Bruce V Morton

[Red Sox 2]

Like to see people's opinion on Cam Bruce and Cale Morton. The thread on moving Garland forward got me to thinking of our fantastic/super/brilliant defensive unit (Frawley, Garland, Grimes, Warnock, Rivers, Bartram, Morton, Bruce) and also the team as a whole.

I wouldn't change a thing with our core group of defenders and I believe that our forward line, even though it is struggling a bit has a lot of upside with the likes of Jurrah, Petterd, Wonna, Tapscott, Sylvia, Bennell, Hughes, Maric, Stef Martin even Jack Fitzpatrick all currently on the outside looking in for various reasons. Add this group to a developing Watts, Bate who will improve further in a better set up and the likes of Dunn, Jetta who add depth and a floating Brad Green....I have no concern that in time this line will come together nicely.

In my opinion there is a squeeze coming with the roles Bruce and Morton play and I would prefer to see a player like Strauss start to get time in the side. His use of the ball far outweighs both Bruce and Morton and he could develop his game off a half bank flank, a forward flank or the midfield. There are plenty of options for Strauss.

Saying all that, it is Cam Bruce who I think is most at threat. I think Morton has so much upside to him, he finds the ball easily, he is such a tall unit and can play in multiple positions. Cale needs to use the ball a bit better and also hit some marking contests a bit harder and use his height to advantage there but with a bit more bulk and confidence I've no doubt all of this will come together for Cale and he has the makings of developing his game as Brendon Goddard has done. Cam used to be able to do this but no longer, his kicking is terrible, pie floaters really and for this reason he cant be used forward any more and needs almost the spare floating role in the back half that any of Grimes, Rivers or Morton can easily cover. I find that Bruce also dishes off handballs to team mates that are in far less better positions than he is which gets us caught with ball too often (he is not alone here currently but he has been around 10 years and should make better decisions).

Cam has been a great club man for the MFC and I take my hat off to him for his achievements. I just think his time has come.

What do you think?

[e25 5]

Yes there is.

For now.

I don't even really see them as that similar.

Well, that's not quite right - they both have huge tanks and similar builds.

They do play similar to one another in some ways.

But Morton finds a lot more space and gets on the end of a lot more loose balls.

He also has a long lethal kick that Bruce does not.

Bruce gets the ball in congestion much more.

His disposal is very very suspect at times, but he is better at taking the opposition on. Marginally.

He IS creative with the footy, but often to our detriment as he runs himself into trouble.

Selling teammates into trouble does him no favours.

Simply: Morton can be a lot more damaging than Bruce.

As Morton fills out he will become a much different player.

Bruce has only a couple of seasons left.

[Redleg 40,926]

Yes there is.

For now.

I don't even really see them as that similar.

Well, that's not quite right - they both have huge tanks and similar builds.

They do play similar to one another in some ways.

But Morton finds a lot more space and gets on the end of a lot more loose balls.

He also has a long lethal kick that Bruce does not.

Bruce gets the ball in congestion much more.

His disposal is very very suspect at times, but he is better at taking the opposition on. Marginally.

He IS creative with the footy, but often to our detriment as he runs himself into trouble.

Selling teammates into trouble does him no favours.

Simply: Morton can be a lot more damaging than Bruce.

As Morton fills out he will become a much different player.

Bruce has only a couple of seasons left.

I don't generally bag players and will try to stick to the facts as I know them, but Bruce's disposal this year too often has been disastrous for us.

His first quarter on monday contained at least 5 crucial errors which led to turnovers and on a few occasions goals to the Pies.

He appears to be unwilling to take body contact and will sell a team mate into trouble.

His kicking is not what it was and his decision making at times is absolutely atrocious.

I would guess he leads our turnovers stat this year and if he doesn't it is probably only due to the hard work of others in trying to rectify the situation.

I now cringe when he has the ball especially when he is in traffic.

He has been a great player for us but now that he is 30 he seems to be unwilling to take body contact and as a result just wants to get rid of the ball and then often does it poorly.

In today's football you just can't afford to give away possession.

[Red Sox 2]

Let me be clear. I certainly do not intend to bag Cam Bruce. He has achieved a lot for our club which I would never argue against and if not for Guerra may even have pocketed a brownlow medal?!

Some players once they reach 30 can hit the wall quickly which I think has happened to Cam and other players are going past him that can't be ingored IMO, Junior Mac is the opposite of this and could go another 2 years they way he is playing.

I would be happy with myself given the chance to pull on the red & blue as many times as Cam has.

I wish him the best with my thoughts but I wish the club greater success again!

[e25 5]

To be honest, I think Bruce's kicking has been consistent but the requirements of the modern game have made it harder for him.

He used to be able to spot up a free player fairly easily, but now those players are covered and under pressure that is now expected by defenders, or by a zone defense.

Some players kick to a 50/50 but to advantage - he seems to kick to 50/50s but to dosadvantage.

Perplexing.

His handballing also falls half a metre short too often.

This compounded by handballing to players in worse positions than he is in.

Like redleg said, this seems because he fears contact.

Not a good sign when the current style of play involves drawing a defender and forcing him to tackle you, freeing up your teammate.

[e25 5]

I'm trying not to be purely critical of Bruce, rather, make a critical analysis.

I'm perfectly open to others making points which either prove me wrong or give valid reasons for his style of play.

As it is I find it immensely frustrating when he gets the ball.

From an experiences player I want reliability first and foremost.

[ox_5 163]

I would actually like Bruce to move to half forward. Like Beamer said in his Best Dees line up the other day, he feels Bruce plays his best footy at half forward, and so do I.

He has shown in the past he can be a damaging forward. He has the ability to slip away from his opponent and find space up there. Having him up forward would remove his biggest issues - he would not need to use as much creative handball where he lands teammates in trouble more often than not, and his kicking would have a bigger target - between the big sticks.

[Redleg 40,926]

I would actually like Bruce to move to half forward. Like Beamer said in his Best Dees line up the other day, he feels Bruce plays his best footy at half forward, and so do I.

He has shown in the past he can be a damaging forward. He has the ability to slip away from his opponent and find space up there. Having him up forward would remove his biggest issues - he would not need to use as much creative handball where he lands teammates in trouble more often than not, and his kicking would have a bigger target - between the big sticks.

I would far rather Bruce play forward than in defence. Disposal errors are a little less costly there. He also can take a mark and even if played deep he is still a chance to snag a goal. I recall telling other Melbourne mates over the summer that Bennell should also be played forward as he made too many mistakes at the moment and was too light and easily brushed aside. His pace and skill however could give us goals and again like Bruce errors would be less costly up forward. Bennell's move up forward has been successful IMO. When he matures other positions will be open.

[e25 5]

Yep, I think Bennell's move forward is only temporary and he will one day find a home on the HBF or in a BP.

[Guest Thomo]

Awesome, a thread on Bruce not being part of the future. Any chance you could start a thread on Watts or Miller, we need more of those as well???

[DeeSpencer 25,713]

Morton started down back this season but on Monday was moved to wing after being the lose man in defence and I think that is where he excels. I like the way he dropped back to help out but also got on the end of a few pieces of play (with the goal and beautiful kick to Bate in particular). Cale probably played a tough a game I've seen him play and hopefully that improvement will continue.

Bruce has really been a pillar on which this backline was built. He held the group together many times last year and in 08 and I think has been instrumental in helping Grimes, Frawley, Warnock and others. But now his disposal especially under immense pressure is leaving a lot to be desired and I even thought there were times on Monday the players didn't want to give him the ball.

I'm happy with him in the side at the moment. I'm not a massive fan of Macdonald or Cheney and I'd like to see Strauss have a couple of more good games first. However I'd be very disappointed if either Cam or the club made a decision to keep him around when he was past it. Retiring on a high would be nice, we've seen some imperfect ends to careers of late and thinking back to the Daniher years we've seen veteran players block the development of youngsters.

[Red Sox 2]

Awesome, a thread on Bruce not being part of the future. Any chance you could start a thread on Watts or Miller, we need more of those as well???

Thomo....hopefully you can gain that 30 seconds back from your life that you wasted even commenting on the thread if so opposed.

I read it as Morton taking over from Bruce and therefore squeezing Bruce out altogether as I can't see another position that would warrant Bruce being selected.

Happy to hear your take on where he best fits if at all....otherwise, ignore it and move on mate because there is a fair chance you might see a few more of these pop up considering we tend to discuss MFC players here.

Happy to talk about Craig Moores longevity for the Socceroos should you so desire.

[H_T 3,047]

Happy to talk about Craig Moores longevity for the Socceroos should you so desire.

Don't bother....2 weeks, there, said it.

[trudders 0]

A few have mentioned that Garland should move up forward to make way for Cheney.

I reckon we put bruce up forward to make way for Cheney.

[Dappa Dan 2,188]

Like to see people's opinion on Cam Bruce and Cale Morton.

Cam has been a great club man for the MFC and I take my hat off to him for his achievements. I just think his time has come.

The stories of Cam's demise are greatly exaggerated.

I'm getting sick to death of posts claiming he's going to get a tap on the shoulder at the end of the year. (not this thread, by the way) It's garbage. He'll play next year and will play more often than he doesn't because he's a very important player in the side.

As far as the comparison between the two goes... yes they're similar, but it's not like we're talking Warnock and Frawley here. They're similar in that they can play anywhere on the ground. The side can EASILY do with two players of this type... the genuine utilities. One won't squeeze out the other at all... and the cult of youth will not, in this case, claim another scalp prematurely.

[Little Goffy 14,556]

A Bruce - Morton comparison doesn't sit well with me.

After being a relatively patient mostly defender of Bruce for a long time, I'm just beginning to think he's done. Early in the game against Collingwood I felt like I was watching his career end - so many of his traditional handballs to a teammate who is just about to be tackled, so many dinky little 50/50 passes.

If I were making a comparison on who should be a negating but sometimes dangerous forward, I'd compare Bruce and Dunn. And I'd have Dunn ahead. He offered a strong controlling effort and still looks more dangerous attacking than Bruce.

I've got a lot of time for Cameron Bruce, I love re-watching the 2000 Qualifying final and he bobs up in highlights right over the last ten years. In future I'll resist the urge to comment on it because it is unfair to slap a guy when he's not terrible, just not delivering anything great. This is probably his last season (or contract period), footy sucks sometimes but I hope he's in the team and playing his guts out in Round 22 against the Kangaroos, to slip us into the finals for a big farewell.

Just on that, does anyone else share the little flicker of a dream that the storyline will run to round 22 with the Demons and Kangaroos fighting for the final spot in the 8, and everything on the line for both teams, with Brent Harvey and Cameron Bruce matched up on eachother looking for one last pre-retirement final.

[praha 11,240]

The game has passed Bruce. He has been a club stalwart, but I definitely don't see any future for him beyond 2010 with the emergence of young players.

[Red Sox 2]

The stories of Cam's demise are greatly exaggerated.

I'm getting sick to death of posts claiming he's going to get a tap on the shoulder at the end of the year. (not this thread, by the way) It's garbage. He'll play next year and will play more often than he doesn't because he's a very important player in the side.

As far as the comparison between the two goes... yes they're similar, but it's not like we're talking Warnock and Frawley here. They're similar in that they can play anywhere on the ground. The side can EASILY do with two players of this type... the genuine utilities. One won't squeeze out the other at all... and the cult of youth will not, in this case, claim another scalp prematurely.

Well argued Dappa....I was looking at as Morton & Bruce fighting for the one position rather than simply bashing Cam and wanting him gone. In my opinion I still believe this to be the case but if there is room for both and a firing Cam Bruce I'm all for it....just not sure if he can be as effective as we need him to be.

[jayceebee31 761]

I think Cam should be preparing for retirement even possibly next year.He has done a good solid job- but others are moving ahead of him IMO..

[e25 5]

Well one thing is for sure; he won't be pushing Morton out of the side.

As time goes on (and possibly by the end of this season) youg players will progress in their development until they are too good to be denied a spot for 'an experienced leader'.

Once he starts regularly featuring in the VFL and can't squeeze into the side, I think he'll pull the pin.

It's all dependent on the kids. And there's a lot of them.

Spots are already hard to come by.

This is why I think Joel Mac is on borrowed time.