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5 hours ago, Demon17 said:

Iv'e forgotten why Woey lost his spot. Did somene come back in.  I thought he performed well for one so young and deserves a shot at finals experience.

Not in the midfield . JJ to replace Gus, but small forward type role perhaps.

Thoughts

He gets lost in the zone and press. He'll be a handy player, but not this year IMO.

Now watch him get selected this week. 😄

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50 minutes ago, Engorged Onion said:

I disagree whole heatedly 😁, its a method that has meant we have been in the top 4 for effectively 3 seasons...

Disappointing when it doesn't come off.. sure... the method is not the problem, our inaccuracy on the night was.

If you were to sit Fritsch, JVR, Kossie, BBB, Chandler or any forward worth their salt down in a dark room with a tap dripping in the background some truth serum, shine a light in their eyes and ask them if they prefer the ball coming in slow into a mass of bodies I am tipping they will say no. We don’t get clean looks in good areas often enough to get value for our forward entry. It absolutely is the method. I don’t want to be the ungrateful kid on Christmas morning I am glad that we are playing finals compared to where we have been for most of my life. I am happy but not content, I want more. Our forward line and connection has been an issue for far too long. We should be better than we are, we are not. We don’t play to our forwards strengths it absolutely is the method. I hope I am wrong but I don’t think we can win a premiership playing the way we currently play. Not enough emphasis on offence for mine. Footy is a pretty simple game, if you score more than the opposition you win. I don’t think we give ourselves the best chance to kick a winning score. 

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1 hour ago, Brownie said:

It's both the method and the misses. It is a combination of both.

We should have finished top of the ladder if our forward entries and structure were better and our accuracy in pressure games wasn't so bad.

I reckon it's both.

This. Exactly this ⬆️

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+32 inside 50s should= at least an 8 goal win, shouldn't it?. image if we'd beaten the pies by 8 goals. Such a big opportunity lost. I'm still 😡. Anyway..., We have lost 1 game in dry conditions this season. (against freo)  The forecast say dry....Dee's by 24

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33 minutes ago, Jack Vineys Anger Manager said:

+32 inside 50s should= at least an 8 goal win, shouldn't it?. image if we'd beaten the pies by 8 goals. Such a big opportunity lost. I'm still 😡. Anyway..., We have lost 1 game in dry conditions this season. (against freo)  The forecast say dry....Dee's by 24

It drizzled that day

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How crocked is our forward line? Despite the drama through the year personnel-wise it’s actually not that bad. 

Our Rd1 forward line as named: Chandler, TMac, Spargo, Koz, BBB, ANB. Grundy on the bench, Fritsch out injured.

Rd2: Spargo, TMac, Chandler, ANB, BBB, Trac. Grundy and Fritsch on the Bench. Koz suspended.

Rd3: Bowey (?), JVR (debut), Trac, Chandler, BBB, ANB. Gawn our injured so Grundy in the ruck, Fritsch and Spargo on the bench. TMac was dropped, back the next week for BBB who got injured.

Why am I wasting your time with this? Well if you look at the teams selected when we had a full list the key one missing last week was BBB. All others are available (noting that TMac and Fritsch are only just back of big layoffs). Yes Petty has come and gone, as has Melksham but aside from Brown we have our first choice forward line available for selection.

So if we aren’t that injured what’s the problem? It really is connection (as Goody has been saying for 2 years and seemingly unable to permanently fix).

BBB when fit gives us what we’re missing which is a forward who knows how to lead and create space. TMac also leads up as goes JVR, but they’re not as persistent at it as Brown. It’s also hard to be persistent at it when your leads get ignored in favour of bombing to the hot spot. 

The mids need to move the ball quickly, we seem to wait at half forward for the perfect target while defenders clog up space and our forwards stand around at the top of the square. 

Yes we get a lot of repeat entries with the theory being that builds pressure but against good teams junk entries aren’t worth anything. 69 entries for 7 goals is a lot of junk entries. 

The forwards also need to move and get out of each others way, work to create space for teammates and accept you’re not going to be on the end of every pass. Watching Brisbane last night you hardly ever saw Daniher and Hipwood on screen at the same time, when one was close to goal the other was up the field. Cameron one out in the square, have we ever seen Koz or Fritsch or any forward one on one in the square this year?

It’s not rocket science and it doesn’t require players we don’t have, it requires working for each other instead of for themselves and it requires the mids to take risks and move quickly. 

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2 hours ago, Binmans PA said:

He gets lost in the zone and press. He'll be a handy player, but not this year IMO.

Now watch him get selected this week. 😄

Maybe so but his ball use seperated him from our current average wingers/ half forwards. 

When the heat was on against Brisbane in a finals like game, he nailed a running shot from 40. I'm not seeing many others capable of this at the moment. 

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2 minutes ago, Dannyz said:

Maybe so but his ball use seperated him from our current average wingers/ half forwards. 

When the heat was on against Brisbane in a finals like game, he nailed a running shot from 40. I'm not seeing many others capable of this at the moment. 

In that same game, IMV he cost us at least one goal and the way they transitioned that night from front to back when he was a half forward was alarming. It's not just on him, but you do only need one weak link in the chain.

He needs to get fitter and understand his positioning better.

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2 hours ago, Gorgoroth said:

I’d love to see Rivers replace Gus in the middle. Full time midfield. 

We then lose a major bounce from half back.

Unless, of course, we shift Salem into the Rivers intercept role and lose some speed, but keep the ball use and decision-making in Salem, plus get him into the game.

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These tribunal appeals are a joke both JVR and Martin got what they deserved. JVR clearly ran past the ball and made a hit and Martin cheap punched a player in the head. Despite this both clubs are considering appeals. If a club appeals and fails they should double the penalty. Embarrassing if Dees appeal this they would be better getting JVR to understand how he has let down his teammates.

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14 hours ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

That's an extremely simplistic view of things. People who were confident we would beat the Pies were proven to have every right to be confident considering the key stats not least of which being inside 50s and expected score. You're acting as though we could never have won on Thursday without a genuine kpf when clearly we could have.

I not sure why everyone fails to understand the simply facts of winning and losing. If you dont score more than the opposition you lose. You might have actually played better but they did not put a winning score on the board

I always thought we would struggle with Tmac and JVR as our key forwards. As I expected we got very little from Tmac and not much more from the Roo.

This week we don't even have JVR, to be honest I think The Bun with give us more as a ruckman than JVR and as much as a forward. I hope we put on a good effort but I don't expect us to win. Again No good KPF's IMO you need as an absolutely minority One KPF to be  playing well in finals games. Carlton have a good backline if our KPF's give us nothing we lose.

 

 

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3 hours ago, mauriesy said:

"Bombing" comes about because sides are too slow moving the ball in transition after a turnover. The opposition gets all their players back in the defensive half, and then when the ball carrier looks up (often under pressure) all they see is a congested forward line with no space to lead into. Port Adelaide had the same problem last night.

Move the ball faster and the forward line will open up more.

Yeah, First Crack isolated the stilted and stifling play off half back where we went sideways and didn’t reward blokes that got free in the middle - culprits were the backs and the wingers. 

This is not surprising and extremely disappointing that we seemingly didn’t use the last 6 weeks to learn new habits to win games at the risk of losing them.

And now we have enabled our own demise not looking to expose and be bold. We are tight and worried and that is not the definition of a flag winning team.

Can Goodwin release them? Is not this why you are on the bench like a soccer manager? 

Because one manager I know used to yell at his Celtic team to “pass it [censored] FORWARD!”

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8 minutes ago, Deesprate said:

These tribunal appeals are a joke both JVR and Martin got what they deserved. JVR clearly ran past the ball and made a hit and Martin cheap punched a player in the head. Despite this both clubs are considering appeals. If a club appeals and fails they should double the penalty. Embarrassing if Dees appeal this they would be better getting JVR to understand how he has let down his teammates.

I tend to agree but the dog eat dog attitude extends to off the field

All avenues to winning are taken up by all the clubs and whilst we could set a good example, the other clubs won't

Collingwood will fight tooth and nail to get their player off as we should expect them to

But the authorities, the AFL, the tribunal, the MRO and the rule makers need to do their job properly ... not pander to popular thinking or weaken under pressure

In other words, we need great governance

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3 minutes ago, Macca said:

I tend to agree but the dog eat dog attitude extends to off the field

All avenues to winning are taken up by all the clubs and whilst we could set a good example, the other clubs won't

Collingwood will fight tooth and nail to get their player off as we should expect them to

But the authorities, the AFL, the tribunal, the MRO and the rule makers need to do their job properly ... not pander to popular thinking or weaken under pressure

In other words, we need great governance

That will be difficult Macca it is the AFL we are talking about.

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2 minutes ago, old dee said:

That will be difficult Macca it is the AFL we are talking about.

Yep, you're right

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I don't get the talk about connection, it was the execution, and this becomes a feedback loop, you hit the early ones, the others go through easier. when they keep missing then everything becomes manic. I don't believe it is the system. I would have liked to see more use of the corridor though, thought First Crack was right about that, we went cautious. 

Also re Goodwin and coaching and forward line, Tmac fell off a cliff quicker than anticipated, BBB too, if we had Petty and Melk in the team I think we would have been just fine. We didn't have the best fwd line but we had enough of a forward line and we know it works, this is just one of those years we're we get unlucky with injuries, not the coach was blind to the forward line. If there was a spare FF going free for a price we could afford that was better than what we had in 22, I don't know about it. Grundy may not have worked, but it was worth a punt, Goodwin has the credits in the bank.

I also don't think a week off for JvR is the end of the world, he needs a reset, has some work to do for the prelim. Wasn't happy with his game at all.

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