite frankly I watch other Club games and this bloke goes not seem to stand out or make me sit up and say “we should get him”.

Maybe it’s because I would rather us concentrate on wick fast mids or a star smaller forward ( if any available in trading) rather than half back. 

Also never have been impressed really with the Power defence. Allir Allir stands out like a beacon. 

Just now, 58er said:

Quite frankly I watch other Club games and this bloke goes not seem to stand out or make me sit up and say “we should get him”.

Maybe it’s because I would rather us concentrate on wick fast mids or a star smaller forward ( if any available in trading) rather than half back. 

Also never have been impressed really with the Power defence. Allir Allir stands out like a beacon. 

Houston’s weapon is his ability to transition from HB with kicking - it’s the role Bowey and Salem have for us but nowhere near as effective.
 

I’d much rather a  Lions / Pies / Swans / Hawks style of back half transition. 

6 minutes ago, Sir Windsor said:

Houston’s weapon is his ability to transition from HB with kicking - it’s the role Bowey and Salem have for us but nowhere near as effective.
 

I’d much rather a  Lions / Pies / Swans / Hawks style of back half transition. 

Yes Salo and Bowser transitioned along with Riv better in 2021 than now. 

I still feel it’s a game plan/ style issue as McVee does run mostly and Riv a bit. 

Take your point as it is most  important in forward connection in our team. 

I think we still have to be front runners due to what we can offer him in $ and port in picks.

B - McVee, May, Derksen

HB - Houston, Lever, Salem

We had him.
 

Dramas. Culture dramas. Trac saga.  

We lost him.  Ouch  

Was ok because he was staying at Port.  

Now he wants to be in Victoria.  Other clubs now piling in to the chase.   Blues getting war chest ready … Ouch. Time to reset !!! 

Edited September 24, 2024Sep 24 by spirit of norm smith
P

Who cares?

Port would want pick 5. 
They can’t have it. 
Negotiations end.

We could re-enter the fray if anyone is thinking of putting it on the table?

Houston is not the smart play for us at this point.

10 minutes ago, Mach5 said:

Houston is not the smart play for us at this point.

I believe he was the smart play for us.  

His position and ability to move the ball quicker/smarter/better into our mids and forwards is most important one we need to fix if we are a chance of a flag in the next 5 years (which I believed we were).

If we had been a decent team this year and our first round pick was in the teens as expected, it would've been a fair price to pay for him at trade. When we turned to rubbish and finished with pick 5, he ceased to be an option.

Even if he nominated us now, I wouldn't do the trade as pick 5 will be an elite midfielder who plays over a decade for us.

 

I thought what made him so appealing is his long accurate kicking which opens the ground up in transition.

 

There's stats gurus that know this better than me but most scores come from turnover.  Salem and Bowey can open the game up with precise kicking (if encouraged to take the 45 degree corridor kick) but they don't have the ability to kick the sort of distance that Houston can which makes our transition more predictable.

If I'm seeing the future with my red and blue coloured glasses on, we have largely fixed our forward issues this year in terms of personnel.  They were actually ok - it was more our midfield fell apart with no Gus, Clarry down / injured and Trac missing the second half.  We get them back at their best with a bit more speed in there from Rivers, McVee and Windsor and the missing piece might actually be the long kicking architect coming out of defence... ie Houston.

If we managed to get Lions 1st (17/18) and paired that with next years 1st rounder, surely that would be enough to get Houston to us assuming he wants to be at the Dees next year. 

39 minutes ago, Sir Windsor said:

If we managed to get Lions 1st (17/18) and paired that with next years 1st rounder, surely that would be enough to get Houston to us assuming he wants to be at the Dees next year. 

Stuff that, we need to bring in as much top end talent kids as possible to help with our list regeneration (we’ve already started), before Tassie comes in and pillages it.

1 hour ago, Demon Disciple said:

Stuff that, we need to bring in as much top end talent kids as possible to help with our list regeneration (we’ve already started), before Tassie comes in and pillages it.

I'm on the fence about the trade in general - purely because i dont like the prospect of facing short term pain for long term gain. I think with Houston on our list, it solves our back half transition issues significantly. Salem and Bowey have been woeful this year and it isnt a coincidence that this has translated to ladder position. 

Question we have to ask ourselves is what confidence do we have this gets better next year? The back half / turnover game is becoming increasingly important in the modern game and we suck big time in this area. We don't have to be top 2, but at least top 6 in order to punish teams that try and take us on with faster ball movement - they get away with this aggressive style because we just cannot hurt them on turnover. 

Do you think Bowey and Salem are just magically going to return to '21 '22 form? Houston solves the problem IMV - young enough to get us through the mini rebuild too. 

Also if Trac does decide to leave next year, you can bank on at least 2 first rounders coming back our way. 

10 minutes ago, Sir Windsor said:

I'm on the fence about the trade in general - purely because i dont like the prospect of facing short term pain for long term gain. I think with Houston on our list, it solves our back half transition issues significantly. Salem and Bowey have been woeful this year and it isnt a coincidence that this has translated to ladder position. 

Question we have to ask ourselves is what confidence do we have this gets better next year? The back half / turnover game is becoming increasingly important in the modern game and we suck big time in this area. We don't have to be top 2, but at least top 6 in order to punish teams that try and take us on with faster ball movement - they get away with this aggressive style because we just cannot hurt them on turnover. 

Do you think Bowey and Salem are just magically going to return to '21 '22 form? Houston solves the problem IMV - young enough to get us through the mini rebuild too. 

Also if Trac does decide to leave next year, you can bank on at least 2 first rounders coming back our way. 

If we can address our midfield issues, Salem and Bowey can both become much more effective as they won’t need to be as defensively focused.

It’s a big ‘if’ though, relies upon our top 5 pick having a spot on the ground from Round 1

Honestly, is this trade period even going to be much to write home about? The last thing we need to do is get involved in trading in for the sake of trading in. 

Houston was the one proven quality player that could make a difference, after that who? Kennedy? Owies? Macrae? Everything else is speculative.

We need to strengthen our draft hand and put in the hard yards now. A couple of picks in the top 15 with potentially one in the 20s would be desirable. 

 

17 minutes ago, BW511 said:

If we can address our midfield issues, Salem and Bowey can both become much more effective as they won’t need to be as defensively focused.

It’s a big ‘if’ though, relies upon our top 5 pick having a spot on the ground from Round 1

I don't see them being highly effective by foot and they certainly dont have leg speed. Even if there was better midfield defensive efforts, they dont hurt team from back half. The HB line is one of, if not the weakest line in our team. 

Most defensive setups now have 2 key talls and a whole bunch of mid/smaller sized players that are agile, fast or good by foot. Putting May, TMac and Lever aside, which defensive players tick those boxes out of:

Rivers - Fast and agile but avg by foot
McVee - Slow but evasive (not to be confused with agile) and ok by foot
AMW - Avg pace, agile and avg by foot
Bowey - slow not agile avg by foot
Salem - slow not agile avg by foot

I think we need really to need to get to work on this line as it has been criminally overlooked for years. whether by draft or trade.