Interesting interview with Jason McCartney, GWS manager of football.

I’m paraphrasing, but after the meeting with Clayton, Melbourne knew what they were doing but they didn’t have any strength in the negotiations.

He was very complimentary about Tim Lamb, but said that sometimes these situations arise, and that he’d also been through it before. IOW, they worked out what they were prepared to pay and it was take it or leave it. He only had 2 discussions with Tim Lamb, it was mostly done through Clayton’s manager.

He also said that you have to look at the whole trade and draft period, not just individual trades.

If anyone else was listening and wants to expand on or correct the above, feel free.

Clearly, the main thing working against us was that there weren’t rival bidders to push the price up. As it was, they had us over a barrel.

Edited 3 hours ago3 hr by bing181

And to reply to my own post …

He basically confirmed that Oliver was pushed out (though perhaps not in as many words), and that crucially, we weren't taking him back.

31 minutes ago, bing181 said:

Interesting interview with Jason McCartney, GWS manager of football.

I’m paraphrasing, but after the meeting with Clayton, Melbourne knew what they were doing but they didn’t have any strength in the negotiations.

He was very complimentary about Tim Lamb, but said that sometimes these situations arise, and that he’d also been through it before. IOW, they worked out what they were prepared to pay and it was take it or leave it. He only had 2 discussions with Tim Lamb, it was mostly done through Clayton’s manager.

He also said that you have to look at the whole trade and draft period, not just individual trades.

If anyone else was listening and wants to expand on or correct the above, feel free.

Clearly, the main thing working against us was that there weren’t rival bidders to push the price up. As it was, they had us over a barrel.

Rival bidders are a bit of a myth in AFL trades. Once a player has made up their mind where they want to go you just have to deal with that club. Collingwood was clearly interested in Oliver but Oliver had no interest in them.

This is all even more true when you ask a player to explore their options. You just have to take what you can get.

16 minutes ago, bing181 said:

And to reply to my own post …

He basically confirmed that Oliver was pushed out (though perhaps not in as many words), and that crucially, we weren't taking him back.

That from his Manager's pov who I suspect didn't tell McCartney how Oliver contributed to the 'no way back' divorce. If Oliver played his cards differently he would still be with us. Burnt his bridges and slammed the door on the way out. Of course, the club would not take him back.

Once the manager told GWS his version and the up to $700k mfc contribution we had no bargaining power. His manager did the club no service.

Thanks to the Trac trade bounty the club will be fine.

I truly hope Oliver finds a happy place off the field and gets back to his best. Being out of the AFL bubble should help

Edited 2 hours ago2 hr by Lucifers Hero

I have come to accept the lose of trac as it seems we have been well compensated and he didn't appear to want to play for us, but still digesting the Oliver departure. Can we have some facts? I feel the supporters need and honest explanation as to what led to the decision and why we get such a poor return in the "trade".

1 hour ago, Gibberish said:

I'm finding some of the comments on this thread quite unpalatable. Maybe it's a coping mechanism for some but I will miss Oliver and wish him the best.

The circumstance I see is more a reflection of the failings of our previous administration. He didn't hand out his own contract.

Good luck Clarry, just don't play too well when you play us.

As an aside I wonder if we've created some salary cap space where we can possibly front end what he's owed, so we don't have this black hole in our cap in future years.

He was worth the contract at the time of signing it, the only failing by the previous administration is to not have acted quicker in removing him from the club. Are you under the age of 30? Because your response suggests that you are, this is the problem with a lot of younger people today, a sense of entitlement and no accountability (talking about Oliver). Yes everyone makes mistakes and not everyone is lucky enough to get the assistance he would have received and he continues to behave the way he does. He would want to be investing his earnings well because when his footy career is over if he hadn’t set himself up the real world may not be as forgiving.

22 hours ago, Ghostwriter said:

They’re all very sad days for different reasons. And there’s plenty to choose from. I have a friend who says for her there will never be a day sadder than Boxing Day 2004 💔

I had forgotten about that

Indeed a sad day for millions but so too for the club.

IN 2021 was a part of the solution, then has become part of the problem. Hard to believe we only got a future third rounder for him.

The club needs to take some key lessons from this. Long-term contracts are a millstone around the club's neck. With player movement so easy and player power being so strong, we need to be smarter about managing our list. Flexibility is key and this means being willing to let our stars go. If you have cap space, you can pick up players like Oliver, Steele, Ainsworth for next to nothing.

2 minutes ago, Bombay Airconditioning said:

He was worth the contract at the time of signing it, the only failing by the previous administration is to not have acted quicker in removing him from the club. Are you under the age of 30? Because your response suggests that you are, this is the problem with a lot of younger people today, a sense of entitlement and no accountability (talking about Oliver). Yes everyone makes mistakes and not everyone is lucky enough to get the assistance he would have received and he continues to behave the way he does. He would want to be investing his earnings well because when his footy career is over if he hadn’t set himself up the real world may not be as forgiving.

Not disputing all you say but you have to consider that the players are often very young themselves.

Some are just not equipped to deal with the pressure and attention towards them.

I'm not making excuses or defending any immature behaviour but it's worth considering these young kids find themselves in situations a lot of us would struggle with at their age.

I know I would have .

In this players situation I withhold saying anything except that there are extenuating circumstances and we should cut him a little slack.

49 minutes ago, bing181 said:

And to reply to my own post …

He basically confirmed that Oliver was pushed out (though perhaps not in as many words), and that crucially, we weren't taking him back.

The upside was that the hole created in the salary cap (with the loss of Oliver) allowed us to sign a 'virtual' free agent in Steele

Trouble walks out the door replaced with a solid citizen (and leader) who slots straight into a midfield role

Lmfao, I know. I blame Goodwin in part for this; his last couple of years had the smell of when the players ruled the roost before Roos and Jackson got there, and behaviors were excused. But there must be more to this.

There was nothing wrong with Oliver's contract!!!

Trac's was almost identical!

And, we were not taking either of them back.

But look at the different trade results:

Oliver:

• F3rd pick

• GWS take only about 50% of the $1.3+ pa salary freeing up only about $700k in sal cap for 5 years

Petracca:

• 3 - first round picks (2 top 10 2025, F1st in 2026)

• 2 - second round picks (ND 37 in 2025, 2026 F2nd)

• 1 - third round pick (2027)

• GCS take 100% of his salary freeing up $1.3+m pa in sal cap

Giving GCS

• 3 - second round picks (ND24, ND28 in 2025, 2026 F2nd)

The sal cap benefit of the Trac trade should not be underestimated.

As much as we all love Oliver and feel that the club has 'shot bambi' people need to ask themselves how two champions can have such a different trade value.

It isn't the contract!

Edited 1 hour ago1 hr by Lucifers Hero

It's sad, but this is the right move for the team and the club

I wouldn't use the word farewell for Oliver . This guy is kid in an mans body who hasn't grown up. We got our fingers burnt on this dude, paying part of his wage and accepting a crappy pick is beyond comprehension.

22 minutes ago, Lucifers Hero said:

There was nothing wrong with Oliver's contract!!!

Trac's was almost identical!

And, we were not taking either of them back.

But look at the different trade results:

Oliver:

• F3rd pick

• GWS take only about 50% of the $1.3+ pa salary freeing up only about $700k in sal cap for 5 years

Petracca:

• 3 - first round picks (2 top 10 2025, F1st in 2026)

• 2 - second round picks (ND 37 in 2025, 2026 F2nd)

• 1 - third round pick (2027)

• GCS take 100% of his salary freeing up $1.3+m pa in sal cap

Giving GCS

• 3 - second round picks (ND24, ND28 in 2025, 2026 F2nd)

The sal cap benefit of the Trac trade should not be underestimated.

As much as we all love Oliver and feel that the club has 'shot bambi' people need to ask themselves how two champions can have such a different trade value.

It isn't the contract!

AFL clubs have enough leverage to get a good trade with one extra year on the contract. (Even players out of contract usually get nearly full value.) But seven years becomes a liability.

Petracca's contract was also a massive risk. If he had not played again after getting injured last year we would still have suffered a massive cap hit.

Same with Brayshaw.

The long-term contracts are a disaster. Even a player like Kossie, who is a star, is now a libaility from a list perspective.

We need to let players go and gain players from other clubs mistakes. If we do this and recruit well, we will be a top club consistently.

27 minutes ago, Lucifers Hero said:

There was nothing wrong with Oliver's contract!!!

Trac's was almost identical!

And, we were not taking either of them back.

But look at the different trade results:

Oliver:

• F3rd pick

• GWS take only about 50% of the $1.3+ pa salary freeing up only about $700k in sal cap for 5 years

Petracca:

• 3 - first round picks (2 top 10 2025, F1st in 2026)

• 2 - second round picks (ND 37 in 2025, 2026 F2nd)

• 1 - third round pick (2027)

• GCS take 100% of his salary freeing up $1.3+m pa in sal cap

Giving GCS

• 3 - second round picks (ND24, ND28 in 2025, 2026 F2nd)

The sal cap benefit of the Trac trade should not be underestimated.

As much as we all love Oliver and feel that the club has 'shot bambi' people need to ask themselves how two champions can have such a different trade value.

It isn't the contract!

The fact the Saints are paying some of Steeles contract, I’d say we would have a net impact of approx 250-300k.

9 hours ago, Mel Bourne said:

I don’t want to put the boot in - coaching an AFL team in the current era would be hugely demanding. Not only for the obvious reasons, but coaches are also dealing with young minds during a mental health epidemic. I’m confident that Goodwin was doing his best to deal with the various issues between players, but it was just too tall an order for him.

The need for AFL teams to have their mental-health programs in order is rising exponentially. These players are just as addicted to their phones as anyone, and they’re constantly reading all kinds of opinions on their performances and their general behaviour. They are deeply susceptible to depression and anxiety (and the subsequent “acting out” that can come with it), and it takes a lot of expertise and emotional intelligence to guide an entire group through such an environment.

Maybe the messaging has always been wrong with Clarry, or maybe he was just unreachable, but I hope King and his crew are able to create an environment that brings out the best in our players and encourages them to actually want to be “demons for life”. The recent trades of our stars have been a deeply disappointing demonstration of how important that is

AFL players get so much support (way more than the average adult/teen/kid in the street doing it tough mentally/physically) they have the AFLPA and a lot of resources within and outside the club. They can reach out to older players from nearly any club on advice, goalkicking, habits, wellness programs, post career, social media etiquette. It's all available.

57 minutes ago, demon3165 said:

Lmfao, I know. I blame Goodwin in part for this; his last couple of years had the smell of when the players ruled the roost before Roos and Jackson got there, and behaviors were excused. But there must be more to this.

Rumour is Goodwin was more of a mate than a father figure.

Probably hard to command respect on field if you are not perceived as a leader.

5 minutes ago, TooheysBlueDemons said:

AFL players get so much support (way more than the average adult/teen/kid in the street doing it tough mentally/physically) they have the AFLPA and a lot of resources within and outside the club. They can reach out to older players from nearly any club on advice, goalkicking, habits, wellness programs, post career, social media etiquette. It's all available.

Yes, but the most important support should be their families. You can throw money and resources to Psychologists, Doctors etc. but the most important part of all is your immediate circle.

It is difficult to say goodbye to someone that you have loved watching for such a long time in the Red and Blue will we ever see such a Star again burning so brightly for so long then flickering out and falling to the ground, you ask how can it be that this former mega star is now worth only a 3rd rounder and we are still paying for his earlier brilliance. Clayton, Clarry Choo Choo is no more, but we can all remember 2021 Bang, Bang,Bang, Bang.💥

18 minutes ago, Fat Tony said:

AFL clubs have enough leverage to get a good trade with one extra year on the contract. (Even players out of contract usually get nearly full value.) But seven years becomes a liability.

Petracca's contract was also a massive risk. If he had not played again after getting injured last year we would still have suffered a massive cap hit.

Same with Brayshaw.

The long-term contracts are a disaster. Even a player like Kossie, who is a star, is now a libaility from a list perspective.

We need to let players go and gain players from other clubs mistakes. If we do this and recruit well, we will be a top club consistently.

With our lack of a home base and being a smaller club, we are one of the least attractive teams for anyone looking to join. Anyone wanting to be in Melbourne will try and go to almost any other Melbourne-based team before us, with the exception of maybe North. Until this changes we have to offer long contracts to good players to be competitive - just the way it is. No one is driving to Casey if they have a choice unless there's a significant financial incentive.

1 hour ago, Lucifers Hero said:

As much as we all love Oliver and feel that the club has 'shot bambi' people need to ask themselves how two champions can have such a different trade value.

My word.

Everyone needs to ask themselves this. Our fans, opposition fans, media, everybody.

1 hour ago, Bombay Airconditioning said:

He was worth the contract at the time of signing it, the only failing by the previous administration is to not have acted quicker in removing him from the club. Are you under the age of 30? Because your response suggests that you are, this is the problem with a lot of younger people today, a sense of entitlement and no accountability (talking about Oliver). Yes everyone makes mistakes and not everyone is lucky enough to get the assistance he would have received and he continues to behave the way he does. He would want to be investing his earnings well because when his footy career is over if he hadn’t set himself up the real world may not be as forgiving.

I wish I was still under 30!

I don't think that the monetary value was ludicrous, but it is a significant amount. It was probably around the mark given his out put up to that point. But if there were behavioural issues then surely we would have had some first hand knowledge. Why didn't we add some performance or behavioural elements to a contract of that size? If there were off field issues why was he continually picked each week, even despite his, at times, lack of conditioning. These are some of the failings I am eluding to.

I don't know of his off field troubles, I don't know anyone involved with the club. I'm only judging him on what he has achieved on the field for our club. He brought a lot of success in his time and, as a player, I'll miss seeing him run around in the red and blue.