Gary Bukenara on Demon’s 2021 List

[Demonland 73,140]

 

[Sir Why You Little 37,133]

I think Gary should just do something else after what he said last year

[DeesignerAU 383]

This is what he had to say last year (2020)

https://www.myheartbeatstrue.com/news/from-the-archive-recruiting-guru-gary-buckenara-analyses-melbourne-demons-list-after-the-2020-afl-season/

[mauriesy 7,357]

He rates the Melbourne list as:

A-grade: Steven May, Christian Salem, Christian Petracca, Jack Viney, Jake Lever, Angus Brayshaw, Max Gawn, Clayton Oliver, Ed Langdon.

B-grade: James Harmes, Michael Hibberd, Jake Melksham, Tom McDonald, Sam Weideman, Jayden Hunt, Alex Neal-Bullen, Bayley Fritsch, Ben Brown.

C-grade: Adam Tomlinson, Oskar Baker, Marty Hore, Mitch Brown, Joel Smith, Kye Declase, Majak Daw.

Developing

Future AB: Luke Jackson, Charlie Spargo, Toby Bedford, Bailey Laurie, Jake Bowey, James Jordan, Trent Rivers, Tom Sparrow, Harrison Petty, Kysaiah Pickett,

Need more time: Fraser Rosman, Kade Chandler, Daniel Turner, Deakyn Smith.

I think this is mostly reasonable, but I'd easily have Fritsch as A-grade under his criteria, and possibly Neal-Bullen after his great season and improvement.

Jackson, Spargo, Pickett,  Bowey, Sparrow, Rivers and Jordon are well on the way to B (at least), I think they're already there. If not for his injury I'd swap Tomlinson for Weideman.

Edited October 6, 2021 by mauriesy

[Mickey 4,731]

I'd swap Gus and Fritta. Gus had a great year in his position, but I'm not sure he's 'A grade'. Bailey definitely is.

[DeeSpencer 26,082]

May, Oliver, Petracca, Gawn are undoubtable. Oliver slipped a little last year but they all should’ve been A graders last year. Salem was knocking on the door and cemented himself this year. Lever found the consistency that he flashed last year and became the A grader he was meant to be.

Gus had a great grand final but is no where near A grade and neither is Langdon even accounting for his brilliant work rate. He was A grade for the first half of the year but not the second half.

Viney showed what he’s capable of in finals but misses too many games with injury and has a few too many shaky regular season games to quality as A grade.

Fritsch is very close, can argue either way, probably needs to back it up next year to me. Unless the grand final tips him over. He’s a B++ along with Langdon and Viney. Ben Brown’s end to the season was that level as well.

Melk and Weid are C graders too, just a bit too flawed to be reliable.

All the premiership players are key parts of a premiership team. I don’t care if they are 19 or 22 or where they will be in a few years time. They’re all solid B graders right now. There’s no young players who were carried. Every one of them earned their spot.

[Lord Nev 13,512]

20 minutes ago, DeesignerAU said:

This is what he had to say last year (2020)

https://www.myheartbeatstrue.com/news/from-the-archive-recruiting-guru-gary-buckenara-analyses-melbourne-demons-list-after-the-2020-afl-season/

[Fritta and Turner 4,539]

I don't have any objection to Buckys name been spelt wrong.  Pukenara even better....

Fritta B grade like really? So whoever played on him was C grade.... (and we all  know who they are)

 

[Turner 1,516]

6 hours ago, mauriesy said:

He rates the Melbourne list as:

A-grade: Steven May, Christian Salem, Christian Petracca, Jack Viney, Jake Lever, Angus Brayshaw, Max Gawn, Clayton Oliver, Ed Langdon.

B-grade: James Harmes, Michael Hibberd, Jake Melksham, Tom McDonald, Sam Weideman, Jayden Hunt, Alex Neal-Bullen, Bayley Fritsch, Ben Brown.

C-grade: Adam Tomlinson, Oskar Baker, Marty Hore, Mitch Brown, Joel Smith, Kye Declase, Majak Daw.

Developing

Future AB: Luke Jackson, Charlie Spargo, Toby Bedford, Bailey Laurie, Jake Bowey, James Jordan, Trent Rivers, Tom Sparrow, Harrison Petty, Kysaiah Pickett,

Need more time: Fraser Rosman, Kade Chandler, Daniel Turner, Deakyn Smith.

I think this is mostly reasonable, but I'd easily have Fritsch as A-grade under his criteria, and possibly Neal-Bullen after his great season and improvement.

Jackson, Spargo, Pickett,  Bowey, Sparrow, Rivers and Jordon are well on the way to B (at least), I think they're already there. If not for his injury I'd swap Tomlinson for Weideman.

Ben Brown goes up - he's a top 10 player at any club as he's a key forward imo

Brayshaw, Langdon down - not elite but still good players (definitely fit his 10-18 criteria at every club)

Hibberd, Weideman, Melksham down - are they even in our 10-18??

Tomlinson up - did he only put him there because he's injured? doesn't change his ability

Bedford down for mine - has had more chances than the others and not broken through

[Demon Disciple 12,274]

6 hours ago, Mickey said:

I'd swap Gus and Fritta. Gus had a great year in his position, but I'm not sure he's 'A grade'. Bailey definitely is.

Gus played an ‘A-Grade’ quality Grand Final, that’s when it matters most. His 3rd quarter was simply magnificent. Put his body on the line and accepted the hits on numerous occasions for the betterment of the team. 

Jack Viney’s finals series was superb as well. He is built for the pressure and physicality of finals football. His season was a ‘B’ at best, yet he was an ‘A-Grader’ come the pointy end.

No point having overrated ‘Gary Rohans’ who play glorified football during the season, only to be MIA come finals footy.

[mauriesy 7,357]

27 minutes ago, Turner said:

Ben Brown goes up - he's a top 10 player at any club as he's a key forward imo

Brayshaw, Langdon down - not elite but still good players (definitely fit his 10-18 criteria at every club)

Hibberd, Weideman, Melksham down - are they even in our 10-18??

Tomlinson up - did he only put him there because he's injured? doesn't change his ability

Bedford down for mine - has had more chances than the others and not broken through

Buckenara's classifications are probably a bit more "general" than what we normally think. I tend to think of A-grade as the "very elite", but he is not quite as strict.

A-grade: Elite players on any AFL list

B-grade: Top 10-18 player on most lists

C-grade: An 19-30 player on a list

Developing: Aged 21 or under

Future AB players: These are players that will hopefully develop into an A or B ranked player once they turn 22. They might be playing to this level now, but it takes sustained years.

Need more time: These players would be a player recently drafted that is still developing and therefore will need more time to see if he is likely to develop into an A or B grade player.

Edited October 6, 2021 by mauriesy

[dworship 3,342]

10 hours ago, DeeSpencer said:

May, Oliver, Petracca, Gawn are undoubtable. Oliver slipped a little last year but they all should’ve been A graders last year. Salem was knocking on the door and cemented himself this year. Lever found the consistency that he flashed last year and became the A grader he was meant to be.

Gus had a great grand final but is no where near A grade and neither is Langdon even accounting for his brilliant work rate. He was A grade for the first half of the year but not the second half.

Viney showed what he’s capable of in finals but misses too many games with injury and has a few too many shaky regular season games to quality as A grade.

Fritsch is very close, can argue either way, probably needs to back it up next year to me. Unless the grand final tips him over. He’s a B++ along with Langdon and Viney. Ben Brown’s end to the season was that level as well.

Melk and Weid are C graders too, just a bit too flawed to be reliable.

All the premiership players are key parts of a premiership team. I don’t care if they are 19 or 22 or where they will be in a few years time. They’re all solid B graders right now. There’s no young players who were carried. Every one of them earned their spot.

Oh my Lord!! DeeSpencer is a pseudonym, you're Bucknara!!

[DeeSpencer 26,082]

5 minutes ago, dworship said:

Oh my Lord!! DeeSpencer is a pseudonym, you're Bucknara!!

You really argued that well. Good contribution.

[roy11 3,893]

20 hours ago, Lord Nev said:

Laughing at Buck aside,

Interesting to see the change in classifications; Langdon the big mover jumping from C to A.

Gone from 1 A grade player to 9

 

 

[dworship 3,342]

11 hours ago, DeeSpencer said:

You really argued that well. Good contribution.

I'm just saying you're very insightful, sorry for being obtuse.

[Mt. Dee-Maaan 608]

this guy is legit hopeless.. how can say that declasse is C grade when he hasn't played a game yet? yet turner is 'needs more time'?..

just give up mate. i swear, despite us being premiers and having such a good year, the industry pundits who analyse/comment on our list must do their reports in a 5 minute email. so [censored].

[Dee*ceiving 1,690]

Agree Rocky. He's pretending that he actually analyses anything and puts names in columns knowing that only fans of the team , or real footy heads, will know any better. The vast majority of readers won't care. 

Langdon and Gus are great, but not A grade for mine.  Neither is Viney IMO. 

Fritsch definitely A grade. 

[DeeSpencer 26,082]

1 hour ago, dworship said:

I'm just saying you're very insightful, sorry for being obtuse.

My bad. 1 elite player and trade Oliver Bucky is not who I want to be! 

[DeeSpencer 26,082]

12 minutes ago, Dee*ceiving said:

Agree Rocky. He's pretending that he actually analyses anything and puts names in columns knowing that only fans of the team , or real footy heads, will know any better. The vast majority of readers won't care. 

Langdon and Gus are great, but not A grade for mine.  Neither is Viney IMO. 

Fritsch definitely A grade. 

Fritsch is an A grade goal kicker but C grade at everything else, that what makes him borderline to me. A grade players don’t have many holes in their game. Maybe a slight weakness here or there like Oliver’s kicking but they can do almost everything else. That said, if Fritsch’s finals put him over the line I can respect that. 

[DeeSpencer 26,082]

37 minutes ago, Rocky said:

this guy is legit hopeless.. how can say that declasse is C grade when he hasn't played a game yet? yet turner is 'needs more time'?..

just give up mate. i swear, despite us being premiers and having such a good year, the industry pundits who analyse/comment on our list must do their reports in a 5 minute email. so [censored].

Declase is 24, he doesn’t rank under 22’s because that would require watching games. So Declase gets a ranking, Turner doesn’t. 

[Dee*ceiving 1,690]

Fritsch more than just A grade goalkicker for mine. Hands are elite, in the air and on the ground and rarely if ever loses his feet. Almost like a cat, even when jumping at the high ball often finds a way to land on his feet and stay in the contest.

His goal in the third where Max inadvertantly spoiled his marking attempt a prime example. 

Also can be quite elusive with the ball in hand in general play.

Tackling not a strength and I will admit he looks more A grade with both BB and TMac in the side allowing him to get the third defender, but you can only beat who you're up against (most of the time).  . 

 

 

[deejammin' 2,373]

One of the unexpected joys of the great many joys of this premiership has been laughing at these so called “experts” back-track on their Melbourne-hate laden commentary. 

Buckenara has been one, he hates the Dees, he’s been pathetic in his analysis of our lists over many years, his failure to rate Trac, Lever, May and Oliver for starters. 
Like many in the AFL media he hates us and has traded on the ‘Melbourne will inevitably fail’ narrative that has pervaded all commentary on our Dees. I think we all know why this exists, and in the past it’s been deserved but it has genuinely prevented a lot of football minds from viewing us objectively.
 

I’ve been going back through watching all our games this year (I mean, why wouldn’t you?!) and it’s really interesting listening to the commentary and thinking back on all the experts this year, Whately, Derwayne Russell, David King, that [censored] BT, Jimmy Bartel, they all refused to believe Melbourne was capable of anything even when we were 11-1. Listening to the commentary of BT screaming “I just don’t believe they’re good” when we’re 30+ points up on Carlton in round 9 is particularly funny now. Even in the second half of the season there was this begrudging acknowledgment that Melbourne was good but a constant narrative that others were better and we would fall down when it counted. Ahhhh the schaudenfreuder!

For me the biggest [censored] of all is Matt Rendell, I listen to draft radio as I love footy but why does anyone listen to a word this guy says? Picked 3 of the top 8 this year, had the premiers 15th losing our coach in the first half of our season and in the greatest [censored] move of all still had us unable to win the premiership with a list that’s not good enough in round 17!!! Check this out: 

https://www.sen.com.au/news/2021/07/28/the-biggest-worry-for-melbourne-right-now/

Also just last week the genius Rendell declared Max Gawn had “done his job” as captain and was one of 16 captains who could lose the role next year. Also didn’t have him in the top 3 captains in the AFL. The Melbourne hate lives on in surreptitious ways. Bring it on! Let’s prove him wrong again! 

MATT RENDELL = [censored]

Edited October 7, 2021 by deejammin'

[durango 2,023]

The definition of an expert I was once told is a 'drip under pressure' well that applies to Rendell and Buckenara who again they live on past glories.

I never thought of Rendell as a good footballer and his recruiting of Dangerfield was the highlight of his recruiting career.

If you pick the eyes out of the draft most years of career you are an genius at recruiting but if you are a hit and miss type then you are an expert.

Edited October 7, 2021 by durango

[IRW 1,387]

1 hour ago, DeeSpencer said:

Fritsch is an A grade goal kicker but C grade at everything else, that what makes him borderline to me. A grade players don’t have many holes in their game. Maybe a slight weakness here or there like Oliver’s kicking but they can do almost everything else. That said, if Fritsch’s finals put him over the line I can respect that. 

Ollie's kicking no longer looks like much of a problem to me but you have nailed Fritsch . B+ for the reason you offered 

[IRW 1,387]

18 hours ago, Turner said:

Ben Brown goes up - he's a top 10 player at any club as he's a key forward imo

Brayshaw, Langdon down - not elite but still good players (definitely fit his 10-18 criteria at every club)

Hibberd, Weideman, Melksham down - are they even in our 10-18??

Tomlinson up - did he only put him there because he's injured? doesn't change his ability

Bedford down for mine - has had more chances than the others and not broken through

Weideman needs more time..but it's not as if he hasn't been gifted plenty already