Post Season Discussion 2016

[Older demon 2,779]

To me the big surprise is just how well we did with the introduction of so many first year players.

Surely the expectation, that gains over the last few years would see improvement but with established stronger bigger bodies. To have Lamumba, Dunne, Garland, Dawes, Grimes and Pederson play little or no part in the year would not have been part of the plan and the expectation should have been that this group lead our youngsters forward. This did not happen and the fall off in all this group is alarming. These are the seasoned bigger bodies expected to shield the kids. Geelong's and last week, Carlton's bigger bodies out muscled and tackled us. Not for the first time yesterday and throughout the year we were unable to stick tackles or break them.

Do not have high expectations next year as many of this years youth will only be in their second year and there is often fall away in year 2. I see 2-3 years before we harden up, unless we get some older bodies in. Do not expect the young guys to automatically advance, Roos at his presser said they need to spend the next 8 weeks (their break) working hard to return to pre season well prepared. I am rapt in the progress of Oscar and emergence of Hunt and didn't see that coming. Oliver is a beast as is Trac and I like the way Frost streams out the backline. But each an every player needs to find improvement for next year.

The leadership group is thin for experience and muscle and can we expect the same output next year from Nathan, Bernie and Neville.

Desperately need a ruckman forward to support Max as all the big boys are running with 2 and the Eagles and Hawks will be scouting for similar.

A good year with a sour end and no promise of advancement next year but certainly we have improved.

[Wiseblood 24,637]

Forget yesterday.  Geelong were in unbelievable form and we didn't really want to be there.

Our improvement has been good, and I'm pumped for the off season and already looking forward to 2017.  We've got lots of talent on our list, we'll add more experience in the form of Melksham and probably Hibberd, and we can get another summer into the legs of our younger players.

I'm sure many will hang their hat on yesterday, but I won't be one of them.  I'm looking forward to 2017 with plenty of optimism - the alternative makes it a very, very long summer indeed.

[JV7 2,354]

I think the year has been a success... 10 wins for the first time in a decade. Won 3 on the trot, beat the Hawks, won in SA, won in Darwin. The losses to Essendon, Carlton & twice to St.Kilda were the low points. Having said that we are in a much better position than those 3 sides moving forward so in the long run they don't phase me too much, over the next season or 2 those losses will correct themselves, albeit with the inevitable upset here or there.

We will put a gap between ourselves, Richmond, Collingwood, Gold Coast & Carlton next year & WILL go past North & should leap frog Port & St.Kilda

The huge improvement from Gawn has been enormous. Games and quality performances in Petracca, Hunt, O. Mcdonald, Oliver, Harmes, Stretch. Tyson & Viney taken another step. Kent had a good uninterrupted season. Watts emerged as a key forward. Frost has settled into defence. 

There are a lot of positives to come from the season. Bring on 2017, after 10 years will finally be talked about in people top 8 predictions!!

[praha 11,240]

I've certainly calmed down since yesterday. 

My pass mark was 10 wins and they reached that. Was the season a "success"? I think a few games, in particularly yesterday, make us less of a "destination" club. We have to work harder to attract free agents than the Richmond or Hawthorn or Collingwood teams of the world. 

That said, Bulldogs won 7 games in 2014 and played finals in 2015.

Port won 5 games in 2012 and played finals in 2013.

I think that we still have too large a gap between a young players and experienced leaders. Goodwin still has a lot of work to do in order to balance out this list.

[Diamond_Jim 12,628]

Let's face it ....the youngsters in the main went forward whereas the bulk of the senior players went backwards.

Very happy for Watts and looking forward to a possible A+ grade season next year. (I would rate this season at around B+ to A- for Watts.)

Gawn is good(excellent in fact) and we need to leverage his hit outs. TBH I am not convinced that in the modern game a dominant ruckman (as contrasted to a round the grounds taker of contested marks at which Gawn excels) is an essential component.

I am looking forward to next season..... I will wear my usual cloke of pessimism that I find is an essential defence if one is to avoid the usual miseries of being an MFC supporter. So a glimmer of hope perhaps but I can only look at GWS' list with envy and think.....(hell I am not sure what to think).

[Lil_red_fire_engine 11,233]

We have clearly improved as the stats don't lie. Its the intangibles of what defines improvement that will be up for debate and most of this will be based on expectations held prior and during the year or the factors that people believe influenced the statistical improvement.

I hoped for 10 wins at the start of the year (which we did), to take a finals team scalp (which we did ), win away (which we did) and win the games we were clearly expected to (which we didn't).

I am amazed that we did this whilst blooding so many young players at once and accept the variance that comes with playing so many of them. The peek into the future shown particularly by Oliver, Hunt, O-Mac and Petracca really made the year worthwhile.

We showed we have an elite weapon at our disposal in Gawn and the ability to play such an exciting brand of footy to watch were also important stamps for me this year.

However the improvement came off the back of a close to injury free year where Salem aside we were able to keep most on the park that we wanted at most times. Whilst Casey has been great all year in most cases it was proven those that dominated down there were a rung or two below what we need to elevate at senior level.

The biggest disappointment to me was even after 3 years of the culture buster that is Roos, our leadership is still in the lowest ranks of the AFL and I still see a gap between those mature enough to do it now ie: Jones, Vince and those that have the natural attributes to be the true leaders we need. I suspect we have seen the best of both Jones and Vince as footballers and the older they get the more focus they will put on individual performance and not on the team. It will be interesting to see how that manifests over the preseason. 

 

 

 

Edited August 28, 2016 by big_red_fire_engine

[At the break of Gawn 4,460]

7 minutes ago, big_red_fire_engine said:

We have clearly improved as the stats don't lie. Its the intangibles of what defines improvement that will be up for debate and most of this will be based on expectations held prior and during the year or the factors that people believe influenced the statistical improvement.

I hoped for 10 wins at the start of the year (which we did), to take a finals team scalp (which we did ), win away (which we did) and win the games we were clearly expected to (which we didn't).

I am amazed that we did this whilst blooding so many young players at once and accept the variance that comes with playing so many of them. The peek into the future shown particularly by Oliver, Hunt, O-Mac and Petracca really made the year worthwhile.

We showed we have an elite weapon at our disposal in Gawn and the ability to play such an exciting brand of footy to watch were also important stamps for me this year.

However the improvement came off the back of a close to injury free year where Salem aside we were able to keep most on the park that we wanted at most times. Whilst Casey has been great all year in most cases it was proven those that dominated down there were a rung or two below what we need to elevate at senior level.

The biggest disappointment to me was even after 3 years of the culture buster that is Roos, our leadership is still in the lowest ranks of the AFL and I still see a gap between those mature enough to do it now ie: Jones, Vince and those that have the natural attributes to be the true leaders we need. I suspect we have seen the best of both Jones and Vince as footballers and the older they get the more focus they will put on individual performance and not on the team. It will be interesting to see how that manifests over the preseason. 

 

 

 

So you're essentially saying Jones and Vince will become more selfish? Interesting call given that Roos has spent 3 years telling Jones that a good performance for him isn't about a 30 possie game but an effort that lifts the team.

[dazzledavey36 55,347]

Going by this article  it seems Pedolanko will be kept on the list for another year as the club have sent him off for surgery.

Great news!

 

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/leader/localfooty/box-hill-hawks-farewell-iles-casey-scorpions-say-hello-to-finals/news-story/b2c3f6cd3c39b57b5a6bed6bc9d5550a

[Wiseblood 24,637]

3 minutes ago, dazzledavey36 said:

Going by this article  it seems Pedolanko will be kept on the list for another year as the club have sent him off for surgery.

Great news!

 

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/leader/localfooty/box-hill-hawks-farewell-iles-casey-scorpions-say-hello-to-finals/news-story/b2c3f6cd3c39b57b5a6bed6bc9d5550a

Agreed.  I think he finished off the season quite strongly and is good insurance going forward.

Doesn't bode well for Dawes, though.  I can't see the club keeping both on for next season.

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, dazzledavey36 said:

Going by this article  it seems Pedolanko will be kept on the list for another year as the club have sent him off for surgery.

Great news!

 

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/leader/localfooty/box-hill-hawks-farewell-iles-casey-scorpions-say-hello-to-finals/news-story/b2c3f6cd3c39b57b5a6bed6bc9d5550a

Stuie will be pizzed...

[beelzebub 23,383]

1 hour ago, Diamond said:

Make or break what? It'll be pretty much the same as this year.

If we cant advance NEXT  year...we NEVER will...ever again. Its that simple. We either become relevant  or we are irrelevant to the competition..and a hoard of supporters

[John Crow Batty 8,879]

Watching the replay  the TV cameras were constantly crossing over to our coaches box in the last half of the game. Never seen Roos as well as the rest of the coaches so disapointed ever.  It must have really hurt.

Edited August 28, 2016 by america de cali

[Lil_red_fire_engine 11,233]

32 minutes ago, demon9 said:

So you're essentially saying Jones and Vince will become more selfish? Interesting call given that Roos has spent 3 years telling Jones that a good performance for him isn't about a 30 possie game but an effort that lifts the team.

It's natural behaviour that as their abilities decline they are likely to become more focussed on their own form than the team. Particularly when leadership does not come naturally to either of them. May not be next year but they both appear to have reached their best.

Edited August 28, 2016 by big_red_fire_engine

[At the break of Gawn 4,460]

12 hours ago, DemonAndrew said:

it was a real up and down season.

 

a massive let-down in the last two weeks. hopefully not a sign of things to come in 2017.

 

there's nothing quite like going 'BANG!' after an appalling final round performance...here's my player ratings for the entire season after a flattening final round.

 

1. jesse hogan - 5.5/10. a real hit and miss season. if he doesn't mark the ball he doesn't get involved in the play, provides little to no defensive pressure, and can't do much below his knees. could be a superstar, but might not be

2. nathan jones - 7.5/10. still too many cotchin-like games where he is 'busy' but doesn't do much with the ball, but his best is still great and 
generally speaking when he's up and about we look a better side

3. christian salem - 2/10. great last game, but he needs to actually play regularly to achieve more out of his football as he is clearly one of our more naturally talented players

4. jack watts - 7.5/10. probably his best season, but he still goes missing throughout games and has lapses into poor second efforts on too many occasions, and needs to continue to work on that

5 christian petracca - 6.5/10. shows a tremendous amount of promise, but he dips in and out of games too frequently for my liking and for a player with such exquisite skill too often tries to overdo it

6. chris dawes - 1/10. hope he gets another crack at another club, but he's fundamentally had a shocking four years at melbourne through both injury and poor form, good luck for your future

7. jack viney - 8.5/10. a great season, but his last several weeks have been very poor and his disposal needs a lot of work as too often he makes mistakes at key moments

8. heretier lumumba - 1/10. hope he retires, good luck for your future

9. jack trengove - 3/10. i'm happy that he's been able to come back to play afl-level football, and i'm hoping he can come back but i definitely see him as that sort of 28-32 on the list player who can play a role when required

10. angus brayshaw - 4.5/10. i really question how good he'll be; his disposal under zero pressure and hitting a teammate short is the worst i've ever seen even if his effort cannot be questioned

11. max gawn - 11/10. an amazing season. he's clearly tired as the year has gone on, but he's had an absolutely brilliant 2016, i'd say 9/10 in reality

12. dom tyson - 7/10. a very good second half of the year in particular, but he's another player whose disposal is poor and he often loses possession at key moments in games by turnover or by being caught holding

13. clayton oliver - 7/10. i understand that they're probably managing him, but he's clearly our second best clearance player already - big things expected and i would rather he play in the afl than the vfl

14. lynden dunn - 2/10. depth at best. others have gone past him and his inability to adapt to the gameplan was glaring

15. billy stretch - 7/10. an up and about and lively player who more often than not makes the correct decision, think he'll be a good 'n as he makes the 'right' decisions more often than not

16. dean kent - 7/10. vital to giving us some genuine run through the midfield into the f50, we need him to have another strong fitness base; that said, another with dodgy disposal at times under pressure

17. sam frost - 7/10. can't understand why they persisted with him as a forward / ruckman early in the season; looks at home down back and provides great contest and run; same story as so many of our players re disposal by foot

18. jake melksham - gets a pass, for now...but i have massive doubts as to what he'll bring to the side

19. ben newton - 1/10. had an interrupted preseason which probably put him on the back foot, but i think he's a likely player to be cleared off the list

20. colin garland - 1/10. i still can't fathom giving him a three year deal at the end of last year; should've been two as he's not in our best 22 and barely a depth player as key defensive cover

21. cam pedersen - 5/10. massive mistake not to have him in against carlton, as for the most part he's serviceable and provides a great contest; misses too many games through injury and goes missing in patches too yet i think we have to retain him to give us depth in talls

22. viv michie - 1/10. probably a case of an excellent player at a lower level but not afl-ready, as his disposals at afl provided no advantage for the side despite his deceiving efficiency and his defensive coverage was non-existent, good luck for the future

23. bernie vince - 6/10. really hope his last seven or so rounds were due the knock against the power in darwin, as he has been pretty ordinary in the second half of the year and hopefully father time has not suddenly caught up with him

24. jay kennedy-harris - gets a pass, for now...his body clearly let him down all year, but if it's true that carlton are offering a second round pick for him i'd take it; don't reckon he's fast or skillful enough based on previous years

25. tom mcdonald - 8/10. by far and away our best tall defender, and whilst he makes mistakes and stuffs up attacking plays from time to time, we're better for having him than not

26. sam weideman - 3/10. probably a mistake playing him against carlton, but once that was lost might as well have played him against the cats, despite how little readiness he had for the afl-level game, but in truth the same was true for o mac in his first games too

27. liam hulett - pass, really thought he'd have made the senior side ahead of the weed as he looks the more physically ready player at this stage

28. oscar mcdonald - 6.5/10. we had to blood him at some stage, and he's ahead of the older options in terms of his ability to impact the play...probably both positively and negatively, although his run of games since the bye has been impressive

29. jayden hunt - 7.5/10. the find of the season, with his pace a massive weapon that whilst occasionally sees him run into trouble, i'd rather encourage his willingness to take the game on than curb it

30. alex neal-bullen - 2/10. a super disappointing second season at afl level, unable to replicate any of his vfl form; his skills didn't look up to snuff, but like other youngsters he either deserves more time or an opportunity elsewhere

31. jack grimes - 1/10. just looks cooked as an afl level player; i'd like to think he'd make it elsewhere, but unfortunately i think his lack of pace and skills sees him exposed at afl level

32. tomas bugg - 4/10. a lively player who is aggressive and in-your-face, he misses too many targets by hand and foot and goes missing for too many extended periods of time to be a best 22 player

33. jack spencer - no rating, never got a go so unfair to rate him, but i worry if he's our back-up if gawn goes down

34. mitchell king - unfair to rate, hopefully the season out will see him learn a lot a la gawn, hogan and petracca

35. ben kennedy - 5.5/10. i think he's better than others, as i like his turn of speed and his ability to impact the scoreboard, plus i think he 'goes when it's his turn...he's probably not best 22, but he's not far off it

36. jeff garlett - 4.5/10. see, i would've had kennedy's buzziness in the forward 50 ahead of garlett's for the majority of the year; no doubt jeff is a more talented player but he doesn't do nearly enough with his talent

37. aaron vandenberg - 6/10. i basically see vdb as playing a default chf role - he gets up the ground, competes in the air, tries to hit the scoreboard, provides some defensive pressure, but he's really let down by his disposal when he gets it it, which is infrequently

39. neville jetta - 8/10. our best defender by a street, as there's no one else in the side that can play the role he does, to lock down on the best small forward plus also provide a lot of run out of the defensive 50

41. mitchell white - 2/10. he doesn't offer much more than depth, and it would be a surprise if he was upgraded to the senior list after the mandatory two years on the rookie list

42. josh wager - 3/10. he's first cab off the rank, more or less, for tall(ish) defensive coverage, and he's able to provide a bit of run, but he really doesn't impress as an afl-level or afl-ready player

43. james harmes - 4/10. he was good in patches in three roles, from a marking half forward to a wingman and then as a defender, but his disposal is just nowehere near good enough

44. josh smith - unrated, hopefully he can continue to develop at casey next year and become a surprise packet

45. matt jones - 6.5/10. a really surprisingly successful season, he's a player who has got a lot out of himself and runs hard both ways; don't really want him in best 22, but he's better than other depth options at this stage

46. dean terlich - unrated, all the best for the future

47. max king - unrated, all the best for the future

 

i think that's it?

 

what's clear i think is that we desperately need:

- a kurt tippett-type, a player who can play both forward and move into the ruck - watts has battled away admirably playing that role but he's not best-suited to it.

- class and skill through the midfield, particularly players who can break lines, hit targets and impact the scoreboard, someone like a fit jaeger o'meara would be ideal, but we don't even seem to be in the conversation to land him, and he's not played a game for two years so fitness is a massive concern

 

of course, these sort of stars hardly grow on trees!

 

in terms of victorians that we could 'lure home' i'd love gaff and 2 metre peter please, preferably traded for a packet of stale twisties so as not to upset the balance of our list.

Overrating Jetta there, don't think he's received a coaches vote this year. Harsh on Hogan as well - the delivery into the forward line for most of the season has been putrid. With better delivery him and Watts could kick 50 each a season.

[Jaded No More 68,974]

Right now the last two weeks are what I can think about when I think about this season. Maybe in a few days the disappointment will fade and I'll be able to recognize this year for what it actually is, an improvement. 

We have a long way to go to become a consistently reliable good side and our list is still to me only 80% AFL level. 

The biggest unknown going forward is whether Goodwin can actually coach.

[Satyriconhome 10,879]

6 minutes ago, demon9 said:

Overrating Jetta there, don't think he's received a coaches vote this year. Harsh on Hogan as well - the delivery into the forward line for most of the season has been putrid. With better delivery him and Watts could kick 50 each a season.

Nev does his job, never will be a match winner, they get the votes, hence Viney, Gawn, Tyson, will be interesting though to see where he finishes in the B&F

[Guest]

Thank goodness I had my Amnesty meeting yesterday. I kept up with scores a bit on my mobile but when we got 52 down, I thought we would stem the bleeding a bit and end up losing by maybe 30 to 48. How wrong I was.

We need to look at the last two weeks separately to the rest of the year.

I said both last year as well as this year that the year need be judged by the result at the end of the season. Was this year an improvement? Without a doubt, yes. Three more wins. Percentage increased by 20. Finals still in the equation until the second last round. Wins against top four teams. Hell, even 9 goal plus losses were reduced  (6 last year versus 2 this year and both coming against the eventual top two teams).

Now let's look at yesterday...

Yesterday was a slap in the face to a bloke who has copped a LOT of the heat for the playing group and effectively insulated them from a lot of criticism. Only once did I ever see PR come out and actively pot the playing group (round 2, 2014) as I believe that was more out of outright shock than anything else.He and others have worked bloody hard on making the club relevant and that is how they repay him. No one thought it was going to be a cake walk but that? That's pretty hard to swallow.

Now that that is out of the way, we need to look at what lies ahead for 2017.

Not that I was happy when we lost to Carlton and were eliminated from finals calculations but I must say that I was looking forward to the reaction of the 'finals or bust' crowd who couldn't see that making the finals this year bought the potential of both reward and risk. Reward in that it gave a young group the chance to play with the absolute best at the time of year all footballers aspire to play in. Risk in that it may give us a false impression of how good we actually are. 

We needn't have worried about a finals berth giving us a false impression of where we are at as the competition gave us a big whack and let us know where we stand. It wasn't just the loss at Shellshocked Stadium. Don't forget the team that comprehensively out played us last week also got towelled up by a team who are currently missing 10 or so of their best players.

Our challenge for next year is three fold. 

1) We need to improve at a rate commensurate with or better than the rest of the competition.  Ever since I have followed the mighty Demons, there has always been this mindset that we will improve every following season but the rest of the competition will stand still and not improve at all. This mindset needs to go.  As far as I'm concerned, only 5 of the bottom 10 (Brisbane, Gold Coast, Freo, Essendon and Carlton) have no chance of making the finals. The other 5 will be pushing for the bottom of the 8 and will be looking at ways at getting that extra 1% that will get them past their opposition. We need to be aware of this. Essentially, we need to learn to respect all our opposition (not just the top 4).

2) If the club were to be reincarnated as a footballer, we would be Brent Crosswell.  There are times when we can come to play and pull out great wins but there are times when, put nicely, we appear uninterested. Let's not go over the specifics *coughessendonandcarltoncough* but we all know what I'm talking about.

3) While some might point at the GCS match as a 'close win', we need to learn to close out games where pressure is tight and the stakes high. I view the GCS game (in light of Bernie's clanger) as one where we basically stumbled over the line. Jack's clutch goal was great but what if Tommy Lynch had connected with that kick? 

The match against the Roos in Hobart, the loss to the Weagles in Perth, the first loss to the Dawks (and you could even make an argument for our loss against Adelaide as one where we just couldn't cope with the pressure cooker) are all prime examples of this. Cooler heads in 3 of these matches and I would have had no concerns about us being ready for finals. We definitely would deserve to be there (albeit still in 8th position).

Goody, the ball is now in your court. There is upside to this team but there are still areas we need to work on. The reality is that while we have done some things well this year, there are also a lot of things that we need to do a lot better.

 

 

Edited August 28, 2016 by Colin B. Flaubert

[grey wolf 226]

It was way too wet in the rainforest so I went down out of the hills and made for my shack at the beach where I strolled to the sand lay in the dune and lit my cheroot. The surf was rolling nicely and two young blokes were catching the long left handers toward the lighthouse in the ghosting distance and it was Jonesy and Harmes must have been late withdrawals I murmured to no one while further down the white crunching sand was a group playing cricket and shouting in good humoured rivalry and I recognised Hogan and watts and viney amongst others and so no one was going to geelong today I mused. And so it was...

But without keeping score or perhaps it was the quality of my smoking cigar but as I reflected it seemed to me I felt a lot calmer at the end of this footy season than for many a moon and it was because I liked the way we played we were exciting with watts and hunt and the macs and mad frosty and weird track and the red head and the beard of course and even with the diamond defence it was a pleasure at last to watch my team even though they handballed in circles and kicked to the opposition at times they were fast and they could run and they were unpredictable and they had flair.

So whats not to like about this season... has anyone got a light?

Edited August 28, 2016 by grey wolf

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, grey wolf said:

It was way too wet in the rainforest so I went down out of the hills and made for my shack at the beach where I strolled to the sand lay in the dune and lit my cheroot. The surf was rolling nicely and two young blokes were catching the long left handers toward the lighthouse in the ghosting distance and it was Jonesy and Harmes must have been late withdrawals I murmured to no one while further down the white crunching sand was a group playing cricket and shouting in good humoured rivalry and I recognised Hogan and watts and viney amongst others and so no one was going to geelong today I mused. And so it was...

But without keeping score or perhaps it was the quality of my smoking cigar but as I reflected it seemed to me I felt a lot calmer at the end of this footy season than for many a moon and it was because I liked the way we played we were exciting with watts and hunt and the macs and mad frosty and weird track and the red head and the beard of course and even with the diamond defence it was a pleasure at last to watch my team even though the handballed in circles and kicked to the opposition at times they were fast and they could run and they were unpredictable and they had flair.

So whats not to like about this season... has anyone got a light?

I always wondered what I would do for my weekly dose of inane, rambling bull**** now that dee-luded has gone AWOL and I believe I have found the solution to my problem.

Edited August 28, 2016 by Colin B. Flaubert

[Chris 2,892]

2 hours ago, DemonAndrew said:

Salem played eight games, Lumumba five.

 

Other than games against the Tigers and yesterday for Salem, I'd say they had very poor years.

Salem also played 7 of those while under the cloud of an undiagnosed condition that turned out to be one that saps you of energy, and he was serviceable without being great in those games. I won't say he had a great year but I certainly wouldn't be anywhere near as harsh as you are on him. 

 

[CBDees 3,167]

17 hours ago, Mickey said:

Improved. Still a work in progress. Some dizzying highs and some disappointing lows. 

Saw some good signs from young guys like Hunt, Omac, Petracca, Clarry and others. Great to see the continued emergence of Viney and Gawn, as well as TMac and Tyson.

But the highlight for me has been the emergence of Wattsy. Has always been a favourite of mine, and he has certainly repaid the faith this year. Couldn't be more rapt for him and the club

Add to that, the re-signing of Trenners. I just get a feeling that he will have a great pre-season and be a key component in our best 22 next year (blitzing $cully)! That is after getting BOG in Casey's Premiership!

[Demons11 7,051]

14 hours ago, DemonAndrew said:

it was a real up and down season.

 

a massive let-down in the last two weeks. hopefully not a sign of things to come in 2017.

 

there's nothing quite like going 'BANG!' after an appalling final round performance...here's my player ratings for the entire season after a flattening final round.

 

1. jesse hogan - 5.5/10. a real hit and miss season. if he doesn't mark the ball he doesn't get involved in the play, provides little to no defensive pressure, and can't do much below his knees. could be a superstar, but might not be

2. nathan jones - 7.5/10. still too many cotchin-like games where he is 'busy' but doesn't do much with the ball, but his best is still great and 
generally speaking when he's up and about we look a better side

3. christian salem - 2/10. great last game, but he needs to actually play regularly to achieve more out of his football as he is clearly one of our more naturally talented players

4. jack watts - 7.5/10. probably his best season, but he still goes missing throughout games and has lapses into poor second efforts on too many occasions, and needs to continue to work on that

5 christian petracca - 6.5/10. shows a tremendous amount of promise, but he dips in and out of games too frequently for my liking and for a player with such exquisite skill too often tries to overdo it

6. chris dawes - 1/10. hope he gets another crack at another club, but he's fundamentally had a shocking four years at melbourne through both injury and poor form, good luck for your future

7. jack viney - 8.5/10. a great season, but his last several weeks have been very poor and his disposal needs a lot of work as too often he makes mistakes at key moments

8. heretier lumumba - 1/10. hope he retires, good luck for your future

9. jack trengove - 3/10. i'm happy that he's been able to come back to play afl-level football, and i'm hoping he can come back but i definitely see him as that sort of 28-32 on the list player who can play a role when required

10. angus brayshaw - 4.5/10. i really question how good he'll be; his disposal under zero pressure and hitting a teammate short is the worst i've ever seen even if his effort cannot be questioned

11. max gawn - 11/10. an amazing season. he's clearly tired as the year has gone on, but he's had an absolutely brilliant 2016, i'd say 9/10 in reality

12. dom tyson - 7/10. a very good second half of the year in particular, but he's another player whose disposal is poor and he often loses possession at key moments in games by turnover or by being caught holding

13. clayton oliver - 7/10. i understand that they're probably managing him, but he's clearly our second best clearance player already - big things expected and i would rather he play in the afl than the vfl

14. lynden dunn - 2/10. depth at best. others have gone past him and his inability to adapt to the gameplan was glaring

15. billy stretch - 7/10. an up and about and lively player who more often than not makes the correct decision, think he'll be a good 'n as he makes the 'right' decisions more often than not

16. dean kent - 7/10. vital to giving us some genuine run through the midfield into the f50, we need him to have another strong fitness base; that said, another with dodgy disposal at times under pressure

17. sam frost - 7/10. can't understand why they persisted with him as a forward / ruckman early in the season; looks at home down back and provides great contest and run; same story as so many of our players re disposal by foot

18. jake melksham - gets a pass, for now...but i have massive doubts as to what he'll bring to the side

19. ben newton - 1/10. had an interrupted preseason which probably put him on the back foot, but i think he's a likely player to be cleared off the list

20. colin garland - 1/10. i still can't fathom giving him a three year deal at the end of last year; should've been two as he's not in our best 22 and barely a depth player as key defensive cover

21. cam pedersen - 5/10. massive mistake not to have him in against carlton, as for the most part he's serviceable and provides a great contest; misses too many games through injury and goes missing in patches too yet i think we have to retain him to give us depth in talls

22. viv michie - 1/10. probably a case of an excellent player at a lower level but not afl-ready, as his disposals at afl provided no advantage for the side despite his deceiving efficiency and his defensive coverage was non-existent, good luck for the future

23. bernie vince - 6/10. really hope his last seven or so rounds were due the knock against the power in darwin, as he has been pretty ordinary in the second half of the year and hopefully father time has not suddenly caught up with him

24. jay kennedy-harris - gets a pass, for now...his body clearly let him down all year, but if it's true that carlton are offering a second round pick for him i'd take it; don't reckon he's fast or skillful enough based on previous years

25. tom mcdonald - 8/10. by far and away our best tall defender, and whilst he makes mistakes and stuffs up attacking plays from time to time, we're better for having him than not

26. sam weideman - 3/10. probably a mistake playing him against carlton, but once that was lost might as well have played him against the cats, despite how little readiness he had for the afl-level game, but in truth the same was true for o mac in his first games too

27. liam hulett - pass, really thought he'd have made the senior side ahead of the weed as he looks the more physically ready player at this stage

28. oscar mcdonald - 6.5/10. we had to blood him at some stage, and he's ahead of the older options in terms of his ability to impact the play...probably both positively and negatively, although his run of games since the bye has been impressive

29. jayden hunt - 7.5/10. the find of the season, with his pace a massive weapon that whilst occasionally sees him run into trouble, i'd rather encourage his willingness to take the game on than curb it

30. alex neal-bullen - 2/10. a super disappointing second season at afl level, unable to replicate any of his vfl form; his skills didn't look up to snuff, but like other youngsters he either deserves more time or an opportunity elsewhere

31. jack grimes - 1/10. just looks cooked as an afl level player; i'd like to think he'd make it elsewhere, but unfortunately i think his lack of pace and skills sees him exposed at afl level

32. tomas bugg - 4/10. a lively player who is aggressive and in-your-face, he misses too many targets by hand and foot and goes missing for too many extended periods of time to be a best 22 player

33. jack spencer - no rating, never got a go so unfair to rate him, but i worry if he's our back-up if gawn goes down

34. mitchell king - unfair to rate, hopefully the season out will see him learn a lot a la gawn, hogan and petracca

35. ben kennedy - 5.5/10. i think he's better than others, as i like his turn of speed and his ability to impact the scoreboard, plus i think he 'goes when it's his turn...he's probably not best 22, but he's not far off it

36. jeff garlett - 4.5/10. see, i would've had kennedy's buzziness in the forward 50 ahead of garlett's for the majority of the year; no doubt jeff is a more talented player but he doesn't do nearly enough with his talent

37. aaron vandenberg - 6/10. i basically see vdb as playing a default chf role - he gets up the ground, competes in the air, tries to hit the scoreboard, provides some defensive pressure, but he's really let down by his disposal when he gets it it, which is infrequently

39. neville jetta - 8/10. our best defender by a street, as there's no one else in the side that can play the role he does, to lock down on the best small forward plus also provide a lot of run out of the defensive 50

41. mitchell white - 2/10. he doesn't offer much more than depth, and it would be a surprise if he was upgraded to the senior list after the mandatory two years on the rookie list

42. josh wager - 3/10. he's first cab off the rank, more or less, for tall(ish) defensive coverage, and he's able to provide a bit of run, but he really doesn't impress as an afl-level or afl-ready player

43. james harmes - 4/10. he was good in patches in three roles, from a marking half forward to a wingman and then as a defender, but his disposal is just nowehere near good enough

44. josh smith - unrated, hopefully he can continue to develop at casey next year and become a surprise packet

45. matt jones - 6.5/10. a really surprisingly successful season, he's a player who has got a lot out of himself and runs hard both ways; don't really want him in best 22, but he's better than other depth options at this stage

46. dean terlich - unrated, all the best for the future

47. max king - unrated, all the best for the future

 

i think that's it?

 

what's clear i think is that we desperately need:

- a kurt tippett-type, a player who can play both forward and move into the ruck - watts has battled away admirably playing that role but he's not best-suited to it.

- class and skill through the midfield, particularly players who can break lines, hit targets and impact the scoreboard, someone like a fit jaeger o'meara would be ideal, but we don't even seem to be in the conversation to land him, and he's not played a game for two years so fitness is a massive concern

 

of course, these sort of stars hardly grow on trees!

 

in terms of victorians that we could 'lure home' i'd love gaff and 2 metre peter please, preferably traded for a packet of stale twisties so as not to upset the balance of our list.

I love your effort and I think most you are spot on with.  In saying that I think Tyson had an enormous year.  I think only Gawn tops him this year. 

[The heart beats true 18,145]

Honestly - I'm super proud and excited to be a Demons supporter. We go to the footy each week now knowing our best footy can beat anyone. It's been a bloody long time since that was the case.

We ran out of puff at the end of the year. That was hard to watch - but what we saw for the month before that was seriously quality.

Brayshaw, Salem, Petracca, Hunt, Harmes, Kent, Hogan, Oliver, Weed, Omac, Frosty, Tyson, Viney and Gawn all have the potential to play 150 games together. If that happens it'll be an exciting period as a Dee.

Ride the ups and downs of supporting a young team, but get behind us. It's an exciting time. 

Go Dees!

[jumbo returns 6,741]

I want Hogan to sign, all the boys to become really good mates, and make a pact to win finals together....as GWS have..

[Guest]

6 minutes ago, jumbo returns said:

I want Hogan to sign, all the boys to become really good mates, and make a pact to win finals together....as GWS have..

I think we are nearly there to be honest if you look at the bond among the group. They are bloody tight. He is the last domino to fall.

I reckon the question that will be asked if he does leave is do we revert to type and fall in a heap after the 'savior' leaves (ala Tom Scully)? Or do we adapt to our new reality like Hawthorn/Geelong post Buddy/Ablett and move onto bigger and better things? 

Edited August 28, 2016 by Colin B. Flaubert