36 minutes ago, Deemania since 56 said:

Refreshing isn't it, a concept well supported by:

• his football knowledge,
• his modernism and tactical nouse within the best arrays of the modern game (Hawthorn at and across its peak) and its execution,
• his communication skills above par by a mile,
•  his currency on the best means to approach the modern game - supported extensively in very recent times by his onfield leadership (excellence) despite being just past the sunset of his onfield, playing capabilities.

A quality man, as well. Values driven, articulate, thoughtful, resilient, great leadership mixed with personalisation at appropriate length. 

But has Lewis done the coaches' course? Following the Essendon fiasco I seem to recall a new ruling from the AFL that clubs can now only appoint as Senior Coach (or possibly to any coaching role) people who have undertaken and passed the coaches' course.

Even if it isn't mandatory, I think any club would be crazy to appoint as a senior coach anyone who isn't properly accredited. And they would be just as crazy to appoint as senior coach someone who hasn't had a number of years of proper training as an assistant coach.

59 minutes ago, Redleg said:

That is what I said, 38 on main list, that is 2 less than this year.

"How many players are on AFL lists now? Teams have between 38 and 40 footballers on their 'primary' list, and either four, five or six Category A rookies for a maximum combination of 44.Apr 4, 2020"

I reckon the list will be 38 players, plus 1 Cat B rookie.   Whether that is 36 + 2 Rookies or just straight out 38 players no more rookie list

Certain Delistings

Bedford

Chandler

Wagners x 2

That would bring us to the 40 players.  We need another 3 for draft picks

Dunkley

Bennell(unfortunately stuffed up completely)

Omac

Trade

Buddle up Sparrow and Petty for Adelaide second round pick 19

Tmac for Steak knives which will suck as we will be left with tops third rd pick and paying some of his contract might be worth more to keep him on the list

Preuss 

Retire

Jetta unfortunately his time is up has a massive dangerous flaw in his game that he needs to retire for his health.  He leads with his head, been the last 2 years he puts his head into danger way to may times.

Kolodjashnij same as Jetta, you life after the game is more important than your time in the game.

The big issue for the club both Jetta and Kolo are contracted for 2021 so if we pay them out on health issues does this fall into the 2021 cap?

Jones, not sure on him as yet with the compromised draft and not seeing the 18s this year another year for Jones is better than taking a punt with a kid at pick 70 or a rookie

Thats 12 players, I think we are at 44 plus Cat B rookie.  We keep Bradtke as Cat B rookie

That takes us to 32 players, based on 38 players we have 6 new players to bring in.  

 

 

 

 

5 hours ago, WERRIDEE said:

 

I don't see the need to cut rookies unless the AFL cut the list. It's a compromised weak draft so you would expect a weak rookie draft. I'd keep Chandler and Dunkley for one more year. If their was a year to keep most of your list intact this would be the year.

Yes to a degree @WERRIDEE. But they are also limited players who would only get games of our list was hit with a big injury list.

Realistically Dunkley is already behind Sparrow and Jordon for that midfield spot. Not once did he get named emergency at all. He's just another inside midfielder who making up number on our list.

Chandler is a bit the same. He's behind Pickett, ANB, Hunt, Spargo and even Bedford.

Our aim for this trade period and draft is fast outside players/tall forwards.

I agree with those who suggest we won't just do a massive cull. However, if the list shrinks by 2 and we want to draft 3 kids, that's already five spots before we get to any FA/trade decisions or additional draft picks.

Based off @Lucifer's Hero's list, I'd start with Jones, Bedford and J Wagner. If Jones wants to play another year we have a very difficult conversation on our hands but I just cannot see a best 22 for us in 2021 that features Jones consistently.

I don't think we should be keeping all three of OMac, Hore and Smith. I think one has to go and IMO it should be OMac: he's had plenty of time on our list to develop but just has not fixed his weaknesses.

That's four, and I suspect there will be one or two more, which starts to put pressure on Hore (although I like him and would prefer him to Smith), Hannan (how many times was he dropped this year?) and then Jordon and Nietschke. Hard to know if it's fair to keep them when they've not had the chance, but the flipside is that we can't hold onto speculative players indefinitely just to see if they can crack a game in 2021.

Rookie wise I'd keep both Brown and Lockhart, both of whom should probably be on our senior list. Subject to knowing the full story and context to the Bennell issue, I'd keep him as I think he could make a big difference in 2021. I'd otherwise move on from Chandler, Dunkley, C Wagner and Bradtke.

I don't know how retirements affect the salary cap but the writing is on the wall for Jetta and KK (for different reasons) and I'm not sure either will be getting much game time in 2021.

6 minutes ago, drdrake said:

Trade

Buddle up Sparrow and Petty for Adelaide second round pick 19

why would u put 2-3 years developing both these boys to ship them off for a mid range draft pick in a compromised draft... these two have shown the most promise and most chance to break into the 22 consistently

Always interesting to have this discussion every year! IMHO we need to target 2 ready made players from other clubs using a few players with something that others clubs can utilise. The ones most likely would be Preuss to GWS, ? Perryman and TMAC/Sparrow/Dunkley to Ess for Saad.

If Daniher is open to coming to us and we can sort out his issues that would solve some of our glaring issues. 

All of our draftees must have kicking and marking skills

12 minutes ago, Turner said:

why would u put 2-3 years developing both these boys to ship them off for a mid range draft pick in a compromised draft... these two have shown the most promise and most chance to break into the 22 consistently

Petty can't get his body right and Sparrow is more of what we have.  To have pick 19 and 22 you can use one to on trade or bundle up to get into the top 10 or take to the draft there will be good players available at these picks. 

10 minutes ago, drdrake said:

Petty can't get his body right and Sparrow is more of what we have.  To have pick 19 and 22 you can use one to on trade or bundle up to get into the top 10 or take to the draft there will be good players available at these picks. 

so you've done a thorough medical on petty and have come to the conclusion that he will never get better?

People have forgotten how handy Petty is

Edited September 21, 20204 yr by Dr.D

2 hours ago, Pollyanna said:

No-one here can make a sensible call on Jordon, Nietschke, Chandler, Dunkley or Bradtke given the season we've had and the fact that we haven't been able to see them play.  The FD however will know what they want to do.

Agree but I think it's worth noting that the club definitely thinks we should be threatening top 4, so given we are reducing list sizes, imo when considering "non best 26" players, they will make a call on who can play a role next year, because it is very hard to hold onto players to develop them with smaller lists. 

We cannot afford to cut too many unless we trade  

The IMO will be minimal.

KK .              injury list for too long   Concussion

Nietscke       Knee reco  times 2 .....Risky

Dunkley         No games played 2020  

Jones            Time is up         Great servant 

Jetta              Touch and go     he will possibly make the call.

Smith              Played last 3 games        Trade  or Delist       Has a contract Why?   

He was given the games in the hope there would be some currency on the table.  IMO.

These are the first steps l would be looking to do.

 

3 hours ago, Turner said:

 

if you look at it every single club has roughly 8 list changes every season on average from premiers right through to spooners. + an extra 2 for the shrinking of list sizes its pretty realistic, and u cant say theres not 10 players on our list that shouldn't leave

I think this year is not like every single year though.

37 minutes ago, Dr.D said:

so you've done a thorough medical on petty and have come to the conclusion that he will never get better?

People have forgotten how handy Petty is

When was the last time this guy played a game?

The guy has played 3 or 4 games in as many years, even if you add in Casey games he has struggled getting his body right.  He played a forward cameo for 2 games, his debut down back wasn't good.  I think people get over excited by a player.   Could he get his body right and claim either a KPP Forward or back role, yes, will he be able to maintain a high level performance no idea he hasn't to date.  

1 hour ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

But has Lewis done the coaches' course? Following the Essendon fiasco I seem to recall a new ruling from the AFL that clubs can now only appoint as Senior Coach (or possibly to any coaching role) people who have undertaken and passed the coaches' course.

Even if it isn't mandatory, I think any club would be crazy to appoint as a senior coach anyone who isn't properly accredited. And they would be just as crazy to appoint as senior coach someone who hasn't had a number of years of proper training as an assistant coach.

I've heard enough from Lewis in his commentary position to be comfortable saying he'll be best placed in the media. He's tried to discuss what we're doing a number of times this year and his lack of insight was noticeable. Not only that, his understanding of players on his most recent team was staggeringly poor.

I'm thinking Jetta and Jones, will be retirements and that KK, Bennell, both Wagners, O McDonald, Bradtke and Dunkley will be delisted.  Bedford must also be in the firing line, simply because Spargo has been starting to show a bit.

It's also possible that Viney may go as a free agent and that T McDonald (and possibly Smith, if he's not delisted) could be traded. Preuss could be another up for trade, giving him the chance to be the #1 ruckman at another club.

If Viney does go as a free agent, then there's no way we would consider getting rid of Sparrow who was starting to show something until he did his shoulder. 

As for Nietscke, I hope that he's given a chance to prove himself... let's not forget we have another player who had two knee reconstructions and he has since been All Australian ruckman. Chandler is another I'd like to see persevered with, as, if I recall correctly, he showed a bit in the couple of games he did play. 

There's no way Petty goes anywhere... he was looking very very good before being cruelled by injury.

Oops! I think I might have just gotten rid of half of our list.

 

I think that the club would want another 300 game player and therefore keep Jones.

This unfortunately would spell doom for Jetta as we can’t keep them both.

42 minutes ago, hardtack said:

I'm thinking Jetta and Jones, will be retirements and that KK, Bennell, both Wagners, O McDonald, Bradtke and Dunkley will be delisted.  Bedford must also be in the firing line, simply because Spargo has been starting to show a bit.

It's also possible that Viney may go as a free agent and that T McDonald (and possibly Smith, if he's not delisted) could be traded. Preuss could be another up for trade, giving him the chance to be the #1 ruckman at another club.

If Viney does go as a free agent, then there's no way we would consider getting rid of Sparrow who was starting to show something until he did his shoulder. 

As for Nietscke, I hope that he's given a chance to prove himself... let's not forget we have another player who had two knee reconstructions and he has since been All Australian ruckman. Chandler is another I'd like to see persevered with, as, if I recall correctly, he showed a bit in the couple of games he did play. 

There's no way Petty goes anywhere... he was looking very very good before being cruelled by injury.

Oops! I think I might have just gotten rid of half of our list.

 

Jetta and omac have contracts we will not be paying out player contracts in this environment.

Edited September 21, 20204 yr by old dee

Re-contract: Fritsch, Spargo, Petty, Sparrow, Jordon, Hore, Lockhart, Hibberd, Nietschke

Delisted: Wagner, Wagner, Dunkley, Bedford
Trade: Tom Mc
Retire:  Jones, Jetta*, KK*
Decision time: Viney

Fringe: Chandler, Bennell, Smith, Oscar, Hannan, Hunt, Brown, Bradtke**

*Nev and/or KK might have to be redrafted as a rookie then replaced over summer
** Bradtke likely stays assuming he keeps Category B status

The future of the fringe group depends on who else we can get, how low the list size shrinks to and how many we trade out. 

5 minutes ago, old dee said:

Jetta and omac have contracts we will not be paying out player contracts in this environment.

We should do what the Pies did with Daniel Wells for Jetta. Retire him and give him a job in the footy department and community department. That means the money gets split under the footy department cap and in normal expenditure. Nev can provide more value to the club in a role like that than he would playing on.

It only costs 80k extra and a rookie list spot to bring in a rookie in his place.

Oscar is out of contract according to articles from 2018.

11 minutes ago, old dee said:

Jetta and omac have contracts we will not be paying out player contracts in this environment.

Fair point... but I have Jetta as a retirement (I'm assuming it will be his choice), so wouldn't that break any contract arrangements pertaining to his being paid out?

Edited September 21, 20204 yr by hardtack

3 hours ago, binman said:

If we took Perryman i would want him to be on a purely performance based salary.

So when he was having a shocker at the G i could yell out:

DON'T PAY THE PERRYMAN!!!

????

I haven't read all this thread but can someone tell when meetings /delistings are likely to start being announced?

1 minute ago, Bitter but optimistic said:

I haven't read all this thread but can someone tell when meetings /delistings are likely to start being announced?

Two weeks ago... they just forgot to let us supporters know.

34 minutes ago, DeeZee said:

I think that the club would want another 300 game player and therefore keep Jones.

This unfortunately would spell doom for Jetta as we can’t keep them both.

Of course you can, particularly with the reduced player numbers but more important reduced coaches, they can both play and help out with the coaching side of things. 
Jetta would also offer great support for the young indigenous boys. 
They might not play every game but if you had to pick a squad of 30, they would both be comfortably in it. 

5 minutes ago, hardtack said:

Fair point... but I have Jetta as a retirement (I'm assuming it will be his choice), so wouldn't that break any contract arrangements pertaining to his being paid out?

Why would he retire HT?

1 minute ago, Bitter but optimistic said:

I haven't read all this thread but can someone tell when meetings /delistings are likely to start being announced?

Clubs that missed finals were doing their exit interviews even before round 18 so they could get up and out of the hub ASAP.

I'd imagine given we were a legitimate finals chance until last night that we'll be holding off at least until now.

I doubt we'd do what North did, but it's likely rumours or confirmation of at least the first batch come through this week. Usually we wait until the trade period for a second/third group of list changes.