Let's look at some recent deals:

1. Picks 2 and 20 for Tyson and 9 (Salem)
Values Tyson at approximately pick 5. He'd barely played, had knee problems and the Giants didn't want him. Yes we got Hunt late but we would've got him anyway, no impact on the deal. Did we need a ready to play midfielder, sure? But why pay so much?
Verdict: Clear OVERS

2. Bernie Vince for pick 23
Vince was 27 and playing as a depth mid for the Crows, really not doing a lot. We needed a mid and got 23 from Sylvia but we still gave up a solid pick for 3 useful years of a player. That Bernie played so well for us was more of an indication of our lack of depth than his value. 
Verdict: Overs

3. Melksham for 25
Again, the player has been ok but he was in the Essendon 2's at some stages and banned for a year. A solid pick for a depth player
Verdict: Overs.

4. Lever for the farm
Time will tell but the Tigers just won the flag avoiding giving 2 first rounders for Treloar and signing Prestia instead. We acquiesced to a trade demand on the 4th day of the 2 week period.
Verdict: Overs

Convincing players to come to your club with money and opportunity is a way to improve your list. You're meant to win trades by giving up market value then having the player do well in your system. Instead we are paying clearly over market value then hoping the players justify the trades. 

These players have improved the team but they haven't improved the list. It's the reason we still have big weaknesses on the list despite some quality drafting and development. We are using trades to return to the middle of the ladder, not to get ahead of other sides.

Josh Mahoney, the last of the Cam Schwab hires, the journeyman player and failed Neeld assistant coach who did a short course at Harvard. It's time to go. 

 

 

So I take it you don't like Josh Mahoney.

25 is a 'solid pick'. What does that even mean?

 

 

LOL

Been very good for the club and it shows in our rise up the ladder.

I see no mention of the Oliver or Hibberd deals.

Wow. I'd expect better from you, mate. Let's just say we disagree. 

We gave up second rounders in order to fill needs. It's been covered in the Lever thread, but picks are so speculative, even the top 10 picks, let alone picks in the mid 20s.

Just now, DeeSpencer said:

 

Let's look at some recent deals:

1. Picks 2 and 20 for Tyson and 9 (Salem)Josh Mahoney, the last of the Cam Schwab hires, the journeyman player and failed Neeld assistant coach who did a short course at Harvard. It's time to go. 

 

 

Amazing how some usually good posters can make a bit of a toss of themselves in a single over the top post.

Mahoney has done a wonderful job of keeping our list together thus far, and if you want to bag him for Melksham/2nd round, you might want to include AA Hibberd/2nd round in your diatribe.

 

Mahoney is a gold chip member of our team, and deserves recognition as such.

 

 

2 minutes ago, Fifty-5 said:

I see no mention of the Oliver or Hibberd deals.

Selective posting   interesting that Roos, Goodwin, Viney, Taylor input into these deals is not mentioned 

Important to look at trade periods as a whole imo. Lots of deals done to shuffle picks that open up other doors, and I think we have done this moreso than other clubs.

The Lever deal does seem a bit too much to me, but let's see the lay of the land this time next week.

didn't realise mahoney was the list and recruiting manager

And Melksham for 25 is a definite win. 25 is pretty speculative, Melksham had a good first year, and it opened the door to a cut price deal for Hibberd.

Really? We secure the biggest name in however long and you're having a whinge?

Grow up. Seriously.

Bernie was brought in for maturity. If we had pick after pick we would be young. GWS mixed picked with older players. 

We have improved and thats all we can ask for. 

 

6 minutes ago, Fifty-5 said:

I see no mention of the Oliver or Hibberd deals.

They were fair value deals in which the players have been excellent. 

But even if Oliver was a dud I wouldn't be upset with that deal because it was a pick for pick deal that made sense.

What I'm upset with is paying above market rate. It's limiting our improvement. We don't have highly skilled athletic youngsters coming through the VFL learning footy craft.

Each year we still have more players to delist than we know what to do with and back fill the list with speculative options because we haven't given Jason Taylor enough top 40 picks to work with.

1 minute ago, Dirts said:

Bernie was brought in for maturity. If we had pick after pick we would be young. GWS mixed picked with older players. 

We have improved and thats all we can ask for. 

 

We could've taken a pick with 23 and found another Daniel Cross for maturity. That's what teams like Brisbane are doing now.

No mention of the Oliver deal, Hibberd and Lewis deals and the fact that we haven't lost anyone that we wanted to keep over the past 4 years.

People bag out Dodoro then get upset when we don't act like him.

We don't play games with trades. Our list is top 4 worthy, it's time for the High Performance team and the players to deliver.

When I first saw the deal I did not see we were getting Adelaides second back.

Pick 10 & 15 (approx) for Lever and 35 plus we upgrade a 4th to a 3rd next year (which is around another say 10 pick upgrade) looks pretty good to me, gone are the days where our first round pick is going to be top 3 and worth the farm. At the end of the day there isn't too much between a early second and a late first. 

We still have a pretty decent draft position with 27, 35 and probably 29 from the Watts trade.

You have to give to get quality.

5 minutes ago, Forest Demon said:

And Melksham for 25 is a definite win. 25 is pretty speculative, Melksham had a good first year, and it opened the door to a cut price deal for Hibberd.

Why not 35 for him? Use the extra pick value on upgrading the later pick that we took Liam Hulett with who is now out of the club. Could've taken Harley Balic and had him 2 years in to our system. Whatever pick we use on Balic now could be used on a the pacey player we need.

It's not about players it's about VALUE!

I think a Bex and a good lie down is in order DS

Bernie Vince has won a b&f. No matter how hard your critearia this has to be a win for a pick in the 20's

 

Mahoney, get away
Get a good player on less pay and you're okay
Mahoney, you're flash
Grab those picks with both hands and make a stash
New star, on radar, big star daydream
Think you'll buy me a football team

Mahoney, get back
He's all right, Jack, kindly keep off his back
Mahoney, you're a hit
Try to get that Watts boy to commit
I'm in the high-anxiety hand wringing demon set
All I want from the draft is a jet

Way off the mark here. It's actually baffling that us recruiting a marquee player has resulted in an attack on JM. Only on DL ... 

 

What a bulls hit thread. And it's not even school holidays

I remember the hawks passing over two first rounders for Burgoyne with bad knees. theysaw their target and got it over the line.

We saw our target, yes I thought  we could have done better but we have him now. I couldn't spend another season watching the McDona;ld brothers turn the ball over with little pressure. Now we half at least half a backline who can kick in Lever, Hibberd and Jetta.

 

Also the Vince deal was worth it every day of the week.

 

and Melksham for pick 25?. Let us know who you would have chosen that was better. He was good this year.