PREGAME: Rd 22 vs Carlton

[PaulRB 6,101]

Love that we have an AA quality mid in Clarry, and AA quality ruck in Grundy coming into a midfield/clearance group that is already humming. 

We should be able to maintain the momentum for longer, and simply grind teams down with high quality intense contested footy for all four quarters.

Feels like we’re very well positioned as the season turns toward the final straight. 

Clarry to have a monster game…

[layzie 30,375]

Dunno guys, think we're up against it against the might of Carlton. They've been unbelievable and never lost a game according to the media. 

[buck_nekkid 5,633]

I also suspect BG went back to do a mini preseason.  Playing poorly at FF allowed him to rest.  Notice each week at Casey his time in the ruck increased?  He missed all of the 22 season. He will be stronger and faster for longer, cherry ripe for finals.

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,534]

13 hours ago, dees189227 said:

I'm more confident with Grundy in the ruck when max is off than van Rooyen. He can stay forward. 

I know max has been smashing it out of the ball park but maybe he can have more of a rest on the bench than forward and let Grundy ruck a bit more

Imagine if Goodwin continues to use van Rooyen as the second ruck and keeps Grundy as a KPF for the whole game. Just to confuse everyone's expectations and so he can say in his post-match media conference, "I told you so".

I don't expect this, of course, and it will be fascinating to see how van Rooyen goes when he can stay forward for the whole game.

[Dee*ceiving 1,249]

13 hours ago, DubDee said:

Hibbo stiff as

hopefully is in for finals

Hibbo being managed I reckon. Will be sub and assure the defense for the last qtr and a half. Where we'll likely be looking to protect a lead...

[Dee Zephyr 18,222]

MCG expecting 70,000 tomorrow night, let's get loud.

[binman 39,479]

5 minutes ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

I don't expect this, of course, and it will be fascinating to see how van Rooyen goes when he can stay forward for the whole game.

I think this is so important, particularly now that Petty is out. 

A huge part of pett's role was to create a contest and bring the ball to ground. 

But with his ability to find leading lanes, mark on the lead, contested marking skills and ability to take his chances, Petty looked a natural forward. 

Grundy doesn't bring the same natural forward skills, but i'm confident he can do the job creating contests and stopping oppo defenders marring the ball - and all the other donkey working up and down the ground, as well as giving Maxy a chop out in the ruck. Any goals he kicks are a bonus.

But that makes JVR even more important that he would have been with Petty in the team as he is the now the key pure tall forward.

And for him to thrive we don't want him spending all his petrol tickets working up and down the ground, rucking and getting smashed up on the half back in marking contests from the long ball from May.

We need maximum Van Ruin impact close to goals

[beelzebub 22,716]

14 hours ago, brendan said:

Grundy forward just needs to compete and he will be better than max at ground level, max to still ruck 80% Grundy rucks forward 50 so max can play a kick behind play, if game is won some point in last sub max out and Grundy can finish it off 

I would have thought this was the idea all along... obviously not...as here we are.

Quite possibly the idea of Grundy doing a mini apprenticeship was to become a bit more savvy with "positioning"..   now for mine Brodie is quite a good reader if the ball...that tends to be a strength of many rucks.  This is his "force".   He ought use it to either offer an alternative option..  so not crowd the pack and break from his direct opponent...or use that tie to draw that defender out.

Clever ball play doesn't actually mean YOU have the ball... it's about space ( suddenly mind flashed back over 50 years lol ...some might get it) ...  Clever ball play doesn't mean you're going for the ball ( directly ) 

Id like to see Brodie linger around the square.

You'd like to think Milky.. Roo and Grundy could provide quite interesting options.

Divide and conquer....keep out of each others way... and with Kozzie Chandler.. Nibbler and the like waiting to pounce we ought to have the better of them (Carlton )

Our defence just needs to spin repeat the last meeting with them.

I dont underestimate Carlton..   mor do i over rate them. They go better against teams that are well...  simply not us.

Dees by 5 goals

[ManDee 7,101]

11 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

......... it's about space ( suddenly mind flashed back over 50 years lol ...some might get it) .....

It's about time! 🙂

[old55 21,862]

14 hours ago, Demon Dynasty said:

Lordy no thanks 55.

We'd probably end up either well behind or so far behind, we'd be chasing tail for the most part or kissing the game Goodbye by half time.

Has to be Max for the first 3 quarters or so .....then Grundy, but only with the game well in hand imv.

Grundy spending significant time at CBs (aside from coming on as sub late) = handing the momentum / game to the oppo.

The diff between Max & Grundy is chalk and cheese.

Not sure what's changed that has lead Goody to back flip on the Grundy to VFL decision so soon. 

Yes Petty is out but Grundy hardly demanded a call up based on his two matches at Casey.  You have to ask what was the point of all the 'forward craft' learnings nonsense we heard from the FD here.   There was certainly no learnings that i witnessed.

I don't believe that it's correct that we lose momentum when Grundy is in the ruck. 

In R12 vs Carlton Max and Brodie each attended exactly 50% of CBs:

https://dailyfantasyrankings.com.au/resources/afl/cba.php

We didn't lose momentum at any time in this match:

https://www.afl.com.au/afl/matches/4884#timeline

In fact from R6 - R13 inclusive when Max and Brodie shared the ruck almost exactly 50:50 we went 6-2.

I challenge you to produce evidence that we lose momentum when Grundy rucks.

Edited August 11, 2023 by old55

[DubDee 21,930]

I personally don't think Gawn and Grundy work well as a ruck/fwd combo.  Gawn is far too good to not be dominating in the middle and neither plays well fwd.

Fair enough to give it another go but Grundy will have impact up fwd to stay in the side and he has not done that to date

[beelzebub 22,716]

2 hours ago, buck_nekkid said:

I also suspect BG went back to do a mini preseason.  Playing poorly at FF allowed him to rest.  Notice each week at Casey his time in the ruck increased?  He missed all of the 22 season. He will be stronger and faster for longer, cherry ripe for finals.

Interesting observations ( thanks re info...t.i.r. etc ) 

Yeah i think ...and it may well just be me.... this year was never going to be, nor intended, as the slam dunk of affairs re Grundy. 

I suspect next year.....another preseason..  more coaching...   might be very illuminating. 

Meanwhile...back to this game.

A lot of Carltons momentum...over season ( of late ) and in-game , has come from them getting some rhythm into their game.

That also worked in their earlier outting against us....'til we changed the music.

Took us a little while ( often does and that irks me ) but once their dance was upended they "worry" the ball..   They aren't overly superb at second effort rebound entries...  they tend to cough it up. Once this starts happening a few times their patterns fall apart. Our game is built upin fwd 50 contesting. Theirs is about "process" to goal.  Interupt that.. Carlton is on toast.

[Deebauched 1,219]

If we beat Carlton we have to go all out to win our last two games and finish 2nd.

We're not getting top spot. Pies wont lose their last 3 games. One win seals it for them and they play bog ordinary Essendon in last game.

I just hope we dont have to win our last game at the SCG Buddy Circus  to avoid finishing 3rd.

I'd take 4th right now and play wobbly Pies in the QF.

3rd place is a steaming pile of camel dung on a baren Gedrosian landscape.

[old55 21,862]

3 minutes ago, Deebauched said:

If we beat Carlton we have to go all out to win our last two games and finish 2nd.

We're not getting top spot. Pies wont lose their last 3 games. One win seals it for them and they play bog ordinary Essendon in last game.

I just hope we dont have to win our last game at the SCG Buddy Circus  to avoid finishing 3rd.

I'd take 4th right now and play wobbly Pies in the QF.

3rd place is a steaming pile of camel dung on a baren Gedrosian landscape.

Incorrect, if Collingwood go 1-2 and Brisbane and MFC go 3-0 then top spot is decided on percentage and Collingwood's will fall, while Brisbane and Melbourne's will rise in that scenario.

Edited August 11, 2023 by old55

[Demonland 66,923]

LISTEN HERE

[Deebauched 1,219]

6 minutes ago, old55 said:

Incorrect, if Collingwood go 1-2 and Brisbane and MFC go 3-0 then top spot is decided on percentage and Collingwood's will fall, while Brisbane and Melbourne's will rise in that scenario.

Yes, but thats a big IF. Could very well be over tonight ..

Geelong are ordinary this year even at home they struggle.

[ignition. 1,426]

The team is nearly perfect.

Injuries aside, it's just missing Fritta (and now Petty).

Fingers crossed the list can stay relatively healthy as we lead into September.

Go Dees!

[Roost it far 6,438]

If Fritsch comes in who goes out: Grundy, Melksham or a mid such as JJ? What about Spargo?

Edited August 11, 2023 by Roost it far

[Deebauched 1,219]

9 minutes ago, ignition. said:

The team is nearly perfect.

Injuries aside, it's just missing Fritta (and now Petty).

Fingers crossed the list can stay relatively healthy as we lead into September.

Go Dees!

yep,  Jordan better play out of skin otherwise he'll be out for Fritsch.

Spargo already omitted, Petty no longer in the frame this year.

No other slots available bar injury.

[YearOfTheDees 3,142]

29 minutes ago, Deebauched said:

Yes, but thats a big IF. Could very well be over tonight ..

Geelong are ordinary this year even at home they struggle.

If the Pies drop tonight they have the Lions at the one interstate ground the can play ok at. 

[ignition. 1,426]

12 minutes ago, Roost it far said:

If Fritsch comes in who goes out: Grundy, Melksham or a mid such as JJ? What about Spargo?

Definitely JJ. Last week was his best game to date, aside from that he's been average at best.

Fritsch is an instant in who consistently kicks 2+ goals a game. Can go be placed at CHF (where Smith currently is who can go back or forward). Sub spot can be with Hibberd or JJ depending on the opposition.

Edited August 11, 2023 by ignition.

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,534]

48 minutes ago, old55 said:

Incorrect, if Collingwood go 1-2 and Brisbane and MFC go 3-0 then top spot is decided on percentage and Collingwood's will fall, while Brisbane and Melbourne's will rise in that scenario.

Just to clarify, our percentage will only go up if our winning margins are such that our percentage in each game is higher than where we started.

[Bystander 894]

7 minutes ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

Just to clarify, our percentage will only go up if our winning margins are such that our percentage in each game is higher than where we started.

Just to clarify that, I don't think it needs to be in "each" game. For the final percentage to be higher than current, the totals of the margins for the remaining games, expressed as a percentage in the usual manner, has to be higher than the current percentage.

[Demonland 66,923]

 

[Supreme_Demon 3,065]

A massive game against Carlton this Saturday night. The crowd will be huge!

I dare say this is probably the BIGGEST game against Carlton since the finals in 2000! Back when Brad Green was kicking goals from all angles and announced himself as a star player for Melbourne.

It will be interesting to see how Clayton Oliver and Brodie Grundy go both returning to the senior side. I assume both will be fired up to make an impact.

However, I am still very curious to see how our forward line will function against the Blues after sadly losing Harry Petty to injury.

I would of liked to see Tom McDonald get another chance in the forward line. But I guess he needs match practice at VFL level with Casey first. The other issue is that he is so slow and he has the turning circle of a cargo ship. Anyway, the ball is in his court to try and get (probably) his last chance to break back into the senior side of the Demons. It's all up to you Tommy!

Hopefully we don't underestimate Carlton. They are definitely on a roll and we need to be prepared for that and anything they might throw at us.

 

Edited August 11, 2023 by Supreme_Demon