POST MATCH DISCUSSION - Round 6

[Wiseblood 24,637]

Just now, AdamFarr said:

And we beat GWS who beat Hawthorn by 75 points. What's your point?

He's trying really hard to argue that the club he supports is a rabble.  Why people try and argue that point is beyond me.

[Adam The God 30,421]

33 minutes ago, Wiseblood said:

He's trying really hard to argue that the club he supports is a rabble.  Why people try and argue that point is beyond me.

It hasn't needed arguing for the best part of a decade. It was a fact. But to argue it now is short-sighted. Rounds 3-5 showed me enough of what we're trying to do and that when it works, it works beautifully and is extremely exciting. When our consistency finally clicks, we'll be a very exciting team indeed.

Edited April 30, 2016 by AdamFarr

[DeeSpencer 26,083]

We aren't that good, we aren't that bad.

Saints are good. Home ground. Vintage Nick Riewoldt who's a zone defense destroyer.

Inside mids won the ball, but we lack outside talent to capitalise.

We lack forwards who can impact on the scoreboard and defend. Garlett had his head in the clouds. Too many of our other forwards are good in space but don't have the short space smarts that the best players do. Plenty of work to be done there.

Backline is a mess. But hey, we kind of new that. Dunn got left out for Oscar Mc in round 1. Tommy Mc is Tommy Mc, take the good with the bad. Lumumba is a head case. Salem needs more time to handle teams who can run him up and down the ground. Wagner and Hunt have 5 games between them.

You can't love the extra scoring the zone system has given us this year and hate when it goes balls up. If we don't bring forward pressure and pressure around the ball it's going to happen.

[Buzzy 992]

1 hour ago, Ted Fidge said:

Defence brief for Frost. He gets into good positions, has good hands. Takes at least as many marks and kicks as many goals as the guy he replaced (Dawes), has more upside.

With a little more polish by hand and foot, he'll be potent.

Hmmm, that 1 single mark he took today really showcased his good hands.  

Consistently refuses to lead because he doesn't want the ball and has zero confidence in the air - not much better on the ground.  He's way off and has been in our bottom 2 players in all but one of his 5 games this year.  He only has upside because he can't possibly play any worse.  A fit Dawes would replace him in a heartbeat.

[Fork 'em 6,991]

3 hours ago, btdemon said:

I got there about an hour early today and watched the saints warm up. Their kicking was low, sharp and precise. We don't have enough players who can do this. They cut us up from the backline to goal. Our kicks, in contrast were often down the line to a contest. I don't think i saw StKilda kick out from a point without targeting a player to advantage.

I watched them warm up pre-game aswell and saw them doing full pace leading and passing drills working up a sweat and then looked up the other end to us and we're wandering around having casual shots at goal like millionaires.

Surprise, surprise, just how the game panned out.

[DeeSpencer 26,083]

18 minutes ago, Fork 'em said:

I watched them warm up pre-game aswell and saw them doing full pace leading and passing drills working up a sweat and then looked up the other end to us and we're wandering around having casual shots at goal like millionaires.

Surprise, surprise, just how the game panned out.

I'd love to ask our coaches about this. Because really the Saints aren't a great kicking side. 

Webster and Savage have moments at half back. Newnes is a good long kick. Montagna obviously. Riewoldt kicks lovely to a lead. Not sure about most of the rest. 

We have Salem, Vince, Jones, I like the way Wagner kicks, Dunn can spin it, Watts, Garlett. We've got some guys who can kick a footy now. I just don't think we are using them. 

 

[DeeSpencer 26,083]

By the way, I've heard from a Saints assistant coach that they are number 1 in the league in scoring from kick outs. 

They go long to the far side and get numbers front and centre then quickly kick to a spot down the line, getting guys running in to that space.

So I was far from surprised when they got us out there all the time. Especially from that Frost miss.

I've been waiting a decade for us to do better at kick outs, I hope we take notice of the Saints.

[Adam The God 30,421]

39 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

We aren't that good, we aren't that bad.

Saints are good. Home ground. Vintage Nick Riewoldt who's a zone defense destroyer.

Inside mids won the ball, but we lack outside talent to capitalise.

We lack forwards who can impact on the scoreboard and defend. Garlett had his head in the clouds. Too many of our other forwards are good in space but don't have the short space smarts that the best players do. Plenty of work to be done there.

Backline is a mess. But hey, we kind of new that. Dunn got left out for Oscar Mc in round 1. Tommy Mc is Tommy Mc, take the good with the bad. Lumumba is a head case. Salem needs more time to handle teams who can run him up and down the ground. Wagner and Hunt have 5 games between them.

You can't love the extra scoring the zone system has given us this year and hate when it goes balls up. If we don't bring forward pressure and pressure around the ball it's going to happen.

I maintain Lumumba will look like a headless chook when his team mates don't work on the spread for him. He is also learning to play with the vast majority of them. He's looked the goods when we have brought the work rate this year.

I also thought Salem was terrific in the first quarter and then unsighted afterwards. Did I read somewhere that he copped another concussion?

[TONKA 64]

f**cking disgusting performance. i got my a** ripped on here for not signing up last year and guess what? i still ain't signed up to this dog [censored] team. we wont pass 8 wins again, game over, rebuild, new coach, new players, who f**cng cares anymore???

on a side note well done Jesse, been a long time since I've seen a demon kick a real bag.

[stinga 586]

Nothing to do with the footy.  I went today and prior to the game went into the Victory Room for Melbourne Members and had a coffee.  I am a Melbourne AFL member and had no trouble getting in.  Someone was interviewing a couple of the players from tomorrows VFL game which was interesting.  At half time I tried to return but was told I'm not a Melbourne Member I couldn't go in and there are rooms for AFL members.  There were other Melbourne AFL members also turned away ( the room is directly opposite the AFL members area behind the interchange gates).  I just wondered if anybody else had the same experience.

[Little Goffy 14,645]

Got beaten on the spread from stoppages and on the push back into defence.

Bit short on accountability - too many opponents got loose enough to make decisive kicks.

Had a few passengers and a few players just had shockers.

I was a little concerned by the number of bounces attended by Pederson. Though he fought as he does, it did give a hint that there might be some worries on Gawn's fatigue.

Garlett, well, it's the curse of being a small forward. Would be silly to drop him. 

Frost... honestly, despite two goals, I'm really not convinced of his contribution. 

Lumumba... maybe he deserves some patience for being constantly mismatched, but he blew it a great many times today. VFL time in my opinion.

Other than that, we have to decide which kids need a rest and refreshment, and who we can bring in to shore up our defence a bit.

 

[Fork 'em 6,991]

Pretty sure he clashed heads with Viney so a fair bet he's concussed.

 

[Coq au vin 755]

50 minutes ago, AdamFarr said:

And we beat GWS who beat Hawthorn by 75 points. What's your point?

Different from yours

[jnrmac 20,189]

Last 4 weeks our defence has let in 21, 9, 14 and 20 goals.

The zone thing isnt working and today was a shambles. No-one had a clue what they were doing. Tackles didn't stick. We allowed them to get hands free and dish off to a runner. Infuriatingly Reiwoldt was alone all day. They took 18 uncontested marks iside their fwd 50. Unforgiveable.

Our defence stinks. Dunn had a complete shocker. Salem gets out muscled constantly.Jetta had a shocker, Harmes was poor, Hunt was poor, McDonald was a joke today. Lumumba tried to start some runs but they had him worled out very quickly and he had one of those running in circles before getting caught games.

So much for Roosy teaching us defence first before moving on to offence. Our defence leaks like a sieve. They need to go back to the drawing board. Fast.

Edited April 30, 2016 by jnrmac

[jnrmac 20,189]

7 minutes ago, Fork 'em said:

Pretty sure he clashed heads with Viney so a fair bet he's concussed.

 

And apparently wasn't wearing a mouthguard if you can believe that. His front teeth were wobbly.

[Fork 'em 6,991]

You don't have to wear a mouth guard playing bruise free.

 

[jnrmac 20,189]

11 minutes ago, Little Goffy said:

Got beaten on the spread from stoppages and on the push back into defence.

Bit short on accountability - too many opponents got loose enough to make decisive kicks.

Had a few passengers and a few players just had shockers.

I was a little concerned by the number of bounces attended by Pederson. Though he fought as he does, it did give a hint that there might be some worries on Gawn's fatigue.

Garlett, well, it's the curse of being a small forward. Would be silly to drop him. 

Frost... honestly, despite two goals, I'm really not convinced of his contribution. 

Lumumba... maybe he deserves some patience for being constantly mismatched, but he blew it a great many times today. VFL time in my opinion.

Other than that, we have to decide which kids need a rest and refreshment, and who we can bring in to shore up our defence a bit.

 

Frost had 3 kicks I think. The experiment is not working. Not sure what he hads to the team.

[SaberFang 7,151]

3 minutes ago, jnrmac said:

And apparently wasn't wearing a mouthguard if you can believe that. His front teeth were wobbly.

Surely... SURELY not. No way an MFC player could be that dumb, surely?

[Wiseblood 24,637]

Just now, jnrmac said:

Last 4 weeks our defence has let in 21, 9, 20 and 20 goals.

Garland dropped, backline leaks goals.  It's no coincidence!

And the Tigers didn't kick 20 goals against us, but I get your point.  We still struggle to get the balance right.

[Adam The God 30,421]

Having arrived right on the bounce of play, we waited for a St Kilda player to line up for a shot at about the 15 minute mark of the first quarter, before racing up to Level 3 to get seats. When did Salem suffer this head injury? I completely missed this.

Edited April 30, 2016 by AdamFarr

[SaberFang 7,151]

I'm not convinced it's about balance anymore; I think the gameplan is flawed. How can you spend 2 years focusing on defence yet still leak 20+ goals 3 years later? It makes no sense.

[jnrmac 20,189]

2 minutes ago, Wiseblood said:

Garland dropped, backline leaks goals.  It's no coincidence!

And the Tigers didn't kick 20 goals against us, but I get your point.  We still struggle to get the balance right.

I'll give you credit for consistent championing of Garland but he's not the answer in my book. May get a run next week though because Frost is sure to be out or maybe Dunn after his shocker..

[Fork 'em 6,991]

1 minute ago, AdamFarr said:

Having arrived right on the bounce of play, when a St Kilda player was lining up for a shot about 15 minutes into the first we raced up stairs to Level 3 to get seats. When did Salem suffer this head injury? I completely missed this.

Very late in the 3rd.
Game was long over by then though.

 

Edited April 30, 2016 by Fork 'em

[Redleg 41,481]

And the fact that an 85 year old Saints Captain ran harder and put in more effort than any Demon, is a disgrace.

[jnrmac 20,189]

4 minutes ago, Wiseblood said:

And the Tigers didn't kick 20 goals against us, but I get your point.  We still struggle to get the balance right.

Yep good pick up. changed that.