Trade Targets

[DistrACTION Jackson 8,302]

8 minutes ago, dazzledavey36 said:

Great pick up DL!

The way you've outlined it all seems to be pointing to us who have nominated both for the state combine. 

Also worth noting that Riak is currently in the Casey Demons development squad so clearly we've had a fair bit to do with putting some development around him it seems.

No doubt we would be keeping in touch with Mac and saying wouldn't you love to come play with your brother...

[roy11 3,807]

17 minutes ago, SPC said:

Waterman keen on the Hawks. We appear heading into a period, where we can only attract talent with paying overs and giving long contracts.

Even after our flag, no one wanted to come to us, now we are on the nose.. it’s going to be real hard

We've gone back in time!

[MrFreeze 1,931]

11 minutes ago, SthSea22 said:

Hawthorn seems to be getting attraction once again as a destination FC

Barrass is a massive upgrade to Frost imo

 

They might use Sicily forward if they can recruit Barass, especially if Battle also joins. Lever/May style recruitment, bit scary for the rest of the comp. Love their smaller running backline this year though, great to watch. 

[Adam The God 29,856]

1 hour ago, Jibroni said:

 

2018 feels like an era ago and we are now only a shadow of the 2021 team.  Our performances overall been average this year and even at a 5-2 there was no conviction with the method played.

With May and Gawn 33 next year, Petracca and Lever 29, Oliver 28 (I have no idea what Clarry will bring next year) do you believe we should go all chips in? Or concede the run is over and rebuild as we literally have no depth to compete with the Swans, Dockers or Giants anytime soon.

Ruckmen can play longer than bang and crash mids. As long as Max's knees hold up, he could play for another 2-3 years at an elite level. And then you replace him with a competitor, and you tweak your method to accommodate not having Max's aerial strength and stoppage strength.

As for May, I think he probably has 1-2 years left at an elite level. Lake played until 33, Frawley until 33 as well. But we have good cover for May in Petty. I'm no longer worried about the key position spots in the back half.

28-29 is the peak powers of most players, so having stars in that age bracket is important for a flag push in Lever, Trac and Clarry.

I think talk of our depth woes is overstated. We've shown this year that our youngsters are very capable at the AFL level, which means some of the older fringe guys will have to make way for the next generation at the end of this year and next (Tomlinson, Hunter, Schache, BB and Melksham), and replenish underneath them.

Over the next 24 months we'll get at least two F/Ss to get a look at and a highly fancied NGA next year that will fill list needs (forward/ruck and key position tall).

I believe we can continue to replenish on the fly. The obvious list gap is the age demographic of 25-27, but this cohort is either now in free agency or approaching free agency, which means we're a chance to shift the age profile of the list a bit further with some clever recruiting. Isaac Cumming for example is 26 and fits that profile. If we could land him and maybe one or two others in that demo, we spread the list profile a bit. Houston is 27 too.

But at this stage we should be thinking about two elite ends of the list profile. Obviously, the elite talent is stacked in the 28-32 age range (May, Max, Lever, Clarry, Trac, Viney, Langdon, Salem and Fritta will be 28 in December). That's 9, plus we had Gus in that age bracket too. And TMac and ANB are also in that group, although I'd argue they're highly reliable role players with flaws, who occasionally play elite games. So that's 11 in that older group, now that Gus has retired.

The other group is obviously in the 19-24 group that isn't necessarily elite yet, but has the potential to be and contains Windsor, McVee, JVR, Petty, Kozzy, Rivers, Bowey. That's 7. So I'd be targeting players in that age demographic in 2025-2026 to start to hand over more responsibility to that generation. Think adding someone like Finn Callaghan (21) and/or a player like Bailey Humphrey (19), or Zak Butters (about to turn 24, who held off signing at Port until he knew whether Ken was staying).

I guess what I'm arguing is we can keep our list build going and compete at a high level IMV. But I agree that we need to look at game style and not be afraid to trade out someone from that older elite group.

And if we do trade someone, instead of directly replenishing through the draft, try and flip whatever we get for a player and convert it into a player in that younger age demographic,  or in that list hole demographic of 25-27. 

Edited August 13 by Binmans PA

[Fat Tony 5,203]

11 hours ago, dazzledavey36 said:

Just on Will Brodie, I do know for a fact he was a number of players we had enquired at the end of the 2021 season regarding midfield depth.

This was around the time we were also chasing Dunstan.

He didn't want to come across as depth especially at a club that was pretty stacked on midfield talent that had just won a flag. Pretty hard one to sell.

I only know this from him being an ex bushie boy from up this way.

Could it be more enticing now? I'd certainly ask the question. He was an absolute star at junior level and was rated at one stage a top number 1 draft prospect.

I think Brodie is too slow. The game has gone past inside midfielders without the ability to accelerate our of the stoppages.

[poita 3,889]

46 minutes ago, SthSea22 said:

Hawthorn seems to be getting attraction once again as a destination FC 

 

Not surprising. They are a big, well resourced club, playing a great style of football and have a coach that is currently getting the best out of his players. 

Contrast that to our horrible game plan and a list that has seen most players regress since 2021.

[Demons11 6,863]

1 hour ago, SPC said:

Waterman keen on the Hawks. We appear heading into a period, where we can only attract talent with paying overs and giving long contracts.

Even after our flag, no one wanted to come to us, now we are on the nose.. it’s going to be real hard

Waterman was pretty clear in an interview on the weekend that he won’t be leaving WC

[Demons11 6,863]

12 hours ago, Binmans PA said:

Wouldn't mind Macrae and Brodie.

Particularly, if our midfield is a little bit younger next year.

You need those older bodies and heads over the course of a long season.

They are soooooo slow and won’t help us 

[SthSea22 600]

55 minutes ago, MrFreeze said:

They might use Sicily forward if they can recruit Barass, especially if Battle also joins. Lever/May style recruitment, bit scary for the rest of the comp. Love their smaller running backline this year though, great to watch. 

They would still have him forward imo

[58er 6,254]

50 minutes ago, Binmans PA said:

Ruckmen can play longer than bang and crash mids. As long as Max's knees hold up, he could play for another 2-3 years at an elite level. And then you replace him with a competitor, and you tweak your method to accommodate not having Max's aerial strength and stoppage strength.

As for May, I think he probably has 1-2 years left at an elite level. Lake played until 33, Frawley until 33 as well. But we have good cover for May in Petty. I'm no longer worried about the key position spots in the back half.

28-29 is the peak powers of most players, so having stars in that age bracket is important for a flag push in Lever, Trac and Clarry.

I think talk of our depth woes is overstated. We've shown this year that our youngsters are very capable at the AFL level, which means some of the older fringe guys will have to make way for the next generation at the end of this year and next (Tomlinson, Hunter, Schache, BB and Melksham), and replenish underneath them.

Over the next 24 months we'll get at least two F/Ss to get a look at and a highly fancied NGA next year that will fill list needs (forward/ruck and key position tall).

I believe we can continue to replenish on the fly. The obvious list gap is the age demographic of 25-27, but this cohort is either now in free agency or approaching free agency, which means we're a chance to shift the age profile of the list a bit further with some clever recruiting. Isaac Cumming for example is 26 and fits that profile. If we could land him and maybe one or two others in that demo, we spread the list profile a bit. Houston is 27 too.

But at this stage we should be thinking about two elite ends of the list profile. Obviously, the elite talent is stacked in the 28-32 age range (May, Max, Lever, Clarry, Trac, Viney, Langdon, Salem and Fritta will be 28 in December). That's 9, plus we had Gus in that age bracket too. And TMac and ANB are also in that group, although I'd argue they're highly reliable role players with flaws, who occasionally play elite games. So that's 11 in that older group, now that Gus has retired.

The other group is obviously in the 19-24 group that isn't necessarily elite yet, but has the potential to be and contains Windsor, McVee, JVR, Petty, Kozzy, Rivers, Bowey. That's 7. So I'd be targeting players in that age demographic in 2025-2026 to start to hand over more responsibility to that generation. Think adding someone like Finn Callaghan (21) and/or a player like Bailey Humphrey (19), or Zak Butters (about to turn 24, who held off signing at Port until he knew whether Ken was staying).

I guess what I'm arguing is we can keep our list build going and compete at a high level IMV. But I agree that we need to look at game style and not be afraid to trade out someone from that older elite group.

And if we do trade someone, instead of directly replenishing through the draft, try and flip whatever we get for a player and convert it into a player in that younger age demographic,  or in that list hole demographic of 25-27. 

Turner  Jefferson  makes. 9 !!

Do you  think gaining players is like picking apples from a tree? Really so much like a buffet?  
 

 

[SPC 3,514]

30 minutes ago, Demons11 said:

Waterman was pretty clear in an interview on the weekend that he won’t be leaving WC

I just saw it as a headline on the Today Show this morning 

[Adam The God 29,856]

2 minutes ago, 58er said:

Turner  Jefferson  makes. 9 !!

Do you  think gaining players is like picking apples from a tree? Really so much like a buffet?  

I think Turner has shown he could be a good forward at AFL level.

Jefferson has not shown that yet, because he hasn't played at the level.

Let's hope we can add both to the list in 2 years time.

As for picking apples from trees, that's probably not quite apt for list management, but it's not a mile off.

[DistrACTION Jackson 8,302]

13 minutes ago, SPC said:

I just saw it as a headline on the Today Show this morning 

Cashing in on the hawks revival. They know their supporters would be reading every article

[spirit of norm smith 15,898]

@dazzledavey36 agree with Finn Callaghan. He’s a star.  Wait and then throw the whole piggy back at him !!  

Ps. Make sure we don’t mention anything about Casey training facilities.  

[Nascent 8,971]

Wonder if Sam Berry would be worthy of consideration? Tacking machine that's been in and out of the Crows team a bit this year. Out of contract and Vic lad. Won't be a star but could really add to our midfield depth and shouldn't cost much.

Edited August 13 by Nascent

[dazzledavey36 53,880]

12 minutes ago, Nascent said:

Wonder if Sam Berry would be worthy of consideration? Tacking machine that's been in and out of the Crows team a bit this year. Out of contract and Vic lad. Won't be a star but could really add to our midfield depth and shouldn't cost much.

Ia he no different to Sparrow..?

[Nascent 8,971]

1 minute ago, dazzledavey36 said:

Ia he no different to Sparrow..?

Couldn't really tell you to be honest. I remember being impressed with him 2 years ago with his contested footy. Was injured for most of 2023. Havent watched much of Adelaide this year, maybe some SA dees/footy watchers could enlighten us about his deficiencies? 

[Beetle 4,577]

On 12/08/2024 at 10:04, SthSea22 said:

Do we try and lure Tom Lynch for 2 seasons?

They tried last year and got knocked back. 

[Ted Lasso 19,097]

Thoughts on Liam Ryan? if he was open to the a move to the Dees he would add some X factor on the ground and in the air to our forward line, and potentially without a huge amount being required trade wise.

[DeeSpencer 25,259]

1 hour ago, dazzledavey36 said:

Ia he no different to Sparrow..?

Marginally better inside ball winner but without the 2 way running and explosive burst Sparrow has. More of a pure inside mid. But we’d be in trouble if he was more than depth and I hope we don’t need to burn list spots on one dimensional depth players.

[DeeSpencer 25,259]

35 minutes ago, Ted Lasso said:

Thoughts on Liam Ryan? if he was open to the a move to the Dees he would add some X factor on the ground and in the air to our forward line, and potentially without a huge amount being required trade wise.

A luxury addition at a time we’re trying to restock our meat and potatoes players and culture. 

[Moonshadow 17,672]

7 hours ago, SPC said:

Waterman keen on the Hawks. We appear heading into a period, where we can only attract talent with paying overs and giving long contracts.

Even after our flag, no one wanted to come to us, now we are on the nose.. it’s going to be real hard

Despite not working out, Grundy was a massive pick up

[spirit of norm smith 15,898]

Surely it’s Will Brodie for a future 5th round pick.  Freo owe us a favour !!! 

[FreedFromDesire 884]

I'm a little torn this year on trade targets and free agents, so I'm not sure this will make complete sense but hopefully you lot understand what I'm trying to get across.

We need depth. But we need high quality depth. I can understand we haven't had a lot to work with since the premiership in terms of trade currency - And last year we clearly needed to add some top end draft talent which we did - But 'bargains hunting' with Hunter, Billings, Schache, Dunstan and even perhaps Grundy; has not worked out for us at all. It was worth a shot. The players we likely would have drafted with the picks we gave up for them would have had a lower chance of impacting, but the quality of our depth is now an issue.

Given the number of players likely to leave (for differing reason) we're probably looking at needing a minimum of 6 and perhaps up to 8 or so to replenish our list. We have to use a minimum of 3 draft picks, but I think we can still use them to upgrade rookies? I'm not 100% sure on that but I'm sure someone will know. For the sake of a hypothetical, let's say we need 4 players to come in via trade and free agency.

My list, which I don't think is too controversial, of gettable options, including the existing rumours would be:

Houston. Edwards. Cumming. Lobb (I know, I know).

Houston and Cumming (and Lobb) go a long way towards improving our ball movement by foot, and also release Rivers to be a permanent mid, with the options then opening up for Salem, McVee, Bowey and Howes to be tried in other roles. Improving our kicking is the far better option for improving our speed than actual leg speed. This would also hopefully allow Goodwin and co to bring in a more attacking game style.

Edwards and Lobb allow us to persist with Turner and Petty forward, and Edwards especially relieves the stress of May getting closer to the end. Lobb also gives us a break glass option for ruck backup. I know he's not a fashionable choice, but his form down back has been a revelation.

I believe we can look to Brisbane and Fremantle (for different reasons) for our options in obtaining the picks required to make all this happen. Cumming is a free agent of course. I think we could get those deals done and still be left with 2 good quality draftees and perhaps a rookie upgrade to make up the 3 pick requirement. 

Edited August 13 by FreedFromDesire

[Demons11 6,863]

3 hours ago, dazzledavey36 said:

Ia he no different to Sparrow..?

Sparrow doesn’t tackle