Does Kade make the grade, or will it be Chandlermonium

[DeeSpencer 23,630]

There seems to be consistent praise from coaches, team mates and track watchers for Kade Chandler in recent weeks. And in addition to Grundy and Hunter it seems he has a genuine opportunity to be a fresh face to make the best 22, with Kossie moving to the midfield rotation.

Pros: He’s physically ready now, 23 years old, solid endurance base and muscle. He found consistent form in the VFL last year and broke open the VFL grand final. He can mark, he’s a willing tackler (as evidenced by his sling tackle ban) and he has an accurate left foot kick. 

Cons: whilst he can mark overhead he’s very much a small at 175cm so won’t be out marking too many defenders. He has quick lateral movement but not blistering speed to burst clear or chase down tackle. 

And maybe most concerning is that in previous years he’s very much attempted to fend or break through tackles and struggled to do so at AFL level. He likes to take it on and kick rather than use first option hands. When it works he can create goals, but trying too much without the strength or speed to get out of trouble is a receipt for turnovers and angry team mates.

How about a little game. If $1.00 reflects the share price for a depth player on a 1 year deal and $2.00 is an established role player worthy of 2 years, and so on, then what value are you buying Chandler shares at?

I think he came in to the preseason at about $1.30 but given recent good forecasts is now trading at $1.65. I’d have him about a $1.50. Who’s buying? Who’s selling?

[adonski 9,402]

Lacks the poise 

 

But then again so does ANB and he's might end up playing 400 games?

 

[picket fence 15,733]

Will make it and be a very good player in 2023

[Bring-Back-Powell 13,595]

Chandler always seems to rip up the MFC practice matches we play out at Casey (3 goals in the 2021 game V Tigers) so if he can translate that form to the home and away season, then he could be a valuable member of the side.

Definitely hasn’t been afforded many opportunities given Goodwin’s faith and loyalty in Neale-Bullen and Spargo.

[DeeSpencer 23,630]

Give me $$$ amounts people, I want to see the level of belief 

[Ollie fan 2,336]

I don’t believe. $1.00. He has never translated Casey form to AFL grade. I would love to be proved wrong.

[adonski 9,402]

7 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

Give me $$$ amounts people, I want to see the level of belief 

0.98 cents on the dollar

Traded or delisted to accommodate a Liam Henry list spot

[Bring-Back-Powell 13,595]

18 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

Give me $$$ amounts people, I want to see the level of belief 

A penny stock unless our coach becomes less rigid at selection.

Edited February 19, 2023 by Bring-Back-Powell

[whatwhat say what 20,220]

$1.42

about the same as bedford last year, who failed to make the most of opportunities and regressed when back in the vfl

chandler showed SLIGHTLY more in the back half of the 2022 vfl season but ultimately still strikes as a good vfl level player, not an afl one 

[mo64 5,278]

I'm with BBP. If given the chances that ANB and Spargo have been gifted at times, his price should be $1.80. But based on loyalties to the 2021 premiership players, his stock price will be $1.

 

[Little Goffy 12,937]

1 hour ago, DeeSpencer said:

Give me $$$ amounts people, I want to see the level of belief 

There should be some kind of game you can play where over the season you can try to anticipate which players are going to go up or down in value, and trade them in and out.

As for Chandler himself, I don't see how he cracks the firsts teams with any regularity this season, or holds a place with us into 2024.

Touch wood, but our midfield is practically impossible to crack into, and our mix of small and medium forward options gives him a lot of competition.

Even the flow on if Pickett successfully plays significantly more midfield time wouldn't help Chandler. Probably means we not only use Sparrow and Nibbler more exclusively as pressure forwards, but also try out Viney for more minutes as a hunter-killer and Petracca as a Petraccing-ball up there as well.

On the bright side, we have so many options of Chandler's type, that if he does play AFL level it'll be because he had earned it.

[Demonsterative 2,337]

If given a good run at it, Chandler has more upside therefore more potential impact than our current Half Forwards. All things equal, he should be at $2.Just not sure our selection committee and coaches will provide him the solid foundation and opportunity. 

[Rodney (Balls) Grinter 10,588]

2 hours ago, DeeSpencer said:

Cons: whilst he can mark overhead he’s very much a small at 175cm so won’t be out marking too many defenders. He has quick lateral movement but not blistering speed to burst clear or chase down tackle. 

Paul Puopolo was the AFL's tenth shortest player, standing at 173 cm and played nearly 200 games in what was a strong multi premiership team at the time.

If Chandler can find his niche in the MFC side, I don't think height is really such a barrier.  I didn't watch Puopolo super closely as a player, because of my general loathing of Hawthorn, but seem to remember him as being a nuggety and strong for his height, a tenacious tackler and a player that kept bobing up and presenting in good places around goals.  He was also a reliable shot on goal and didn't miss many opportunities.  I see alot of the same traits in Chandler.

He's also great mates with Max and I think generally a pretty popular guy with his peers, which has got to count for something.  I'm going to be a bit more bullish on Chandler and offer up $2.20 for the farm boy from outback SA.   

A a supporter group, we've just got to come up with a nickname that's as infuriatingly annoying to opposition supporters as 'Poppy'.

Edited February 19, 2023 by Rodney (Balls) Grinter

[DeeSpencer 23,630]

The following is roughly how he gets in the side:

C; Langdon Petracca Hunter
HF: Viney T Mc  Spargo 
FF: Fritsch Bbb Chandler 
Foll: Gawn Oliver Pickett
Int: DEF, Grundy, Sparrow, Harmes

Overlooked: JJ, ANB

Don’t get caught up on the names but just for an indication without injuries he probably has to pass 2 of JJ, Harmes, ANB, Spargo, Sparrow.

The indications to me are they’re keen to use midfielders (including Pickett) as the HFF. Personally I doubt Spargo gets moved from the other flank given how much the coaches rate his inside 50 kicking.

The criticism for the coaches not picking him last year is a bit misplaced because he doesn’t play the role ANB and Spargo were asked to play. And he wasn’t going to get picked over Pickett. If there’s a reshuffle of Pickett’s role (and Fritsch’s for that matter) it’s a different set of circumstances for Chandler. Not sure it will be enough but it’s different to have him try to do ANB’s job straight up 

 

[buck_nekkid 5,622]

If Kozzie goes more through the middle and Viney rests forward, then there is certainly a role for a small forward.  On the basis I think Chandler is a ‘buy’ at about 2.65.

[demosaw 879]

I bought in when he was 50 cents, think he will make it. Has enough talent and has the right attitude. Just hope we have enough spots so he can make it with us.

[Gator 16,921]

I'm not a fan.  $1 at best.

175cm is OK.  Papley is only 177cm and Kosi just 171cm, but for me Chandler's tricks at VFL level don't translate to the AFL.

He lacks a little pace.  And it's that lack of pace that finds him out in the higher grade.

[mo64 5,278]

18 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

The following is roughly how he gets in the side:

C; Langdon Petracca Hunter
HF: Viney T Mc  Spargo 
FF: Fritsch Bbb Chandler 
Foll: Gawn Oliver Pickett
Int: DEF, Grundy, Sparrow, Harmes

Overlooked: JJ, ANB

Don’t get caught up on the names but just for an indication without injuries he probably has to pass 2 of JJ, Harmes, ANB, Spargo, Sparrow.

The indications to me are they’re keen to use midfielders (including Pickett) as the HFF. Personally I doubt Spargo gets moved from the other flank given how much the coaches rate his inside 50 kicking.

The criticism for the coaches not picking him last year is a bit misplaced because he doesn’t play the role ANB and Spargo were asked to play. And he wasn’t going to get picked over Pickett. If there’s a reshuffle of Pickett’s role (and Fritsch’s for that matter) it’s a different set of circumstances for Chandler. Not sure it will be enough but it’s different to have him try to do ANB’s job straight up 

 

I don't think that Chandler plays the role of Pickett, ANB or Spargo. But the match committee need to decide whether they go again with an underperforming forward line, or they change things up. 

Pickett is our only true crumbing forward. Moving him out of the forward line for long periods of the game would be disastrous. When he's in form, ANB's role is important, but you can't carry out of form players. Chandler's skillset as a forward potentially offers more than what Spargo does in his role.

[Diamond_Jim 12,095]

2 hours ago, whatwhat say what said:

$1.42

about the same as bedford last year, who failed to make the most of opportunities and regressed when back in the vfl

chandler showed SLIGHTLY more in the back half of the 2022 vfl season but ultimately still strikes as a good vfl level player, not an afl one 

This is about it I think.

He's an okay player but what special factor does he add? Both Spargo and ANB although often maligned on this Board offer more upside

He'll get a run as the Sub and due to rule changes will get more time than Bedford so we shall see.

[Neil Crompton 4,945]

34 minutes ago, Diamond_Jim said:

This is about it I think.

He's an okay player but what special factor does he add? Both Spargo and ANB although often maligned on this Board offer more upside

He'll get a run as the Sub and due to rule changes will get more time than Bedford so we shall see.

What’s the upside for Spargo and ANB you talk about? Spargo hopefully has some, but I very much doubt ANB does. I think Chandler has the greater upside - but we won’t know for sure till he’s given a decent chance (and I don’t mean as the sub).

Edited February 19, 2023 by Neil Crompton

[DeeSpencer 23,630]

17 minutes ago, Neil Crompton said:

What’s the upside for Spargo and ANB you talk about? Spargo hopefully has some, but I very much doubt ANB does. I think Chandler has the greater upside - but we won’t know for sure till he’s given a decent chance (and I don’t mean as the sub).

I doubt ANB will suddenly add more skills but he’s shown in 2018 and 2021 that when the team is humming his decision making and ball use generally hums with it. I do think he’s right on the fringes if they want midfield flexibility from the half forwards. Of course ANB also has midfield flexibility himself but it doesn’t seem like the coaches are keen to give him an extended run at this stage. I’d actually love to see him go back to Casey and have 35 and remind everyone he’s got more to his game.

Spargo’s decent upside comes if other players give him the ball when he’s open. He can add 4 or so decisive possessions per week if he’s used more often by a team willing to take more chances and play faster.

[Rodney (Balls) Grinter 10,588]

10 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

I doubt ANB will suddenly add more skills but he’s shown in 2018 and 2021 that when the team is humming his decision making and ball use generally hums with it. I do think he’s right on the fringes if they want midfield flexibility from the half forwards. Of course ANB also has midfield flexibility himself but it doesn’t seem like the coaches are keen to give him an extended run at this stage. I’d actually love to see him go back to Casey and have 35 and remind everyone he’s got more to his game.

Spargo’s decent upside comes if other players give him the ball when he’s open. He can add 4 or so decisive possessions per week if he’s used more often by a team willing to take more chances and play faster.

As pointed out by T Mac and others, ANB does a tonne of running without ball in hand and plays a role for the side pushing up and back defensively that few others would have the aerobic capasity for.  I'm not sure he nessacerilly needs to be a decision making king when he gets the ball to hold his place in the side, it's more the cherry on to when he can link up, deliver well and slot the odd goal when he's really on his game.

Spargo's pressure, hardness and intensity is right up there normally and he was pretty much the leader in the competition for hitting targets inside 50 last season, so unless he drops off, I think his spot is pretty much safe as houses.

The real challenge for Chandler is more about how can we create an opening within the current structure for him to contribute to the side.  As others have started, the increased on-ball time for Kossie is the most obvious scenario, but it's also been suggested that will provide more forward time for the likes of Trac, Oliver and Viney.

Chandler may find himself with substitute role in alot if games, similar to Bedford, although he'd be more likely to be used more regularly and get more game time with the recient rule change.  The other possibility is that perhaps this season the coaches and selection pannell might have more of an emphasis on rotating players through the senior team, which would certainly be a good thing.  If we can have a fairly good run with injuries, it could certainly be more than just Chandler on the sidelines of the senior side trying to break in for a game, with guys like Harmes, JJ, Sparrow, Laurrie, Rivers, Bowie, Turner, BBB, JvR and likely others that would get  game in most other sides in the comp that could be on the frindge banging the door down.  Wouldn't hurt if we were more flexible and less predictable to opposition sides.

[Demons11 6,404]

He has played some phenomenal games at VFL level but just lacks consistency.  I think he finds that this year and will be a great addition to the team 

[Rodney (Balls) Grinter 10,588]

In thinking about things a little further, I think the real point of difference that Chandler offers, compared to Spargo and ANB, is that he's a more attacking small forward than either of those two and has the capasity/potential and game style to kick multiple/bags of goals that I'm not sure is Spargs or ANB strength.  Even with Kossie playing a small forward role, I think it's well worth having a second small live wire around goal as it both takes the pressure off Kossie somewhat mentally and also makes it harder for opposition to contain both of them at once.

Edited February 19, 2023 by Rodney (Balls) Grinter

[Rodney (Balls) Grinter 10,588]

2 hours ago, Gator said:

He lacks a little pace.  And it's that lack of pace that finds him out in the higher grade.

Not sure that he needs Kossie Picket etc level pace if he can find a way of poping up in the right places and be well balanced and poised around goal, which I think he's shown some ability for.

5 hours ago, DeeSpencer said:

And maybe most concerning is that in previous years he’s very much attempted to fend or break through tackles and struggled to do so at AFL level. He likes to take it on and kick rather than use first option hands. When it works he can create goals, but trying too much without the strength or speed to get out of trouble is a receipt for turnovers and angry team mates.

You'd think these are the kind of things that would come through in reviews during the regular season and could be a big focus for him over preseason to adjust in his game.  I think the other part is just about getting enough time at AFL level to become accustomed to the pace, adjust and get comfortable with it.

In all honesty, I'm not sure if Kade will make it with the MFC or not, but I'd love to see him get the chance and make it if he can.  Seems like a ripping bloke who deserves his chance.  It would somewhat frustrate me to see him overlooked all year, but then get picked up by our opposition and go on to become a star player.  Will be interesting to see how Bedford goes in this respect, but I wish him well.