IMV, AFL has shifted to an elite sport, and with that, the coaching sphere has changed.

If you look at the EPL, the manager will bring the philosophy and how they want to play, but it won't be up to the manager to coach it as such. The first team coach will do that. In the AFL, it's the line coaches and strategy coach that works out how to play that way within the framework of the coach's philosophy.

Goody has definitely tweaked his philosophy. Everything flows from contest because that's the game, but in possession we have different gears. Either go immediately (we are one of the faster transition teams in the comp) or chip and maintain possession to pull apart the opposition's zonal structure.

Our model is not entirely unique to us, we're blending other's styles, but I maintain we want to use our pressure and stoppage strength to give a point of difference. The more good ball users we can get behind the ball and across half forward, the better we'll be.

I've compared our new style to the way Slot has changed Liverpool. Klopp, the previous manager, was 100% all the time, think Collingwood. No real variance to their game.

Ultimately, if the style can't be implemented it falls on the shoulders of the head coach, but the ability to implement really flows from how good the messaging is across the entire coaching team.

With the shifting philosophy, the list has had to shift too. I think we're not that far off, but the guys that are letting us down now are the forwards and mids, and their inability to finish the hard work of the rest of the team.

Edited May 18May 18 by Adam The God

27 minutes ago, Adam The God said:

IMV, AFL has shifted to an elite sport, and with that, the coaching sphere has changed.

If you look at the EPL, the manager will bring the philosophy and how they want to play, but it won't be up to the manager to coach it as such. The first team coach will do that. In the AFL, it's the line coaches and strategy coach that works out how to play that way within the framework of the coaches philosophy.

Goody has definitely tweaked his philosophy. Everything flows from contest because that's the game, but in possession we have different gears. Either go immediately (we are one of the faster transition teams in the comp) or chip and maintain possession to pull apart the opposition's zonal structure.

Our model is not entirely unique to us, we're blending other's styles, but I maintain we want to use our pressure and stoppage strength to give a point of difference. The more good ball users we can get behind the ball and across half forward, the better we'll be.

I've compared our new style to the way Slot has changed Liverpool. Klopp, the previous manager, was 100% all the time, think Collingwood. No real variance to their game.

Ultimately, if the style can't be implemented it falls on the shoulders of the head coach, but the ability to implement really flows from how good the messaging is across the entire coaching team.

With the shifting philosophy, the list has had to shift too. I think we're not that far off, but the guys that are letting us down now are the forwards and mids, and their inability to finish the hard work of the rest of the team.

Can we at least have collingwoods system and players that adhere to it

I can easily see their system

I cannot see ours and I wonder if we have one other than kick it to max down the line.

If we have one and the players can't won't adhere to it then we need new players in my view

2 minutes ago, jackaub said:

Can we at least have collingwoods system and players that adhere to it

I can easily see their system

I cannot see ours and I wonder if we have one other than kick it to max down the line.

If we have one and the players can't won't adhere to it then we need new players in my view

We do need more talent, all sides do, but we need players who can kick straight and take their chances forward of centre. That simple IMO.

47 minutes ago, Adam The God said:

We do need more talent, all sides do, but we need players who can kick straight and take their chances forward of centre. That simple IMO.

That’s a cop out for mine, we have plenty of talent, Collingwood and the Bulldogs have their fair share of average players that thrive in a good system and not all of their players are elite kicks.

4 minutes ago, Bombay Airconditioning said:

That’s a cop out for mine, we have plenty of talent, Collingwood and the Bulldogs have their fair share of average players that thrive in a good system and not all of their players are elite kicks.

I didn't say we needed more talent to implement the system. I just said we needed more talent as all teams do...

It would be nice to get some generational type father sons though.

Just now, Adam The God said:

I didn't say we needed more talent to implement the system. I just said we needed more talent as all teams do...

It would be nice to get some generational type father sons though.

No doubt all teams would love more talent, footy is interesting game had we gotten Houston we potentially say goodbye to one of Langford or X. But as it stand we have a lot of talent on this list. Some completely out of form, some past their past, some up and coming and some at the peak of their powers. We need to stop looking for excuses, so far this year we’ve had thrown up injuries, new gameplan, off field issues and as recently as a week or two ago @Disco InTurno suggested this year was a gap year of sorts as we transition our gameplan. I was of the opinion as I think most people were when our draw come out that we were finals bound. Goody needs to go along with one or two of favourite players in order to move on. There’s a stale feeling about the place.

1 hour ago, jackaub said:

Can we at least have collingwoods system and players that adhere to it

I can easily see their system

I cannot see ours and I wonder if we have one other than kick it to max down the line.

If we have one and the players can't won't adhere to it then we need new players in my view

If you actually think our system is kick it long down the line to Max you haven’t been watching us or you don’t know what you’re watching

1 hour ago, Pennant St Dee said:

If you actually think our system is kick it long down the line to Max you haven’t been watching us or you don’t know what you’re watching

Ok let's count how many times we do it today

Pls a simple statement of our system would assist me

11 minutes ago, jackaub said:

Ok let's count how many times we do it today

Pls a simple statement of our system would assist me

Seriously dudereham, we don’t use that anywhere like what we used to. I feel today will be the day it all comes together. Can see us really dominating large parts of today. Our goal kicking will decide whether we win by 8 or 40.

6 hours ago, beelzebub said:

I'm actually starting to think Goodwin is simply in the wrong role.

He obviously has a good connection with the players but as a coach, I.e the bloke who's supposed to coordinate the play etc I don't rate him.

I've fully believed for some time it was Ooze who was the real catalyst for our winning. He's gone, we're floundering.

But the connection of players and Goody remains.

I think he might simply be doing the wrong job.

Mentoring might be more his fit.

Tend to agree.

Goody would be a brilliant Football Department Manager…

It has been a steady decline since Burgess and Yze left the building

3 hours ago, jackaub said:

Ok let's count how many times we do it today

Pls a simple statement of our system would assist me

Did you see it, handball chains, hitting the 45s, moving the ball quickly which has been on show for 5 weeks. Playing at different speeds slow chipping when needed to work through zones, then going quicker honouring the run with handball as opposed to bombing it into 50 to create forward stoppage, which was the 21-24 model. And continued handball to work it into space. Not to mention we bring a lot more pressure across the ground That’s not to say we don’t still have a contested side but we are far more balanced at the stoppages than we were previously

3 hours ago, Roost it far said:

Seriously dudereham, we don’t use that anywhere like what we used to. I feel today will be the day it all comes together. Can see us really dominating large parts of today. Our goal kicking will decide whether we win by 8 or 40.

Well, that was a good pick!!!

8 minutes ago, Ollie fan said:

Well, that was a good pick!!!

I actually thought that win was coming last week. Happy to be proven correct even if it was a little roll of the confidence dice!!

Lock thread.

11 hours ago, beelzebub said:

I've fully believed for some time it was Ooze who was the real catalyst for our winning. He's gone, we're floundering.

Question - do you credit Yze with our midfield performance in 2022 and 2023 as well?

Lost at selection!

time to go Goody. No selection integrity!

Oh, did we win this week?

I’ll save this post for later then

11 minutes ago, DubDee said:

Question - do you credit Yze with our midfield performance in 2022 and 2023 as well?

Valid ...

I have wondered.

I do wonder what he was tasked to do....

Did 21 actually change some dynamics within the club ?

All a curiosity for sure

One hot day does not make a Summer

15 minutes ago, DubDee said:

Question - do you credit Yze with our midfield performance in 2022 and 2023 as well?

If Goodwin wasn't responsible for 2021, he's not responsible for 24 or 25 either. Can't have it both ways.

Giving no credit for success but all the blame for failure is of course classic confirmation bias.

1 minute ago, bing181 said:

If Goodwin wasn't responsible for 2021, he's not responsible for 24 or 25 either. Can't have it both ways.

Giving no credit for success but all the blame for failure is of course classic confirmation bias.

Actually you can..

Depends who was doing what, who tasked with what ?

Not your brightest post mate

26 minutes ago, DubDee said:

Question - do you credit Yze with our midfield performance in 2022 and 2023 as well?

Great call. And what about all the tactical innovations before Yze joined us (his first year was 2021)?

Over the last decade we have worked out way through at least three distinct phases of "scoring strategy":

1. Strategy designed to reduce opposition shot conversion percentage, while providing us extra numbers around the contest. (Opposition potentially gets quantity but low quality).(Think Diamond Defence era).

2. After that we played a "centre at all costs" strategy, where we gave the ball off to someone 30 m out straight in front every time, to maximise accuracy/conversion (shot quality not quantity)

3. From there we moved to the extreme forward press with repeat entries (quantity not quality). That won us a flag and got us top 4 for 3 years in a row.

On top of that we have had a constantly evolving tactics around "defence, contest, and transition" that has supported the scoring strategy.

This has included various defensive zone structures including Diamond Defence, and others including where we push a player up to contest, leave a man free out the back and back ourselves to work back faster than opposition transitiona.

We've had contested ball tactics that have utilised +1 at the contest and -1 at the contest.

We've used kick it long to Max and force a stoppage tactics. We've had play on at all cost tactics too. Now we use 45 degree cut out passes, short chips to retain possession. We use forward handballs.

I'm sure Goodwin has had substantial support from his assistant coaches with these innovations and changes over the years. But my bet is we would find that he is an innovative tactical thinker, who uses sport science and data/stats to drive plans, and that even though he might not be the guy coming up with every plan, he is the guy leading those plans and encouraging his team to do that analysis and make those changes.

This doesn't mean I don't think he will have an effective shelf life as coach, that he can get stale, or lose the players. It doesn't mean I don't think he is under significant pressure.

But I do think,from a reasonable outside perspective, he has runs on the board (including 3 successive top 4 finishes with a flag) that means he should be allowed to see through his transition to a new strategy and game plan, unless something has gone wrong at the relationship level.

Edited May 18May 18 by deanox

1 hour ago, bing181 said:

If Goodwin wasn't responsible for 2021, he's not responsible for 24 or 25 either. Can't have it both ways.

Giving no credit for success but all the blame for failure is of course classic confirmation bias.

Yes you can. It's the reason Domonland exists.

13 hours ago, beelzebub said:

I'm actually starting to think Goodwin is simply in the wrong role.

He obviously has a good connection with the players but as a coach, I.e the bloke who's supposed to coordinate the play etc I don't rate him.

I've fully believed for some time it was Ooze who was the real catalyst for our winning. He's gone, we're floundering.

But the connection of players and Goody remains.

I think he might simply be doing the wrong job.

Mentoring might be more his fit.

After seeing Goodys coaching performance today & actually in the last few games maybe time to retract your statement ?

9 hours ago, Bombay Airconditioning said:

No doubt all teams would love more talent, footy is interesting game had we gotten Houston we potentially say goodbye to one of Langford or X. But as it stand we have a lot of talent on this list. Some completely out of form, some past their past, some up and coming and some at the peak of their powers. We need to stop looking for excuses, so far this year we’ve had thrown up injuries, new gameplan, off field issues and as recently as a week or two ago @Disco InTurno suggested this year was a gap year of sorts as we transition our gameplan. I was of the opinion as I think most people were when our draw come out that we were finals bound. Goody needs to go along with one or two of favourite players in order to move on. There’s a stale feeling about the place.

🤷

8 hours ago, Roost it far said:

Seriously dudereham, we don’t use that anywhere like what we used to. I feel today will be the day it all comes together. Can see us really dominating large parts of today. Our goal kicking will decide whether we win by 8 or 40.

Wow .... Early call, impressive call.

I was hoping we'd stay with 'em but a win never entered my mind till the last 5mins.
Seen too many teams roll over us of late when the whips start cracking.