He has done nothing to show me why he went number 1 pick

[classy dees 42]

But as Bailey said, draftees need two full pre-seasons under their belt before they can start to seriously compete. For Watts, a KPP, that might take 3-4 years.

Bailey also mentioned Frawley, and how he has come on so well this year, after putting that finals 3-4 kgs onto his frame. It took Frawley, who isn't as big as Watts, 3 years to really adapt. He looked hopeless at the start of his career.

yup. almost in first 10 picked i'd imagine. looks a mainstay for years to come

[biggestred 4,823]

im sorry but all good markers of the footy look at the ball when marking it

just like gary ablett did. all those photos of players taking marks with their eyes closed.

anyway, he was a bit casual but he had space - not expecting a hit, and because there was no one around him.

the kid is clever. he will adjust, and be a gun, make no mistake.

[Jaded No More 67,822]

Doesn't strike me as someone who fears the hard stuff (he seems pretty into it actually)... just as someone so skinny that Fletcher can lift him off the ground with one hand!

By the way, it was a very good indication of what opposition teams think of Watts, that for most of the game Fletcher played on him, instead of playing on Robbo and/or Miller. I know Fletcher doesn't always take the opposition's best forward, but for him to be given the job on a second gamer, was a good mark of respect for Watts, and a great lesson for Watts as well.

[Redleg 40,228]

I heard Leigh make those comments. Throwaway line that was bound to excite the minds of some.

Correct. People should not over analyse the statement. What he was presumably simply saying is that he has not seen anything brilliant from Watts "so far" that illustrates his draft position, that is not to say that he doesn't believe in time he will become a good or even better player.

[Redleg 40,228]

It took Frawley, who isn't as big as Watts, 3 years to really adapt. He looked hopeless at the start of his career.

Agree.

[Freak 100]

look at riewoldt, pavlich and jonathan brown. they NEVER take their eyes off the footy when marking.

anyway, i know longer respect the draft camp results. Watts over 20metres is meant to be quicker than Aaron Davey and Lovett for Gods sake. But he simply looks average speed. And he doesnt look 196cm either. Franklin looks 196cm, Watts looks about 192cm. I think he will be good but yeh slightly disappointed that he hasnt shown his speed. Speed is something that is unaffected by your experience. If you're fast you look it from day 1.

[rodent killer 0]

Leigh and Dennis were talking about Watts and Leigh said he has done nothing to show me why he got picked number 1. Then straight away Watts marked and kicked his 2nd. Dennis said a few positives about Watts but I thought it was an interesting comment. There has been so much hype about this kid and this would have been the first time Leigh saw him live. Hodge and Reiwoldt didn't star in the first 2 games did they? Lets be patient with the kid.

On a other note should we keep playing him in the seniors or send him back to Casey for a hit out.

keep playing him, he reminds exactly of Reiwoldt when he first started

[dee-luded 2,959]

I also believe that Matthews said he was a key position player, and he's obviously going to take time...

Matthews is IMO a Finishing coach. Not a development coach. IMO he doesn't have the patience to List Manage & develop a List of beginners. I'm glad we don't have him @ Present,,, as coach.

Down the track a couple of years he'd be OK.

[Jaded No More 67,822]

look at riewoldt, pavlich and jonathan brown. they NEVER take their eyes off the footy when marking.

anyway, i know longer respect the draft camp results. Watts over 20metres is meant to be quicker than Aaron Davey and Lovett for Gods sake. But he simply looks average speed. And he doesnt look 196cm either. Franklin looks 196cm, Watts looks about 192cm. I think he will be good but yeh slightly disappointed that he hasnt shown his speed. Speed is something that is unaffected by your experience. If you're fast you look it from day 1.

Speed is most certainly something that is affected by experience. Watts now knows how quick the game is, and how quick he needs to be. He didn't go full speed when Davey was on his back, and he should have. Still, I wouldn't expect a 196cm kid to beat Davey in a foot race. He would beat him because he has the lateral movement and thinking to do so.

You think the Draft Camp made up the results, do you, and that perhaps Watts has shrunk at his old age?

This thread is now more ridiculous than the original blowup of the comment regarding Watts.

[rodent killer 0]

I also believe that Matthews said he was a key position player, and he's obviously going to take time...

Mathews just likes the sound of his own voice

[dee-luded 2,959]

This thread is now more ridiculous than the original blowup of the comment regarding Watts.

Is this the Dean??

[Einstein 1]

My earliest footballing memory is being at a game and watching him king hit Peter Giles behind the play, this seems to be a common theme.

Yeah, I remember that game, late in 1982. Happened right in front of me in the old Southern Stand. Giles made him look old and slow, ran away from him. After Giles cleared the ball out of defense Matthews just king hits him from behind.

What was amusing was that Brent Crosswell retaliated by striking Michael Moncrieff twice in two separeate incidents, getting reported both times. He got suspended and it was his last game in the VFL.

That was actually a pretty amazing game. We were down by 7 goals at 3 quarter time and came back to hit the front in the last quarter, Giles kicking the goal to take the lead. Unfortunately the Hawks steadied and kicked 2 goals in time-on to win the game.

And for the Steven Smith incident, I never actually saw it, I was up the other end of Princes Park when it took place. The story goes that Barass made sure that Smithy would still be on the stretcher in the rooms at halftime so the boys could see what was done to him.

As for the thread topic itself, I think it was just good to see Watts do a couple of good things last night. Clearly he isn't physically prepared for AFL football yet, but he has a good football brain and polished skills. His body will come in time. There's absolutely no reason for anybody to worry about him right now. Matthews' comments were pretty throw away from all accounts, havent heard them yet myself. Watts is easily still the right choice at 1st pick in last years draft.

Not sure if he'll play again next week. According to those who know him, he will only play another 3 games this season. Maybe they will spread them out over the last 10 weeks or maybe give them all to him in a row before sending him back to Casey to finish the season.

[Freak 100]

Speed is most certainly something that is affected by experience. Watts now knows how quick the game is, and how quick he needs to be. He didn't go full speed when Davey was on his back, and he should have. Still, I wouldn't expect a 196cm kid to beat Davey in a foot race. He would beat him because he has the lateral movement and thinking to do so.

You think the Draft Camp made up the results, do you, and that perhaps Watts has shrunk at his old age?

This thread is now more ridiculous than the original blowup of the comment regarding Watts.

[Freak 100]

Speed is most certainly something that is affected by experience. Watts now knows how quick the game is, and how quick he needs to be. He didn't go full speed when Davey was on his back, and he should have. Still, I wouldn't expect a 196cm kid to beat Davey in a foot race. He would beat him because he has the lateral movement and thinking to do so.

You think the Draft Camp made up the results, do you, and that perhaps Watts has shrunk at his old age?

This thread is now more ridiculous than the original blowup of the comment regarding Watts.

you say you dont expect a 196cm player to beat davey in a foot race..yet the draft camp results suggest he should.

[Rogue 585]

I KNOW! in a whole 2 games. Jeeeez why isnt he kicking bags of 6 or 10?

This is a strawman argument. You're misrepresenting Freak's comment - you don't need to be dominating, or even competitive, to show pace.

I hope we're not so precious that nothing that could be deemed as negative will be accepted.

[Hannabal 4]

look at riewoldt, pavlich and jonathan brown. they NEVER take their eyes off the footy when marking.

anyway, i know longer respect the draft camp results. Watts over 20metres is meant to be quicker than Aaron Davey and Lovett for Gods sake. But he simply looks average speed. And he doesnt look 196cm either. Franklin looks 196cm, Watts looks about 192cm. I think he will be good but yeh slightly disappointed that he hasnt shown his speed. Speed is something that is unaffected by your experience. If you're fast you look it from day 1.

You clearly never saw Phil Carman take a mark.

Watts ran 2.82 at DC for 20 metres, but had previously tested for 2.79. He's fast, but clearly hasn't used his pace yet.

Btw Freak, are you Mo's son ?

[Jaded No More 67,822]

you say you dont expect a 196cm player to beat davey in a foot race..yet the draft camp results suggest he should.

I don't expect Watts to beat Davey in a foot race. I expect Watts to beat Davey over the distance.

Watts had precisely 5 meters on Davey, and next time I would back him to evade him with a clever sidestep.

To suggest that he is actually not as quick as the Draft Camp results show because of yesterday, is to not understand that those results are done in vastly different environments.

Watts is actually that quick, and does have the agility that those results indicate, but when he has played two games and is yet to acclimatise to the pace, the conditions, and the game plan, his speed is likely to be impacted, not because he is suddenly slow, but because he doesn't know when he needs to go up to fifth gear, and when he can try and cruise along, giving him time to work through a situation.

And pace, without an ability to work through a situation and read the play, is useless. Just ask Daniel Ward.

Plenty of guys can run fast in a straight line, but not many, particularly those of Jack's height, have the speed of turn and evasive skills that he has. That's why in a year or two he'll be sidestepping the best of them.

[Rogue 585]

I can't remember the exact words, but Matthews qualified what he said by saying something like "I'm not sure what I expected from an 18 year old school kid and that Key Position players do take a long time to develop."

That sounds like a fair comment - if you looked at what everyone else from the 2008 draft has shown, I'm sure many are looking much better.

I'm also not sure Watts has shown anything too special - sure, his kicking for goal looked nice, but that's not worthy of a number one ranking.

Note to those hyper-sensitive about Watts: I've not criticised him, not suggested we shouldn't have taken him at #1, and I certainly haven't said he won't make it/is no good.

[titan_uranus 24,654]

That sounds like a fair comment - if you looked at what everyone else from the 2008 draft has shown, I'm sure many are looking much better.

I'm also not sure Watts has shown anything too special - sure, his kicking for goal looked nice, but that's not worthy of a number one ranking.

Note to those hyper-sensitive about Watts: I've not criticised him, not suggested we shouldn't have taken him at #1, and I certainly haven't said he won't make it/is no good.

A fair and accurate appraisal of Watts so far.

[beelzebub 23,200]

if you want a more reailstic idea of differences in debuts look no further than Watts v Jurrah.. Chalk and cheese really. But I mean that as no slight to Watts . He is at a different place in terms of his personal development. I have no doubt he, JW, will come along quite nicely and really cant believe the anti hype towards him.

Am happy for him NOT to set the world on fire htis season

[Rogue 585]

Well this isn't completely true, alot of Melbourne fans expected alot more of him this year even though they knew where he came from and what he's done, this is something I don't really understand. [...] overall he looked like a schoolboy playing against men....er sound familiar?

Exactly. After his first game I mentioned to another Dees fan that it looked like he was in a kids versus parents scratch match at times.

If people are surprised or unhappy with how Watts is going, they should think about how the year-12 Watts would fare against a 26-year old Watts from the future, in peak physical condition with 8 years of elite sport behind him.

[rpfc 28,052]

if you want a more reailstic idea of differences in debuts look no further than Watts v Jurrah.. Chalk and cheese really. But I mean that as no slight to Watts . He is at a different place in terms of his personal development. I have no doubt he, JW, will come along quite nicely and really cant believe the anti hype towards him.

Am happy for him NOT to set the world on fire htis season

Agree.

He is a baby at the start of his career - I'm just enjoying his fledgling career. It's gotta start somewhere, and it's gonna start slow...

Just be happy to see the beginning of something special.

And Captain Picard is right to be frustrated, some of you are losing my respect pretty quickly.

And what other currency is there on forums like this?

Just remember - Just because you think it, doesn't mean you have to come on here and type it up. Save yourself some embarrassment and keep it to yourself.

[Geddy Lee 582]

One passage of play in the 2nd quarter on the half-forward flank was pretty encouraging and no surprise it was lost on so many. JW got the ball, evaded, sized up his options and delivered to an MFC player (Jurrah maybe). He looked as if he was moving slowly, but he wasn't. He was graceful, poised and smart, and I thought it was great to see.

But it's Demonland so let's all talk about Davey running him down.

[Jaded No More 67,822]

One passage of play in the 2nd quarter on the half-forward flank was pretty encouraging and no surprise it was lost on so many. JW got the ball, evaded, sized up his options and delivered to an MFC player (Jurrah maybe). He looked as if he was moving slowly, but he wasn't. He was graceful, poised and smart, and I thought it was great to see.

But it's Demonland so let's all talk about Davey running him down.

2nd quarter, 9:40 on the clock.

Just watched it. Superb mid-air pickup and blind handball over his head.

People need to watch that and understand why this kid is so so good and went at number one. Most players don't have the skills or vision to do that, let alone at his height. Beautiful to watch.

On replay, that Davey rundown was all down to Watts strolling instead of running. He was looking for options (what a surprise, he had none ), and didn't realise Davey was behind him. He was 2 seconds away from disposing the ball too. He now knows that you never stroll in the defensive 50, you BOLT!

Edit: the comment from Leigh Matthews was just odd. It came at a silly time of the match (as Watts was lining up for his second, after a really good run and chase) and was a pointless remark. Nothing to get excited about.

[jacey 333]

Breaking tackles isn't always about force, it's about angles and thinking one's way through a problem

- this was reiterated when Green was on the wing and had Davey hot on his heel. Rather than attempting to wait for the tackle and break it, or get rid of the ball before being tackled, Green took possession of the ball and ran at an angle so that when Davey did reach him, he was too off balance to affect a tackle.

Spot on.

Look at Pendlebury. I wouldn't consider him quick but he's smart and runs hard at angles which makes it harder for opposition to line him up and make an effective tackle.

Jack may be number 1 but he's still learning and we all can see he's class. Take your time young fella.