1 hour ago, dazzledavey36 said:

Besides two brain fades, I thought Smith defended well. I can certainly see why the coaches are in love with him. His athletic ability is quite freakish.

I do wish he was playing up forward though.

Spot on DD.  Apart from 2 brain fades he was very solid for a bloke essentially re-starting his career after injuries and a longtime out. Steven May would be on 3 times his money and probably had 3 brain fades when you consider his poor attempt at a mark 3rd man up which got over the back and resulted in their first goal plus his pathetic kicking out which included a look away attempt that he pulled across his body and it was just good luck it didn’t come straight back over his head for another goal.  Lever would be on twice his money and was no better than Smith.  I’m staggered that anyone would suggest dropping him after that game to bring back Hibberd the turn over merchant or slow as treacle Oscar.

What people must realise is that you can’t play all 3 of Oscar, Jetta & Lever because they are so slow.  When you consider that Salem isn’t quick but great kicking skills, you can understand why they’re trying to get some run out of defence via Harmes, Joel Smith & Rivers.

Just unfortunate for Smith that his 2 errors were so graphic that a few on here highlight him instead of others that were totally useless to rather ineffective but inconspicuous, eg Tom MAC, Nathan Jones, Melksham, Lever, May.  All of whom are far more experienced and on much more money.
 

 

 

1 hour ago, binman said:

As i posted i don't understand why they have not stuck with him as a forward.

They've explained why. See the Troy Chaplin interview. With his relative youth and injury history, they feel that there are less demands on his body in the backline. Also that his versatility (play on tall/small) and athleticism are more damaging down back where he can play as an attacking defender.

But heh, it's just a whole football department full of experienced professionals making these decisions, what would they know?

Re changes, Weideman for Jackson is a no-brainer I would have thought, though playing Brown against his old club would make sense. Pickett in perhaps (though will the club be looking to add to his penalty?), for one of Jones, Hunt, ANB.

I don't think they'll be changing too much in the backline, they need continuity. Jetta out maybe, but that's a tall one and depends on matchups, though Essendon have some nippy forwards.

6 hours ago, DeeSpencer said:

Casboult, McGovern and McKay combined for all of 2 goals. I don't think we missed the big witches hat at all.

Cripps got one, I think the other 4 came from crumbing type efforts, hopefully Lockhart is fit and can play next week, as need someone willing to play small defender role!

7 hours ago, DeeSpencer said:

Oscar's been a core part of the team for years when they've continued to all fly at the same ball. It was hardly a new problem tonight.

In fact this may be harsh but I reckon Oscar's lack of reliability in a pack has been a key part of why Jetta, Hibberd and our other small defenders have always been so desperate to leave their men and fly 3rd or 4th or 5th man up.

I've never seen May as a CHB. He played one great game against the Swans chopping 3rd man across against Buddy but otherwise his main strength has been as a lock down defender. His body didn't hold up to the extra kms last year. He's not overly tall and has flat hands when marking. I still think the best role for May is to try to get what the Tigers get with Grimes and before him Rance. Deepest defender who gets his share of intercepts dropping back in to space.

Oscar could come in and play the Astbury role but if we keep midfield pressure combined with having May and Smith behind him he shouldn't face one on ones inside defensive 50. At some stage Jake has to start winning contests even if he's against a dangerous CHF. 

May said before he came to the dees that he played his best when he had Rory Thompson on the last line playing a goal keeper type role, which I think Omac gives us. Allows May to be an attacking CHB, which is where he's played the best games of his career. The reason we have so many flying in packs is the make up of the player, Jetta I think overestimates how good he is in the air, and getting played on Mackay didn't help that mindset, while Hibberd has always been an aggressive back. 

Smith was the wrong move yesterday as we had 3 aggressive talls, we needed one to hang back, which is not in his make up. I love his athleticism and aggression but if the opposition has multiple talls we need omac to play goal keeper. A small forward line and I think he'd work better. 

4 hours ago, D4Life said:

Cripps got one, I think the other 4 came from crumbing type efforts, hopefully Lockhart is fit and can play next week, as need someone willing to play small defender role!

Yes yes yes 

My changes for the bombers would be:

Weid for Jackson - I liked what I saw from Jacko but he's still a bit raw, and weid will create more contests.

Kossie for Jones - ANB had a real impact early as a small forward early but we got nothing all day from Jones. We needed more spark.

I'd leave Smith in, only because the bombers play with a small forward line, if it was the cats this week I'd bring in omac. Melk and tmac get by only just on past performance at this stage. I'd give both AVB and Hannan another run before considering them. I'd also consider Lockhart for Jetta, again gives a bit more spark, for me it's a bigger call than dropping Jones.

Edited June 13, 20204 yr by Red and Blue realist
Backline update

8 hours ago, titan_uranus said:

I just do not see what you see, dazzle. I know you're not the only one, but I thought Smith was our worst defender today by a mile. Lever cops it because we spent two first round picks on him but Smith was so much worse.

If we're going to drop a defender IMO it has to be Smith, but I'm inclined to leave the backline as it is, with one exception: get Harmes out of there. Surely Lockhart can play Harmes' role?

Harmes goes into the middle where someone has to go - Brayshaw is in line to be dropped IMO. I love him, but he and Oliver are emblematic of our problem: sub-standard defensive pressure when we need it the most. 

Hunt and ANB were pretty poor for 2.5 quarters but as they kicked 5 of our 8 goals, I can't see them getting dropped.

Jones and Melksham, though, should be in trouble. Pickett and AVB could be replacements?

I'd also look at Weideman in place of TMac or Jackson (TMac deserves to be dropped but Jackson just doesn't look ready).

If he flies fir marks he has to like anyone else IMPACT the contest.

and please ONLY 2 UP at the one time There is no need for Jets to fly unless he is in a one on one!

Smith was fine today albeit made a couple of errors.  The kid is very inexperienced.   Have a look at Docherty the bloke has been playing for 10 years and made some terrible mistakes also.  All players make mistakes in a game, some are just at more pivotal moments that we remember. 

It was the 1st game back after 12 weeks, we started like a house on fire at a ground we traditionally play terrible at.  When we get to the end of the year we won’t care how the games are won but as long as you get the 4pts. 

There was plenty to like from today’s game.  Rivers being my biggest highlight. 
 

We need to get Weid in, let Jackson develop at the lower levels.  MacDonald was terrible today but his opponent had a brilliant game. 

11 hours ago, Vineytime said:

Let’s start shuffling the deck chairs at selection, again...

There is the usual get out of jail card. 
The real problems are still there as I have banged on about for years.
We lack skill, brains and good coaching to adapt to run ons by the opposition. 
Carlton came back when they started winning  clearances, we turned over the ball and then lost structures. 
Watch the game again people and you will see how many times we turnover the ball, when we have possession, by poor kicking and poor decisions, in kicking to 1 on 2 or 3 opponents. Why? Keep possession and we win easily. 
Also when Pittonet improved in the ruck, we did nothing different. Max should have belted the ball forward to change the dynamic and stop the clearances. 
Our lack of disposal skill has killed us for years and continues to do so. 
Lastly, the Coach seems to do nothing to change what is happening. Why? 
Fix these areas and we are a reasonable side.

 

Edited June 13, 20204 yr by Redleg

11 hours ago, old dee said:

Both are better than a kid who played his only game since under 18’s today. Watching his selection is proof the FD ain’t that clever. Give the kid a chance to develop away from AFL seniors. What they did was put a sixth grader into Uni and wonder why he struggled.

And why did we recruit Brown and renew  The Weid’s contact last year if neither  is not good enough to play in the second game of the season. As you all know I am not a big fan but surely the Weid is better than a kid in his first game since under 18’s. Will any of us be left here at the end of 2022?

Interesting points and propably reflective of the lack of contributors here too, od. 

9 minutes ago, Redleg said:

There is the usual get out of jail card. 
The real problems are still there as I have banged on about for years.
We lack skill, brains and good coaching to adapt to run ons by the opposition. 
Carlton came back when they started winning  clearances, we turned over the ball and then lost structures. 
Watch the game again people and you will see how many times we turnover the ball, when we have possession, by poor kicking and poor decisions, in kicking to 1 on 2 or 3 opponents. Why? Keep possession and we win easily. 
Also when Pittonet improved in the ruck, we did nothing different. Max should have belted the ball forward to change the dynamic and stop the clearances. 
Our lack of disposal skill has killed us for years and continues to do so. 
Lastly, the Coach seems to do nothing to change what is happening. Why? 
Fix these areas and we are a reasonable side.

 

Great point.

10 hours ago, binman said:

As much as i'd like to see OMac back i reckon it would be a mistake to drop smith. Dropping an inexperienced player after the one game, particularly when you have backed him in is bad for everyone i reckon and as rule shouldn't happen. Would do Smiths head in and smash his confidence.

Tmac is another thing all together. I'd be dropping him and replacing him with Weid. Tmac is simply not mobile enough at the moment and has the turning circle of the Ruby Princess.  

But Corey Maynard realized it wasn't for him and retired off the back of his  demolition by Selwood, and Petty came back stronger as a forward. Is it that necessary to play a man down again or have more structural imbalance in defence, just for their individual morale? It could get worse.

Edited June 13, 20204 yr by John Demonic

We showed guts rolling the dice with the inclusions and I said pre game I hope we get a block of games into them. Its time a critical eye was put over some of the regulars including their roles. Viney and Brayshaw have been given a golden run of time on the ball, an area where even a moderate football can get possessions. Harmes to the middle, Salem is rover size and maybe Sparrow comes into consideration in the medium turn. Viney, Brayshaw Oliver does not cut it anymore.

13 hours ago, dazzledavey36 said:

I dont see why we can't play all 3 of Jackson, McDonald and Weideman.

Yet instead of having a skinny half forward flanker at full forward why not stick Weid or McDonald down there instead. Use Jacko as the backup ruckman, and leave Weid and McDonald as genuine key forwards.

Jackson showed there is something to work with. Feel like that more game time and experience the better.

Gotta get Kossi and Vanders in there as well.

'Dazz', if we don't want to play 3 talls then T Mac should be the one to go.

He needs an absolute rocket.

...but it may not work, that good season forward equates to his good season back. We've never seen it again.

I hope we do, we need it.

14 hours ago, Emerald said:

Out: Goodwin's bong

I see you have it.

TMac’s fall from grace is killing us. He looked like an absolute lump out there again yesterday. I watched him try and change direction at one stage and they almost had to let him out the stadium to complete his turn.

1 minute ago, Forest Demon said:

TMac’s fall from grace is killing us. He looked like an absolute lump out there again yesterday. I watched him try and change direction at one stage and they almost had to let him out the stadium to complete his turn.

He has bulked up considerably through his torso - chest & back but it has cost him his agility...

To go with that he couldn’t keep his feet, if he is to be our main focal point up forward we are in strife. 

Just now, Vineytime said:

He has bulked up considerably through his torso - chest & back but it has cost him his agility...

To go with that he couldn’t keep his feet, if he is to be our main focal point up forward we are in strife. 

He looks like he has concrete in his boots at times.

I wonder if the biggest issue is that he can’t handle the no.1 defender? He was great in 2018 playing the 2nd best but since Hogan has left he just can’t beat his opponent.

1 minute ago, At the break of Gawn said:

He looks like he has concrete in his boots at times.

I wonder if the biggest issue is that he can’t handle the no.1 defender? He was great in 2018 playing the 2nd best but since Hogan has left he just can’t beat his opponent.

I’d be shocked if it wasn’t linked to his foot injury from a couple of years ago.

Out TMac, Jackson, Jones.

In Weideman , Pickett Hibberd.

Hibberd to go back and Smith to go forward.

Jetta has also been pretty shaky the last few games and is close to getting dropped for mine. So Jetta for Lockhart Is another possible change.

4 minutes ago, At the break of Gawn said:

He looks like he has concrete in his boots at times.

I wonder if the biggest issue is that he can’t handle the no.1 defender? He was great in 2018 playing the 2nd best but since Hogan has left he just can’t beat his opponent.

Perhaps we should swap him for hogan! I was saying all last year and will continue. We have no one who can provide the 50 goals that Hogan kicked in 2018. Until we get that forward we will not play finals this year or any into the future. Right now we are a bottom five side our failure to put away Carlton proves it.

Smith maybe unlucky and miss out this week and I think Hunt and Jones/ ANB may make way for Pickett and Vanders. I do not even think that Jackson will miss out. He will be given more weeks for confidence building. Agree CFB needs a O Mc but I am not a fan as sometimes he plays for the opposition when he gives away goals.Maybe Hibberd comes in for Smith at CHB...??  Lever def a half back flanker in my mind. 

I dont think Hunt will be dropped being one of our only effective forwards 

1 hour ago, Redleg said:

There is the usual get out of jail card. 
The real problems are still there as I have banged on about for years.
We lack skill, brains and good coaching to adapt to run ons by the opposition. 
Carlton came back when they started winning  clearances, we turned over the ball and then lost structures. 
Watch the game again people and you will see how many times we turnover the ball, when we have possession, by poor kicking and poor decisions, in kicking to 1 on 2 or 3 opponents. Why? Keep possession and we win easily. 
Also when Pittonet improved in the ruck, we did nothing different. Max should have belted the ball forward to change the dynamic and stop the clearances. 
Our lack of disposal skill has killed us for years and continues to do so. 
Lastly, the Coach seems to do nothing to change what is happening. Why? 
Fix these areas and we are a reasonable side.

 

Spot onMr. Leg. The essence of failure is to keep doing same things and To expect a different result.
Our FD is bottom five material. Until we improve them the team will stay there with them.

We actually might have been better to lose yesterday then everyone would realise the Emperor has no clothes. 
no finals this year and the FD will not be able to hide behind “injuries”!

Edited June 14, 20204 yr by old dee