I recall Roos saying recently that Jack has always been a well liked player around the club, as in he got on with everyone and was "one of the boys", however he has started to realise that earning their respect is a different thing and by playing good football is the way to do that. 

FWIW I think Jack has the potential to be in the leadership group next year (or the year after). He seems to be showing a lot  more passion and becoming quite demonstrative out on the field which is something we haven't seen. These observations alone show the penny has finally dropped for Jack, but I just can't help but wonder why it's taken him so long to care about his football. The positive is though, it's probably an environmental thing which has fostered this change so the football club is cultivating a much better culture these days.

3 hours ago, demon9 said:

I recall Roos saying recently that Jack has always been a well liked player around the club, as in he got on with everyone and was "one of the boys", however he has started to realise that earning their respect is a different thing and by playing good football is the way to do that. 

FWIW I think Jack has the potential to be in the leadership group next year (or the year after). He seems to be showing a lot  more passion and becoming quite demonstrative out on the field which is something we haven't seen. These observations alone show the penny has finally dropped for Jack, but I just can't help but wonder why it's taken him so long to care about his football. The positive is though, it's probably an environmental thing which has fostered this change so the football club is cultivating a much better culture these days.

At a guess, I'd say:

• He's definitely more physically mature this year - finally.
• This is the first year he's been played in the same position every game so far.
• He's developing a great understanding with Hogan in particular. The best passes both of them receive are from each other, and at times they seem to be able to anticipate where the other one is likely to be leading before they actually look. And they're learning to keep out of each other's space (other forwards less so) and even to create space for the other to run into.
• Our ball movement into the forward line this year is definitely faster, and our press to keep it in there for successive minutes is definitely better. We still lose a lot on that final kick into the f50, and our mids need to learn the concept of "kicking to advantage", but overall the delivery to the forward line has improved.

What I'd like him to do now is to feel free to have a crack at goal whenever he gets the ball in the f50, even if he's in a tight situation. There were about 3 occasions on Sunday where, instead of having a ping (like Petracca did in the first couple of minutes), he tried a dinky little pass to find someone in a better position and the chance was lost. If Watts has the ball in f50 and he's under pressure, there's more chance of a goal coming from a snap over his shoulder than from him trying a dinky little pass to look for someone in a better position in a congested space. Get in his ear Tracc!! 

On 6/18/2016 at 3:50 PM, ProDee said:

So entering his prime years and with 8 seasons under his belt you're satisfied if he's holding his spot in the best 22 ?

Here's a spade, so you can start digging and set the bar even lower. 

Why you think it's disingenuous to use this season as a benchmark as we move forward is beyond me. 

Agreed. How wonderful to have a team of players performing at minimum standard.

I'm sure that's how Hawthorn have won all of their flags.

12 hours ago, Vogon Poetry said:

Thanks Nut. Can you just clarify this:

"Am I right in thinking your minimum standards have nothing to do with whether he should be on our list or in our team but where you thought he would be better or worse than he actually was?   "

A player being better or worse than I thought should dictate whether a player is in the team and ultimately on the list.

And that is where it is so subjective.

If I take it as gospel that we tried to offload Watts last year then I can assume that the footy department didn't think he was delivering what he could deliver  - he was dropped from the team and put on the trade table. 

To me each player will be measured differently. To me Gartlett is the far superior small forward to Kent and to my mind they have had similar seasons but I feel Gartlett was axed because he was not working hard enough. I think the expectation of Gartlett is higher than Kent. 

To me Nev Jetta is a 7/10 player. As long as Jetta performs like a 7/10 player or thereabouts he will stay in the team until a 8/10 player comes along who can take his spot. (I know everyone loves Nev on this site as do I - the reason is you get exactly the same from him week in and week out  - the difference between his best and worst is marginal - but he certainly has his weaknesses - he gets burned for speed and doesn't offer enough offense) Ro Bail got lots of games in his first year of Roos because he played to the best of his ability and there was no one better to take his spot. That changed. Dawes is a limited player but in most games plays to his ability and plays his role. He will stay in the team because of this until the likes of more talented footballers like the Weed are ready to take his spot.

As a supporter i have completely different expectations of Dawes and Hogan. So Watts has been in and out of the team and on the trade table last year because he was not playing to expectation. This year he has delivered good football consistently and is rightly being applauded. (if i was backwards looking i would ask why it took so long - but that is pointless). But he hasn't lifted his skills this years - they are pretty much the same as they have been since his 2nd or 3rd year. He has lifted his intent. So he has reached a level this year that will earn him a new contract and that is based on his intent. However I think he still has periods where his intent drops off and we still some of the old Jack - I think he can take his game to a new level by maintaining and lifting his intent.

 

Note  - one does need shift their expectation based on reality. The Ox's knees reco's meant I expected less of him later in his career. Ox's intent never dropped off - just his ability to do what he did prior to the injuries. Judd's game changed in the last years at Carlton - he was not the same explosive footballer he was earlier as he pace dropped off - but his intent never dropped off. It's all about intent

Edited June 21, 20169 yr by nutbean

5 hours ago, nutbean said:

If I take it as gospel that we tried to offload Watts last year then I can assume that the footy department didn't think he was delivering what he could deliver  - he was dropped from the team and put on the trade table. 

As a supporter i have completely different expectations of Dawes and Hogan. 

Thanks Nut, I was really after a one word answer and I'm more confused than ever now but we'll move on.

I also heard from a reliable source that Watts was on the table meaning we were prepared to sell him for a price.  It doesn't mean we didn't want him, only that we suspected he might have a higher value in the market than we thought he was worth and that we thought he  had/has weaknesses we thought were serious but not fatal.  If he'd been delisted he would have been on an AFL list somewhere meaning he had a price.

And in the hope of a simple answer do Dawes and Hogan have the same "minimum standard" to be selected in the seniors?

Great news about about Jack wanting to sign on (if there was ever any doubt)

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/melbourne-forward-jack-watts-says-outgoing-demons-coach-paul-roos-saved-his-career/news-story/a0f2d0e55dee5098b47f9835f491d20b

 

Roosy is a legend.

1 hour ago, TeamPlayedFine39 said:

Great news about about Jack wanting to sign on (if there was ever any doubt)

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/melbourne-forward-jack-watts-says-outgoing-demons-coach-paul-roos-saved-his-career/news-story/a0f2d0e55dee5098b47f9835f491d20b

 

Absolute legend Jack.  After all he's been through -  still loyal, still keen to see success at Dee's & making re-signing sound simple.  Pity T Mac & Co aren't made of the same stuff.

Watts is going to kick around 35 goals himself this year, but his skills, class and smarts will create at least that many more for his team mates.

I am involved at a different AFL club and i can tell you the respect for Jack outside the MFC has gone through the roof this year, he would have attracted significant interest if he remained unsigned. 

45 minutes ago, Abe said:

Watts is going to kick around 35 goals himself this year, but his skills, class and smarts will create at least that many more for his team mates.

I am involved at a different AFL club and i can tell you the respect for Jack outside the MFC has gone through the roof this year, he would have attracted significant interest if he remained unsigned. 

Hmmmmm .............Interesting.  Anything else for us ....?

Edited June 22, 20169 yr by Bigred
duplication

On 6/22/2016 at 8:14 PM, Bigred said:

Hmmmmm .............Interesting.  Anything else for us for us.....?

Respect is growing, that's all that really matters here, it's not just jack either, a few clubs are a bit jealous of the quality of our kids.

Just got some shorts from Jacks side business. Great quality shorts and it even came with a signed picture of himself. Get on it guys! Skwosh!

Okay, ready to sign. Awesome...

Now to capture the unicorn....

2 hours ago, Abe said:

Watts is going to kick around 35 goals himself this year, but his skills, class and smarts will create at least that many more for his team mates.

I am involved at a different AFL club and i can tell you the respect for Jack outside the MFC has gone through the roof this year, he would have attracted significant interest if he remained unsigned. 

You've outed yourself now Abe- Demonlanders are going to be beating your door down in trade week.

22 hours ago, Vogon Poetry said:

Thanks Nut, I was really after a one word answer and I'm more confused than ever now but we'll move on.

 

Come now...you must have read my posts - why answer something in one word when i can use 201 words....

Watts has reached my minimum output level ( we know my expectation counts for nothing but you asked). If he maintains this we have a good footballer. If he delivers minimum output as per now - he stays in the team and the list with the proviso that another club doesn't offer us a deal way above his worth .I believe him to be able to deliver way more - not because of improved skill - but because of him lifting his intent even further.

 

(that's as concise as i can get)

Edited June 23, 20169 yr by nutbean

1 hour ago, nutbean said:

Come now...you must have read my posts - why answer something in one word when i can use 201 words....

Were you 'waffling' again Nut? 

I prefer waffles.

Could Jack Watts be on the move next year?

Headline of Nick Bowen's chat forum on afl.com.au today.

It would just be plain bizarre if Watts left after a career best year, the happiest he's ever been at MFC and the fact that he declared that his coach saved his career.

What is Bowen getting at?

 

Edited June 23, 20169 yr by Bring-Back-Powell

5 minutes ago, Bring-Back-Powell said:

Could Jack Watts be on the move next year?

Headline of Nick Bowen's chat forum on afl.com.au today.

It would just be plain bizarre if Watts left after a career best year, the happiest he's ever been at MFC and the fact that he declared that his coach saved his career.

What is Bowen getting at?

 

Click bait - it's a pretty boring free agency pool this year.

6 minutes ago, Bring-Back-Powell said:

Could Jack Watts be on the move next year?

Headline of Nick Bowen's chat forum on afl.com.au today.

It would just be plain bizarre if Watts left after a career best year, the happiest he's ever been at MFC and the fact that he declared that his coach saved his career.

What is Bowen getting at?

 

Maybe he has a better relationship with Roos than Goodwin? Maybe maybe maybe. We live in a football world that is all about rumour, innuendo, and news creation.

All I know is that nothing is certain in this world but unless there is a definite decision made and communicated we get lost in a world of paranoia and speculation. I have learnt to enjoy the moment and let the future take care of itself. If the club does the right thing, I am sure Jack will be a one club player.  

2 hours ago, H_T said:

Were you 'waffling' again Nut? 

I prefer waffles.

The "again" was superfluous therefore making the question rhetorical.

In the famous words of Descartes on eating his breakfast  - "I waffle therefore I am"

7 minutes ago, nutbean said:

The "again" was superfluous therefore making the question rhetorical.

In the famous words of Descartes on eating his breakfast  - "I waffle therefore I am"

Descarte   ..or ....  A la Carte ?  

3 hours ago, beelzebub said:

Descarte   ..or ....  A la Carte ?  

I think Descartes eats a la carte ... does that therefore mean that I am? ☺?

23 minutes ago, Red and Bluebeard said:

I think Descartes eats a la carte ... does that therefore mean that I am? ☺?

Very profound and clever, RandB

Edited June 23, 20169 yr by Lucifer's Hero

11 minutes ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

Very profound and clever, RandB

Yes, this is all very profound (and tres witty); but WTF does it have to do with Jacques Watts?

31 minutes ago, small but forward said:

Yes, this is all very profound (and tres witty); but WTF does it have to do with Jacques Watts?

Zip!!

Its bye week - any distraction, especially if witty is welcome...I think

 

All threads may get derailed this weekend as we all suffer from severe 'no-game' withdrawal symptoms...I think

Edited June 23, 20169 yr by Lucifer's Hero