On 01/10/2024 at 07:31, mo64 said:

The only reason we would be shopping Oliver around is that his off field issues are similar to that of Jesse Hogan.

If he's being shopped around, I don't know that any of us know the reasons. The internal workings and the internal dynamics of a playing group and club are not generally accessible to the wider public.

But to throw my own baseless speculation into the ring, I do wonder whether deep down here at some level the club has decided to close-off on this playing group and look to rebuilding around the next group down (JVR, Rivers, Judd, Windsor etc) plus going to the draft - and in particular this draft which apparently has plenty of talent. We've got Pick 5, perhaps we can massage our way into a second first-round pick. But if we could get a third first-rounder as well, it could go a fair way to setting us up long-term.

So ... Oliver: getting older, would get us some decent picks plus clear salary space. Also, much as we love him, he's not bringing leadership or a wise head either - and this when we've lost Gus and ANB.

Random thoughts.

 

  On 01/10/2024 at 07:36, Jaded No More said:

Perhaps it’s because Pert is going against the wishes of the FD

Or perhaps not.

  On 01/10/2024 at 07:16, DeesignerAU said:

Sure, I wasn't aware of this until I made some enquiries with "connected" people during Petracca-Gate.

I was told that a number of high profile Melbourne "people" (influential members/coterie types) are getting sick of Pert "working from home" in Noosa.

I initially was sceptical however Google is a wonderful thing and a little bit of digging confirmed that there's a "close family" business listed on the Dunn & Bradstreet register where the address is Noosa. I won't say who or what.

Now before anyone pipes up, this could absolutely be a way to claim back flights to and from the family holiday house or.... the truth that he in fact lives and "works from home" in Noosa and the information I was given is correct.

@Superunknown 

  On 01/10/2024 at 07:38, Return to Glory said:

I'm not across the review. Am I right in suggesting that Gary Pert is, in effect, partially reviewing himself? 

On the basis of what we know, the review is into the Football Department.

We either keep Oliver and throw everything into the next two years, or dump him and start building towards 2028. We will get [censored] all for him. 

<iframe src="https://gifer.com/embed/VgT" width=480 height=361.290 frameBorder="0" allowFullScreen></iframe><p><a href="https://gifer.com">via GIFER</a></p><iframe src="https://gifer.com/embed/VgT" width=480 height=361.290 frameBorder="0" allowFullScreen></iframe><p><a href="https://gifer.com">via GIFER</a></p>

  On 01/10/2024 at 07:54, DeesignerAU said:

@Superunknown 

Ta!

  On 01/10/2024 at 07:53, bing181 said:

Or perhaps not.

So 24 hours ago the club via Richo releases a statement claiming Oliver is a required player and we look forward to seeing him in red and blue next year and beyond. 
24 hours later we have 4 different leaks, suggesting the club is pushing Clarry to look at this options after Pert rang around clubs to see if they’d be interested. 

Make it make sense, because as far as I can tell, those are two different positions being taken by two different parts of the club.

  On 01/10/2024 at 07:57, Jaded No More said:

Make it make sense, because as far as I can tell, those are two different positions being taken by two different parts of the club.

Publicly the club has to deny deny deny. If Richardson comes out and says "we've suggested to Clayton that he explores his options", we'd be lucky to get a future second-rounder for him, especially on his salary.

I heard Collingwood were in a party mood when Pert left.

  On 01/10/2024 at 08:02, bing181 said:

Publicly the club has to deny deny deny. If Richardson comes out and says "we've suggested to Clayton that he explores his options", we'd be lucky to get a future second-rounder for him, especially on his salary.

The club can say nothing, as other clubs have when their players are being floated for trade. 
 

Why does no other club have their player movements plastered all over the media?

We are a [censored] mess 

  On 01/10/2024 at 08:02, bing181 said:

Publicly the club has to deny deny deny. If Richardson comes out and says "we've suggested to Clayton that he explores his options", we'd be lucky to get a future second-rounder for him, especially on his salary.

How does that work? Pert is calling up a bunch of clubs and saying "hey are you still keen on Oliver?" and we think we can con them into paying overs because we release a public statement to the press saying we will never trade him.

  On 01/10/2024 at 07:57, Jaded No More said:

So 24 hours ago the club via Richo releases a statement claiming Oliver is a required player and we look forward to seeing him in red and blue next year and beyond. 
24 hours later we have 4 different leaks, suggesting the club is pushing Clarry to look at this options after Pert rang around clubs to see if they’d be interested. 

Make it make sense, because as far as I can tell, those are two different positions being taken by two different parts of the club.

Club is Rudderless!

  On 01/10/2024 at 07:51, bing181 said:

If he's being shopped around, I don't know that any of us know the reasons. The internal workings and the internal dynamics of a playing group and club are not generally accessible to the wider public.

But to throw my own baseless speculation into the ring, I do wonder whether deep down here at some level the club has decided to close-off on this playing group and look to rebuilding around the next group down (JVR, Rivers, Judd, Windsor etc) plus going to the draft - and in particular this draft which apparently has plenty of talent. We've got Pick 5, perhaps we can massage our way into a second first-round pick. But if we could get a third first-rounder as well, it could go a fair way to setting us up long-term.

So ... Oliver: getting older, would get us some decent picks plus clear salary space. Also, much as we love him, he's not bringing leadership or a wise head either - and this when we've lost Gus and ANB.

Random thoughts.

If I was in charge I would be thinking something similiar. 

  On 01/10/2024 at 08:06, KozzyCan said:

How does that work? Pert is calling up a bunch of clubs and saying "hey are you still keen on Oliver?" and we think we can con them into paying overs because we release a public statement to the press saying we will never trade him.

Exactly right. 
Clubs aren’t stupid. If we are floating an A grader with 5 years remaining on his deal, then we are willing to take unders. It’s not as if Clarry has asked for a trade, and we stand firm and say no way unless we get 2 top 10 picks etc. 

If it’s us driving the trade, we will lose in the deal. Which is why we are an amateur club.

  On 01/10/2024 at 04:04, picket fence said:

He is the best mate of the source who is an influential person. 

Oh no...not an influencer....bit like Laura Loumer then......he/she is not Chinese by any chance and whispers a lot?

  On 01/10/2024 at 08:02, bing181 said:

Publicly the club has to deny deny deny. If Richardson comes out and says "we've suggested to Clayton that he explores his options", we'd be lucky to get a future second-rounder for him, especially on his salary.

This makes no sense. You don't categorically deny the rumours and say a player of his popularity and calibre will be at the club next year, while at the same time privately shopping him around, mere weeks after the club was leaking stories almost daily about Petracca (and now Kozzie).

Either the club is straight up lying to its supporters, in which case we should he disgusted and very angry, or the club is in disarray. 

Which one? Are supporters being take for mugs or is the club breaking down?

  On 01/10/2024 at 07:51, bing181 said:

If he's being shopped around, I don't know that any of us know the reasons. The internal workings and the internal dynamics of a playing group and club are not generally accessible to the wider public.

But to throw my own baseless speculation into the ring, I do wonder whether deep down here at some level the club has decided to close-off on this playing group and look to rebuilding around the next group down (JVR, Rivers, Judd, Windsor etc) plus going to the draft - and in particular this draft which apparently has plenty of talent. We've got Pick 5, perhaps we can massage our way into a second first-round pick. But if we could get a third first-rounder as well, it could go a fair way to setting us up long-term.

So ... Oliver: getting older, would get us some decent picks plus clear salary space. Also, much as we love him, he's not bringing leadership or a wise head either - and this when we've lost Gus and ANB.

Random thoughts.

If the club thinks we should rebuild around our young players, why sign Viney long term? Why keep Langdon? Why not also trade Trac? Why chase Houston?

Oliver just turned 27. That’s prime age for a midfielder. Cripps won two Brownlows in his 30s.

  On 01/10/2024 at 08:11, praha said:

This makes no sense. You don't categorically deny the rumours and say a player of his popularity and calibre will be at the club next year, while at the same time privately shopping him around, mere weeks after the club was leaking stories almost daily about Petracca (and now Kozzie).

Either the club is straight up lying to its supporters, in which case we should he disgusted and very angry, or the club is in disarray. 

Which one? Are supporters being take for mugs or is the club breaking down?

us supporters are mugs for thinking that the club hasn't been breaking down in front of our eyes for the last 18 months

I had a good chat with one of our assistant coaches a couple of months ago and he told me that Clayton had made his mind up to leave last year and wanted out for various reasons but mainly his injury management and also wasn’t in a good headspace which then turned into what happened this pre season.

The club had to work really really hard to convince him to stay.

Now this .

The Cats have been trying to get him for two years now.

  On 01/10/2024 at 08:11, Jaded No More said:

If the club thinks we should rebuild around our young players, why sign Viney long term? Why keep Langdon? Why not also trade Trac? Why chase Houston?

Oliver just turned 27. That’s prime age for a midfielder. Cripps won two Brownlows in his 30s.

Club needed to make this assessment a month ago. Is this group still up for it or are we fooling ourselves? If it's the former you put all your efforts into getting this group right and bolstering them through solid trades and a high end draft pick or two. If it's the latter then do what Richmond have done and get as much value out of your players at the trade table and load up at the draft. Our behaviour implies the club is being pulled in two different directions from within.

  On 01/10/2024 at 07:51, bing181 said:

If he's being shopped around, I don't know that any of us know the reasons. The internal workings and the internal dynamics of a playing group and club are not generally accessible to the wider public.

But to throw my own baseless speculation into the ring, I do wonder whether deep down here at some level the club has decided to close-off on this playing group and look to rebuilding around the next group down (JVR, Rivers, Judd, Windsor etc) plus going to the draft - and in particular this draft which apparently has plenty of talent. We've got Pick 5, perhaps we can massage our way into a second first-round pick. But if we could get a third first-rounder as well, it could go a fair way to setting us up long-term.

So ... Oliver: getting older, would get us some decent picks plus clear salary space. Also, much as we love him, he's not bringing leadership or a wise head either - and this when we've lost Gus and ANB.

Random thoughts.

in theory that has some merit but it seems likely we wouldnt be getting anywhere near the compensation necessary for him and may still be forking out part of his contract for years to come, which would be extremely unpalatable

I love DL.  People hear or read things, then make all sorts of assumptions about what is going on and then reach conclusions as if their conclusion was written in holy writ, especially if it is consistent with their own previous disapproval of a person or the club. 

How about some "If this is true, then X" rather than just saying "X"?  Just occasionally?

In this case try insering an IF at the beginning of the sentence:  Pert is shopping Oliver around without the knowledge or in opposition to the list managers, he should be sacked. 

We can vent all we like, but very few of us know anything about what's goig on.

  On 01/10/2024 at 08:16, KozzyCan said:

Club needed to make this assessment a month ago. Is this group still up for it or are we fooling ourselves? If it's the former you put all your efforts into getting this group right and bolstering them through solid trades and a high end draft pick or two. If it's the latter then do what Richmond have done and get as much value out of your players at the trade table and load up at the draft. Our behaviour implies the club is being pulled in two different directions from within.

At a guess Goodwin's pushing for top ups and others are saying "time to trade and draft to future success" I'll take the latter as I reckon we've lost the game on option 1.