PREGAME: Rd 21 vs Western Bulldogs

[Deelectable 1,043]

53 minutes ago, binman said:

Not a debate? What is it then?

All i flippin said is that the club will still be doing everything they can to make finals.

You asked if I'd prefer we did, and I said yes.

I didn't ask for an explanation as to why you think why my desire for us to make the 8 is flawed.

And to be clear that last para was rhetorical so, please, no need for a rebuttal.

And you run this joint do you? You can dictate what others have to say? Superiority complex alive and well. Goodonya champ.

[Sir Why You Little 37,033]

If we make Finals from here, that will be great experience and exposure for our young guys. 
You can’t pack up now, that is an attitude we had 10 years ago. 
This Club has got to learn to fight, better than it does now 

Clubs around us will lose, we have to keep fighting 

[At Least I Saw a Flag 5,237]

What could possibly go wrong?

[binman 42,896]

52 minutes ago, Deelectable said:

And you run this joint do you? You can dictate what others have to say? Superiority complex alive and well. Goodonya champ.

Seriously, what on earth are you on about?

Did you fail the conclusion protocols or something?

[Deelectable 1,043]

4 minutes ago, binman said:

Seriously, what on earth are you on about?

Did you fail the conclusion protocols or something?

You failed plasticine buddy.

[monoccular 17,423]

16 hours ago, No10 said:

I think this is right, it should be done.

However, I think Windsor should be the one to take a rest.

By giving Windsor a rest, with probably but not certainly only 4 games to go, do you mean not play him at all?  Why?    VFL is not a rest. 

[middleagedemon 325]

6 hours ago, binman said:

Seriously, what on earth are you on about?

Did you fail the conclusion protocols or something?

Haha. Jeez Louise, from the poster who consistently talks down those who 'play the man'. 

I would have thought demonland's favourite son might be better than that!

As far as this season goes and the weekly commentary you provide on the state of our side, list, game-plan etc, it's fair to say that you're happy to move the goal posts depending on the result! Which of course keeps most happy on this site, as nobody wants to believe in a cup half empty. 

But if I may, whilst I agree Goody and co may want to fight nail and tooth to make the 8, I'm not sure the positives outweigh the negatives given the importance of bringing in quality high-end picks especially before the Tassie draft concessions hit.

Do people think we'd have won the 21 flag without the help of our bumper draft of Jackson, Pickett and Rivers? Do you? 

The thing about being glass half full all the time is that you end up painting over cracks, constantly. And a big part of why your views are so popular around here is because they make like-minded supporters 'feel good'. 

But hopefully reality has set in a bit and supporters can see with their own eyes that we do have fundemental flaws in our game plan, list, method and that coaches are open to criticism. And that losing in straight sets is not just down to inmacuracy on the night and/or injuries, umpires, blah blah blah. And that our team isn't actually as great as many think? And that Van Rooyen might not me 'the' best young key forward in the game. He might be a good one though? 

Btw, do you still think we're "tracking exactly as we should be"? 

 

There are those on here who do say some outlandishly negative [censored] on gameday threads etc, but those of us who have had strong views on club when we've dished up some absolute rubbish have been scoffed at from you and your merry brigade. But now, it looks like we were right all along. 

These cracks keep getting bigger, but your goal posts keep moving. Which is interesting. 

For the sake of longevity at the top whilst we have Gawn, May, Lever, Viney for the next couple of years, I think it'd bode well for us to finish outside the 8 this year to have another big crack at the draft and whilst making sure we absolutely nail FA/trade period and bring some a couple of fresh and highly respected assistant coaches to challenge this group that at times look completely uninspired and uninterested in following Godwin's message. 

 

 

[Jaded No More 68,903]

In a season this even, why wouldn’t you try and make the 8? Wouldn’t you rather we win one final and walk away from this season having removed the finals monkey off our backs and given our young players that finals experience? 

How is finishing 10th better than finishing 8th? I really don’t get the vibes in here. 

5 years ago you’d all be thrilled at the prospect of making the 8. Now we discount it because it only matters if you win the flag?
You all do realize that finals experience is really important to winning the whole thing right, and that 7 other finalists will also not go on to win the flag. You think Hawks fans don’t want to make it because they know their chances of winning the flag are incredibly slim?

[BDA 22,743]

Reckon there’s a few trolls signed up to the site recently 

[middleagedemon 325]

9 minutes ago, Jaded No More said:

You all do realize that finals experience is really important to winning the whole thing right, and that 7 other finalists will also not go on to win the flag. You think Hawks fans don’t want to make it because they know their chances of winning the flag are incredibly slim?

Didn't seem to bother us in 21?

And it certainly hasn't helped us make the 8 this year! 

So which is it?

The hawk's comparison is nonsensical given they're playing arguably the best football in the league right now and have been doing so consistently, have the vibrancy and drive of youth and are hungry. They're in a completely different spot to us as a list and don't need a top up of talent.

We are middling, are no flag threat, need another strong draft hand and most definitely need a mental rest. 

 

 

 

[rjay 24,917]

I've believed for most of this season that we need to reset the list.

The talk of making finals this year, it's not happening. Any chance went out the window with Trac's injury & probably earlier with Gus' s retirement.

Reset with a decent draft hand, good trade period & go again in 2025.

 

[No10 461]

44 minutes ago, monoccular said:

By giving Windsor a rest, with probably but not certainly only 4 games to go, do you mean not play him at all?  Why?    VFL is not a rest. 

As a first year player he’s overdue for a rest imo. No game at any level. ‘Managed’

I’m of the belief that if we win against the dogs then we play finals. Port (at home) then two lame duck sides.

So I don’t love the idea of no Windsor but I trust Hunter can deliver enough.

[Jaded No More 68,903]

20 minutes ago, middleagedemon said:

Didn't seem to bother us in 21?

And it certainly hasn't helped us make the 8 this year! 

So which is it?

The hawk's comparison is nonsensical given they're playing arguably the best football in the league right now and have been doing so consistently, have the vibrancy and drive of youth and are hungry. They're in a completely different spot to us as a list and don't need a top up of talent.

We are middling, are no flag threat, need another strong draft hand and most definitely need a mental rest. 

 

 

 

The 2018 finals experience was extremely important to us winning the flag in 2021. Many of our players have said so. Nobody expected us to do anything in 2018 in finals and yet we made the prelims. 

There is never an argument that I would agree with in which finishing just outside the 8 is better than in it. 
The difference in draft picks is inconsequential. It’s not as if the trade off is finals or a top 3 draft pick. 

[No10 461]

49 minutes ago, middleagedemon said:

Haha. Jeez Louise, from the poster who consistently talks down those who 'play the man'. 

I would have thought demonland's favourite son might be better than that!

As far as this season goes and the weekly commentary you provide on the state of our side, list, game-plan etc, it's fair to say that you're happy to move the goal posts depending on the result! Which of course keeps most happy on this site, as nobody wants to believe in a cup half empty. 

But if I may, whilst I agree Goody and co may want to fight nail and tooth to make the 8, I'm not sure the positives outweigh the negatives given the importance of bringing in quality high-end picks especially before the Tassie draft concessions hit.

Do people think we'd have won the 21 flag without the help of our bumper draft of Jackson, Pickett and Rivers? Do you? 

The thing about being glass half full all the time is that you end up painting over cracks, constantly. And a big part of why your views are so popular around here is because they make like-minded supporters 'feel good'. 

But hopefully reality has set in a bit and supporters can see with their own eyes that we do have fundemental flaws in our game plan, list, method and that coaches are open to criticism. And that losing in straight sets is not just down to inmacuracy on the night and/or injuries, umpires, blah blah blah. And that our team isn't actually as great as many think? And that Van Rooyen might not me 'the' best young key forward in the game. He might be a good one though? 

Btw, do you still think we're "tracking exactly as we should be"? 

 

There are those on here who do say some outlandishly negative [censored] on gameday threads etc, but those of us who have had strong views on club when we've dished up some absolute rubbish have been scoffed at from you and your merry brigade. But now, it looks like we were right all along. 

These cracks keep getting bigger, but your goal posts keep moving. Which is interesting. 

For the sake of longevity at the top whilst we have Gawn, May, Lever, Viney for the next couple of years, I think it'd bode well for us to finish outside the 8 this year to have another big crack at the draft and whilst making sure we absolutely nail FA/trade period and bring some a couple of fresh and highly respected assistant coaches to challenge this group that at times look completely uninspired and uninterested in following Godwin's message. 

 

 

How do you “nail FA / trade period” with a team not playing finals?

[640MD 3,375]

11 hours ago, Deelectable said:

Sorry mate. I've followed the Demons for nearly 70 years. Finishing 7th or 8th does little for me. There is only one prize and we're not winning it from there. Too many issues. Very excited for next season. Pick 6, 7 or 8 is juicy. Pre finals bye adds an extra layer of fatigue. Anyway, it's a moot point. Not beating Dogs or Suns which means it's over. Port and Pies are 50/50 at best.

Ditto.  Play the long game, need more luck in injured players and keeping them fit to play .  Get all players fixed before preseason. Not coming good in February. And any player from another club needs to be good enough to play a game and their part not just a bit player or break glass emergency. Nice blokes but NQR for our position 

[JJJ 1,263]

11 minutes ago, rjay said:

I've believed for most of this season that we need to reset the list.

The talk of making finals this year, it's not happening. Any chance went out the window with Trac's injury & probably earlier with Gus' s retirement.

Reset with a decent draft hand, good trade period & go again in 2025.

 

I agree that we need a reset. Although I don’t see much difference between finishing 8th (if we miraculously make it) or 10-12th in terms of draft hand.

However, I would like to see Jefferson and Doggy Brown squeeze in 1 or 2 games if possible and trial young players who have stalled, such as Bowey, a run in a different position.

[Deelectable 1,043]

1 hour ago, middleagedemon said:

Haha. Jeez Louise, from the poster who consistently talks down those who 'play the man'. 

I would have thought demonland's favourite son might be better than that!

As far as this season goes and the weekly commentary you provide on the state of our side, list, game-plan etc, it's fair to say that you're happy to move the goal posts depending on the result! Which of course keeps most happy on this site, as nobody wants to believe in a cup half empty. 

But if I may, whilst I agree Goody and co may want to fight nail and tooth to make the 8, I'm not sure the positives outweigh the negatives given the importance of bringing in quality high-end picks especially before the Tassie draft concessions hit.

Do people think we'd have won the 21 flag without the help of our bumper draft of Jackson, Pickett and Rivers? Do you? 

The thing about being glass half full all the time is that you end up painting over cracks, constantly. And a big part of why your views are so popular around here is because they make like-minded supporters 'feel good'. 

But hopefully reality has set in a bit and supporters can see with their own eyes that we do have fundemental flaws in our game plan, list, method and that coaches are open to criticism. And that losing in straight sets is not just down to inmacuracy on the night and/or injuries, umpires, blah blah blah. And that our team isn't actually as great as many think? And that Van Rooyen might not me 'the' best young key forward in the game. He might be a good one though? 

Btw, do you still think we're "tracking exactly as we should be"? 

 

There are those on here who do say some outlandishly negative [censored] on gameday threads etc, but those of us who have had strong views on club when we've dished up some absolute rubbish have been scoffed at from you and your merry brigade. But now, it looks like we were right all along. 

These cracks keep getting bigger, but your goal posts keep moving. Which is interesting. 

For the sake of longevity at the top whilst we have Gawn, May, Lever, Viney for the next couple of years, I think it'd bode well for us to finish outside the 8 this year to have another big crack at the draft and whilst making sure we absolutely nail FA/trade period and bring some a couple of fresh and highly respected assistant coaches to challenge this group that at times look completely uninspired and uninterested in following Godwin's message. 

 

 

Well said mate and spot on. Pity our recalcitrant 'friend' doesn't have your insight.

[dees189227 12,388]

So apparently goody has cellulitis. That's a nasty skin infection & can really knock you around. 

It can also come back so he needs to look after himself 

[rjay 24,917]

1 hour ago, JJJ said:

I agree that we need a reset. Although I don’t see much difference between finishing 8th (if we miraculously make it) or 10-12th in terms of draft hand.

However, I would like to see Jefferson and Doggy Brown squeeze in 1 or 2 games if possible and trial young players who have stalled, such as Bowey, a run in a different position.

Fair chance we could finish 13/14...although they say it's an even draft this year.

The myths of the draft..

This is a super draft

He is a generational talent

This is an even/deep draft

[Damo 3,355]

Play the kids. Look forward to the draft.

[Roost it far 8,255]

The debate about where we finish is moot. The players and coaches will be giving it everything to win and keep winning. We can argue what's best but it won't change that fact. Personally I think the Hawks have that '87 Demons vibe about them and will keep on winning...even saying that makes me vomit a little in my mouth. I'm loving the Dogs atm as well. For those who think we're best off admitting defeat how say you if we roll the Dogs and Suns? I look at our fixture and above all else I want this team to smash the Pies, that will do me as I think we're better set for next year than we were for this year once we lost Gus. 

Edited July 28 by Roost it far

[Deemania since 56 6,634]

On 27/07/2024 at 22:42, biggestred said:

Sparrow def back in

Doggies will cut us to pieces

Disco would also be an advantage inclusion.

[dazzledavey36 54,861]

1 hour ago, Jaded No More said:

The 2018 finals experience was extremely important to us winning the flag in 2021. Many of our players have said so. Nobody expected us to do anything in 2018 in finals and yet we made the prelims. 

There is never an argument that I would agree with in which finishing just outside the 8 is better than in it. 
The difference in draft picks is inconsequential. It’s not as if the trade off is finals or a top 3 draft pick. 

Nathan Jones in a Shane Crawford podcast openly stated that missing out in 2020 finals series was what set up the 2021 premiership. 

Whilst the club just missed out, he explained that that they knew that they had the list and belief capable of contending the following year. There was good exposure of games into first year kids in Rivers, Pickett and Jackson which also helped 

Jones also stated tha missing out on the finals forced the club into refining a few little things here and there, and then set themselves up for a huge pre season

It's not a negative if the club misses out this year. I see huge positives in it if anything. 

[dazzledavey36 54,861]

1 hour ago, No10 said:

How do you “nail FA / trade period” with a team not playing finals?

Really?

Ask Richmond how they did it at the end of 2016, or Collingwood after the 2021 season.

Look out how we nailed the 2019 draft with Jackson, Pickett and Rivers and then Bowey and Ben Brown the following year.

It really can change quick smart if you absolutely nail your off season season with trades and draft.

[Clintosaurus 7,843]

Finals always better than no finals. There are commercial benefits that have to be considered. A loss this week makes it basically mathematical given the percentage difference but I want us going full pelt until Round 24. If we finish 13th then so be it.