KPF

[Bingo 241]

It was quite clear yesterday that we lacked a big marking forward. When our midfielders looked up they either had no one to kick to or an out numbered medium sized green, sylvia, jurrah ect to kick to.

Not only were Collingwood dominating the stoppages, they also had great merking targets to kick to in their forward line.

Now, i believe that we do have a couple of players on the list that could fill this void in the future...but this will be 3 years away. We need to target a player to fill the void straight away. Now some will say this will take games and opportunity away from some of the younger kids...but i ask you this...are our kids unable to play to our game plan because we don't have all the pieces of the puzzle?

I'm no expert on the lower leagues, so people, please throw up some suitable players that could play this KPF role for us till Watts, Cook, Fitzpatrick are ready to take over.

I for one would love to see us target Jessie White, or to a lesser extent Fevola.

[Scipio 5,902]

It was quite clear yesterday that we lacked a big marking forward. When our midfielders looked up they either had no one to kick to or an out numbered medium sized green, sylvia, jurrah ect to kick to.

Not only were Collingwood dominating the stoppages, they also had great merking targets to kick to in their forward line.

Now, i believe that we do have a couple of players on the list that could fill this void in the future...but this will be 3 years away. We need to target a player to fill the void straight away. Now some will say this will take games and opportunity away from some of the younger kids...but i ask you this...are our kids unable to play to our game plan because we don't have all the pieces of the puzzle?

I'm no expert on the lower leagues, so people, please throw up some suitable players that could play this KPF role for us till Watts, Cook, Fitzpatrick are ready to take over.

I for one would love to see us target Jessie White, or to a lesser extent Fevola.

I think Jesse White would be perfect as he is out of favour at Sydney, a massive unit and would crash the packs, bringing the ball down to our smaller guys if not marking it. Hopefully wouldnt take much to trade for him.

[The Chazz 4,077]

Stef Martin (when Jamar comes back). Or maybe Jamar (when Jamar comes back) and leave Martin as our ruckman (can someone provide me with Martin's hit outs to advantage please?).

[sylvinator 96]

I think Jesse White would be perfect as he is out of favour at Sydney, a massive unit and would crash the packs, bringing the ball down to our smaller guys if not marking it. Hopefully wouldnt take much to trade for him.

Yes, we need a big marking forward, but we will end up being bitterly disappointed by the lack of different that big forward makes to our team if he isn't a QUALITY big crash busting forward.

Fevola is not an option- there is a reason he got sacked by 2 clubs, because he is a terribly bad influence of club culture and he is still off the rails. Plus he's 31 years old next year and out of our age bracket.

Jesse White- is not a quality footballer AT ALL. Equivalent to Brad Miller quality.

David Hale last year is a perfect example. Some people wanted him bc he's the 'TYPE' of player we need... but he isn't good enough at that position to make a significant difference. If we would have traded for Hale we would never be getting experience into Gawn, we may not have discovered Martin's upside and we wouldn't have Jeremy Howe, who looks like a really strong half forward flanker who actually prides himself on tackling pressure and agressiveness.

Get a Chris Dawes would be ideale

[drdrake 3,058]

What difference does a key forward make if you can't get the footy inside the 50m arc. We need to get the footy deep inside 50m at least 50 times per game. You could have Wayne Carey at full forward but if you can't supply him he is wasted.

Edited June 14, 2011 by drdrake

[jacey 333]

if he isn't a QUALITY big crash busting forward.

Jesse White- is not a quality footballer AT ALL.

One myth about Jessie White. He is not a big bash crash forward. He is more of a finesse forward who has great agility.

He still is potentially a good player but needs to use his size and frame more often. Prob why they've got no forwards yet Jessie White is in the two's. I'd chase him but he is a work in progress not a plug and play big bustling key forward ppl seem to think.

Daniel Stewart is someone who we should be chasing hard. Lesser price. Out injured for the rest of the year but 200cm, 95kegs and uses his frame and imposes himself. Great mark. Plays for port too so might be one who's fed up and wants out.

Late developer and an injury risk but he would be one i'd want.

[Bingo 241]

What difference does a key forward make if you can't get the footy inside the 50m arc. We need to get the footy deep inside 50m at least 50 times per game. You could have Wayne Carey at full forward but if you can't supply him he is wasted.

I agree with what you're saying, but i did see on occasions yesterday people lower their eyes and kick to a contest around 40m out where it would have been much more dangerous to kick to the top of the square to a big KPF. The ball ends up in a much more dangerous spot and if their isn't a mark their is a contest which brings our crumbers into play.

[Craig Drinker 179]

Stef Martin (when Jamar comes back). Or maybe Jamar (when Jamar comes back) and leave Martin as our ruckman (can someone provide me with Martin's hit outs to advantage please?).

Agree with this.Keep Gawn in the side,play Stef as permanent CHF with Jamar in the ruck.

[jabberwocky 2,301]

It's a chicken-egg scenario. Collingwood smacked the ball deep inside thier 50 because they knew there was a fair chance that it would be marked by one of thier forwards.

Several times we had the footy between centre and half forward and either had no targets, kicked short to contests or turned it over while we waited for something to present.

We struggled to win a contest and didn't back our forwards, and we didn't back our forwards because they struggled to win a contest.

[Guest Artie Bucco]

Lucas Cook will be this type of player.

I can wait.

[_becks_ 35]

Jamar could play this role for 50% of game time. Martin just needs to hold his own in the ruck the other 50%. If this does not work, then Robbie Campbell has played the last two games for Casey, he is a massive unit. Not sure what his marking hands are like though.

[dee-luded 2,958]

I think it's time for Lucas Cook to come in. We could use him either in the forwardline or, as I'm inclined, at the backline. He has a great Brain for making the play and executing great kicks to team mates.

This would allow Watts to play more in the forwardline, where he could use his pace to present, and good kicking to finish.

[Lil_red_fire_engine 10,378]

Lucas Cook will be this type of player.

I can wait.

I agree. Martin has shown he is more than adequate in the ruck. This should allow Jamar to spend more time forward and the two of them to split their time as the deep target. We then just wait for Cook to be ready to develop his game at the next level after some more kilos are added to his light frame. I do not want a short term solution particularly if it means paying over the odds ala Hale.

[dee-luded 2,958]

I agree. Martin has shown he is more than adequate in the ruck. This should allow Jamar to spend more time forward and the two of them to split their time as the deep target. We then just wait for Cook to be ready to develop his game at the next level after some more kilos are added to his light frame. I do not want a short term solution particularly if it means paying over the odds ala Hale.

He's ready now for a game. His body is OK. He needs to get a taste of it, and Nows the right time. Jamar in, Gawn out... Morton out, Cook in,,, starts to give us a bit more strength maturity and contested ball. each little bit more of contested situations allows us to grow confidence and belief.

[loges 6,276]

I raised the point during the trade period that if we couldn't attract a big bodied forward to contest in the air then it would retard our developement. Of course it attracted its share of naysayers, and then well there you go, nothing else to say really

[daisycutter 28,709]

I agree. Martin has shown he is more than adequate in the ruck. This should allow Jamar to spend more time forward and the two of them to split their time as the deep target. We then just wait for Cook to be ready to develop his game at the next level after some more kilos are added to his light frame. I do not want a short term solution particularly if it means paying over the odds ala Hale.

No, he's not "more than adequate" he is just adequate as a 2nd ruck. Lets not get carried away yet.

Let Jamar do what he is best at.

[Lil_red_fire_engine 10,378]

He's ready now for a game. His body is OK. He needs to get a taste of it, and Nows the right time. Jamar in, Gawn out... Morton out, Cook in,,, starts to give us a bit more strength maturity and contested ball. each little bit more of contested situations allows us to grow confidence and belief.

Cook would likely be playing on McPharlin and giving away 10 kilos?

[Lil_red_fire_engine 10,378]

No, he's not "more than adequate" he is just adequate as a 2nd ruck. Lets not get carried away yet.

Let Jamar do what he is best at.

I am not calling him a superstar (althought did you see him smash Esenndon rucks 2 weeks ago?)I am saying he can hold his own both in the centre and around the ground. Jamar was rucking 85% game time prior to injury as we did not know if Martin could hold his own for extended periods of time. I think it is fair to say that the coaches would have greater confidence to leave Jamar forward for greater periods of time than they would have a month ago.

[The Chazz 4,077]

No, he's not "more than adequate" he is just adequate as a 2nd ruck. Lets not get carried away yet.

Let Jamar do what he is best at.

I think Stef is a bit better than that, but he needs to either become our number 1 ruck, or secure a KPF position. One would assume with Gawn getting game time that this will continue over the coming years, providing he produces, and with Jamar as a forward/ruck option, it is leaving Stef in an in-between position.

It was interesting to read on the Herald Sun website that Bailey said the Russian was close to a recall and a forward marking option is where we are lacking at the moment.

Can we play the 3 big boys?

[BAMF 3,812]

I am not calling him a superstar (althought did you see him smash Esenndon rucks 2 weeks ago?)I am saying he can hold his own both in the centre and around the ground. Jamar was rucking 85% game time prior to injury as we did not know if Martin could hold his own for extended periods of time. I think it is fair to say that the coaches would have greater confidence to leave Jamar forward for greater periods of time than they would have a month ago.

It was Essendon's 3 rucks!

Martin has been awesome, but I would rather have Jamar dominating the rucks rather than Martin breaking even.

It's great that we will have more confidence giving Martin ruck time while Jamar rests forward. Especially easing Jamar back in from injury.

[stuie 7,374]

How will a KPF help us win stoppages or break a press from the backline?

Not saying we don't need one, but it's not the major problem right now, the problem is we can't get the ball inside 50 very often without the Jamar/Moloney combo from the bounce and some sort of a structure from the back 50.

[sylvinator 96]

How will a KPF help us win stoppages or break a press from the backline?

Not saying we don't need one, but it's not the major problem right now, the problem is we can't get the ball inside 50 very often without the Jamar/Moloney combo from the bounce and some sort of a structure from the back 50.

To fix our midfield, what we really need is for our young midfielders- Scully, Trengove, Mckenzie, Gysberts, Blease, Bail- to get to 50-100 senior afl games ASAP. Because at the moment we are relying on them but they're just too light and inexperienced to play really consistently. but we all know they have huge talent and will come good.

To fix out forward line, what we really need is for Watts, Cook, Howe and Jurrah to get to 50-100 senior afl games asap.

Our defence line is actually really strong, and performs VERY well each and every week considering our defence has been decimated by injury and we concede up to 70- yep you didn't misread it was 70- inside 50 each and every week. Garland, Frawley, Rivers, Grimes, Tapscott, Bail is a really nice defensive unit imo. Could use more games playing together.

I think everyone can see the argument i'm making is that we have been unrealistic with expectations this season and all will take is patience and faith in our youngsters- bc they will come good in the end

[Lil_red_fire_engine 10,378]

To fix our midfield, what we really need is for our young midfielders- Scully, Trengove, Mckenzie, Gysberts, Blease, Bail- to get to 50-100 senior afl games ASAP. Because at the moment we are relying on them but they're just too light and inexperienced to play really consistently. but we all know they have huge talent and will come good.

To fix out forward line, what we really need is for Watts, Cook, Howe and Jurrah to get to 50-100 senior afl games asap.

Our defence line is actually really strong, and performs VERY well each and every week considering our defence has been decimated by injury and we concede up to 70- yep you didn't misread it was 70- inside 50 each and every week. Garland, Frawley, Rivers, Grimes, Tapscott, Bail is a really nice defensive unit imo. Could use more games playing together.

I think everyone can see the argument i'm making is that we have been unrealistic with expectations this season and all will take is patience and faith in our youngsters- bc they will come good in the end

What are you doing? Logic has no place here

[stuie 7,374]

To fix our midfield, what we really need is for our young midfielders- Scully, Trengove, Mckenzie, Gysberts, Blease, Bail- to get to 50-100 senior afl games ASAP. Because at the moment we are relying on them but they're just too light and inexperienced to play really consistently. but we all know they have huge talent and will come good.

To fix out forward line, what we really need is for Watts, Cook, Howe and Jurrah to get to 50-100 senior afl games asap.

Our defence line is actually really strong, and performs VERY well each and every week considering our defence has been decimated by injury and we concede up to 70- yep you didn't misread it was 70- inside 50 each and every week. Garland, Frawley, Rivers, Grimes, Tapscott, Bail is a really nice defensive unit imo. Could use more games playing together.

I think everyone can see the argument i'm making is that we have been unrealistic with expectations this season and all will take is patience and faith in our youngsters- bc they will come good in the end

No arguments about most of that, great future midfield, HUGE potential up forward, and I love our backline already, however if expecting the distance between our best and worst football to be smaller this year is unrealistic then we are going NOWHERE.

As far as games won go I think most reasonable people would not be terribly disappointed (I would have thought maybe 1 more win at this stage), but it's been the nature of the losses, the speed at which we give up, and the general lack of spirit once we're really challenged that has left me feeling resigned already this year.

I did not expect to make the 8 this year, but I did expect we would improve, so far we have not, simple as that.

[Gouga 512]

Tom Hawkins?