Riley MUST come in

Jamar Or Gawn... Spencer aint up to it! NO MARKS IN A GAME OF FOOTY AS A BIG BLOKE! shocking

Watts a must

Newton and depending on Injury Jetta, Viney

Hogan is a given!

100% disposal efficiency for Spencer I note. Hmmm stats don't mean much do they.

We can't win a clearance and we can't score a goal. It's pathetic that we can't kick 10 goals in a match. Our scoreline reads like a soccer match except for the oppostion's who can score at will.

I agree with this. Lets start in the middle. Against Freo Jamar fought hard v Sandilands and Clarke. Jamar had 34 hitouts to 40 against the best rucks in the comp. we were smashed by Fyffe but this wasn't Jamar's fault

We were then 2/3.I was amazed when Jamar was dropped although I have been keen to see Spencer who played a heck of a game v Carlton last year

Against Pyke Spencer was slaughtered. Admittedly Pyke had support while Spencer didn't. But in windy conditions Spencer who's not inexperienced, allowed Pyke to get in front all day. (I'm speechless that the ruck coach couldn't have corrected this during breaks but ut continued.)

Then again yesterday Spencer was slaughtered by ruck men who are, by no means, top notch. Ceglar is hardly a household name. He was helped by Hale, whereas Spencer's backup was Pedersen, our only key forward. The Hawks doubled our hitouts . Whilst this is not necessarily fatal it makes it very hard for our mids.

I'm not surprised to read that Jamar didn't play well in the 2s. I would be gutted if I were him, and Gawne must be a better bet on the forward line than Spencer who simply doesn't take over head marks. I would play them both. Assuming Hogan plays, then give Dawes some weeks to rest his calf. He's obviously half fit. Play Pedersen at CHF, h's in form. So, omit Dawes and Spencer, bring in Gawne and Jamar. And if this looks a little top heavy, have a look at the Dogs' back line; this combination would trouble them and Jamar would smash Cordy in the ruck. And in a sense this combination offers more rather than less flexibility. Yesterday the Hawks rucks kicked goals when it really mattered and poor old Lynden Dunn was supposed to stop them. If Pedersen hadn't been required upfront, he could have been very useful down back.

As to the mids and onballers I wouldn't make a hasty judgment. Riley should be played. I don't like to see players dropped after one match. Especially as we will plainly lose Salem.

If we could pinch a win v Dogs the season would be vaguely back on track

100% disposal efficiency for Spencer I note. Hmmm stats don't mean much do they.

Viney was on radio yesterday. He is some weeks away

Maybe not.

No point in an after match dressing down when emotions are flared.

No point publicly burning the players.

When the dust settles he will tell them.

He let the game run in the last quarter probably to see how players reacted.

Roos had a surprising calm in his PR.

Looked like a man who had stamped the NQR player's cards.

while he's got the stamp out, might need the red one for the Paul Roos card

I agree with this. Lets start in the middle. Against Freo Jamar fought hard v Sandilands and Clarke. Jamar had 34 hitouts to 40 against the best rucks in the comp. we were smashed by Fyffe but this wasn't Jamar's fault

We were then 2/3.I was amazed when Jamar was dropped although I have been keen to see Spencer who played a heck of a game v Carlton last year

Against Pyke Spencer was slaughtered. Admittedly Pyke had support while Spencer didn't. But in windy conditions Spencer who's not inexperienced, allowed Pyke to get in front all day. (I'm speechless that the ruck coach couldn't have corrected this during breaks but ut continued.)

Then again yesterday Spencer was slaughtered by ruck men who are, by no means, top notch. Ceglar is hardly a household name. He was helped by Hale, whereas Spencer's backup was Pedersen, our only key forward. The Hawks doubled our hitouts . Whilst this is not necessarily fatal it makes it very hard for our mids.

I'm not surprised to read that Jamar didn't play well in the 2s. I would be gutted if I were him, and Gawne must be a better bet on the forward line than Spencer who simply doesn't take over head marks. I would play them both. Assuming Hogan plays, then give Dawes some weeks to rest his calf. He's obviously half fit. Play Pedersen at CHF, h's in form. So, omit Dawes and Spencer, bring in Gawne and Jamar. And if this looks a little top heavy, have a look at the Dogs' back line; this combination would trouble them and Jamar would smash Cordy in the ruck. And in a sense this combination offers more rather than less flexibility. Yesterday the Hawks rucks kicked goals when it really mattered and poor old Lynden Dunn was supposed to stop them. If Pedersen hadn't been required upfront, he could have been very useful down back.

As to the mids and onballers I wouldn't make a hasty judgment. Riley should be played. I don't like to see players dropped after one match. Especially as we will plainly lose Salem.

If we could pinch a win v Dogs the season would be vaguely back on track

Whilst I'm on the fence over whether Jamar should have been dropped when he was, I agree that Spencer's done nothing to warrant holding his spot and I think Jamar should come back in for him.

Not sure about Gawn in for Dawes, mainly because I'm not sure that Gawn offers enough as a key forward and if there's one thing the Dogs want us to it's to go in too tall against them and let them run rings around us.

As for smashing Cordy, he gets smashed in the ruck every week. Today the hit outs were 69-13. Last week it was 48-28 (lost to St Kilda), the week before 75-36 (beat Sydney), and the week before 48-29 (beat Adelaide). I'm confident that if we go in with Spencer he'll get a massive amount of hit outs, but clearly that's not enough to stop the Dogs midfielders from exerting influence in the game.

while he's got the stamp out, might need the red one for the Paul Roos card

I think the 3 or 4 who were on the block last year are still in the frame. we can only chop so many in one hit, unless trades help this time round.

Surely, if Roos is testing Spencer out he'll give him a game against the worst ruck men in the league next weekend

This whole debate peeves me off when we are still talking about Gawn, Spencer Fitzpatrick etc......FFS they have all been in the system for years on our list and still show sweet FA...why are they still on our damn list?

You mean like Rioli (11 disposals)? Litherland (10), Duryea (16), Breust (14)?

We have to stop focusing on the kids and the players we know aren't part of our core.

We need to focus instead on the key players. Dawes, Dunn, Howe, Tyson, Vince, Garland, Lumumba and Cross all need to improve much, much more than we need M Jones, Bail or Michie getting tonnes of disposals.

M Jones, Bail, Michie and Toumpas are all midfielders...Rioli, Bruest, Litherland and Duryea are eithor forwards or defenders.

How can you call Bail, M Jones and Michie kids..?

100% disposal efficiency for Spencer I note. Hmmm stats don't mean much do they.

Ah not really when Spencer only managed 7 disposals for the game.

This whole debate peeves me off when we are still talking about Gawn, Spencer Fitzpatrick etc......FFS they have all been in the system for years on our list and still show sweet FA...why are they still on our damn list?

Gawn had shown the least out of all 3.

Surely, if Roos is testing Spencer out he'll give him a game against the worst ruck men in the league next weekend

if the doggies have instructed they're mids to rove to the opposition rucks, then maybe we better let Dawesy ruck instead. & go with an extra runner.

If we fail to score more than 50 next week then I'm afraid Messiah himself will come under the hammer (Well unless the Dogs score 49 or less).

Roos is just going to ppretend it did not happen.

That's not what he said at all.

He discussed reviewing the game with the players. On the other hand, he said nothing about not reviewing the game himself or with the coaches.

"MELBOURNE coach Paul Roos has told his players to forget about Saturday's 105-point loss to Hawthorn and he has no plans to show them a replay as part of the team's review. "

In any case, even if they don't review it now, I'd bet it will be the first tape that's pulled out when time comes for renewing contracts. Or not.

Roos out, Goodwin in

Roos has been given everything he has requested & open cheque book, result 6 win 23 lose, Neeld 5 win 28 lose.

we were not competitive for the entire 2nd half of last year & beaten by quarter time many times this year.

his recruiting & management have been fine but his coaching is unconnected.

he remains untouchable & beyond criticism by public & media.

Absolute rubbish

if the doggies have instructed they're mids to rove to the opposition rucks, then maybe we better let Dawesy ruck instead. & go with an extra runner.

It's a fair point dee-luded but personally I'd rather see spence have the chance to get a win under his belt

Surely, if Roos is testing Spencer out he'll give him a game against the worst ruck men in the league next weekend

What??? is Minson not playing???

I simply cannot believe that some people here are bagging Roos.

I still can't believe that we were fortunate enough to land him as our senior coach.

He is the sole reason we've actually been able to attract the decent senior players and coaches in the time he's been here.

I was very drunk at the MCG saturday.. Thank god!

Out. Spencer, Salem (inj) M Jones

In. Gawn, Riley, Harmes

My mate ( who was on his bux day will also be out.. )

http://postimg.org/image/b3w1ouivv/

Security actually escorted out in the last quarter for having a play fight with the hawks mascot..

Most fight I saw all day.

As normal members of this site letting emotion get the better of them. Logic not emotion is required. Don't underestimate how far back we have come from. It was always going to take some time. We have improved out of sight in the last year and 7 rounds. However, we still have no depth and once we start having to pick players further down our list we are still terrible. With continued good recruiting and the maturing of our list our depth and best 22 will continue to improve and improve dramatically. I can remember far worse losses that Saturday, some of them in years we even made the finals, one of them in a year we made a GF.

It will be a bumpy road, but at least we are on the road. Mishaps like Saturday have to be expected along the way.

Tarred with the same brush unfortunately.

Love watching Howe take the big grabs but he has been very disappointing. Most of these type will be gone next year, lets see what we can get and move on.

To be honest, rjay, I have got to the point where I don't even enjoy watching Howe take big grabs. I ask if he's willing to put the effort in to jump on some bloke's shoulders, something that comes easy to him, then why isn't he putting in the effort to chase/tackle/pressure? Clearly these things don't come as easy, which probably explains a lot.

In regards to changes for this week - it's an absolute lottery because of the injury status to those that should come straight in when fit (ie Viney, Jetta, Hogan). Obviously if those three in particular are fit, then three changes have to be made, which would be Salem (again, presuming his will be a forced change), followed by Stretch, and WTF knows for the third spot. I'm concerned with the Dunn v Crameri match-up, but the rest of the backline should match up well - thinking McDonald v Boyd, Garland v Stringer, Grimes v Dickson. Grimes has one clear instruction, and that's to never, EVER kick on his left foot again.

It is cruel watching (N) Jones and Tyson play with injury. Sadly, we can't take them out of the team to recover properly - just hope they can get through to the bye round and recover enough in the week off.

How did Watts go??

24 Posessions, a goal and missed a goal.

And lol at everyone suddenly calling for him to come back after kicking him to the dirt.

Anyone criticising Roos either has a very short memory, or zero idea about the modern game.

Was he on the field today? No.

Did he draft or recruit half our list? No.

Did he get us into the mess we're in after years of [censored] drafting and [censored] development? No.

Did he do pretty much everything right from the moment he got in the door, including spending a year teaching players how to defend? Yes.

Is it his fault his players are seemingly incapable of following basic instructions or putting in EFFORT? NO.

I know this isn't a popular opinion around here, but........

the same could be said of Mark Neeld

24 Posessions, a goal and missed a goal.

And lol at everyone suddenly calling for him to come back after kicking him to the dirt.

I think they should play Watts through the midfield and leave Pedersen up forward. He's not a natural forward and seems to play better when he is told to just go and get the ball.

No were not, we've been beaten by easily the best 3 teams in the competition. If we're dusted by the Bulldogs by 50 next week, then tee off.

We simply don't have the talent. And by talent I mean athletic talent as well. You can't outrun your opposition if youre not as fast or as naturally aerobic. You can't outmuscle if you're not as naturally strong.

The effort was there, the ability wasn't. Is Roos responsible for bringing in the talent? Nup.

My oh my do we need Viney, Jetta, Kent, Salem... They go, we go. We have no depth.

Edit: And of course Hogan. So we lost our best forward, our best inside mid (on this years form), our best small defender, our best forward pressure, and our best user out of the back half. Who do we have to replace them with?

So why are we physically unable to compete? Whats Mission doing? cant believe how physically weak the whole team looks>