4 hours ago, DemonWA said:

any one able to copy and paste the article and help a brother out?! haha

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/melbourne-has-tough-calls-to-make-on-jack-grimes-and-jack-trengove/news-story/2baa437e4c13b520fff7f2ab7c7cf54a

Melbourne has tough calls to make on Jack Grimes and Jack Trengove

SIMON Goodwin will have to make tough calls on two former co-captains in his first weeks as new Melbourne coach.

Jack Trengove and Jack Grimes remain out of contract for next season after spending the bulk of the year in the VFL.

While the pair will meet with Goodwin early next week to discuss their futures, Trengove, 24, appears more likely to be retained for next season.

Grimes, 27, is expected to consider his options in October’s exchange period after only two senior games this year.

 

They are difficult decisions for the Demons as Trengove and Grimes are two of the most popular members of the playing group who shouldered a lot of burden throughout the disastrous 2012-14 seasons.

But midfield spots will be tightly contested at Melbourne next season as the club looks to integrate banned Bombers pair Jake Melksham and Michael Hibberd into the senior team.

Both are gone IMO. If anything Grimes has more to offer at AFL level than Trengove & that's saying something seeing Grimes papers have been stamped for 2 years... Unfortunately the game has passed Trengove by and pace was never an assest for him & in those injured 2 years he got slower & the game got twice as fast. I wouldn't be against putting him on the rookie list to make sure under another pre season he can't get back somewhere to his best.

Edited August 24, 20168 yr by JV7

8 hours ago, Je Roos Salem said:

Pardon my ignorance but why is it him or pick 80?

Because there's about 6 - 8 other players that will be let go before we even get to Trengove. Eg Terlich, Newton, Dawes, Pedersen, Grimes, M. Jones, Michie, Max King.

Given we have no 1st round pick and our 2nd round pick will go for Hibberd we'll be required to use our 3rd & 4th round picks (45 & 63) at the draft to go with upgrading Wagner for our minimum required 3 list changes.

Now if you want to delist a Trengove as an extra, well then he's replaced with our next pick in the draft ie 81. Otherwise it's by a free or delisted free agent. And looking at the list, there's not much there that excites me.

15 minutes ago, AngryAtCasey said:

Because there's about 6 - 8 other players that will be let go before we even get to Trengove. Eg Terlich, Newton, Dawes, Pedersen, Grimes, M. Jones, Michie, Max King.

Given we have no 1st round pick and our 2nd round pick will go for Hibberd we'll be required to use our 3rd & 4th round picks (45 & 63) at the draft to go with upgrading Wagner for our minimum required 3 list changes.

Now if you want to delist a Trengove as an extra, well then he's replaced with our next pick in the draft ie 81. Otherwise it's by a free or delisted free agent. And looking at the list, there's not much there that excites me.

He will be kept on the list before Trengove.

Edit: So will Pedersen. 

Edited August 24, 20168 yr by JV7

2 minutes ago, JV7 said:

He will be kept on the list before Trengove.

Edit: So will Pedersen. 

Not convinced either will.

Pedersen has barely been sighted since Dawes made his initial return and only came back for a few games late because of injuries to Hogan and weed. Despite playing well he now finds himself out of the team.

Goodwin is all about ball movement and transition and Matt Jones for all his endeavors is the biggest momentum killer in the team when it comes to that. Hasn't been sighted since the Gold Coast game despite big numbers.

Can see Pedersen being rookie listed. Think Matt Jones may be in trouble.

5 minutes ago, AngryAtCasey said:

Not convinced either will.

Pedersen has barely been sighted since Dawes made his initial return and only came back for a few games late because of injuries to Hogan and weed. Despite playing well he now finds himself out of the team.

Goodwin is all about ball movement and transition and Matt Jones for all his endeavors is the biggest momentum killer in the team when it comes to that. Hasn't been sighted since the Gold Coast game despite big numbers.

Can see Pedersen being rookie listed. Think Matt Jones may be in trouble.

Fair call... I think Pedersen will be kept on a one year deal for back up, given Weideman will have another developing year. I think Matt Jones at least provides outside run & carry, I was never a fan but he improved over last preseason & was doing ok until injured in round 4 & wasnt sighted until late in the year. Although with Hibberd & Melksham coming in to play those half back/wing roles could be trouble for Jones.

Edited August 24, 20168 yr by JV7

I think Trengove has some ability if we can find the right role for him, Grimes is gone.

Trengove has the skills and smarts Grimes would love and age to go on his side as well, i'd certainly give him another year, potentially even as a rookie

Grimes is done, he's been great for the MFC but he's been playing out of his skin at Casey and it's still not been enough to get a run, clearly there is something he isn't doing and the club is strong on the fact you need to be doing that to get a run in the 1's

 

First of all kudos to some sensible thinkers on this thread who actually think about the implications of delisting players (Angry and Stuie I'm looking at you two among others). If we delist a player we need to replace them and we need to replace them with something which is either better or has the potential to be better. 

Trenners is 25 and is dominating the VFL. If we had a VFL player doing what he was doing, we'd be calling for him to be drafted to Melbourne. Trenners puts pressure on the 22 every week and what makes him better - he helps those players become better at training because he is a good bloke. If someone offers me a deal for Trenners (say Hibbard for Trenners), I'd say are we going to get more out of Hibbard then Trenners, then make a decision. We will no delist him, or Pederson, or Grimes, or possibly Matt Jones because they have currency and they will fit into a 44 of one of the 18 teams. You do not simply delist a player who is playing that well at VFL level and has shown they are an effective player at VFL level. I promise you that the Roos, Freo, Dons, Carlton, will all be looking at Trenners, Grimes, Jones. Hawthorn will have a look at Pederson if they dont get Vickery. 

This all comes back to "greater than". We wont get a Hunt with a pick 81, but if pick 53 gets offered up for Pederson then we need to ask ourselves the question. I would love to see Grimes playing in a best 22 somewhere in the league next year and I'm happy as long as we get some sort of compensation for it - but this talk of delisting is wrong and short sighted. Every year since Melbourne 3.0 (Roos, Taylor, etc) the in's have been much better than the out's (have a look at Wikepedia of our outs each year and it is very clear why we were at the bottom). Let's keep it that way, alright demonland?

What a fluff piece of an article. 

anyone following footy could tell you Grimes is gone. The 100th game was a jesture of thanks. That's all. Very generous of the club but all talk leads to Rome and not Melbourne here.

Trenners has climbed Everest to get back in the game. He's a smart cookie. Knows how to use a footy well but isn't in top Nick. He'll be afforded a preseason and a year to show whether he can or can't.

One Jack goes, one stays, for the moment. 

Article is a beat up.

9 hours ago, rjay said:

Yes, and you still don't trade out a first round pick...particularly in a strong draft which next years is.

You want to trade down to a 2nd round pick and a couple of depth players you say are not best 22.

So in other words we give away a first round pick for a 2nd rounder...I don't think so.

Errrrr no, we give away a first round pick next year, which would (hopefully) be around 12-16, and get back two young talented players who fill needs AND pick 32 or 34.

I'm being realistic here, I don't see the point in people that try and put up bargain trades that favour us so much there's no chance they will ever happen.

 

Edited August 24, 20168 yr by stuie

11 hours ago, Canplay said:

Trenners needs to be given another year -  and a speed coach.  Perhaps John Quinn who found Jobe Watson a yard of pace. 

Unfortunately Grimes kicking and decision making will see him behind Hibbert, Malkshem, Salem, Hunt, Wagner off the half back flank.

I think it may have been Dank and the juice that found the pace.

Grimes will be a Tiger next year
Trenners will be given one more pre-season...probably a 1 year extension.

This is just me spit balling though.
Interestingly enough though, remember 2 years back when Trenners was almost traded to the tigers prior to him doing his foot agian? and it just fell through?
I suspect that Richmond may still have that in the back of their minds and may still be up for a trade.

12 hours ago, Demons11 said:

Trenners deserves another chance but unfortunately I can't see a spot for Grimes. 

Trenners can and I think will continue to be an amazing story of endurance and resilience. His 'resurrection' will be an inspirational story for our club and our young players for many years.

 

First thing to with all of our older players not getting a game is to see what they want to do.  I suspect they dont enjoy not playing, so some will want to be shopped around.  this could take the delisting issue out of it.  If I was Grimes Garland or Dunn, I'd request a trade.  The first two would get picked up.  then wish them well and thank them for their service.

JT will 100% get one more year.  he had almost 3 years out of footy (played 2 games one year).  he has come back and performed well at VFL level.  I think he can do a preseason and be in our best 25 next year.  he is smart, a good mark and good kicking skills.  not too many of the list we can say that about.  and I just love the bloke

Grimes: 
Decision is easy its saying it out loud that is uncomfortable. He no longer has a place in the side has too many ahead of him and would be better off elsewhere. Sucks to be him but that is footy, sometimes the timing just isnt right, if he had come to the club this year he would be a future champion.

Trengrove:
Trenners is the tough decision. So long out due to injury not tallent, but serious doubts as to whether he will ever be capable at AFL level again. Slower than a turtle strapped to lead weights and plays a role competed for by about so many others. But tries his guts out every time he walks on the park. If a team comes for him with a reasonable deal I suspect the club will take it. However if nobody comes knocking then I guess he gets a 1 year extension. Unfortunately if he gets the extension then never breaks back into the senior side then any currency he has now will be gone by the end of next year...

Trengove i think personally will get another year. Simond Goodwin this year said that when he was at the crows they rated Trengove extremely highly as a youngster and looked like a star on the rise until injury set in.

Gee....I remember a couple of years ago all the 'experts' of this site were saying that Nev Jetta was a slow,weak, and trade bait.....Things change don't they?.

Speed is a funny thing......Hunt has dash and real speed (which we need)    The rest of our midfield are not that quick at running but move the ball with speed.   Oliver is very smart with his hands as is Tyson but not that quick at running.

Posters here are so quick to bag our players, sitting in their easy chair with drink in hand' nit picking at every mistake, say that the grass is greener over the fence,making up trades which have no possibility of happening.

When we do have injuries, and we will, we will need the experienced players like Trenners, grimsey and Pedersen to cover instead of a pimply faced 18 year old.

I hate trade month.....Will be having a rest from DL for a while.

 

Always an interesting time of year and the backlash to North's Harvey treatment highlights how emotional it can be and how side's can get it right and sometimes wrong.

Angry at Casey has already highlighted that there are six to eight expected departures before we even get to Trengove and that list does not include a couple of rumoured trades - ie: JKH to Carlton, ANB to Port - that will probably only happen if the club gets itself in a bind over luring Hibberd.

Trengove and Michie, who I can't figure out why people are saying is going because he's probably the best rookie in the VFL at the moment and is a complete bargain, will be part of a list management decision. Goody's own personal perception will also come into it, but I suspect he has already made hard calls on Grimes and Dunn, who has another year on his contract. Do we want to, or need to, take away our depth of midfielders? Sure we all like Viney and Tyson and Oliver and Brayshaw, but at some point they will have injuries and as the Dogs have shown, you need back up. 

But as I have said before, my biggest annoyance with the club is that it has never, as far as I'm aware, brought in a specific sprints coach similar to what Sydney did with Matt Shirvington to work with the players during the off-season - even for a few weeks. Instead it has left guys who clearly lack pace to down their own work in the off-season. As a result we have seen guys like Toumpas shown the door (he had other flaws as well, mind) and our biggest complaint about Dunn, Newton, Grimes, Salem, Tyson, Michie and Trengove is that they lack pace.

I get the side's need pace for transition, so if it is such a high priority - why do we assume that our fitness coach (Missen) is also a sprints coach. They are two completely different things. Missen knows how to set them an overall program, but I have never seen him working on improving any player's running technique at training. 

So my biggest wish is that we keep Trenners and Michie and that we employ a sprints coach for a four-week period in the off-season and try and correct our only major concern about the way they play football. The group should include Salem and Tyson and Brayshaw and Petracca and any of the players that feel they need the extra speed work. They are still young enough to pick up an extra yard and if they do, we may find they can play a key role - because they all have footy smarts.

 

10 hours ago, DemonWA said:

Lessons should be learned from the mistakes of previous FD’s. Footy clubs are built from people, and both trenners and grimes being shown the door on top of potentially Dunn and Garland (if traded) wipes out a lot of leadership and strength from the playing group. Sure, these 4 might not be best 22 moving forward but if they’re teaching the young guys how to play at Casey and are ready to be serviceable cover for the AFL side as/when injury or form requires.

 

I’d be delisting Terlich, Dawes, Newton & Michie and keeping guys like Trenners and Grimes around.  

 

Me too DemonWA but what if they want to leave to get a regular games elsewhere or at least the opportunity they are not getting at the MFC?

 

I'd keep Trenners and offer Grimes a player / development role at Casey, assuming he wants to move into Coaching/development.

12 minutes ago, chookrat said:

I'd keep Trenners and offer Grimes a player / development role at Casey, assuming he wants to move into Coaching/development.

Grimes is 27 not 35... He wont want to go to coaching just yet

21 minutes ago, Deespicable said:

Michie, who I can't figure out why people are saying is going because he's probably the best rookie in the VFL at the moment

And that's where he belongs, which is why most think he's gone.

 

Both Grimes and Trengove should be retained, unless either wants out for more regular opportunities. Even if they are not considered best 22, it is highly unlikely we will have such a good run with injury again next year, so experienced depth is important.

Clearly Grimes has done something to [censored] Roos off - hopefully his prospects improve once Roos goes. It would be nice to have a coach picking the team on merit again. Trengove will be better for having a full pre season.

If Trengove goes it will be due to foot issues that the club has kept quiet.

if he is fit and his foot is ok then he will remain.

5 minutes ago, olisik said:

If Trengove goes it will be due to foot issues that the club has kept quiet.

if he is fit and his foot is ok then he will remain.

If he has foot issues it hasn't stopped him from playing and dominating VFL.