What value is 'free agency'?

[rpfc 27,662]

GWS has the same COLA as Sydney so I don't see how it could've made a difference?

Either way GWS is hardly a good example considering they are a new expansion team being heavily backed by the AFL to consolidate their base.

The worry is that FA will jam a spanner in the wheel and stop it turning.

The Worry?

People cannot adequately describe The Worry.

The fear is that big clubs will suck up all the talent through FA.

That is absolute crap. FA allows 28+ year olds a few years at the club of their choice on their terms. Teams can pay them an extra $100k outside the cap to keep them at the club. RFA can be re-signed or traded, if the compensation sticks around in near to it's current form it is another soft landing for clubs in this new FA era.

The Worry is unfounded.

[rpfc 27,662]

And you don't see how taking the only competitor to GWS out of the market would have made a difference?

GWS need their allowance as they teethe, Franklin should be there and the sport would be better for it.

[Bedraggled Dee 336]

I dont think you can judge FA purely on numbers and based on a single years operation. Statistically if you take out players who werent gettiing games at their original clubs like Tom Murphy (6 games), Byrnes (4 games) Knights (5 games), the majority vast majority of the quality player moved from lesser cubs to strong clubs.

FA will never just be a stream of players heading one way but based on the first year it seems likely that if the current trend continues it will make it more diffucult for lesser clubs to attract and retain experienced quality players who want to leave to seek success. There will always be players who leave to take up significant contracts at clubs that have salary cap room but if the Buddy thing tells us anything then it is that where there is a choice it will be to a stronger club. After all, the upwards pressure on player payments and better job security throuigh longer contracts is wha the AFL PA pushed for with FA.

I hope I am wrong but in my view the notion of a premiership window is no longer a truth and you will find that clubs in strong positions will be able to continue success over a longer period by toping up the list. Thats not to say Melbourne etc cant come good, it will just be harder.

[Dr. Gonzo 22,731]

The Worry?

People cannot adequately describe The Worry.

The fear is that big clubs will suck up all the talent through FA.

That is absolute crap. FA allows 28+ year olds a few years at the club of their choice on their terms. Teams can pay them an extra $100k outside the cap to keep them at the club. RFA can be re-signed or traded, if the compensation sticks around in near to it's current form it is another soft landing for clubs in this new FA era.

The Worry is unfounded.

Of course the big clubs will suck up all the talent through FA, to think otherwise is severely delusional. No decent players want to leave their clubs to play in front of 15K people and lose by 10 goals every week to see out their careers. They will either leave for a chance at a flag or move from one contender to another for better coin. The smaller/poorer clubs may attract some B-graders through FA by overpaying for them but any high grade player is only going to move to a big club which will see the smaller clubs lose out in the long run. The salary cap doesn't mean anything if 1) big clubs are allowed to have 3rd party deals and 2) no one wants to play for your club anyway because they are perceived as poor in every facet of the word.

[Carlos Danger 380]

The Worry?

People cannot adequately describe The Worry.

The fear is that big clubs will suck up all the talent through FA.

That is absolute crap. FA allows 28+ year olds a few years at the club of their choice on their terms. Teams can pay them an extra $100k outside the cap to keep them at the club. RFA can be re-signed or traded, if the compensation sticks around in near to it's current form it is another soft landing for clubs in this new FA era.

The Worry is unfounded.

Shouldn't that read 26+ year olds? A player is also eligible for Unrestricted Free Agency if they have spent 8 years on a list and aren't in the top 25% of highest-paid players at the club.

And it's safe to say the system can (and eventually will be) rorted. Just look at the lure and stature of Collingwood already, it's only a matter of time before a bunch of players are happy to take pay hikes to play with other "champions" and finish off their career with an extremely high likelihood of premiership success.

I can still remember how disgruntled Robert Harvey was when he retired, how he rubbished and belittled all of his individual accolades because he never won a premiership.

[daisycutter 28,709]

Shouldn't that read 26+ year olds? A player is also eligible for Unrestricted Free Agency if they have spent 8 years on a list and aren't in the top 25% of highest-paid players at the club.

And it's safe to say the system can (and eventually will be) rorted. Just look at the lure and stature of Collingwood already, it's only a matter of time before a bunch of players are happy to take pay hikes to play with other "champions" and finish off their career with an extremely high likelihood of premiership success.

I can still remember how disgruntled Robert Harvey was when he retired, how he rubbished and belittled all of his individual accolades because he never won a premiership.

it might be 26-28 year olds now but what about tomorrow

those younger than 26 can still have issue with freedom of trade

the aflpa has tasted blood and the cat is out of the bag

we shall see where it all leads to but don't kid yourself that todays FA is tomorrows FA

[rpfc 27,662]

it might be 26-28 year olds now but what about tomorrow

those younger than 26 can still have issue with freedom of trade

the aflpa has tasted blood and the cat is out of the bag

we shall see where it all leads to but don't kid yourself that todays FA is tomorrows FA

And that is why those that don't like FA should embrace what we have now; agents are pushing for removal of compensation, and restricted FA.

Soon they will want to have FA sooner, and they will use the discontent from those who don't like FA to say that it needs to be 'improved.'

The cat is out of the bag but the bag is full of tricks, as another poster pointed out - the NFL is where the AFL and the AFLPA look to for best practice but I wonder what the players will think about the lack of guaranteed money and inability to stop trades that is involved in the NFL.

Edited October 8, 2013 by rpfc

[daisycutter 28,709]

or we could end up like the NRL

[H_T 2,941]

Didn't one of the best players from the Premiers leave in FA?

It is only a disaster if you don't work out how to use it to your advantage.

I will let you whinge for a couple years, but at some point you are going to have to build that bridge because it is here to stay.

I've only started the foundations. Perhaps if our club was better positioned and wasn't in a world of hurt I may see it differently.

I hope to god everything is cyclical.

I'll keep building anyway.

[rpfc 27,662]

or we could end up like the NRL

The worst of all worlds really.

If you are a team 'on the nose' your only hope is that a hall of famer grows up next to your training grounds and loves his mum so he won't leave.

[deejammin' 2,096]

Thought I would put this together to make the results of Free Agency clear, many players who were trades (like Brian Lake and Chris Dawes) are being used against FA. I have not included Delisted free agents as i think this is irrelevant to any discussion regarding teams losing required players. Also I have put the results in ladder order to make it clear which teams are most affected. I will do 2013 when its finished but here is 2012:

Lost Gained

2012

Hawthorn Tom Murphy, Clinton Young Pick 64

Adelaide Chris Knights Nothing

Sydney None None

Collingwood None Quinten Lynch, Clinton Young

West Coast Quinten Lynch Pick 60

Geelong Shannon Byrnes, Jared Rivers

Freo None Danyle Pearce

North None None

St Kilda Brendon Goddard Pick 13

Carlton None None

Essendon None Brendon Goddard

Richmond None Troy Chaplin

Brisbane None None

Port Danyle Pearce, Troy Chaplin Pick 29, Pick 30

WB None None

Melbourne Brent Moloney, Jared Rivers Shannon Byrnes, Pick 48

GC None Tom Murphy

GWS None None

Lost Gained

2013

Hawthorn Lance Franklin, Xavier Ellis Pick 19

Geelong None None

Fremantle None Colin Sylvia

Sydney None Lance Franklin

Richmond Matt White None

Collingwood Dale Thomas Pick 11

PA None Matt White

Carlton Eddie Betts Dale Thomas

Essendon None None

North Melbourne None Nick Dal Santo

Adelaide None Eddie Betts

Brisbane None None

West Coast None Xavier Ellis

Gold Coast None None

Bulldogs None None

St Kilda Nick Dal Santo Pick 25

Melbourne Colin Sylvia Pick 23

GWS None None

So with the 2nd year all over there it is. Bit too early for trends, but we are yet to see a team in the bottom 5 land a significant free agent despite having more cap room.

[monoccular 16,514]

the reason why i regard the compensation as 'not much at all' is more cumulative (i.e. sylvia, moloney, rivers for pick 21, 48, and byrnes) than a singular instance like col.

but if you take him as a single instance example, we are losing our arguably second best midfielder, third most experienced player, who in 2013 averaged 20 possessions and 4.5 tackles a game for a speculative pick.

my biggest complaint is that freo don't have to lose anything to get him; under the previous system if they wanted him they would have had to trade him. their pick would be around that 21 mark due to their finishing position, say pick 18 or so, previously to get to freo they. would have had to negotiated a trade - so it may have been pick 18 and viv michie for sylvia and, say, our third round selection.

the way it works now is that clubs that want to 'top up' can do so with impunity.

I agree totally with your biggest complaint - the buyer has to part with nothing other than money.

They should maybe have to give to the club for whom the UFA played a pick in the round commensurate with the round the UFA was drafted, or some formula that takes that in as well as final salary and even B&F finishes over the final 1,2 or 3 years at the club.

I am sure Messrs Duckworth and Lewis conjure up an appropriate formula :-)

[rpfc 27,662]

I agree totally with your biggest complaint - the buyer has to part with nothing other than money.

They should maybe have to give to the club for whom the UFA played a pick in the round commensurate with the round the UFA was drafted, or some formula that takes that in as well as final salary and even B&F finishes over the final 1,2 or 3 years at the club.

I am sure Messrs Duckworth and Lewis conjure up an appropriate formula :-)

That would confuse it. Just worry about the club that lost the player, it did for us and the Saints.

Swings and roundabouts.

We will be less unattractive when we are not so crap. FA or not - that is why we can't get big names.

'But rpfc, Roos!'

Yeah, yeah, but everyone thinks he is pushing an elephant uphill, and they don't want to be apart of the elephant for the three years it will take to reach the top of that hill.

[Thehardtackler 785]

Remember that we pinched Jeff White from Fremantle when we were a more attractive proposition, so I guess it is swings and roundabouts.

[Earl Hood 5,851]

Remember that we pinched Jeff White from Fremantle when we were a more attractive proposition, so I guess it is swings and roundabouts.

I think the issue is more about the forces acting against equalisation. Unequal competition means there aren't swings and roundabouts. In our case maybe its more about one door closes, another one slams in your face! So far FA movements of good players have been from low clubs to strong clubs and strong clubs to other strong clubs. Yet to see a mature elite player go south. We all thought Buddy was headed that way but he pulled a swifty and got to Sydney on a ridiculously contrived deal.

Now the AFL is looking to squash FA compensation all together. For why I have no idea except some of the powerful clubs are whinging about their compensation and some agents are saying it discourages FA movements. No compensation to lower clubs would be just another slammed door as far as I am concerned.