CASEY: RD 13 vs North Melbourne VFL

[Binmans PA 26,723]

1 hour ago, titan_uranus said:

Why is it nonsense?

I don’t think it’s controversial to say that he’s out of form and struggling.

Bowey and McVee practically had identical games.

13 for Bowey at 62%, 4 intercept possessions, 4 score involvements, 3 rebound 50s, 9 pressure acts and 208m gained.

14 for Judd at 64%, 6 intercept possessions, 2 score involvements, 3 rebound 50s, 6 pressure acts and 209m gained.

The only difference is Bowey had 4 turnovers and Judd had 0, but still went at 64%.

I thought both were handy on the night. And one of Bowey's score involvements, where he won possession in a stoppage under extreme heat and hit a target inside 50 that pretty much no one else in our team could hit is precisely why we need to find ways to push him up to stoppages or even have him off the back of stoppages ala Salem in 2021.

I think they're both developing well. Bowser has had some average moments this year, but he hasn't been alone there. Sure, that intercepted handball that led to a North behind early in the game was poor, but otherwise he was solid. 

I love both of these two guys, they both have pace, composure and are beautiful kicks at 21 and 20.

[Roger Mellie 3,668]

4 hours ago, Antioch said:

Who’s AMW?????

Clue: His initials are AMW

[DubDee 21,969]

29 minutes ago, Binmans PA said:

Bowey and McVee practically had identical games.

13 for Bowey at 62%, 4 intercept possessions, 4 score involvements, 3 rebound 50s, 9 pressure acts and 208m gained.

14 for Judd at 64%, 6 intercept possessions, 2 score involvements, 3 rebound 50s, 6 pressure acts and 209m gained.

The only difference is Bowey had 4 turnovers and Judd had 0, but still went at 64%.

I thought both were handy on the night. And one of Bowey's score involvements, where he won possession in a stoppage under extreme heat and hit a target inside 50 that pretty much no one else in our team could hit is precisely why we need to find ways to push him up to stoppages or even have him off the back of stoppages ala Salem in 2021.

I think they're both developing well. Bowser has had some average moments this year, but he hasn't been alone there. Sure, that intercepted handball that led to a North behind early in the game was poor, but otherwise he was solid. 

I love both of these two guys, they both have pace, composure and are beautiful kicks at 21 and 20.

I love them both too but 4 turnovers turns a good game into a poor game and usually leads to 4 scoring shots

[whatwhat say what 20,399]

1 minute ago, DubDee said:

I love them both too but 4 turnovers turns a good game into a poor game and usually leads to 4 scoring shots

our #1 way to be scored against is on turnover, i believe?

having a half-back turning it over nearly a third of all possessions ain't a great ratio

[TeamPlayedFine39 8,213]

1 hour ago, Roger Mellie said:

I'll have a crack at this. I pretty much said exactly the same thing last year. He seems to have all the tools but doesn't impose himself on the game. I don't know if he's too worried about his opponent, still finding his feet, isn't a great reader of the play or lacks confidence, but he just tries to play his role and not much more. For instance, you'd never know he had the wheels he displayed in the grand final sprint because you never see it. If he backed himself and took the game on, you'd probably see a different player. He's more prominent when Tommo's not there but there's not a whole lot of presence yet. I'd love to see him flourish.

Thanks for this.  I agree with the original poster; we hear so little about Adam’s that I often have to check the injury list.

Does he at least stop his opponent?  Always a place in the squad for a lock down key defender.

 

[The Taciturn Demon 75]

15 hours ago, DeeSpencer said:

Transition defending/work rate/positioning and at times ball use.

He gets caught in between the lines defending at times.

Thanks so much! Love this kind of insight. 

[Demon Dynasty 16,368]

1 hour ago, Roger Mellie said:

Bowey needs to be able to tackle effectively before setting foot in the middle

He is too small / leightweight and easily pushed off the ball to play mid.  Crazy suggestion.

McVee is plausible but regardless, most can't just up and change roles over night.  They'd need a serious training block or a full pre-season in that specific role to know their role properly before they're switched.

Bowey even comfirmed that last season when i asked him what his chances were of playing any HF minutes.

Edited June 23 by Demon Dynasty

[DistrACTION Jackson 6,895]

5 minutes ago, TeamPlayedFine39 said:

Thanks for this.  I agree with the original poster; we hear so little about Adam’s that I often have to check the injury list.

Does he at least stop his opponent?  Always a place in the squad for a lock down key defender.

 

I thought Adams was ok yesterday. He doesn't get much of the ball as he is playing as the full back in more of a shutdown role.

He does have a great left peg though and hit a beautiful 60m pass yesterday that I was impressed with.

He needs more development and probably needs to get more confidence in his body as he builds this up, but there is a bit to work with I think.

He is also now having to be the general down there with Tomlinson out and there is no one else in the backline over 190cm at the moment I don't think.

[Tarax Club 3,354]

18 minutes ago, DistrACTION Jackson said:

I thought Adams was ok yesterday. He doesn't get much of the ball as he is playing as the full back in more of a shutdown role.

He does have a great left peg though and hit a beautiful 60m pass yesterday that I was impressed with.

He needs more development and probably needs to get more confidence in his body as he builds this up, but there is a bit to work with I think.

Agree with most of that, although he did have a young local, Valentine as a companion tall defender. In the corresponding game last year (wildcard final). His North opponent did get hold of him and observed his frustration/dejection. 

This season he appears to be progressing in an understated way. He hasn’t to my re-collection been beaten too often, importantly keeps his feet and stays in the play. North have a a number of tall forwards,  their influence in the second half of yesterday’s match was lessened. As Casey’s overall team performance improved. Young Adams was a contributor too, noticeably intercepting or standing tall with a couple of big pack marks. 

 

[Demonland 66,956]

[roy11 3,152]

I tune into Casey games every so often so not fully aware of all the depth in the other teams. But its interesting to me that Carlton. Collingwood, Essendon are also low on the ladder despite doing well in the AFL. I know collingwood have had some injuries, but what does that say (if anything) about the depth of Carlton and Essendon?

[DiscoStu17 258]

18 hours ago, Tarax Club said:

Verrall showing a bit more presence that quarter.

Yes. Much better in the 2nd half. 
Could be because, by my reckoning, he was only onfield for 30% of the first half!

Then they took him off for the first 10min of the last quarter?? 
Took some good marks and gathered the ground ball well. Nice handball to White, who dropped it! 🤔Needs to make better decisions about who to give it to?

[Demonsone 1,740]

2 hours ago, D Rev said:

We got these guys with the space in the list and salary cap that we had.  They were always going to be top ups, which is fair enough for a team that has finished top 4 for three years in a row.  They haven't worked out due to extra pressure created by a raft of reasons including; general injuries, Angus retiring & Clarrie self destructing.

Id be happier to criticise the lack of improvement from the rest of the playing group, particularly around kicking and forward structure, than to criticise the recruiters.  There's also a good reason to question why the Perry "experiment" has continued.

Agree somewhat but top ups should be improving and didn’t address the first straight exits in 2 seasons, why let Jordan go we knew what we had vs Billings & Brayshaw was always a danger of retiring our fwd issues not addressed, yet playing JVR ruck instead of sitting at FF ti develop, were not winning clearances so use Petty etc 

[Roger Mellie 3,668]

1 hour ago, TeamPlayedFine39 said:

Thanks for this.  I agree with the original poster; we hear so little about Adam’s that I often have to check the injury list.

Does he at least stop his opponent?  Always a place in the squad for a lock down key defender.

 

Let me qualify - I only watch the games on the AFL website and the vision is pretty limited (ie. ordinary) as the camera just follows the footy around. It's hard to get a sense of anything up or downfield. I will leave that observation to tracksiders other than, in a team defence set-up, I don't see it that much, but he has a strong frame and is a good mark. Like Jeffo, he's a developing tall in his second year.

[Demonstone 20,033]

22 minutes ago, Demonsone said:

why let Jordan go

Why do you persist with this myth that we "let him go"?

You know very well that we tried to keep him but he chose to exercise his free agency rights.

I can only conclude that you are very obtuse or that you are a troll.

[Nascent 7,759]

It was interesting that Kynan didn't play for Casey after 16 minutes game time for the seniors, while Stephens played a full game after 43 minutes. Different ages obviously and recovery program likely a factor. Linking in with that factor is it's only a 5 day break from Casey's game to the seniors playing on Friday. Perhaps an indication he will hold his spot?

[seventyfour 535]

5 hours ago, Roger Mellie said:

I'll have a crack at this. I pretty much said exactly the same thing last year. He seems to have all the tools but doesn't impose himself on the game. I don't know if he's too worried about his opponent, still finding his feet, isn't a great reader of the play or lacks confidence, but he just tries to play his role and not much more. For instance, you'd never know he had the wheels he displayed in the grand final sprint because you never see it. If he backed himself and took the game on, you'd probably see a different player. He's more prominent when Tommo's not there but there's not a whole lot of presence yet. I'd love to see him flourish.

Thanks for this, appreciate the input. Reminds me of another defender when he debuted for us in 2018... Petty. 

[D Rev 405]

2 hours ago, Demonsone said:

Agree somewhat but top ups should be improving and didn’t address the first straight exits in 2 seasons, why let Jordan go we knew what we had vs Billings & Brayshaw was always a danger of retiring our fwd issues not addressed, yet playing JVR ruck instead of sitting at FF ti develop, were not winning clearances so use Petty etc 

I'm not 100% against JVR playing in the ruck, not too much, but it is necessary in the modern game to have talls that can pinch hit there.  Luckily for us, he's pretty good at it.  Unluckily for us, there doesn't seem to be anyone else that can do it.

The question around Petty's form is a good one.  He had a limited pre season but the drop off here has been stark.

As for letting Jordan go, he didn't have a great 2023 and we don't have any insights as to what Sydney offered him - aside from guaranteed match time - so its hard to criticise the club for that.

 

[Willmoy1947 3,855]

2 hours ago, Demonstone said:

Why do you persist with this myth that we "let him go"?

You know very well that we tried to keep him but he chose to exercise his free agency rights.

I can only conclude that you are very obtuse or that you are a troll.

Yeh, cut it out Demonsone.

[Diamond_Jim 12,103]

17 hours ago, Demon Dynasty said:

Me neither.  If he can't get a look in ahead of Bowey coming back from such a long lay off and mostly struggling since returning, then why is he being constantly groomed as a rebounding HB?

Never gets a call up so what's the point of this.

Play him as a small crumbing / pressure forward for just a few matches and see what he can bring.  Casey's done and dusted for this season anyways.  What's to lose.

If it doesn't work who cares.  Send him down back again.

if it does work and he starts firing, who knows.  You might be able to bring him in for a struggling Chandler up forward and find someone who can hit the scoreboard a little more often plus bring similar pressure i50 to Chin.  Or better.

I'd be training him in both roles. Same with Woewodin and Brown but differing roles. Their role in this season and the next is as depth. To be a good depth player you need a few arrows in the quiver. Perhaps training as a tagger or teaching players how to break even with a tagger.

On Jefferson if we dare I'd play him against the Eagles, put Petty down back and rest May. Unfortunately the Eagles game may well be the last chance saloon for the AFL side if we lose to Brisbane this weekend.

[adonski 9,471]

Eagles are a tough ask for a debut aa a key forward against a McGovern/Barass defence

I'd give Jeffo a crack R21 against the Dogs when he may get an O'Donnell, Khamis style of match up

[Diamond_Jim 12,103]

3 hours ago, roy11 said:

I tune into Casey games every so often so not fully aware of all the depth in the other teams. But its interesting to me that Carlton. Collingwood, Essendon are also low on the ladder despite doing well in the AFL. I know collingwood have had some injuries, but what does that say (if anything) about the depth of Carlton and Essendon?

A lot of Casey's success pre 2023 was due to a core group of Casey listed players who provided a solid base for the AFL players. Most of them have now left.

I suspect that is the case with a few AFL affiliated teams. Would you like to play football where your main task is to make AFL youngsters look good and be liable to being dropped purely based on the number of uninjured AFL players. And then there's the problem of rarely training as a team and being paid one tenth of some of your less well performing team mates.

Strange competition... the VFL

[Demonland 66,956]

WILDCARDS by KC from Casey

Casey’s season continued to drift into helplessness on Sunday when they lost another home game by a narrow margin, this time six points, in their Round 13 clash with North Melbourne’s VFL combination.

The game was in stunning contrast to their last meeting at the same venue when Casey won the VFL Wildcard Match by 101 points. Back then, their standout players were Brodie Grundy and James Jordon who are starring in the AFL with ladder leaders, the Sydney Swans (it turned out to be their last game in the red and blue). Tom McDonald was in fine fettle as was Jimmy Munro who was closing in on retirement.

When the tables were turned on Sunday, there were very few constants for the Casey Demons. One was Mitch White, still the skipper, the workhorse with 27 disposals and a well-earned goal: the man who pushed himself to his fullest capacity but who sadly missed his partner-in-crime Munro. The other was former NGA draftee Andy Moniz-Wakefield  who kicked four goals in that game but has since been moved down back with the odd run through the middle where he has been dominating but mysteriously, he rarely gets a mention for AFL honours. He did it again this time with his 35 disposals, four marks and three tackles, giving the team every opportunity to score a win. His time must come soon.

One improver from that final is forward Matt Jefferson, a youngster whose body was tiring at the end of a long season and who managed a few behinds in the Wildcard Match. This time around, he slotted through four goals, showed up more around the ground and took eight marks. I wouldn’t rush him into the fray at AFL just yet but he’s pushing forward with every week. Will Verrall is much in the same category but also very much a work in progress as an aspiring ruckman. He finished this game concussed. Watch out for both in 2025 with extra weight and another preseason under their belts.

North Melbourne had only six AFL listers on that fateful day last year but this time around, the Kangaroos were far better prepared. Apart from the fact that they had greater AFL representation, they were far more rounded on Sunday. And they had two of the first four 2023 AFL draft selections in their ranks and a couple more first rounders to boot. Along with a handy Deakyn Smith who was at Casey last year.

The game was close in the first half with the lead changing hands but the Kangaroos gained the momentum in the third term. Casey made a few serious lunges in the final quarter but North was able to hold on strongly and deserved the victory. One of their aces was Dylan Stephens who was subbed on late in the third term at the MCG on Saturday night and picked up 14 possessions in his team’s late revival. He returned to play VFL on Sunday, collected 24 touches and played a key role in ensuring that his team would prevail and prevent a Casey victory.

With Melbourne in the running for an AFL finals berth, its substitute was not considered for a similar role at Casey Fields even though he had minimal time on the ground on Saturday night. Kynan Brown must be a certainty to play in Brisbane this week. We can also expect Melbourne will bring a couple of carry over players up north with them so who knows whether the VFL side will be a fullest possible when the team takes on the stand alone Northern Bullants at Genis Street Oval, Preston on Saturday afternoon? 

It probably doesn’t matter because the finals are now out of reach, as are the Wildcard Matches.

CASEY DEMONS 2.5.17 5.8.38 8.8.56 11.11.77

NORTH MELBOURNE VFL 3.5.23 8.6.54 10.10.70 12.11.83

GOALS 

CASEY DEMONS Jefferson 4 Fullarton Kentfield King Laurie McAdam Szybkowski White

NORTH MELBOURNE VFL Hansen Jr 4 Maley Sellers 2 Free Hardeman Harvey Payne 

BEST

MELBOURNE White Moniz-Wakefield Edwards Jefferson Billings Laurie

NORTH MELBOURNE VFL Lazzaro Stephenson McKercher Hardeman Stephens Hansen Jr

Statistics

Jed Adams 5 kicks 5 disposals 2 marks 1 tackle 21 dream team points
Jack Billings 13 kicks 8 handballs 21 disposals 3 marks 1 tackle 69 dream team points
Tyler Edwards 13 kicks 6 handballs 19 disposals 3 marks 5 tackles 82 dream team points
Tom Freeman 11 kicks 3 handballs 14 disposals 5 marks 2 tackles 65 dream team points
Tom Fullarton 1 goal 1 behind 5 kicks 6 handballs 11 disposals 3 marks 8 hitouts 48 dream team points
Max Gregory 7 kicks 3 handballs 10 disposals 5 marks 3 tackles 55 dream team points
Matt Jefferson 4 goals 9 kicks 1 handball 10 disposals 8 marks 1 tackle 81 dream team points
Luker Kentfield 1 goal 2 kicks 1 handballs 3 disposals 1 mark 1 tackles 21 dream team points
Eddie King 1 goal 3 kicks 3 handballs 6 disposals 2 marks 1 tackle 31 dream team points
Bailey Laurie 1 goal 11 kicks 8 handballs 19 disposals 2 marks 5 tackles 67 dream team points
Shane McAdam 1 goal 1 behind 4 kicks 4 handballs 8 disposals 2 marks 2 tackles 35 dream team points
Andy Moniz-Wakefield 1 behind 22 kicks 13 handballs 35 disposals 4 marks 3 tackles 115 dream team points
Ned Moodie 3 kicks 6 handballs 9 disposals 2 tackles 31 dream team points
Charlie Peters 5 kicks 7 handballs 12 disposals 1 mark 3 tackles 38 dream team points
Josh Schache 1 behind 3 kicks 1 handballs 4 disposals 1 mark 1 tackle 20 dream team points
Ollie Sestan 1 kick 5 handballs 6 disposals 4 tackles 29 dream team points
Roan Steele 9 kicks 3 handballs 12 disposals 5 marks 4 tackles 61 dream team points
Mitch Szybkowski 1 goal 4 kicks 10 handballs 14 disposals 2 marks 2 tackles 53 dream team points
Ryan Valentine 4 kicks 1 handball 5 disposals 2 marks 17 dream team points
Will Verrall 7 kicks 6 handballs 13 disposals 3 marks 16 hitouts 49 dream team points
Mitch White 1 goal 2 behinds 19 kicks 8 handballs 27 disposals 4 marks 9 tackles 131 dream team points
Kai Windsor 1 behind 3 kicks 4 handballs 7 disposals 3 marks 27 dream team points
Taj Woewodin 2 kicks 5 handballs 7 disposals 1 mark 2 tackles 22 dream team points

[whatwhat say what 20,399]

1 hour ago, Demonland said:

Jack Billings 13 kicks 8 handballs 21 disposals 3 marks 1 tackle 39 dream team points

not sure that fantasy total is correct; vfl.com.au has it as 71

in fact, a lot of those fantasy / dream team totals don't correlate with official match stats: https://www.afl.com.au/vfl/matches/6475#player-stats

Edited June 24 by whatwhat say what

[poita 3,755]

Six MFC listed players with 8 touches or less. No wonder half our senior team is undroppable with so little pressure for spots.