Jump to content

The Speed myth

buck_nekkid
in Melbourne Demons

Featured Replies

Posted

From AFL.com, here are our speedsters for 2020.

Interstingly, many teams that we think are fast are significantly slower than us if you compare results.  It is not speed of player, but speed of ball that counts!

Would these have been your top 5?

Top-five fastest players in 2020
Christian Salem, 34.8km/h v Sydney, round 15
Michael Hibberd, 34.6km/h v Collingwood, round 12
Aaron vandenBerg, 34.3km/h v Fremantle, round 16
Kysaiah Pickett , 34.2km/h v Brisbane, round 8
James Harmes, 33.9km/h v Collingwood, round 12

Fastest speeds clocked in a game in 2020    
Christian Salem, 34.8km/h v Sydney, round 15
Michael Hibberd, 34.6km/h v Collingwood, round 12
Aaron vandenBerg, 34.3km/h v Fremantle, round 16
Kysaiah Pickett , 34.2km/h v Brisbane, round 8
James Harmes, 33.9km/h v Collingwood, round 12

  • Quote
    • Like 4
    • Thanks 1
     

    Shows how bad it is neither Salem or Harmes were never trialed on the wing..!

    Edited by adonski

  • Quote
    • Shocked 1

    Would not imagine any of the those guys, aside from Kossie, burning away from people on the run.

    Intent and decision making speed are probably more important

  • Quote
    • Like 1
     
    • Author
    8 minutes ago, adonski said:

    Shows how bad it is neither Salem or Harmes were never trialed on the wing..!

    I think the wing is all about endurance gut running, not just speed.  The ability to not just be fast once, but to hold the width and continuously it in sprint efforts is what matters.  Interesting that Langdon made such a difference to us as a winger yet he was not in the fast 5?

  • Quote
    • Like 3

    Is this a speed measured in a single event or average 

  • Quote

    • Author
    4 minutes ago, BW511 said:

    Would not imagine any of the those guys, aside from Kossie, burning away from people on the run.

    Intent and decision making speed are probably more important

    Agree with decision making speed.  Instead of rushing and panicking, simply being fast is a different trait.  

    I also wonder if most of these efforts were not ‘burning away from’ but closing speeds into tackles (AVB in particular). 

  • Quote

    So much for all the people who repeatedly say Salem is slow.

    #Salomyths

    Edited by Lucifer's Hero

  • Quote
    • Like 6
    • Thanks 1
    • Author
    3 minutes ago, Kent said:

    Is this a speed measured in a single event or average 

    I think this was single event. If they had average speeds of 34km/h plus then they would have top speeds off the charts!  The reported stat was top measured speed - for many teams a single player had 2 or 3 top speed events for the team over the year, although we had 5 distinct fastest events/players.

  • Quote
    •  
    15 minutes ago, buck_nekkid said:

    I think the wing is all about endurance gut running, not just speed.  The ability to not just be fast once, but to hold the width and continuously it in sprint efforts is what matters.  Interesting that Langdon made such a difference to us as a winger yet he was not in the fast 5?

    Speed endurance.

    Langdon may not be the quickest over a certain distance, but he can keep doing it over and over again.

    Repeat 100-200’s would be his bread and butter.

    But as we agreed on with my other post, he had the desire to do it, which I don’t believe the rest of our guys do consistently enough

  • Quote
    • Like 2

    17 minutes ago, Kent said:

    Is this a speed measured in a single event or average 

    Single event, which shows these players are capable but don’t utilize their speed often. Basically Vanders got up to 34kms in a chase, but otherwise stood around with his hands on his hips.

    Average cruising speed is the important stat. It would show players like Langdon excelling as they constantly move at speed to adjust position with hard two way running.

  • Quote
    • Like 2
    6 minutes ago, BW511 said:

    Speed endurance.

    Langdon may not be the quickest over a certain distance, but he can keep doing it over and over again.

    Repeat 100-200’s would be his bread and butter.

    But as we agreed on with my other post, he had the desire to do it, which I don’t believe the rest of our guys do consistently enough

    Langdon said this in an interview after our gws game.  The question was something about 3km runs and Langdon responded more like repeat 150m runs.

    Speed in football is different, top speed is important but break away speed and the ability to change direction at high speed are more important.

  • Quote
    • Like 2

    I would need to know speed over what distance before I question whether that is surprising.  Also these are one off acts and games.The most interesting thing there is none of them could repeat it and get in the top 5 more than once per match or act.

    Edited by big_red_fire_engine

  • Quote
    • Like 1
    16 minutes ago, big_red_fire_engine said:

    I would need to know speed over what distance before I question whether that is surprising.  Also these are one off acts and games.The most interesting thing there is none of them could repeat it and get in the top 5 more than once per match or act.

    That was my thinking as well BRFE

  • Quote

    So the competetion best is about 37 km/hr and the worst 32 km/hr 

    It wouldnt make a helava difference? I would RATHER MEASURE HOW MANY TOP SPEED EVENTS PER GAME  SO WE COULD GET AN AVERAGE ACROSS THE GROUND 

    Running is only one measure ball movement and accuracy and even thinking and decision making

  • Quote

    doesnt factor in wind and also if the player is running downhill or not because it's much higher in the middle of the ground.

  • Quote
    • Haha 2

    Speed of the ball that counts. Well that is spot on and we are very poor at it. Look at us moving the ball quickly. We tend to stuff it up with poor skills and decision making. Centre bounce area is my favorite.

  • Quote
    • Like 2
    2 hours ago, buck_nekkid said:

    From AFL.com, here are our speedsters for 2020.

    Interstingly, many teams that we think are fast are significantly slower than us if you compare results.  It is not speed of player, but speed of ball that counts!

    Would these have been your top 5?

    Top-five fastest players in 2020
    Christian Salem, 34.8km/h v Sydney, round 15
    Michael Hibberd, 34.6km/h v Collingwood, round 12
    Aaron vandenBerg, 34.3km/h v Fremantle, round 16
    Kysaiah Pickett , 34.2km/h v Brisbane, round 8
    James Harmes, 33.9km/h v Collingwood, round 12

    Fastest speeds clocked in a game in 2020    
    Christian Salem, 34.8km/h v Sydney, round 15
    Michael Hibberd, 34.6km/h v Collingwood, round 12
    Aaron vandenBerg, 34.3km/h v Fremantle, round 16
    Kysaiah Pickett , 34.2km/h v Brisbane, round 8
    James Harmes, 33.9km/h v Collingwood, round 12

    ...but where is the comparison?

    It's showing our top 5 events, where are the other teams?

  • Quote

    They are great for measuring distance covered, but the top speed stats put out by the GPS units are pretty sketchy as I understand it. The largest margin of error tends to be seen in sprints, particularly where direction is changing. The units really struggle on the fine scale and have issues in the indoor stadiums. There was talk about using a different method to capture the data taking cues from the NBA, however that was going to require an investment and is probably not something that would be a priority in the post Covid AFL. 

    In having a look at some info on current day GPS units I came across this article from Deakin Uni. It talks about GPS use in the AFL context up to the 2012 season. Admittedly it's 8 years old, and surprisingly poorly written in parts, but presents an interesting insight into the take up and attitudes around the technology.

    https://dro.deakin.edu.au/eserv/DU:30049079/foreman-globalpositioningsystems-2012.pdf

  • Quote
    • Like 1
    • Thanks 1

    Yes, footspeed really doesn't mean all that much, it is ball movement. 

    It's interesting how many on here would view us as slow and unskilful. After we beat GWS in the final round of 2018, Phil Davis commented how quick we moved the ball and how skilled we were. You can't tell me that we have lost heaps of actual pacey and skilful players over the last two years so where has it gone then?

  • Quote
    3 hours ago, BW511 said:

    Would not imagine any of the those guys, aside from Kossie, burning away from people on the run.

    Intent and decision making speed are probably more important

    Me neither.

    At leaat I got Tmac correct.

  • Quote
    • Haha 1

    As others have said, it is quick controlled ball movement.  If you are moving the ball with little contest, your side looks quicker than the opposition as they are chasing trying to cover positions.   Leg speed allows you too close or break from a contest.  Skills to efficiently move the ball quickly is better than outright speed across a whole team. (Yes you seem speedsters mixed in)

    A game plan where everyone knows where the ball is going to go, really helps too, as they can move to position before the opposition know. 

  • Quote
    •  

    I'm curious to know haw fast Sprago is.

    I know hes not tall but he seems to move quick at times.

    Hunt did not get a mention

    Langdon is up their for endurance.

    Trac has good initial acceleration.

  • Quote
    • Like 1
    2 hours ago, kallangurdemon said:

    interesting how AVB is quicker than Jayden.I should have went to Specsavers .

    Must have been clocked while sailing through the air for a mark KD.... either that or the GPS was glitching

  • Quote

    • Join the conversation

    You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

    Guest
    Unfortunately, your content contains terms that we do not allow. Please edit your content to remove the highlighted words below.
    Reply to this topic...
    Go to topic listing

    Featured Content

    • CASEY: Sydney

      The Casey Demons were always expected to emerge victorious in their matchup against the lowly-ranked Sydney Swans at picturesque Tramway Oval, situated in the shadows of the SCG in Moore Park. They dominated the proceedings in the opening two and a half quarters of the game but had little to show for it. This was primarily due to their own sloppy errors in a low-standard game that produced a number of crowded mauls reminiscent of the rugby game popular in old Sydney Town. However, when the Swans tired, as teams often do when they turn games into ugly defensive contests, Casey lifted the standard of its own play and … it was off to the races. Not to nearby Randwick but to a different race with an objective of piling on goal after goal on the way to a mammoth victory. At the 25-minute mark of the third quarter, the Demons held a slender 14-point lead over the Swans, who are ahead on the ladder of only the previous week's opposition, the ailing Bullants. Forty minutes later, they had more than fully compensated for the sloppiness of their earlier play with a decisive 94-point victory, that culminated in a rousing finish which yielded thirteen unanswered goals. Kicks hit their targets, the ball found itself going through the middle and every player made a contribution.

      • 1 reply
      Demonland

    • REPORT: St. Kilda

      Hands up if you thought, like me, at half-time in yesterday’s game at TIO Traeger Park, Alice Springs that Melbourne’s disposal around the ground and, in particular, its kicking inaccuracy in front of the goals couldn’t get any worse. Well, it did. And what’s even more damning for the Melbourne Football Club is that the game against St Kilda and its resurgence from the bottomless pit of its miserable start to the season wasn’t just lost through poor conversion for goal but rather in the 15 minutes when the entire team went into a slumber and was mugged by the out-of-form Saints. Their six goals two behinds (one goal less than the Demons managed for the whole game) weaved a path of destruction from which they were unable to recover. Ross Lyon’s astute use of pressure to contain the situation once they had asserted their grip on the game, and Melbourne’s self-destructive wastefulness, assured that outcome. The old adage about the insanity of repeatedly doing something and expecting a different result, was out there. Two years ago, the score line in Melbourne’s loss to the Giants at this same ground was 5 goals 15 behinds - a ratio of one goal per four scoring shots - was perfectly replicated with yesterday’s 7 goals 21 behinds. 
      This has been going on for a while and opens up a number of questions. I’ll put forward a few that come to mind from this performance. The obvious first question is whether the club can find a suitable coach to instruct players on proper kicking techniques or is this a skill that can no longer be developed at this stage of the development of our playing group? Another concern is the team's ability to counter an opponent's dominance during a run on as exemplified by the Saints in the first quarter. Did the Demons underestimate their opponents, considering St Kilda's goals during this period were scored by relatively unknown forwards? Furthermore, given the modest attendance of 6,721 at TIO Traeger Park and the team's poor past performances at this venue, is it prudent to prioritize financial gain over potentially sacrificing valuable premiership points by relinquishing home ground advantage, notwithstanding the cultural significance of the team's connection to the Red Centre? 

        • Haha
      • 4 replies
      Demonland

    • PREGAME: Collingwood

      After a disappointing loss in Alice Springs the Demons return to the MCG to take on the Magpies in the annual King's Birthday Big Freeze for MND game. Who comes in and who goes out?

        • Clap
        • Like
      • 170 replies
      Demonland

    • PODCAST: St. Kilda

      The Demonland Podcast will air LIVE on Monday, 2nd June @ 8:00pm. Join Binman, George & I as we have a chat with former Demon ruckman Jeff White about his YouTube channel First Use where he dissects ruck setups and contests. We'll then discuss the Dees disappointing loss to the Saints in Alice Springs.
      Your questions and comments are a huge part of our podcast so please post anything you want to ask or say below and we'll give you a shout out on the show.
      Listen LIVE: https://demonland.com/

        • Sad
      • 46 replies
      Demonland

    • POSTGAME: St. Kilda

      After kicking the first goal of the match the Demons were always playing catch up against the Saints in Alice Spring and could never make the most of their inside 50 entries to wrestle back the lead.

        • Clap
        • Like
      • 328 replies
      Demonland

    • VOTES: St. Kilda

      Max Gawn still has a massive lead in the Demonland Player of the Year award as Christian Petracca, Jake Bowey, Clayton Oliver & Kozzy Pickett round out the Top 5. Your votes please. 6, 5, 4, 3, 2 & 1

        • Like
      • 31 replies
      Demonland
    View All