3 hours ago, WiseDeeMan said:

I was told at the beginning of 2021 specifically from a former player (hasn't been at the club for a 2-3 years now) Oliver is big, big trouble.  He is treated differently to everyone else simply because he is a good player. If others were to do some of the things he does, they would be treated very differently.  He mentioned that one day when Oliver was behaving poorly, he gave it to him straight....yet Oliver wasn't the one reprimanded, it was Goodwin who spoke with this particular player and said "you can't talk to Clayton like that, we have to be careful with him". 

I would say enough is enough.  He clearly is massive trouble and has a huge contract.  Let go of getting compensated fairly based on his playing ability alone.  It's the whole package you must look at, his character is highly questionable and his contract will haunt us for years to come if he stays.

I'm guessing here, and this is just my opinion, but we have heard Petracca isn't upset with Oliver, but more with the way the club has handled him. I would say this is consistent with the above - they have had rules for him, and rules for others.  

It also was backed up by the infamous Pert / Goodwin interview where they said we've tolerated things and he will now be held accountable for his actions.  

Overall a good move by the MFC I say. 

The Chicago bulls in the 90s made room for all their personalities. Max Gawn seems to lead that way as well. Sometimes to get the most out of people you have to let them be who they are. If you make certain personality types submit to your will you will break them and get nothing out of them.

 

Worth bearing in mind in all the mass erratic outrage over keeping Clayton or ridding ourselves of him (depending on the latest update), is the key variable in all of this is what Geelong is willing to send back our way, and I’ve not seen that confirmed anywhere.

I also wouldn’t trust Mackie to not walk it back once at the point of no return.

3 hours ago, WiseDeeMan said:

I was told at the beginning of 2021 specifically from a former player (hasn't been at the club for a 2-3 years now) Oliver is big, big trouble.  He is treated differently to everyone else simply because he is a good player. If others were to do some of the things he does, they would be treated very differently.  He mentioned that one day when Oliver was behaving poorly, he gave it to him straight....yet Oliver wasn't the one reprimanded, it was Goodwin who spoke with this particular player and said "you can't talk to Clayton like that, we have to be careful with him". 

I would say enough is enough.  He clearly is massive trouble and has a huge contract.  Let go of getting compensated fairly based on his playing ability alone.  It's the whole package you must look at, his character is highly questionable and his contract will haunt us for years to come if he stays.

I'm guessing here, and this is just my opinion, but we have heard Petracca isn't upset with Oliver, but more with the way the club has handled him. I would say this is consistent with the above - they have had rules for him, and rules for others.  

It also was backed up by the infamous Pert / Goodwin interview where they said we've tolerated things and he will now be held accountable for his actions.  

Overall a good move by the MFC I say. 

I don't disagree with this but it comes back to mismanagement by the club and that is who must be held accountable. Oliver is a symptom of this culture, not the cause.

Combine that with the way the potential trade scenario has been handled and it is complete dysfunctional. We are a laughing stock and it is not because of Oliver.

Just now, At the break of Gawn said:

 

Live scene from the MFC

11 minutes ago, Big Gun said:

Wonder how poor Jimmy, being so passionate  about supporting young people through Reach, would view the treatment of these young men by the club.

 

There’s been a lot of weird posts on here of late but this has just taken the lead.

To trade Oliver for next to nothing would have torn the club apart. We get another year of a way healthier version ( I hope) and if we handle it well throughout the year will get way better value IF it comes to it. I’m relieved. 

10 minutes ago, RedFox said:

From the outside looking in all I saw from Clayton this season was that of somebody who was doing all the team things. He was getting around all of his teammates on the park, revelling in celebrating milestones, re-signings, playing a key role in the Kozzy doco. If he is a nightmare to work with, it certainly didn't appear that way on game day or in the media content put out by the club.

Even as recently in his podcast interview he spoke pretty well and seemed energised to attack this pre-season. Our skipper on radio this morning says he loves him as a player and even more as a person.

But at no stage was he fit enough to play at the elite level, so he is actually letting the team down, and Clarry must take some responsibility for that, as do the MFC. it was ludicrous to play him in the front half of the ‘24 Season 

9 minutes ago, At the break of Gawn said:

 

Shut down a trade but waiting to see if Geelong come back with a trade proposal? Huh?

Edited October 4, 20241 yr by greenwaves

4 hours ago, Tracca said:

My take is the external review has said get rid of bad apples. And we have told clarry to start looking around

Your'e on the money IMO.

Doesn't refer to ANB though-  he's genuine in needing change 

2 hours ago, dazzledavey36 said:

I agree, it's been handled extremely poorly.

Start off by getting rid of Pert for starters. This wouldn't be handled so poorly under Peter Jacksons and Josh Mahoneys watch.

Look at the way we professionally handled the Jack Watts and Jesse Hogan scenario. 

Can we all just admit that the club is in a complete mess no matter which side of the fence people sit on with Clarry?

There are very valid takes on this from many on here and I can see all sides.

We can't lose sight of the fact that the club has had problems, handled them terribly, and the reason the club is in the damn shape it's in right now is because of bull [censored] like this. 

Edited October 4, 20241 yr by layzie

2 minutes ago, greenwaves said:

Shut down but waiting to see if Geelong come back with a trade proposal? Huh?

It’s just a journalistic method to not fully commit to your statement.

What really concerns me as it does Max is the leaking of information.

Whos doing it?

Cant they do anything without the whole world knowing about it immediately?

Why would people within the club want to hurt the club?

7 minutes ago, Sir Why You Little said:

But at no stage was he fit enough to play at the elite level, so he is actually letting the team down, and Clarry must take some responsibility for that, as do the MFC. it was ludicrous to play him in the front half of the ‘24 Season 

Agree - he clearly wasn't anywhere near the level of fitness required for obvious reasons. Similarly, our midfield was so badly depleted that even at half fitness he was a more viable ball winner than anybody playing in the twos. In hindsight he should have been put on ice as soon as his hand injury was preventing him from performing the fundamentals.

1 hour ago, Adam The God said:

I really don't want to hear the ADD defence either. It's mostly BS.

Why

2 hours ago, JJJ said:

Im sure this is public knowledge but I’ll repeat it anyway, Clazz has been a load since his first season.

When Brendan McCartney was at the club, he got so sick and tired of Oliver’s antics that he sat him down in his office and showed him a long list of names.

He said, “do you recognise these names?”

”yeah some of them”

McCartney replied, “these are all the people at the club who think you’re a [censored]!!”

McCartney was really good for Oliver in those early days. Oliver was unaware that his behaviour was so impactful to so many people. McCartney was no nonsense and steered Oliver the right direction in terms of professionalism and treatment of others.

This is really an indictment on Clarry.

8 years after efforts like this from respected mentors and he chooses not to change

2 minutes ago, DeeZee said:

Why would people within the club want to hurt the club?

There are plenty of people working in the AFL landscape that just see it as a job, they are not passionate about the brand/club. Some of these people might feel a bit of a rush by telling a journo one or two things to start. Then it becomes something more permanent.

7 minutes ago, von said:

Why

I can't speak for the original poster, but essentially, diagnoses are often used as a shield, often without any nuance. Whilst there are legitimate reasons and occurrences where a diagnosis can play a part in an aggravating / mitigating manner, to have it bandied about in such a trivial manner, is not only disingenuous but completely trivialises and diminishes legitimate cases where a diagnoses is  a causative mechanism. I'd also suggest in many cases, these factors are far more causative than enabling. 

 

Edited October 4, 20241 yr by BLWNBA

2 minutes ago, RedFox said:

Agree - he clearly wasn't anywhere near the level of fitness required for obvious reasons. Similarly, our midfield was so badly depleted that even at half fitness he was a more viable ball winner than anybody playing in the twos. In hindsight he should have been put on ice as soon as his hand injury was preventing him from performing the fundamentals.

Clarry needs to be pushed hard this offseason.
He needs to concentrate on one thing. Getting 100% the fittest he has ever been, I don’t want to hear any excuses. I want to see him pushing the limits.
We need to see results next year…

3 minutes ago, JJJ said:

There are plenty of people working in the AFL landscape that just see it as a job, they are not passionate about the brand/club. Some of these people might feel a bit of a rush by telling a journo one or two things to start. Then it becomes something more permanent.

Nailed it. 

All this makes Fawlty Towers management style look good.

3 minutes ago, Sir Why You Little said:

Clarry needs to be pushed hard this offseason.
He needs to concentrate on one thing. Getting 100% the fittest he has ever been, I don’t want to hear any excuses. I want to see him pushing the limits.
We need to see results next year…

I am convinced Clarry is a proud person and will want to prove himself again as a top player. Big pre season coming up  (I hope)    The fact that MAX  says he is a good person is enough for me.  Digressing..  Just remember after a bad year with injuries  we lost to Brisbane up there by a few points Port at MCG by a few points and GWS by a few points.  I expect to make finals this year   Fit trac and Clarrie  ... here we come...   and with young blokes coming through Windsor etc       Hopefully good trade for ANB     injuries as always the key.             Glad Danniher retired  makes them less potent LOL

12 minutes ago, JJJ said:

There are plenty of people working in the AFL landscape that just see it as a job, they are not passionate about the brand/club. Some of these people might feel a bit of a rush by telling a journo one or two things to start. Then it becomes something more permanent.

My understanding there are also plenty of people involved in these negotiations & dealings that are outside of the club, especially player agents, whose incentive is clearly to agitate for more and more player movement, which the rumour mill frenzy feeds.

9 minutes ago, BLWNBA said:

I can't speak for the original poster, but essentially, diagnoses are often used as a shield, often without any nuance. Whilst there are legitimate reasons and occurrences where a diagnosis can play a part in an aggravating / mitigating manner, to have it bandied about in such a trivial manner, is not only disingenuous but completely trivialises and diminishes legitimate cases where a diagnoses is  a causative mechanism. I'd also suggest in many cases, these factors are far more causative than enabling. 

 

He seems to me to have genuine troubles relating to his diagnosis that would impact being in a high performance environment. It’s impossible to know from the outside how his ADD plays out day to day and what effect that has on his life. It’s clearly a significant one. 

Enjoyed this at least